For PF to Vicariously Rant Endlessly About the Over-Emphasis of Iyun through PAA

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  • #1045983

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Updated list:

    Berachos 8a with Maharsha

    Berachos 63b with Rashi

    Shabbos 63a with Rashi

    Eruvin 48a with Rashi

    Kesubos 15a

    Sanhedrin 42a with Rashi

    Avodah Zara 19a with Rashi

    Avodah Zara 19a with Rashi (there are two different gemaras on 19a which I quoted)

    Horayos 14a

    Shemos Rabba Ki Sisa Parsha 41

    Medrash Mishlei 10

    Rambam Letter

    Piskei Riaz Kiddushin Perek 1 7:8

    Shu”t Rivash Siman 271

    Shu”t Maharik Siman 169

    Orchos Tzadikim Shaar Hatorah

    Maharal Tiferes Yisroel Perek 56

    Maharal Nesivos Olam Nesiv Hatorah Perek 5

    Maharal Chiddushei Aggados Sanhedrin

    Maharal Gur Aryeh Parshas Vaeschanan

    Maharal Derech Chaim Avos Perek Shishi Ose 7

    Maharsha Bava Metzia 85a

    Shelah Maseches Shavuos 22, 25-35

    Vavei Ha’amudim 5:14

    Tzava’ah of the Shelah’s son R’ Sheftel Ose 26

    Maadnei Yom Tov Hakdama

    Kli Yakar Amudei Shesh Amud Hatorah

    Chavos Yair siman 124

    Mishnas Chachamim

    Yaavetz

    Sifsei Yeshanim

    Binyan Ariel Parshas Haazinu

    Chayei Adam Hakdama Acharona

    Pri Megadim

    Panim Yafos Genesis 22:1

    Even Shlaima 8:2

    He’aros ??

    Even Shlaima 8:7

    Darchei Noam

    Shulchan Aruch Harav Hilchos Talmud Torah 2:1

    Teshuva Me’ahava Pesicha

    Aliyos Eliyahu Ose 77

    Toldos Adam Perek 3

    Chasam Sofer Chullin 7a

    Derashos Chasam Sofer

    Pele Yoetz Asupa

    Pele Yoetz Girsa

    Pele Yoetz Yesod

    Ohr Yisrael Iggeres 27

    Hamaor

    Dor Revii Hakdama

    Mishnah Berurah Hakdama

    Chofetz Chaim Likutei Amarim perek 4

    Chofetz Chaim Likutei Amarim perek 5

    Lev Aryeh hakdama

    Hachana Deraba Ose 6

    Yalkut Hagershoni Chagiga 5a

    Eimek Haberacha Ma’amar 4

    Shu”t Beis Ridvaz Hakdama (and tzava’a)

    Seridei Eish letter

    Bihyos Haboker Ose 42

    R’ Eliyahu Feinstein

    R’ Yehoshua Leib Diskin

    R’ Elchanan Wasserman

    R’ Baruch Ber Leibowitz

    R’ Yaakov Kamenetsky

    R’ Moshe Feinstein

    Mishnas R’ Aharon Ma’amarim Sha’ar Sheini Siman 10

    Shu”t Mishneh Halachos 8:247

    Midor Dor Siman 8 Ose 5

    Midor Dor Siman 8 Ose 6

    R’ Elazar Menacham Man Shach

    R’ Berel Soloveitchik

    R’ Moshe Chevroni

    R’Aharon Yehuda Leib Shteinman

    R’ Michel Yehuda Lefkowitz

    R’ Yosef Shalom Elyashiv

    Shu”t Yabia Omer Hakdama Ose 6

    Shu”t Yabia Omer Hakdama Ose 7

    Shu”t Yabia Omer Hakdama Ose 9

    R’ Moshe Shmuel Shapiro

    Shevet Halevi 2:57

    R’ Moshe Tzuriel

    Iyun B’Lamdut Mavo

    #1045984

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Hakdama of the Gra’s sons to Biur Hagra:

    ??? ???? ??? ???? ???? ????? ???? ???????? ???????? ?????? ?????? ????? ????? ????? ???? ??? ???????? ???? ???? ?????? ??????? ????? ??? ??? ???? ???? ?? ???? ????? ????? ??? ???? ??? ???? ??

    #1045985

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    ??:

    ???? ??? ??? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ??? ?? ??? ????? ????? ?????? ???? ???? ??? ????? ?????? ??????? ????? ????? ?????? ??’ ????? ??? ??????? ?? ?”? ????? ?? ??????? ??????? ?????? ??? ??????? ?? ???? ???? ??? ??? ??? ???? ??? ???? ?????? ???? ???? ????? ?????? ?????? ?????? ????? ??? ?? ???? ??? ????? ??? ???? ????? ???? ???????? ??? ??? ?????? ??????? ??? ????? ?? ??? ??? ????? ??? ???? ??? ???? ??? ??? ????? ??? ???? ???? ????? ???? ?? ????? ??????? ??????????? ??? ???? ??? ?????? ???????

    #1045986

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    ??:

    ??? ????? ?? ???? ????? ??? ?????? ?????? ???? ?????? ??”? ?? ?? ?????? ???? ????? ???????? ??? ????? ?”? ?????? ???? ??? ????? ???? ?? ??????? ???? ?? ???? ???’ ??? ?????? ?? ??? ??? ????? ???? ???? ?? ???? ??? ???? ?? ?? ????? ?????? ??????? ????? ?????? ??? ?????? ?? ???????? ?????? ?????? ????? ?? ??? ??????? ?????? ???? ???? ???? ??? ?????? ???? ????? ?????? ?? ???? ??? ??? ????? ???? ????? ?? ???? ??? ?????

