April 25, 2012 2:22 am at 2:22 am #603091cooljudeMember
Im a midteen in a regular bais yaakov and lately ive been having some issues. I dont appreciate and love being a bas yisroel. I think the only thing stopping me from going otd is that i hv no frnds like that. while my community is very open minded, i feel like i could use a lil more thrill in my life. can someone pleeeaseee help me before its too late?April 25, 2012 2:36 am at 2:36 am #870474147Participant
Go & meet Rebbetzen Esther Jungreis at Hineni; They are located on West End Avenue between W 71st & W 70th Street. She lectures there every Thursday evening @8PM, but no-doubt you can set up an appointment with her sooner, if this is urgent.
She has dealt with issues similar to your’s, numerous times.
If for some reason this doesn’t work out, touch base with Rav Jonathan Rietti shlita or Rav Dovid Goldwasser shlita or both, for advice & suggestions.April 25, 2012 2:41 am at 2:41 am #870475popa_bar_abbaParticipant
Talk to your parents about it.April 25, 2012 2:51 am at 2:51 am #870476
I actually feel i am in a similiar situation! I dont have anythign against by,or yiddeshkeit for that matter, i love it, it just seems hard when you feel that you are at it alone! My school gives so much homework i can never do anything with my family, so i am soooo bored!!! I feel that( in my community at least) there are always some contest or something for boys and never for girls, its like they think that girls are busy learning how to cook and clean, if nothing exciting starts to happen or be allowed in my community there will be a lot of us feeling this way, i know that for a fact!April 25, 2012 3:06 am at 3:06 am #870477dhl144Member
Hi you are frum bh and you know that your purpose in this world is to serve Hashem i never had thoughts to go off but I cud hear where your coming from that you want thrill as a matter of fact I was just thinking about that 2day that if I wasnt religious maybe my life would be more fun but you gotta keeep telling yourself and engraining it that you know why your here Think of fun things that u can do and do creativve things maybe get involved with chesed Could u ask more specific questions? i would like to help.April 25, 2012 4:49 am at 4:49 am #870478mommamia22Participant
Why do you think going OTD is the only way to have excitement and fun in your life?
I think you need to think about what you consider fun and try to fit that into the context of a frum life.
It sounds like you equate being a bas yisrael with being very prim and proper (the opposite of what you perceive as thrilling). Being appropriate and doing things that are thrilling are not mutually exclusive. I think you need to find people who can be good role models for you of being frum and having fun (sometimes thrilling) lives.
You need to find people who are non-judgemental, perhaps people used to dealing with baalei teshuva who’ve heard it all and can guide you properly.April 25, 2012 6:17 am at 6:17 am #870479
mommamia22- it is not so easy I have actually tried to have role models but they didnt work, i had 2 diffrent ones around the same time, and in the middle they just dropped me if i wasnt having trouble before then it was harder after ! It is not easy to trust in someone again, i thought i picked wisely turns out i was wrong! I dont think it is neccasarlily frum or have fun, you can have them together but what can you do? in my community atleast, when you do something diffrent it is unbeleivable, and horrible! Tell me if you where a teenage girl what would you do for fun?April 25, 2012 7:44 am at 7:44 am #870480jmj613Participant
it takes alot of understanding and emnua to keep oneself on the yiddishkeit track everyday. i fully understand that. been and maybe am in ur place myself. but im older and can tell you that almost every action you take as a teen can have tremendous consequences later on when your grown up and see things in diffrent light.
its deff good to speak to someone about it. maybe even more than once. never forget that lemaase your never alone. reach out and keep on g(r)o(w)ing. Good LUCK to youApril 25, 2012 1:49 pm at 1:49 pm #870481BTGuyParticipant
I can only offer a little perspective I have come across working with teens in the public schools.
Goyish teenagers are distraught, confused, bored, etc..etc… In fact, they have a high rate of, chas veshalom, running away from home, drug abuse, alcohol abuse, getting involved with criminal activities, fighting, and random exploitation of hedonistic activities that do not lead to fulfillment. In many cases, it leads them to depression or a rehab or counseling.
The percentage of non-Jewish teens involved with such activities is VERY high. The rehabs, courts, etc, are flooded with such cases.
A frum teen should not think their age-related confusion is because they are frum. Being frum is a safety valve from going through the school of hard-knocks and learning things the hard way, like the situations I mentioned.
Frum teens should do a reality check and realize that what they think is the answer, is not. There are countless, countless teens free to live a life we would call OTD, and that life is very difficult for them.
Do not abandon building your Olam Haba thinking the grass in greener on the “goyish” side. Think about the problems going on with the kids in any public high school, and avoid making a foolish, or chas veshalom, painful mistake.
