Frum Men Who Color Their Hair

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  • #616236

    flatbusher
    Participant

    I have noticed a number of frum guys who appear to be coloring their hair. I don’t recall if it is mutar or assur, In any case, anyone out there who colors his hair, and if so, why, and how do you get it done? I know there is a product called Grecian Formula, which doesn’t color the hair but is a clear liquidt contains an ingredient that restores the hair to its natural color; it is not a dye.

    #1098154

    zahavasdad
    Participant

    Do you mean color their hair the normal color it was before it was grey or coloring it a crazy color like bleeching it.

    #1098155

    golfer
    Participant

    No comment.

    Just checking in to wonder-

    Might there be a correlation between the name of the OP and the observation of the OP?

    #1098156

    Health
    Participant

    You have to ask a Shailah. I heard it’s Mutter in some instances.

    #1098158

    technical21
    Participant

    golfer- I am assuming that you are not from Flatbush. That comment was uncalled for.

    #1098159

    benignuman
    Participant

    I am pretty sure the Rambam says that it is asur but it depends on societal norms. Ask a shailah halacha l’maysah.

    #1098160

    flatbusher
    Participant

    Golfer, can you explain what you mean?

    #1098161

    apushatayid
    Participant

    just my two cents. people notice too many things about other people.

    #1098162

    Abba_S
    Participant

    I am not a Posek, but if he is dyeing his hair to look younger in order to get a wife or for business purposes it may be permissible otherwise not. But ask a posek, he is better informed as to how to answer this question

    #1098163

    newbee
    Member

    apushatayid: “just my two cents. people notice too many things about other people.”

    Yea, like noticing how other people notice too many things.

    #1098164

    yaakov doe
    Participant

    Ive seen a lot of brightly colored hair recently, green, orange, red, purple, but never on a frum man.

    #1098165

    👑RebYidd23
    Participant

    Was it on a frum person?

    #1098166

    Matan1
    Participant

    Is a woman allowed to color her hair?

    #1098167

    Abba_S
    Participant

    Matan 1

    A woman can dye her hair.

    Flatbusher

    If the product is not a dye but just rejuvenates the hair to it’s original color it would be permitted. But since people will THINK that he dyed his hair it maybe prohibited. A posek is needed to decide this matter

    Reb Yid

    Yes the question is referring to a Frum Male Jew

    #1098168

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Considering the fact that the issue is beged isha, yes, a woman is permitted.

    I don’t think restoring the original color is any better.

    #1098169

    old man
    Participant

    Sorry to disappoint all of you MO mekillim who think this issue is debatable.

    The Shulchan Aruch explicitly prohibits this action, see YD:182:6

    In addition, Reb Moshe zt”l prohibits even oral medication to achieve the same effect.

    See Igros Moshe,YD:82

    #1098170

    DaMoshe
    Participant

    I was once told by my Rosh Yeshiva, R’ Bender shlita, that what is considered beged ish/isha can change based on societal norms. For example, he told me that pants are no longer considered beged ish. It would seem that since it’s normal for men to dye their hair nowadays, it would be allowed.

    #1098171

    flatbusher
    Participant

    Daas Yachid sayid: “I don’t think restoring the original color is any better.”

    Why? Is there a mitzvah to have gray hair?

    #1098172

    apushatayid
    Participant

    “Yea, like noticing how other people notice too many things.”

    Sometimes you cant help but notice certain things, like the statement “I have noticed a number of frum guys…”. Personally, I’d be hard pressed to say with 100% certainty the hair color of my Rav, those who sit near me in shul or the yid who owns the local grocery. Sure, if he showed up next shabbos with fire truck red hair, I would notice, but only because his choice of color is screaming out loud “look here!”.

    #1098174

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Why? Is there a mitzvah to have gray hair?

    No, but that doesn’t mean there’s no issur of beged isha to dye it black.

    DaMoshe, that’s true in some cases, not all.

    #1098175

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Newbee, if noticing what someone writes on the CR is a problem, we’re all guilty.

    #1098176

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant
    #1098177

    oomis
    Participant

    If someone is trying to defraud someone whether in business or looking for a shidduch, by dyeing the hair to appear younger, it would seem to be assur. But many young men go gray prematurely. Why should a 30 year old man feel uncomfortable around people, just by virtue of having gone gray 20 years sooner than most? And if he is not married, it can be a real hindrance. And why should someone in the workforce have to compete with younger-looking men, in a place where youth and vitality are prized, and age is devalued?

    These are issues that were not as prevalent centuries ago. If someone dyed his hair, it often was for arayos of some type, or Avoda Zara. Not so, today. People just do not want to feel old. A more youthful appearance helps.

    #1098178

    screwdriverdelight
    Participant

    oomis, it is muttar for bachelors to dye their white hairs.

    and it’s muttar to dye black hairs white.

    #1098179

    oomis
    Participant

    to dye black hairs white. “

    Why would anyone WANT to???????? I knew about the bachelors, 🙂 .

    #1098180

    newbee
    Member

    “Newbee, if noticing what someone writes on the CR is a problem, we’re all guilty.”

    Yes, but I am not the one who was critical of someone specifically for being critical of others. (Thats how I took the comment)

    “just my two cents. people notice too many things about other people.”

    I took this to mean the OP was wrong for noticing these things

    #1098181

    Abba_S
    Participant

    Old Man

    Rav Moshe wrote that answer over 60 years ago. Do you use deodorant, because back then it was prohibited as perfume, for the same reason.

