May 1, 2015 2:00 pm at 2:00 pm #615614
Don’t say I didn’t warn you..May 1, 2015 2:04 pm at 2:04 pm #1075939JosephParticipant
They’re already here…May 1, 2015 4:01 pm at 4:01 pm #1075940be joyfulParticipant
Start working on your Bitachon & emunah in Hashem & once it has become a part of you then you will get to be the happiest person in the world.
A true person of Faith knows the mishna in pirkei Avos that says the good & bad is all for the good every minute of the day , 24-7. Every Nisayon that a person gets from Hashem & passes, brings him closer & closer to Hashem & every test that a person experiences gets harder & harder, but a person can never ask Hashem why something bad is happening, because we all know that if a person was not able to pass a test then Hashem would never give it to him. Nothing in the world will effect a person of Bitachon, no matter what happens, cause he knows that everything Hashem does is for the good. Do you know what the reward for being a person of Faith & trust is? The reward is worth more then all the money in the world, the reward is the gift of Happiness, you get to be the happiest person in the world cause nothing in the world will effect you. Now can you tell me a better reward then that?.May 1, 2015 4:28 pm at 4:28 pm #1075941HaLeiViParticipant
You actually sound like someone without Bitachon. You seem to give up before you start.May 1, 2015 5:27 pm at 5:27 pm #1075942
be joyful.. I did warn you…May 1, 2015 6:13 pm at 6:13 pm #1075943
i had a friend who talks exactly like the above post (read- memorized the same book). Then one day she did something very hurtful to me and knows im upset but never bothered apologizing. I guess she believes that it was Hashem’s doing and if i didn’t deserve it it wouldnt have happened.
always gave lots of talks about “not getting angry with the stick” but rather look at Who holds the stick. so i guess she used it the other way too. “Nothing in the world will effect a person of Bitachon, no matter what happens, cause he knows that everything Hashem does is for the good”. that means (to her) that even if she is the one who causes the bad, she owes no reparation cuz it was Gds idea and it must have been good!
Even great concepts can be bantered and misused…May 1, 2015 6:42 pm at 6:42 pm #1075944be joyfulParticipant
no she still needs to do teshuva.
only if her gift of FREE-WILL was taken away from her & she does not have it anymore is she not responsible from doing teshuva.
the choice is yours in every deal or option to do the mitzvah or sleep late & miss out on the mitzvah. same with a sin…
If Hashem would not have created every person with the gift of free-will then the world cannot exist.May 1, 2015 7:00 pm at 7:00 pm #1075945
i am well aware that she still needs to apologize, but she who spent months and years internalizing that same book has absorbed the idea that everything is so thouroughly in Hashem’s hands that all she needs to do is sit and smile about it and pass on those words to others. There needs to be more with that. Trying to sell emunah and bitachon as an elixir that “frees you of pain and suffering” is invalidating all the pain of the people you are speaking to. That level of painlessness is so high up there that it is a dream.
Teaching the importance of emunah and bitachon needs to validate the pain and suffering, but at the same time explain the importance and benefit of perspective. Know that your pain is for a purpose and that there is always a bigger picture. Know that if you had clarity you would be free of this pain. Know that you are never alone in your suffering because Gd has only given you that which He KNOWS is to your benefit. Know these things and strive for clarity which will bring peace of mind. That is sooo much different than humming a mantra that your pain is all an illusion because everything is good.May 1, 2015 7:19 pm at 7:19 pm #1075946JosephParticipant
Syag: Does she agree with you that when you were hurt that she wrong you (and thinks you should smile it away) or does she think she didn’t wrong you?May 1, 2015 7:55 pm at 7:55 pm #1075947
it’s hard to know for sure.
she called me one day and after a bit of schmoozing delivered a threatening message from someone that she knew i had no interest in engaging with (we do a lot of community work together with people with very complex situations). I asked her why she would pass such a message, why she would call on the premise of friendship with such a message, why she would deliver such a message knowing the implications (she knew that I now could not avoid confrontation by claiming I never got the message). each remark was met with something to the effect of “yup, kinda crazy” “yes, he can be unreasonable” etc. never seeming to absorb what i was saying to her so clearly (i believe it was very clear).
the next time she saw me was in passing and she said she’d be in touch, to which i responded, “about what, exactly?” She understood what i meant, and that i was still hurt, and hasn’t called me since.