Hang in there, and Hatzlacha!April 25, 2012 5:46 pm at 5:46 pm #870482Be HappyParticipant
I think BT Guy has great advice. I also think you should take up a hobby eg learn the guitar – go to dance lassons, learn jewellery making – It helpsApril 25, 2012 6:50 pm at 6:50 pm #870483MDGParticipant
Nowadays, people need Torah and Mitsvot – not only for Olam Haba – but for Olam Hazeh also.April 25, 2012 7:20 pm at 7:20 pm #870484blinkyParticipant
Be happy- havent seen you post in awhile, hope all is well.(regarding our “conversation” last year…i wasn’t able to send an email) Is it still needed?April 25, 2012 7:21 pm at 7:21 pm #870485NechomahParticipant
What do you mean by you had two role models and they dropped you? A role model can be observed from afar without them really even knowing. Is your mother available to be a role model? Even reading books written by people whose lives you admire can give you a role model.
I totally agree with what BTGuy says, having come from that side of the grass also. There is simply no direction in life without Torah, no lasting goals, nothing to guide us and no role model for life (if that makes sense). Torah is eternal. Going OTD for lack of interest in what religious women do makes no sense because cooking and cleaning are done by goyish women as well.
What kind of excitement are you looking for? Can you find someone in your school who is willing to organize some kind of project/contest for the girls – Shmiras Haloshon, chesed, or something that would interest you and your friends? Try looking within before looking without to find solutions to your problems.April 25, 2012 7:22 pm at 7:22 pm #870486menucha12Member
being OTD ISNT FUN AT ALL your parent/child relationship goes down the drain and its a constent donward spiral that leads nowhere good
doing OTD things may look fun but it is plain pysical pleasure at some point the fun is over and you become shocked at where you landed
my friend from elementry also wanted fun and it started with hooka and has reached the point where she hates life has 8 holes in each ear has a smokers cough and comes to shul on YOM KIPPUR with low cut shirts and pants
there are so many gr8t outlets which i have found that are good
like dance lessons ,
voice lessons,guitar,piano,art,painting,baking,acting,roller blading,bowling,karate,self defence(super awesome),and even READING
(nothing personal but sometimes these feeling come from depression nothing hurts from going to counseling or trying some SAFE perscribed medications)
and above all dont DONT do anything that will change your future permenantly for example:tatoo,extra piercing,smoking,drugs etc.
good luckApril 25, 2012 10:22 pm at 10:22 pm #870487
Nechomah- what i needed was someone who i could talk to, about diffrent things in my life, and to just know that i could if i wanted to! I had that but then she didnt want anything to do with me, she stopped, i felt so hurt from her besides the taunting from my peers(they new of the relashenship)!! My mother actually doesnt understand the stuff I am feeling( didnt grow up frum) and she has a lot on her own plate right now! i do admire a certain writer but that doesnt help so much, i feel i need to vent, but i dont have anyone:( we already have chesed, and a shmeras halashon programs from school, but that isnt fun! Fun is being able to do a dance thing, or have a sports but we cant because NOT TZNIUS! i am not chas veshalom saying tznius is bad, but makes things difficult sometimes!!April 25, 2012 11:09 pm at 11:09 pm #870488zahavasdadParticipant
There was an article in the Jewish press a few weeks ago.
There was a Kiruv Rav who gave a speech to a mixed religious/ non religious audience and realized many of the FRUM people didnt really belive either.
And he wondered why this was. One of the things he mentioned was Tzniut. Some schools claim some things are Halacha Tzniut, but really are only Chumras. When the girls find out about this, they are not too happyApril 26, 2012 1:00 am at 1:00 am #870489mra01385Participant
cooljude: I strongly recommend that you start going to ohr naava, especially on Wed nights, and make an appt to speak with R Zecharia Wallerstein, or even R Skaist or R Miller. These are all great people who would give you their time, and very beneficial advice. Hatzlacha Rabbah!!April 26, 2012 1:39 am at 1:39 am #870490kapustaParticipant
cooljude, theres a difference between “not appreciating being a bas Yisrael” and “using a little more thrill” in life, but both can be fixed. Is there a teacher (or mentor) you’re close with? And hang in there. 🙂
aproudbyg, I’m sorry about what happened with your mentor. Do you have a teacher you feel comfortable talking to? mra01385 mentioned Rabbi Wallerstein, which is a great suggestion. If you can’t get to Ohr Naava, you can watch his Shiurim on TorahAnytime.com. (I’ve heard that he can not always respond to emails right away, but you can try Gateways which is online at asktherabbi.org) And you can always vent in the CR 🙂 Hang in there.April 26, 2012 2:13 am at 2:13 am #870491abcd2Participant
Rabbi Yaakov Salomon from aish hatora
Re:147 Rebbetzin Jungreis also a great suggestion but if you need someone right away it will be at least another week or two. Rebbetzin Jungreis was a speaker by a Pesach program in San diego and fell and fractured her hip very badly erev the second days (surgery was BH succesful)she will not be allowed to fly back to Ny till next week you can keep in mind Esther Bas MiriamApril 26, 2012 2:24 am at 2:24 am #870492
kapusta- thanks!!! happens to be the second teacher i talked about in the first post is my current teacher now, and she like the other one just dropped me, and started with another girl! dont think i drove them away! I just would talk with them in the hallway or in a classroom for 2 or 3 minuets, it was little but what i badly needed at that time!!! I think i am just to afraid to try to connect to a teacher in fear of being rejected again!!!