    #1045987

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    ??:

    ???? ?????? ???? ?????? ??? ???? ?????? ??? ???? ???? ????? ???? ?? ?????? ???? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ??????? ?? ?? ????? ????? ?????? ??????? ?????? ??? ????? ???? ?????? ??? ???? ????? ??????? ???? ?????? ????? ??? ????? ????? ?? ????? ????? ?? ?? ???? ???? ????? ???? ?????? ?????? ????? ?????? ???? ???? ?’ ??????? ??? ????? ?? ?????

    #1045988

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Hakdama to Shu”t Tzitz Eliezer:

    ?????? ?? ????? ????? ???? ????? ??? ?? ??? ?? ???? ??? ????? ????? ??? ????? ?? ??? ??????? ?????? ????? ?? ?????? (????? ?”?: ??????? ?’.) ????? ?? ??? ?? ??? ???? ?? ??? ???? ????? ?? ??????? ?????? ??? ??????? ??? ????? ???? ?????? ???? ????? ????? ?? ???? ???? ???? ?? ?????? ??????? ??? ???? ???? ????? ?? ???? ???? (???? ??”? ??? ???? ???”? ??’ ?”?) ?? ????? ????? ?????? ???????? ??? ???????? ?? ?????? ???? ???? ???? ( ??? ??”? ??”? ????”? ???”? ??’ ?”?) ??? ?????? ?????? ?? ??? ?????? ?? ???? ?? ???? ???? ????? ?????? ?????? (???? ????”? ?”? ?”?. ????”? ??? ???? ?????? ??”? ??”? ????) ?? ?? ???? ???? ???? ????? ?????? ??????? ??????? ???????? ?????? ???? ??? ??? ???? ????? ???? ?????

    Granted he is discussing halacha.

    #1045989

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    R’ AYL Shteinman (brought in ???????? ????? p. ??):

    :??? ????

    ????? ?????? ????? ???? ?????? ??? ??????? ?? ??? ???? ???? ???? ????? ????? ??? ???????? ????? ??? ???? ????? ????? ???? ????? ?? ?? ????? ???? ?????? ?????????? ????? ??? ?? ???? ???? ??? ????? ????? ??????? ????? ?? ??????? ?? ??? ??? ???? ??? ?????? ??? ?????? ???? ??????? ??? ???? ??? ???? ????? ????? ???? ?? ????? ?????? ????? ??????? ???? ??’ ??”? ????’ ?? ??? ??????? ?????? ???????? ??? ???? ??? ??’ ??????? ???? ???? ?????? ???? ????????

    ?”? ?? ???”? ??? ??? ??”?

    Although in the pages immediately following, he extols the virtues of learning B’iyun, I am not going to quote it, since this is not a thread to promote iyun.

    #1045990

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Tzava’ah of Rabbeinu Yaakov Ba’al Haturim:

    ???? ???? ?????? ??????? ????? ??? ?? ????? ???? ??? ????? ???? ????? ????? ??? ????? ??? ????? ????? ?????? ??? ????? ?? ???? ????? ??? ??? ??? ?? ?? ????? ?? ????? ???? ?????

    #1045991

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    This one is not about Iyun per se, although I think it is still applicable.

    Derisha Yoreh Deah 246:

    ?? ???? ???? ?????? ????? ??? ??? ??”? ??? ??? ?????? ??????? ???? ??? ??????? ??? ??? ???? (??????) [????] ??? ??? ????? ?? ????? ????? ??? ??? ????? ?? ???? ?? ????? ??? ??? ?? ???? ?? ?? ??? ?????? ??? ???? ????? ?????? ?? ?? ???? ????? ???? ????? ????? ?????? ???? ???? ???? “??????” “???????” “????”?” ??????? ???? ???? ????? ??????? ????? ?????? ??? ?????? “???? ????? ??????” ??? ???? ??? ????? ???’ ??? ??? ??”? ?? ?? ????? ????? ????? ????? ?????? ??”? ????? ?? ??? ????? ???? ???? ???’ ??? ??? ???? ????? ???? ?? ?????? ??? ???? ???? ????? ??? ?? ???? ???? ????? ?????? ??? ??? ???? ???? ????? ?????? ?? ?? ?’ ?? ?’ ???? ?? ????? ?????? ???? ??”?

    #1045992

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    And quoted by the Shach in Yoreh Deah 246:5:

    ??? ?????? ?? ???? ???? ?????? ????? ??? ??? ??”? ??? ??? ?????? ??????? ???? ??? ??????? ??? (?????) [???] ??? ??? ????? ?? ????? ????? ??? ??? ????? ?? ???? ?? ???? ??? ??? ?”? ??? ????? ???? ??????? ???? ????? ??? ???”? ?????? ????”? ??????? ???? ???? ????? ??????? ????? ?????? ??? ?????? ???”? ??? ???? ??? ????? ??’ ??? ??? ??”? ?? ????? ????? ????? ????? ?????? ??”? ?”? ??? ?”? ???? ???? ??’ ??? ???”? ???? ?? ?????? ?’ ???? ???? ????? ??? ?? ???? ???? ????? ??”? ??? ??? ???? ???? ????? ?????? ?? ?’ ?? ?’ ???? ?? ????? ??”? ???? ??”? ?”?