so you have a good question, and the person she was before she become “free of pain and suffering” would have called me back that night to see if there was something she did wrong or something that needed to be rectified. The person she became (long before our interaction) is the one who shrugged sadly and walked away, seemingly hoping that i would learn to accept that all hurt is Hashem’s doing. it says to me that sometimes things get internalized to your outsides instead of your insides.May 1, 2015 9:40 pm at 9:40 pm #1075948
SL- look i no fan of these books but just because this friend of yours warped it to her likng doesnt necessarily mean the book itself is bad. Also , lots of times someone reading a book like this has a pre existing condition and the book isnt the cause of theyre craziness, its their craziness riding the book.May 1, 2015 9:47 pm at 9:47 pm #1075949
oyy – 100%. It is not necessarily the book, it’s the attitude the above poster developed, very similar to that developed by others who read it. Many people don’t use it that way, as you said, and it is life changing. That friend is one of many, many examples people who seem to be using it as a hallucinogen and have done themselves damage (such as stopping medication). I referred to the book, but i thought i mentioned that it was the misperception of the lessons learned from it and the way they are disseminated that are the problem.May 3, 2015 5:33 am at 5:33 am #1075950
Right on! To bring oneself to any sublime, lofty level is one thing. To demand it in someone else, or to justify someone else’s pain and suffering is wrong and can ?”? have bad repercussions. I’ve just read such a story, where one was ????? ???? of his friend’s loss, and thereby suffered greatly himself. A Tzaddik told him that by justifying someone else’s pain he brought forth a powerful ????? on himself. So yes, talking it over, discussing, comforting, consoling, sharing and feeling with the sufferer is commended. Expecting the he/she live and act according to your sublime levels attainments is wrong.
Just sayin’, but I didn’t read in your story that you told her of your hurt. Sometimes some people have to be told, yes, even the most obvious. This week’s Parsha talks about it specifically – ???? ????? ?? ????? ??? ??? ???? ???, according to some Meforshim it’s referring to sins between fellow Jews, to tell off one another verbally and not hold a grudge – ?? ???? ?? ???? ??????. To rebuke, reproach verbally, get it out, bring about an apology, closure, brings Shalom, peace.May 3, 2015 2:33 pm at 2:33 pm #1075951oomisParticipant
Only Hashem does things that are always for our good, whether or not we recognize that good. People, however, who have Free Will, make bad choices to act independently, and they cannot use the excuse, “Hashem Made me do it!” Their intentions can be for something other than our good, or we would not need mitzvos to help keep us on the right track.May 3, 2015 7:45 pm at 7:45 pm #1075952
Syag – Obviously I don’t know the story here but is it possible that when she delivered that threatening message to you from the other person, she thought she was giving you a head’s up and protecting you?
From your posts, it sounds like she has no clue that she hurt you. You asked her why she would would tell you such a thing but maybe it didn’t register to her that you are actually upset. Did you say outright that you are upset? Some people need it to be spelled out for them (slow learners).
I also don’t get the connection between the book (and its messages) to your story. It doesn’t sound like she had that in mind when she gave you the message. Maybe I’m just totally missing something.
Anyway, lots of times people hurt you and don’t even realize it. Maybe she just realizes from your comments that she made a poor choice in repeating the convo to you. I don’t know. Just guessing here. Some ppl are clueless and others don’t know how to apologize.
I had situation a few years ago where someone got SO ANGRY with me and I honestly did nothing to hurt her. She misunderstood the whole thing. She called me up screaming at me at the top of her lungs. Never had anyone done that to me! She later told me she knew she was wrong and should apologize to me but wasn’t ready yet. She was never ready. She is now no longer among the living. At least it turned out that we were on speaking terms (we were in a store together and just started talking then she invited me to her simchas again) before she passed a away (btw- she wasn’t sick- it was sudden) but she never apologized. I did find it in my heart to forgive her after she passed away. Did it for myself and for her neshama.
Maybe spell it out for this person – give her one more chance to apologize. It’s scary to think it could be too late one day. Anyway, I don’t know how much this person means to you so it’s your call if you want to write her off or try to be friends again (it also depends how close you were with her).
