August 20, 2015 2:40 pm at 2:40 pm #616236
I have noticed a number of frum guys who appear to be coloring their hair. I don’t recall if it is mutar or assur, In any case, anyone out there who colors his hair, and if so, why, and how do you get it done? I know there is a product called Grecian Formula, which doesn’t color the hair but is a clear liquidt contains an ingredient that restores the hair to its natural color; it is not a dye.August 20, 2015 3:03 pm at 3:03 pm #1098154zahavasdadParticipant
Do you mean color their hair the normal color it was before it was grey or coloring it a crazy color like bleeching it.August 20, 2015 3:04 pm at 3:04 pm #1098155golferParticipant
Just checking in to wonder-
Might there be a correlation between the name of the OP and the observation of the OP?August 20, 2015 3:13 pm at 3:13 pm #1098156HealthParticipant
You have to ask a Shailah. I heard it’s Mutter in some instances.August 20, 2015 3:51 pm at 3:51 pm #1098158technical21Participant
golfer- I am assuming that you are not from Flatbush. That comment was uncalled for.August 20, 2015 4:47 pm at 4:47 pm #1098159benignumanParticipant
I am pretty sure the Rambam says that it is asur but it depends on societal norms. Ask a shailah halacha l’maysah.August 20, 2015 5:28 pm at 5:28 pm #1098160
Golfer, can you explain what you mean?August 20, 2015 9:00 pm at 9:00 pm #1098161apushatayidParticipant
just my two cents. people notice too many things about other people.August 20, 2015 9:35 pm at 9:35 pm #1098162
I am not a Posek, but if he is dyeing his hair to look younger in order to get a wife or for business purposes it may be permissible otherwise not. But ask a posek, he is better informed as to how to answer this questionAugust 21, 2015 12:16 am at 12:16 am #1098163newbeeMember
apushatayid: “just my two cents. people notice too many things about other people.”
Yea, like noticing how other people notice too many things.August 21, 2015 2:05 am at 2:05 am #1098164yaakov doeParticipant
Ive seen a lot of brightly colored hair recently, green, orange, red, purple, but never on a frum man.August 21, 2015 2:25 am at 2:25 am #1098165👑RebYidd23Participant
Was it on a frum person?August 21, 2015 4:55 am at 4:55 am #1098166Matan1Participant
Is a woman allowed to color her hair?August 21, 2015 9:01 am at 9:01 am #1098167
A woman can dye her hair.
If the product is not a dye but just rejuvenates the hair to it’s original color it would be permitted. But since people will THINK that he dyed his hair it maybe prohibited. A posek is needed to decide this matter
Yes the question is referring to a Frum Male JewAugust 21, 2015 9:21 am at 9:21 am #1098168
Considering the fact that the issue is beged isha, yes, a woman is permitted.
I don’t think restoring the original color is any better.August 21, 2015 11:28 am at 11:28 am #1098169old manParticipant
Sorry to disappoint all of you MO mekillim who think this issue is debatable.
The Shulchan Aruch explicitly prohibits this action, see YD:182:6
In addition, Reb Moshe zt”l prohibits even oral medication to achieve the same effect.
See Igros Moshe,YD:82August 21, 2015 11:29 am at 11:29 am #1098170DaMosheParticipant
I was once told by my Rosh Yeshiva, R’ Bender shlita, that what is considered beged ish/isha can change based on societal norms. For example, he told me that pants are no longer considered beged ish. It would seem that since it’s normal for men to dye their hair nowadays, it would be allowed.August 21, 2015 1:46 pm at 1:46 pm #1098171
Daas Yachid sayid: “I don’t think restoring the original color is any better.”
Why? Is there a mitzvah to have gray hair?August 21, 2015 1:54 pm at 1:54 pm #1098172apushatayidParticipant
“Yea, like noticing how other people notice too many things.”
Sometimes you cant help but notice certain things, like the statement “I have noticed a number of frum guys…”. Personally, I’d be hard pressed to say with 100% certainty the hair color of my Rav, those who sit near me in shul or the yid who owns the local grocery. Sure, if he showed up next shabbos with fire truck red hair, I would notice, but only because his choice of color is screaming out loud “look here!”.August 21, 2015 3:30 pm at 3:30 pm #1098174
Why? Is there a mitzvah to have gray hair?