I do love yiddeshkeit, and being a by girl( look at username 🙂 ) I am not going of even chalila thinking of going otd, especially after seeing how it hurts my parents and others( my brother is currently otd) I just dont feel that I quite understand my current place in life(i know no teens do i mean diff,..) with things going on I just feel alone!April 26, 2012 2:44 am at 2:44 am #870493mr. awsumMember
i also felt (still a little) the same way. one of my siblings is OTD and i felt jealous of my sibling sometimes, my sibling was always out with friends and having fun etc… it seemed that my sibling had a better/funner life than me, and i am a frum by girl and school was hard then and then i was having a little social problem b”H im not any more and my sibling was having a fun life i was the ‘good’ one and i was having a harder life. one of my teachers in school said that even tho it seems they have a funner life they really don’t and i dont know i guess i just pulled thru b”H even tho sometimes i still think about it, im a little bit better now closer to Hashem (usually)
wow felt good to vend 😉
p.s i always read the cr i finally made an acc a few months ago but never posted now this i decided to maybe youll b seeing me a arnd sometimes now 😉April 26, 2012 3:23 am at 3:23 am #870494cooljudeMember
Thank you so much everyone! I rlly appreci8 it! If i wasnt clear enuf, its like this- i walk the walk and talk the talk and no one wld ever suspect nething but i feel spiritually dead. like im not even interested in growing. yes, i heard many of R. Wallersteins shiurim and theyre fantastic but i can listen to as many shiurim as i want but if i hv no desire to change, then i wont. And wen i say otd i dont mean like hit rock bottom; just a lil chillin and ya eventually come back… ya, i may be the worlds worst jew but im so guiltridden that i usually hv a hard time doing something that ik my parents wld rlly disapprove of. Thank you everyone:)April 26, 2012 3:37 am at 3:37 am #870495mommamia22Participant
I think the “right kind” of role model is someone who’s “weathered the same storm, and come out of it satisfactorily. I would imagine they’re more likely to be empathetic to your plight and not judgemental.
I don’t know why the previous role models ceased supporting you. That information was omitted from your post.
Maybe you could expand the realm of what’s accepted by coming up with creative options.
How about a weekend shabbaton at a girls camp (shira, chedva, sternberg), with a kumsitz, sports for the day…. With shiurim on Shabbos. Perhaps your school would consider that?
How about a fundraiser??? Big words to a struggling school. Try to come up with fun creative ideas to help the school make money ( A bake-a-thon, concert/show, Chinese auction, carnivals).
Have you spoken with the other girls in your class about this feeling of being constrained (meaning, if they’re feeling the same way)? There’s power in numbers. I think you’re best off approaching the administration as a group and not as an individual.April 26, 2012 5:47 am at 5:47 am #870496
mommamia22- actually a number of us feel that way, ( i know you are going to think that it is what all schools do but for us it is rea) our school tries to keep us busy with homework so we wont have time for other things!,( i have overhear the teachers saying it) I actually live in a smile town where eveyrones budget is very tight, how could i let people spend guilt money on us they cant afford?!?!?!
the one that is my teacher currently actaully is a very strong person, she has been through quite a few things and she is just a beatifull person, I wanted to be like her to pull throught, so I to get help from her! i cant find any other that would be “suitable” to ur description, i will just have to trudge forward, thats life, none said it was going to be easy!April 26, 2012 6:03 am at 6:03 am #870497Sam2Participant
Cooljude: Honestly, I’d recommend reading the Artscroll Chumash in English with their commentaries. There are some cool, fun, great, and enjoyable things in there that you can find how to fit into your daily life.April 26, 2012 7:18 am at 7:18 am #870498kapustaParticipant
If you can connect with your teacher, thats great. I understand that based on past experience, you feel uncomfortable, but if you’re cautious, you’ll be ok. 🙂 mommamia22 suggested a Shabbaton, and if you think that wouldn’t work, maybe it can on a smaller scale. Get creative! And maybe if enough people feel the same way, your school can get (a speaker like) Rabbi Wallerstein to come in.
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