    #1045993

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Chayei Adam Hakdamah Kolleles:

    ?????? ??? ???? ??”? ????? ??? ?? ??? ???? ?? ???? ??? ?? ?? ?? ????? ???? ??? ???? ???? ????? ??????? ??? ???? ??? ??????

    #1045994

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Updated list:

    Berachos 8a with Maharsha

    Berachos 63b with Rashi

    Shabbos 63a with Rashi

    Eruvin 48a with Rashi

    Kesubos 15a

    Sanhedrin 42a with Rashi

    Avodah Zara 19a with Rashi

    Avodah Zara 19a with Rashi (there are two different gemaras on 19a which I quoted)

    Horayos 14a

    Shemos Rabba Ki Sisa Parsha 41

    Medrash Mishlei 10

    Rambam Letter

    Piskei Riaz Kiddushin Perek 1 7:8

    Tzava’ah of Rabbeinu Yaakov Ba’al Haturim

    Shu”t Rivash Siman 271

    Shu”t Maharik Siman 169

    Orchos Tzadikim Shaar Hatorah

    Maharal Tiferes Yisroel Perek 56

    Maharal Nesivos Olam Nesiv Hatorah Perek 5

    Maharal Chiddushei Aggados Sanhedrin

    Maharal Gur Aryeh Parshas Vaeschanan

    Maharal Derech Chaim Avos Perek Shishi Ose 7

    Maharsha Bava Metzia 85a

    Shelah Maseches Shavuos 22, 25-35

    Vavei Ha’amudim 5:14

    Tzava’ah of the Shelah’s son R’ Sheftel Ose 26

    Derisha Yoreh Deah 246

    Maadnei Yom Tov Hakdama

    Kli Yakar Amudei Shesh Amud Hatorah

    Shach Yoreh Deah 246:5

    Chavos Yair siman 124

    Mishnas Chachamim

    Yaavetz

    Sifsei Yeshanim

    Binyan Ariel Parshas Haazinu

    Chayei Adam Hakdama Acharona

    Chayei Adam Hakdamah Kolleles

    Pri Megadim

    Panim Yafos Genesis 22:1

    Even Shlaima 8:2

    He’aros ??

    Even Shlaima 8:7

    Hakdama of the Gra’s sons to Biur Hagra

    Darchei Noam

    Shulchan Aruch Harav Hilchos Talmud Torah 2:1

    Teshuva Me’ahava Pesicha

    Aliyos Eliyahu Ose 77

    Toldos Adam Perek 3

    Chasam Sofer Chullin 7a

    Derashos Chasam Sofer

    Pele Yoetz Asupa

    Pele Yoetz Girsa

    Pele Yoetz Yesod

    Ohr Yisrael Iggeres 27

    Hamaor

    Dor Revii Hakdama

    Mishnah Berurah Hakdama

    Chofetz Chaim Likutei Amarim perek 4

    Chofetz Chaim Likutei Amarim perek 5

    Lev Aryeh hakdama

    Hachana Deraba Ose 6

    Yalkut Hagershoni Chagiga 5a

    Eimek Haberacha Ma’amar 4

    Shu”t Beis Ridvaz Hakdama (and tzava’a)

    Seridei Eish letter

    Bihyos Haboker Ose 42

    R’ Eliyahu Feinstein

    R’ Yehoshua Leib Diskin

    R’ Elchanan Wasserman

    R’ Baruch Ber Leibowitz

    R’ Yaakov Kamenetsky

    R’ Moshe Feinstein

    Mishnas R’ Aharon Ma’amarim Sha’ar Sheini Siman 10

    Shu”t Tzitz Eliezer Hakdama

    Shu”t Mishneh Halachos 8:247

    Midor Dor Siman 8 Ose 5

    Midor Dor Siman 8 Ose 6

    R’ Elazar Menacham Man Shach

    R’ Berel Soloveitchik

    R’ Moshe Chevroni

    R’Aharon Yehuda Leib Shteinman Leading With Love p.81/Orchosecha Lamdeini p. 69 (It’s the same letter, one in English and one in Hebrew)

    R’ Michel Yehuda Lefkowitz

    R’ Yosef Shalom Elyashiv

    Shu”t Yabia Omer Hakdama Ose 6

    Shu”t Yabia Omer Hakdama Ose 7

    Shu”t Yabia Omer Hakdama Ose 9

    R’ Moshe Shmuel Shapiro

    Shevet Halevi 2:57

    R’ Moshe Tzuriel

    Iyun B’Lamdut Mavo

    #1045995

    Pretty good list. Nice going. BTW, how do you find all of these?

    #1045996

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Some of them I stam came across in my journey through the corpus of Talmudic/Rabbinic literature. A few of them were pointed out to me by people. Many of them I found while specifically researching this inyan.

    For example, I found the following source accidentally. I was reading someone’s Doctoral Dissertation and he quoted this sefer and the part he was quoting just happened to be on the same page as this:

    R’ Matisyahu Strashun (son of the Rashash) Mivchar Kesavim p. 168:

    ????? ??????? ????”? ???? ????? ??’ ?????? ?????? ?? ???? ???? ?”? ??’ ????? ????? ????? ????? ???? ???? ?????? ????? ??? ???? ???? ????? (???? ????????) ?? ??? ???? ??? ??? ??? ???? ???”? ??? ???? ???? ?? ?? ????? ??????? ????? ??? ?? ???????? ??????? ?? ??? ????? ??? ????? ??? ???? ???? ???? ????? ?????”? ?”? ???? ???????? ??? ??”? It goes on, but I’m not going to bother typing it out since it’s mostly just sources that I’ve already quoted.