No, but that doesn’t mean there’s no issur of beged isha to dye it black.
DaMoshe, that’s true in some cases, not all.August 21, 2015 3:31 pm at 3:31 pm #1098175
Newbee, if noticing what someone writes on the CR is a problem, we’re all guilty.August 21, 2015 4:57 pm at 4:57 pm #1098176August 21, 2015 6:25 pm at 6:25 pm #1098177oomisParticipant
If someone is trying to defraud someone whether in business or looking for a shidduch, by dyeing the hair to appear younger, it would seem to be assur. But many young men go gray prematurely. Why should a 30 year old man feel uncomfortable around people, just by virtue of having gone gray 20 years sooner than most? And if he is not married, it can be a real hindrance. And why should someone in the workforce have to compete with younger-looking men, in a place where youth and vitality are prized, and age is devalued?
These are issues that were not as prevalent centuries ago. If someone dyed his hair, it often was for arayos of some type, or Avoda Zara. Not so, today. People just do not want to feel old. A more youthful appearance helps.August 21, 2015 8:24 pm at 8:24 pm #1098178screwdriverdelightParticipant
oomis, it is muttar for bachelors to dye their white hairs.
and it’s muttar to dye black hairs white.August 21, 2015 9:26 pm at 9:26 pm #1098179oomisParticipant
to dye black hairs white. “
Why would anyone WANT to???????? I knew about the bachelors, 🙂 .August 21, 2015 9:37 pm at 9:37 pm #1098180newbeeMember
“Newbee, if noticing what someone writes on the CR is a problem, we’re all guilty.”
Yes, but I am not the one who was critical of someone specifically for being critical of others. (Thats how I took the comment)
“just my two cents. people notice too many things about other people.”
I took this to mean the OP was wrong for noticing these thingsAugust 23, 2015 2:31 am at 2:31 am #1098181
Rav Moshe wrote that answer over 60 years ago. Do you use deodorant, because back then it was prohibited as perfume, for the same reason.
Sixty years ago the elderly were respected now a days it’s the youth that are respected. So at least in business, to get a job or make a sale you need to have a youthful appearance, which is why some people dye their hair.August 23, 2015 3:00 am at 3:00 am #1098182JosephParticipant
Abba, where does Rav Moshe prohibit deodorant?August 23, 2015 9:10 am at 9:10 am #1098183old manParticipant
How interesting to see that the participants here are performing figure eights in order to throw out a beferush Mechaber, Rama, and Reb Moshe on the grounds that this halachah is outdated, old fashioned and irrelevant in our modern times. Sounds very much like YCT pick and choose thinking that we all love to despise. I would suggest you all look in the mirror to see your hypocrisy, but alas, the Mechaber assurs that too.August 23, 2015 10:41 am at 10:41 am #1098184
I wrote: Why? Is there a mitzvah to have gray hair?
Daas Moshe responded: No, but that doesn’t mean there’s no issur of beged isha to dye it black.
You also said that restoring hair to its natural color may be assur. I would like to know your reasoning.August 23, 2015 1:06 pm at 1:06 pm #1098185
Flatbusher, what do you mean my reasoning? it’s a halachah in Shulchan Aruch, and the Igros Moshe which old man quoted (which I linked) says outright that the medication (vitamins?) which he assered restored the original color.
If you want to be dan the individuals you see l’kaf z’chus, you can assume they did it to get a job, which R’ Moshe is mattir if there’s no ona’ah.August 23, 2015 1:23 pm at 1:23 pm #1098186🍫Syag LchochmaParticipant
Old man- thank you, I was wondering about that too.