    Sixty years ago the elderly were respected now a days it’s the youth that are respected. So at least in business, to get a job or make a sale you need to have a youthful appearance, which is why some people dye their hair.

    #1098182

    Joseph
    Participant

    Abba, where does Rav Moshe prohibit deodorant?

    #1098183

    old man
    Participant

    How interesting to see that the participants here are performing figure eights in order to throw out a beferush Mechaber, Rama, and Reb Moshe on the grounds that this halachah is outdated, old fashioned and irrelevant in our modern times. Sounds very much like YCT pick and choose thinking that we all love to despise. I would suggest you all look in the mirror to see your hypocrisy, but alas, the Mechaber assurs that too.

    #1098184

    flatbusher
    Participant

    I wrote: Why? Is there a mitzvah to have gray hair?

    Daas Moshe responded: No, but that doesn’t mean there’s no issur of beged isha to dye it black.

    You also said that restoring hair to its natural color may be assur. I would like to know your reasoning.

    #1098185

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Flatbusher, what do you mean my reasoning? it’s a halachah in Shulchan Aruch, and the Igros Moshe which old man quoted (which I linked) says outright that the medication (vitamins?) which he assered restored the original color.

    If you want to be dan the individuals you see l’kaf z’chus, you can assume they did it to get a job, which R’ Moshe is mattir if there’s no ona’ah.

    #1098186

    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    Old man- thank you, I was wondering about that too.

    A relative of mine was told he could not dye his grey hairs even after it was given more than once as the reason for rejecting the shidduch. (Personally, I think his grey hairs on him weren’t the problem. I think the girls wanted to believe they were still 20 year olds dating other 20 year olds.)

    #1098187

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Old man, I don’t think it’s fair to compare lack of knowledge (CR posters) to deliberate twisting of halachah to fit modern sensibilities (YCT).

    #1098188

    zahavasdad
    Participant

    Sometimes Halcha does change because of new information, Rav Moshe assured heart transplants because he felt it was murder and there was a low survival rate when this tshuva was written (I think it was from the 1960’s when the operation was just in its infancy)

    #1098189

    Health
    Participant

    Syag Lchochma -“A relative of mine was told he could not dye his grey hairs even after it was given more than once as the reason for rejecting the shidduch”

    Do the girls reject gray hair in the beard or only in the hair?

    #1098190

    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    I wouldn’t really know.i guess it depends how deep their denial runs.

    #1098191

    Happy Go Lucky!!
    Participant

    Color of hair??

    I know of someone, in his forties, vigorous, energetic, vivacious, with a complete white beard. His older brother, a slouch, has a few white hairs…

    #1098192

    👑RebYidd23
    Participant

    I know of someone who had gray hair in his twenties.

    #1098193

    yehudayona
    Participant

    I had gray hair in my 30s. I was told that my father had gray hair even earlier.

    I’m skeptical of the idea that Grecian Formula restores the original color. That would imply that the composition of gray hair differs depending on the person’s pre-gray color. A little googling reveals that Grecian Formula smells terrible, contains lead, and you’re only supposed to wash your hair once a week when you use it. Ugh.

    #1098194

    Joseph
    Participant

    I know someone whose hair was white at his bar mitzvah.

    #1098195

    charliehall
    Participant

    “what is considered beged ish/isha can change based on societal norms. For example, he told me that pants are no longer considered beged ish.”

    Fedora hats were originally beged ishah (and a political statement in favor of licentiousness) but today they are widely accepted in the frum world.

    #1098196

    charliehall
    Participant

    “assured heart transplants because he felt it was murder”

    If you hold that halachic death is anything other than brain death, heart transplant does require murdering the donor.

    #1098198

    charliehall
    Participant

    One concern not mentioned so far: Many hair dyes contain coal tars, which cause cancer.

    #1098199

    shuli
    Participant

    A huge amount of hair dye product contain chemicals linked to cancer. If you get ‘all natural’ and ‘organic’ hair dye (read: expensive) it shouldn’t be a problem.

    I’ve used hydrogen peroxide to bleach my hair, it’s great. Highlights look more natural if done this way instead of using a dyeing kit, and it doesn’t have all that toxic stuff.

    And about men going grey young, what about losing their hair altogether? Is it muttar for a man to get treatment to regrow his hair, or is that considered a woman-thing?

    #1098200

    charliehall
    Participant

    Just because it says organic does not mean it does not contain coal tar, a natural substance.

    #1098201

    screwdriverdelight
    Participant

    old man: throw out a beferush Mechaber, Rama, and Reb Moshe

    A beferush Reb Moshe?? What’s that?

    #1098202

    flatbusher
    Participant

    OK, so what is the concern that would lead to the psak that men coloring hair is beged isha? How is this connected to the original issur of beged isha?

    #1098203

    mentsch1
    Participant

    Flatbusher

    Beged Isha includes all activities normally reserved for women. The poskim include hair coloring. If you wanted to wax your chest it would probably also fall into this category etc.

    When I was in yeshiva I knew two guys that had white patches in their hair. Both asked shaylos about coloring for shiddichum. They asked two different poskim. Both said assur

    #1098204

    flatbusher
    Participant

    Mentsh: But in this day and age hair coloring is no longer reserved for women. Also, that doesn’t answer the question about the concern that led to the issur and how hair coloring for men extends to it. Is it a concern that if men color their hair, they may…do what?

    #1098205

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Flatbusher, why do you assume that it must be assur out of concern that it will come to a different issur?

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