    #1045997

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Rashi Chulin 81a:

    ????? ???. ???? ?? ??? ???? ????? ????? ??? ????? ????? ????? ???? ??’ ????? ?????? ???? ????? ???? ??”? ??? ????? ????? ??? ??????? ????? ????? ??? ??? ???? ?????? ?? ??? ????? ????? ??? ?? ????? ????? ?? ??? ????? ??? ????? ?? ???? ????? ??? ???? ????? ????? ?????? ???? ??? ??? ???? ?????? ??? ??? ??? ????? ??? ???? ?????? ????? ???? ??? ????? ??? ????? ????? ??? ?????? ??? ???? ?”? ??? ??? ????? ???? ??? ??? ???? ?????? ??? ?? ???? ????? ???? ???? ????? ???? ????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ??? ???? ?? ????? ?????? ????? ???? ?? ?? ????? ??’ ?????? ????? ???? ????? ????? ??? ????? ??? ???? ??? ????

    ???’ ????? ??? ???? ???? ???????

    #1045999

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Mivchar Kesavim p. 186:

    ????? ???? ??? ??? ???? ????? ????? ???’ ????? ???”? ??? ?”? ??? ???? ????? ????? ????”? ??? ?????? ????? ?????? ???? ??? ????? ??? ??? ????? ??? ?????? ?? ???? ?????? ????? ?? ?? ????? ???? ??? ??? ??? ??? ???? ?? ????? ???? ????? ???? ?? ???? ???? ?????? ???? ??? ????? ??? ?????? ?????? ????? ???? ??? ?????? ?? ??? ??? ??????? ???? ????? ???? ?????? ??? ?? ??? ?????

    #1046000

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Igros Moshe Yoreh Deiah 3:87:

    ??? ??? ???? ??? ???”? ??? ?????? ?????? ???? ???? ????? ??????? ??????? ?? ??? ???? ????? ????? ???? ????? ????? ?? ?? ??”? ????? ?? ???? ????? ??? ???? ????? ????? ?????? ?? ??????? ???????? ???????? ????????? ??? ???? ?? ?????? ???? ????? ????? ????? ???? ?? ??”? ???????? ?????? ???? ???”? ??? ??? ??? ???? ?????? ???? ???? ???? ????? ???? ?????? ??? ???? ?? ???? ????? ??? ????? ??? ????? ??? ????? ????? ????? ???? ??????? ???????? ????? ?????? ????? ????? ???? ???? ???? ????”?

    Interesting fact:

    This teshuvah is addressed to the author of the pamphlet which I quoted R’ Moshe’s haskama to, earlier in this thread.

    #1046001

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Igros Moshe Yoreh Deiah 2:110:

    ???? ???? ??? ???? ??? ???? ?????? ????? ?”? ????? ??”? ?????? ????? ??? ???? ???? ??? ??? ??? ???? ???? ???? ?????? ??? ?? ?????? ?? ?? ????? ??? ?? ???? ??? ?? ???? ?????? ?? ????? ????? ????”? ?? ??? ?????? ????? ???? ???????? ?? ?’ ?????? ??? ???? ???? ???? ????? ????? ?????? ?????? ?? ????? ??? ????? ??? ??????? ?? ?? ?????? ??? ??? ?? ????? ????? ??? ??? ???? ???? ???? ?????? ??? ????? ??? ???? ?????? ???”? ???? ???? ????? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ????? ???? ??”? ??? ?”? ?? ????? ??? ???? ????? ????? ??? ???? ??? ????? ??”? ???? ????? ??”? ???? ???? ????? ??? ??? ???, ??? ?????? ????? ????? ????? ?????? ??? ??? ?????? ????? ???????? ???? ????

    Also in this teshuvah:

    ??”? ???”? ????? ??????? ????? ?? ????? ?????? ?? ??? ???? ?????? ?? ?”? ????? ??? ??? ??????? ???? ???? ??? ???? ???? ????? ????? ?? ????? ???? ???? ????? ?? ??? ???? ???? ???? ???? ??? ?? ???? ???? ???? ????? ????’ ?’ ???? ????? ?”? ?”? ???? ?? ?? ???? ?’ ?????? ??? ?”? ????? ??? ??? ?????? ??? ?????? ????? ?? ??? ?????? ?”? ?????? ?????? ????? ????? ????? ?????? ???? ??? ?? ??? ???? ?? ???? ?? ???? ??? ???? ??? ???? ?? ????? ??????? ???? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ????? ???”? ?????? ????? ??? ?? ????? ????? ??? ?”? ????? ?? ??? ??? ???? ??”? ?? ?? ????? ??? ???? ??? ????? ??? ???? ??? ???? ???? ???? ???? ??”? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ??? ?????? ??? ??? ????? ?”? ??? ????? ?? ??”? ??? ?’ ????? ????? ?”? ??”? ????? ????? ???? ???? ??? ??? ??”? ?? ?”? ??”? ???? ???? ?? ???? ???? ???? ???? ???? ??????? ????? ??? ?? ????? ?”? ???? ??? ??? ????? ???? ???? ???? ??? ??? ????? ?? ????? ??? ??? ????? ???? ???? ???? ????? ????? ?? ????? ???? ??? ?? ??? ??? ???? ????? ??”? ?”? ???? ??? ???? ???? ???? ???? ??????? ???? ??? ???? ????? ?? ?? ??? ?????? ?? ????? ???? ???? ????? ???? ???? ???? ??? ???? ??? ?? ???? ???? ?”? ???? ??? ???? ????? ?????? ??????? ??????? ??? ???? ???? ????? ???? ?? ???? ????? ????? ?????? ?????? ?? ???”? ?? ?”? ????? ?? ???? ??? ?? ???? ???? ?????? ???? ????? ????? ?? ?????? ??? ??? ??????? ???? ??? ???? ????? ????? ?? ????? ????