A relative of mine was told he could not dye his grey hairs even after it was given more than once as the reason for rejecting the shidduch. (Personally, I think his grey hairs on him weren’t the problem. I think the girls wanted to believe they were still 20 year olds dating other 20 year olds.)August 23, 2015 1:33 pm at 1:33 pm #1098187
Old man, I don’t think it’s fair to compare lack of knowledge (CR posters) to deliberate twisting of halachah to fit modern sensibilities (YCT).August 23, 2015 1:33 pm at 1:33 pm #1098188zahavasdadParticipant
Sometimes Halcha does change because of new information, Rav Moshe assured heart transplants because he felt it was murder and there was a low survival rate when this tshuva was written (I think it was from the 1960’s when the operation was just in its infancy)August 23, 2015 1:54 pm at 1:54 pm #1098189HealthParticipant
Syag Lchochma -“A relative of mine was told he could not dye his grey hairs even after it was given more than once as the reason for rejecting the shidduch”
Do the girls reject gray hair in the beard or only in the hair?August 23, 2015 2:01 pm at 2:01 pm #1098190🍫Syag LchochmaParticipant
I wouldn’t really know.i guess it depends how deep their denial runs.August 23, 2015 2:16 pm at 2:16 pm #1098191Happy Go Lucky!!Participant
Color of hair??
I know of someone, in his forties, vigorous, energetic, vivacious, with a complete white beard. His older brother, a slouch, has a few white hairs…August 23, 2015 2:44 pm at 2:44 pm #1098192👑RebYidd23Participant
I know of someone who had gray hair in his twenties.August 23, 2015 3:25 pm at 3:25 pm #1098193yehudayonaParticipant
I had gray hair in my 30s. I was told that my father had gray hair even earlier.
I’m skeptical of the idea that Grecian Formula restores the original color. That would imply that the composition of gray hair differs depending on the person’s pre-gray color. A little googling reveals that Grecian Formula smells terrible, contains lead, and you’re only supposed to wash your hair once a week when you use it. Ugh.August 23, 2015 4:04 pm at 4:04 pm #1098194JosephParticipant
I know someone whose hair was white at his bar mitzvah.August 23, 2015 4:48 pm at 4:48 pm #1098195
“what is considered beged ish/isha can change based on societal norms. For example, he told me that pants are no longer considered beged ish.”
Fedora hats were originally beged ishah (and a political statement in favor of licentiousness) but today they are widely accepted in the frum world.August 23, 2015 4:49 pm at 4:49 pm #1098196
“assured heart transplants because he felt it was murder”
If you hold that halachic death is anything other than brain death, heart transplant does require murdering the donor.August 23, 2015 4:51 pm at 4:51 pm #1098198
One concern not mentioned so far: Many hair dyes contain coal tars, which cause cancer.August 23, 2015 8:59 pm at 8:59 pm #1098199shuliParticipant
A huge amount of hair dye product contain chemicals linked to cancer. If you get ‘all natural’ and ‘organic’ hair dye (read: expensive) it shouldn’t be a problem.
I’ve used hydrogen peroxide to bleach my hair, it’s great. Highlights look more natural if done this way instead of using a dyeing kit, and it doesn’t have all that toxic stuff.
And about men going grey young, what about losing their hair altogether? Is it muttar for a man to get treatment to regrow his hair, or is that considered a woman-thing?August 23, 2015 10:36 pm at 10:36 pm #1098200
Just because it says organic does not mean it does not contain coal tar, a natural substance.August 24, 2015 6:12 pm at 6:12 pm #1098201screwdriverdelightParticipant
old man: throw out a beferush Mechaber, Rama, and Reb Moshe
A beferush Reb Moshe?? What’s that?August 25, 2015 1:33 pm at 1:33 pm #1098202
OK, so what is the concern that would lead to the psak that men coloring hair is beged isha? How is this connected to the original issur of beged isha?August 25, 2015 4:46 pm at 4:46 pm #1098203mentsch1Participant
Beged Isha includes all activities normally reserved for women. The poskim include hair coloring. If you wanted to wax your chest it would probably also fall into this category etc.
When I was in yeshiva I knew two guys that had white patches in their hair. Both asked shaylos about coloring for shiddichum. They asked two different poskim. Both said assurAugust 26, 2015 12:51 pm at 12:51 pm #1098204
Mentsh: But in this day and age hair coloring is no longer reserved for women. Also, that doesn’t answer the question about the concern that led to the issur and how hair coloring for men extends to it. Is it a concern that if men color their hair, they may…do what?August 26, 2015 1:01 pm at 1:01 pm #1098205
Flatbusher, why do you assume that it must be assur out of concern that it will come to a different issur?
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