In any case – hatzlacha rabba – and may you only be surrounded with true friends and family who only have your best interest at heart. <3May 3, 2015 9:14 pm at 9:14 pm #1075953
thank you all for your caring posts. i think the thread took a wrong turn, tho.
i guess i can clarify a few things:
i didnt feel it was necessary to relay any more details of the story than i did, as it was already too long. What I meant by
She understood what i meant, and that i was still hurt, and hasn’t called me since
was that she understood what i meant and that i was still hurt. I didn’t include the whole exchange, which is why you may feel like it wasn’t clear, but that was why i mentioned that it was clear.
also, i am not agonizing over this friendship or hoping for resolution. the fact of the matter is that what this friend has ‘morphed’ into is not really anyone i have much common ground with and im more than fine with it as is.
My only point was to the now blocked poster, that her approach was incorrect and potentially hurtful. It is never your job to tell someone else that they are in pain due to inadequecies in their bitachon, or to make it seem like living a pain free life is just around the corner. I then brought my story in to show how far this approach can go, to the point that one doesn’t even need to take responsibility for themselves because everything is from Gd.
Oomis said it well (as she so often does) and i would take it even further. Not only do you not say “Hashem made me do it”, but i was hearing, “Hashem wanted this to happen to you”. There are productive ways to express these points and that isnt one of them.May 4, 2015 1:18 am at 1:18 am #1075954
Just saw one of ur sons (don’t ask me which one – no idea) at great chicago. Speaking of this thread going way off track 😉May 4, 2015 2:00 am at 2:00 am #1075955
yes, he just told me, lol. i hope he was using silverware.May 4, 2015 2:15 am at 2:15 am #1075956
LOL. I only saw that he and another boy were having a deep discussion about sports with Rabbi F. (you know who that is, right?)
Besides – who uses silverware at gr8 chic? mostly finger food, no? 😉May 4, 2015 2:17 am at 2:17 am #1075957
?May 4, 2015 2:30 am at 2:30 am #1075958
ah, just ‘chaped’! He is always talking about him. They seem to have some ongoing sports ‘thing’ going between them.
😉May 4, 2015 3:13 am at 3:13 am #1075959147Participant
Happy Times Are Coming…
1) Lag b’Omer
2) Yom Yerusholayim
3) Shovu’osMay 4, 2015 3:23 am at 3:23 am #1075960👑RebYidd23Participant
NotMay 4, 2015 3:58 pm at 3:58 pm #1075961
147: You forgot July 4th..May 4, 2015 6:51 pm at 6:51 pm #1075962
not a pun guy but cmon froggie, HOPPY?May 4, 2015 7:15 pm at 7:15 pm #1075963
You’re right, they should change my subtitle to “Keeps the CR peoplach HOPPY!!
But anyways I just had to post after your’s, because it doesn’t look proper in the main page. It reads: Happy times are coming……oyyoyyoy.
Take it from me, it’s not so bad.May 5, 2015 12:07 am at 12:07 am #1075964
emoji smiley face guyMay 5, 2015 1:50 am at 1:50 am #1075965147Participant
You forgot July 4th.. Little Froggie:- I am so glad to infer that you are so convinced that Moshiach will have arrived prior to Shiva Ossor b’Tamuz, because if Chas veSholom this weren’t so, how could you Little Froggie consider July 4th to be a good thing? considering that both this year & in 1776, July 4th is Shiva Ossor b’Tamuz [albeit not observed until next day if Chas veSholom Moshicah hasn’t arrived yet], but given that Moshiach shall have arrived by then, then the Sosson & Simcha of Shiva Ossor b’Tamuz shall be Shabbos compliant and we all look forward to July 4th Shiva Ossor celebrations.May 5, 2015 2:41 am at 2:41 am #1075966
Well maybe you could be doche Shiva Ossor for July fourth because it’s an ?????? ??????, the United States started to let in Yidden, to let them finally have a safe haven until the real Moshiach comes… something really to celebrate…May 6, 2015 4:19 am at 4:19 am #1075967nisht gedaiget yiddenMember
I am happy! There are so many new threads and posts to read in the CR! It makes my day more enjoyable! Thanks guys for allowing me to read your entertaining rambeling ons! Greatly appreciated folkies!May 6, 2015 5:29 am at 5:29 am #1075968
I just know you mean me!!!May 6, 2015 10:51 pm at 10:51 pm #1075969screwdriverdelightParticipant
At last! I’ve been waiting for them since this thread
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