    ??? ????? ????”? ?”? ??”? ?”? ???? ?? ????? ???? ????? ???? ?? ??? ???? ????? ??? ????? ????? ??? ??? ??? ????? ?????? ??? ???? ??? ???? ???? ????? ?? ????? ??? ?? ????? ?? ????? ??? ????? ???? ????? ?????? ????? ?? ??? ??? ?? ?? ???? ??? ???? ?????? ??? ??? ???? ??? ??? ?? ?? ?? ??? ????? ????? ?? ??? ???? ??? ??? ???? ????? ????? ?????? ??? ???? ????? ?? ????? ???? ?? ?? ???? ??? ?? ????? ?????? ????? ??? ??? ??? ??? ????

    ????? ??”? ??? ??”? ??? ?????? ?? ????? ??? ????? ???? ????? ??? ??? ????? ???? ?? ????”? ??”? ??? ?????? ?? ???? ???? ??? ?? ????? ???? ???? ???? ???? ???? ???? ????? ??”? ??? ???? ???? ???? ???? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ??? ???? ??? ???? ?????? ???? ??? ??? ??? ???? ????? ?? ??????? ?? ?? ??? ?? ?? ???? ??? ??? ????? ?? ????? ??? ?? ???? ????? ??? ??? ???? ???? ????? ??????? ?? ???? ??”? ???? ??? ????? ????? ???? ???? ????? ?? ???? ???? ?????? ???? ???? ?? ?????

    ????? ???? ???? ?? ????? ?? ?????? ??? ????? ???? ????? ???? ?’ ???? ?? ??”? ???? ??? ???? ???? ???

    #1046002

    The other day I had a minor rant on this subject to one of my rebbeim, a man whom I hold in the greatest respect. My point was that since i have learnt a mesechta relatively well(which I am currently chazering) I was able to notice a stirah in 2 tosfosim 39 daf apart, which was not helpfully pointed out by the meaoras hashas. His responce–“When I was your age(3rd year bochur) I would argue about this with people, then I realized that it is so poshut, if they don’t understand it, nothing I say can help them”

    This is a man who I have seen literally knows tamach baal peh, who learnt shas down to halocha lemaaseh over eighteen years, while finishing it a further four times during that time in a different seder. It made me wonder what would have happened if th other people had convinced him. I know he has had a greater impact on my life than almost any other single person. So on that note, rock on PAA. Let those blind to pshat, those who think you krum, say what they wish. At least one person here seriously appreciates this thread.

    #1046003

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Thank you.

    #1046004

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Updated list:

    Berachos 8a with Maharsha

    Berachos 63b with Rashi

    Shabbos 63a with Rashi

    Eruvin 48a with Rashi

    Kesubos 15a

    Sanhedrin 42a with Rashi

    Avodah Zara 19a with Rashi

    Avodah Zara 19a with Rashi (there are two different gemaras on 19a which I quoted)

    Horayos 14a

    Shemos Rabba Ki Sisa Parsha 41

    Medrash Mishlei 10

    Rashi Chulin 81a

    Rambam Letter

    Piskei Riaz Kiddushin Perek 1 7:8

    Tzava’ah of Rabbeinu Yaakov Ba’al Haturim

    Shu”t Rivash Siman 271

    Shu”t Maharik Siman 169

    Orchos Tzadikim Shaar Hatorah

    Maharal Tiferes Yisroel Perek 56

    Maharal Nesivos Olam Nesiv Hatorah Perek 5

    Maharal Chiddushei Aggados Sanhedrin

    Maharal Gur Aryeh Parshas Vaeschanan

    Maharal Derech Chaim Avos Perek Shishi Ose 7

    Maharsha Bava Metzia 85a

    Shelah Maseches Shavuos 22, 25-35

    Vavei Ha’amudim 5:14

    Tzava’ah of the Shelah’s son R’ Sheftel Ose 26

    Derisha Yoreh Deah 246

    Maadnei Yom Tov Hakdama

    Kli Yakar Amudei Shesh Amud Hatorah

    Shach Yoreh Deah 246:5

    Chavos Yair siman 124

    Mishnas Chachamim

    Yaavetz

    Sifsei Yeshanim

    Binyan Ariel Parshas Haazinu

    Chayei Adam Hakdama Acharona

    Chayei Adam Hakdamah Kolleles

    Pri Megadim

    Panim Yafos Genesis 22:1

    Even Shlaima 8:2

    He’aros ??

    Even Shlaima 8:7

    Hakdama of the Gra’s sons to Biur Hagra

    Darchei Noam

    Shulchan Aruch Harav Hilchos Talmud Torah 2:1

    Teshuva Me’ahava Pesicha

    Aliyos Eliyahu Ose 77

    Toldos Adam Perek 3

    Chasam Sofer Chullin 7a

    Derashos Chasam Sofer

    Pele Yoetz Asupa

    Pele Yoetz Girsa

    Pele Yoetz Yesod

    Ohr Yisrael Iggeres 27

    Mivchar Kesavim p. 168

    Mivchar Kesavim p. 186

    Hamaor

    Dor Revii Hakdama

    Mishnah Berurah Hakdama

    Chofetz Chaim Likutei Amarim perek 4

    Chofetz Chaim Likutei Amarim perek 5

    Lev Aryeh hakdama

    Hachana Deraba Ose 6

    Yalkut Hagershoni Chagiga 5a

    Eimek Haberacha Ma’amar 4

    Shu”t Beis Ridvaz Hakdama (and tzava’a)

    Seridei Eish letter

    Bihyos Haboker Ose 42

    R’ Eliyahu Feinstein

    R’ Yehoshua Leib Diskin

    R’ Elchanan Wasserman

    R’ Baruch Ber Leibowitz

    R’ Yaakov Kamenetzky

    R’ Moshe Feinstein/R’ Yaakov Kamenetzky Haskama to TenuKavodLatorah

    Igros Moshe Yoreh Deiah 2:110

    Igros Moshe Yoreh Deiah 3:87

    Mishnas R’ Aharon Ma’amarim Sha’ar Sheini Siman 10

    Shu”t Tzitz Eliezer Hakdama

    Shu”t Mishneh Halachos 8:247

    Midor Dor Siman 8 Ose 5

    Midor Dor Siman 8 Ose 6

    R’ Elazar Menacham Man Shach

    R’ Berel Soloveitchik

    R’ Moshe Chevroni

    R’Aharon Yehuda Leib Shteinman Leading With Love p.81/Orchosecha Lamdeini p. 69 (It’s the same letter, one in English and one in Hebrew)

    R’ Michel Yehuda Lefkowitz

    R’ Yosef Shalom Elyashiv

    Shu”t Yabia Omer Hakdama Ose 6

    Shu”t Yabia Omer Hakdama Ose 7

    Shu”t Yabia Omer Hakdama Ose 9

    R’ Moshe Shmuel Shapiro

    Shevet Halevi 2:57

    R’ Moshe Tzuriel

    Iyun B’Lamdut Mavo

    #1046005

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Piskei Riaz Avodah Zarah Perek 1 4:24:

    ??? ????? ???? ?? ????? ??? ???? ????? ??? ???? ???? ???? ???? ?????

    #1046006

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Kovetz Shiurim Kiddushin Ose 84:

    ??????? ?? ???? ??? ????? ???? ????? ??”? ?? ??? ???? ?????? ?? ???? ?”? ??????? ????? ???? ???? ?’ ??”? ???”? ???? ??”? ?? ????? ??”? ?”? ??????? ??? ???? ???”? ??? ?? ???? ???? ???? ??? ????? ??? ???? ????? ??? ????? ???? ?? ???? ???”? ??? ??????? ??? ??? ???? ????? ????? ????? ?????? ???

    #1046007

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    He’aros Chagiga 5b (R’ Elyashiv):

    (Before the actual quote, some context is in order. The Gemara says:

    ??? ???? ???? ???”? ???? ????? ??? ??? ?? ????? ????? ????? ????? ???? ??? ??? ???? ????? ????? ????? ??? ???? ?????? ?? ?????

    R’ Elyashiv quotes the Taz who explains that in Birchas Hatorah, ??? refers to Pilpul, Yegia, etc. R’ Elyashiv then explains that the first person whom H’ cries over is one who is ???? ????? ????? ????? ???? meaning that he just learns superficially. He calls it “someone who just learns his daf yomi without iyun and yegia to clarify the emes”. The part that I’m about to quote is explaining the second category.)

    ??? ?? ??? ???? ?? ????? ????? ????? ????? ??? ???? ????? ???? ????? ????? ?????? ???? ??? ?? ???? ????? ??? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ????? ?? ???? ?????? ?????? ???? ????? ????? ??? ?? ??? ???? ???? ?? ???? ????? ?????? ????? ??? ????? ?? ?? ???? ????

    In other words, H’ cries over someone who engages in heavy iyun before he is a baki in the Chadrei Hatorah.

    #1046008

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Mivchar Kesavim p. 186-187:

    ???? ?????? ??????? ???? ?? ?? ????? ?????? ??????? ?????? ????? ??????? ?? ???? ??? ???? ?? ??? ???? ??? ?? ?????? ??? ???? ?????? ?? ???????? ??? ????? ???????? ?????? ?????? ???? ??????? ??????? ????? ???? ????? ?? ???? ???? ?????? ????????? ??????? ??????? ???? ???? ??????? ???? ?????? ??? ???????? ?????? ???? ????? ?? ????? ??? ??? ?????? ????? ?????? ?? ????

    ??? ????? ?? ??? ????? ??? ???? ??? ???? ?????? ???? ????? ???? ???? ???? ?? ???? ????? ?? ??????? ??? ?????? ??? ?????? ??????? ???????? ??????? ????? ?’ ??????? ????? ??????? ?? ?? ?????? ????? ?? ??? ?????? ???? ??? ???? ?? ????? ??? ????? ?? ???? ?? ???? (????? ?????”? ??????? ?????) ???????? ????? ?? ??? ?????? ???????? ??????? ???? ???? ??? ?????? ?????? ???? ???? ????? ?????

    #1046009

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Chashukei Chemed Succah 20a:

    ????? ???? ????? ????? ???? ?? ?????

    ????. ????? ?????? ???? ????? ??????? ????? ???? ????? ????? ??? ?? ???? ??”? ?? ??? ???? ?? ?????? ?????? [???? ???? ??????] ?? ???? ??? ?? ?????? ????????

    ?????. ???? ????? ??????? (?? ? ?”?) ???? ??? ????? ?? ?? ?? ??? ??? ????? ?? ????? ??????? ????? ???? ???? ???? ????? ?? ????? ????? ?????? ??? ?? ???? ?? ??? ???? ?? ??????? ?? ???? ??? ????? ???? ????? ??? ????? ?? ??? ???? ???? ????? ??????? (??? ??) ??”? ??????? ?? ???? ??? ????? ???? ????? ??”? ?? ??? ???? ?????? ?? ???? ?”? ??????? ????? ???? ???? ??”? ???”? ???? ??”? ?? ????? ??”? ??? ???? ??????? ??? ???? ???”? ??? ?? ????? ???? ???? ??? ????? ??? ???? ????? ??? ????? ???? ?? ???? ???”? ??? ?????? ??? ??? ???? ????? ????? ????? ?????? ??? ??”? ?????? ????? ???? ?? ? ?”? ???????? ???? ?????? [???”? ????? ??????]… ???? ??????? ??? ??? ???? ????? ?????? ???? ?? ?? ?????”? ?? ????? ??????? ???? ????? ?? ??? ???? ???? ????? ??? ????? ????? ?????? ???? ????? ????? (???? ??”?) ??? ??? ?? ????? ?? ?????? ????? ?? ??? ?????? ???? ??? ??? ???? ??? ??? ????? ????? ?? ????? ???? ???’ ??”? ????? ????? ?? ?? ???? ????? ??? ??????? ??? ??? ????? ????? ?? ????? ???? ??? ?? ?? ??????? ?????? ????? ????? ?? ??? ???? ????? ?????? ???”? ?????? ??? ??”? ????? (??? ?? ?”?) ????? ????? ?? ???? ???? ?? ?? ??? ???? ?????? ?????? ???? ??? ???? ??????? ???”? (????? ???? ???? ???? ????? ?????? ??? ??) ?????? ?????? (?? ?? ?”?) ???? ????? ???? ???? ??? ???? ???? ??? ???? ???? ???? ?????? ???? ???? ???? ???? ??????? ?? ?????? ???? ?? ???? ???? ??”? ??? ????”? ?????? ????”? ???? ?? ?? ?????? ?????? ??? ?? ?? ????? ??? ????? ???? ?????? ????? ???? ?? ??? ?????? ?????? ?? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ???? ????? ?? ???? ??????? ??? ???? ??? ?????? ?? ??? ?????? ????? ?? ??? ????? ??? ?? ????? ?????? ???? ???? ???? ????? ????? ???? ?? ???? ?????? ????? ??”? ????? ????? ???? ????? ???? ????? ?? ????? ??? ???? ????? ?????? ?? ???? ????? ?????? ????? ????? ??? ????? ????? ?? ?????? ??? ???? ????? ?????? ??? ???? ???? ??? ?????

    [ellipsis in original]

    #1046010

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Updated list:

    Berachos 8a with Maharsha

    Berachos 63b with Rashi

    Shabbos 63a with Rashi

    Eruvin 48a with Rashi

    Kesubos 50a

    Sanhedrin 42a with Rashi

    Avodah Zara 19a with Rashi

    Avodah Zara 19a with Rashi (there are two different gemaras on 19a which I quoted)

    Horayos 14a

    Shemos Rabba Ki Sisa Parsha 41

    Medrash Mishlei 10

    Rashi Chulin 81a

    Rambam Letter

    Piskei Riaz Kiddushin Perek 1 7:8

    Piskei Riaz Avodah Zarah Perek 1 4:24

    Tzava’ah of Rabbeinu Yaakov Ba’al Haturim

    Shu”t Rivash Siman 271

    Shu”t Maharik Siman 169

    Orchos Tzadikim Shaar Hatorah

    Maharal Tiferes Yisroel Perek 56

    Maharal Nesivos Olam Nesiv Hatorah Perek 5

    Maharal Chiddushei Aggados Sanhedrin

    Maharal Gur Aryeh Parshas Vaeschanan

    Maharal Derech Chaim Avos Perek Shishi Ose 7

    Maharsha Bava Metzia 85a

    Shelah Maseches Shavuos 22, 25-35

    Vavei Ha’amudim 5:14

    Tzava’ah of the Shelah’s son R’ Sheftel Ose 26

    Derisha Yoreh Deah 246

    Maadnei Yom Tov Hakdama

    Kli Yakar Amudei Shesh Amud Hatorah

    Shach Yoreh Deah 246:5

    Chavos Yair siman 124

    Mishnas Chachamim

    Yaavetz

    Sifsei Yeshanim

    Binyan Ariel Parshas Haazinu

    Chayei Adam Hakdama Acharona

    Chayei Adam Hakdamah Kolleles

    Pri Megadim letter printed in the beginning of Orach Chaim

    Panim Yafos Genesis 22:1

    Even Shlaima 8:2

    He’aros ??

    Even Shlaima 8:7

    Hakdama of the Gra’s sons to Biur Hagra

    Darchei Noam

    Shulchan Aruch Harav Hilchos Talmud Torah 2:1

    Teshuva Me’ahava Pesicha

    Aliyos Eliyahu Ose 77

    Toldos Adam Perek 3

    Chasam Sofer Chullin 7a

    Derashos Chasam Sofer

    Pele Yoetz Asupa

    Pele Yoetz Girsa

    Pele Yoetz Yesod

    Ohr Yisrael Iggeres 27

    Mivchar Kesavim p. 168

    Mivchar Kesavim p. 186 footnote 28

    Mivchar Kesavim p. 186-187

    Hamaor Perek 11

    Dor Revii Hakdama

    Mishnah Berurah Hakdama

    Chofetz Chaim Likutei Amarim perek 4

    Chofetz Chaim Likutei Amarim perek 5

    Lev Aryeh hakdama

    Hachana Deraba Ose 6

    Yalkut Hagershoni Chagiga 5a

    Eimek Haberacha Ma’amar 4

    Shu”t Beis Ridvaz Hakdama (and tzava’a)

    Seridei Eish letter

    Bihyos Haboker Ose 42

    R’ Eliyahu Feinstein

    R’ Yehoshua Leib Diskin

    R’ Elchanan Wasserman Kovetz Ma’amarim V’Igros

    R’ Elchanan Wasserman Kovetz Shiurim Kiddushin Ose 84 (quoting R’ Chaim)

    R’ Baruch Ber Leibowitz

    R’ Yaakov Kamenetzky

    R’ Moshe Feinstein/R’ Yaakov Kamenetzky Haskama to TenuKavodLatorah

    Igros Moshe Yoreh Deiah 2:110

    Igros Moshe Yoreh Deiah 3:87

    Mishnas R’ Aharon Ma’amarim Sha’ar Sheini Siman 10

    Shu”t Tzitz Eliezer Hakdama

    Shu”t Mishneh Halachos 8:247

    Midor Dor Siman 8 Ose 5

    Midor Dor Siman 8 Ose 6

    R’ Elazar Menacham Man Shach

    R’ Berel Soloveitchik

    R’ Moshe Chevroni

    R’Aharon Yehuda Leib Shteinman Leading With Love p.81/Orchosecha Lamdeini p. 69 (It’s the same letter, one in English and one in Hebrew)

    R’ Michel Yehuda Lefkowitz Darchei Chaim chelek 1 Perek 14

    R’ Yosef Shalom Elyashiv Artscroll Biography

    R’ Yosef Shalom Elyashiv He’aros Chagiga 5b

    Shu”t Yabia Omer Hakdama Ose 6

    Shu”t Yabia Omer Hakdama Ose 7

    Shu”t Yabia Omer Hakdama Ose 9

    R’ Moshe Shmuel Shapiro Haskama

    Shevet Halevi 2:57

    Chashukei Chemed Succah 20a

    R’ Moshe Tzuriel ?????? ????? ????? Sha’ar 7 Ose 2

    Iyun B’Lamdut Mavo

    #1046011

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    According to my calculations, the above list now contains 100 sources. Maybe I’ll make a siyum. Or not.

    #1046014

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Igros Moshe Orach Chaim 5:33:2:

    ????? ?????? ?????? ?????? ??? ???? ??????

    ??”? ??? ?’ ?????? ???”?

    ?????? ??? ????”?

    ??? ?? ??? ?? ?????? ?? ???? ?????? ????? ???? ???? ??? ????? ????? ???? ???? ?? ?????? ????? ???? ???? ?????? ?? ????? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ????? ???????? ?? ????? ???? ???, ??? ?? ????? ???? ???? ??? ?????? ????? ??? ???????? ??? ????? ??? ???, ??? ???? ?????? ??? ??”? ????’ ????? ???????? ?? ????? ?? ??? ????? ???? ??”? ?????’ ???? ?? ???? ????? ?? ???”? ?????”? ?????? ?? ????”? ??????? ?? ??? ???? ????? ????? ??????? ??? ????? ????? ???? ???? ?????? ??”? ?????? ???????

    ????? ????? ?????? ?????

    ??? ?????????

    #1046015

    Patur Aval Assur
    Participant

    Ta’anis 24a-24b

    ?? ??? ?????? ??? ???? ??? ??? ????? ???? ??? ??? ?? ????? ?? ??? ??? ?????? ??? ????? ??? ??? ??? ????? ?? ???? ?????

    ??? ??????? ???????

    ????? ??? ????? ?? ????? ??????? ??? ???? ?? ?????? ????? ????? ??? ??? ??? ?? ????? ??????? ???? ?????? ??? ?????? ????? ?? ????? ????? ??????? ?????? ??? ????’ ??? ?????? ?? ????? ??? ???? ?? ?????? ??????? ????? ?????? ????? ?? ????? ?? ??? ???? ?? ????? ??? ????? ???? ?? ??????? ???? ???? ????? ????? ??

    [Emphasis added to distinguish this Gemara from the parallel Gemaros in Berachos (20a) and Sanhedrin (106b) which don’t have this line, although the intent of thse two passages is just as clear.]

    #1385271

    Chortkov
    Participant

    #BringBackTheAlefBes

    #1386771

    Joseph
    Participant

    Yekke — I’m still waiting to hear your question for me.

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