October 18, 2010 1:39 am at 1:39 am #592663need clarificationMember
May one take fully cooked dry food out of the fridge on Shabbos day and place on a hot plate with no knobs or controls? It has always been my understanding that since a hot plate is not a conventional cooking method (i.e. people would generally not use for cooking) that it would be fine and from what I understand being that it is a unconventional cooking method “Yad Soledes Bo” would not even be applicable as well. This seems to be a very confusing and unclear topic and I was wonderingwhat others may know about this. Thanks.October 18, 2010 10:07 am at 10:07 am #703382
You really need to ask a Rav; it is a Machlokes of Modern Day Poskim, and we certainly cannot decide for you. Some believe that the hot plate is a normal method of cooking.October 18, 2010 11:43 am at 11:43 am #703383Dave HirschParticipant
Most Poskim hold that is it Aish. Reb Moshe in general holds that any method of cooking (even a microwave) is Assur.October 18, 2010 1:12 pm at 1:12 pm #703384oomisParticipant
Microwave would be assur anyway, because of the electricity.October 18, 2010 6:00 pm at 6:00 pm #703385
Why can’t you use electricity on shabbos (w/o sparks)?October 18, 2010 6:50 pm at 6:50 pm #703388October 18, 2010 7:09 pm at 7:09 pm #703389
Shouldnt, I was hoping for a better source then a chabad article (hint hint – the Chazon Ish.) 🙂
The ChazOn Ish says that completing a circuit is binyan. A single, unified device.
However, many poskim do not rule like the Chazon Ish; hence permitting usage of LED lights and the like, and electricity which does not involve sparks ( most do). But electricty unto itself, save for the Chazon Ish of Binyan which most poskim disagree with (R’ Moshe, R’ Shlomo Zalman ).
I recently spoke to a renowned Posek about opening a freezer (not dealing with the motor issue) and causing the LED lights to go on; he too permitted it.
Fluorescent lights, as well, would be permitted – but they have a sparker, hence certainly making them Aish. But the lights themselves would seem to be permitted (save for the Chazon Ish).
Practically, this has little application, as most electrical & motor appliances involve sparks at some point, and certainly in a D’Orayasah one would be wary of the words of the Chazon Ish, but I wanted to play Devil’s Advocate.October 18, 2010 7:41 pm at 7:41 pm #703391
I just am not a good writer and typist so I took the easy way out
and did a Google search, I had only two choices 1) from a xXX.edu 2)Chabad. I opted for Chabad I have gotten some pretty good stuff from them. Truth is I did not read this particular one.
As far as I know consensus is issur D’Rbanan. Your Rav was referring to a ???? ???? ??? ???? ??-? which is Mutar in a Issur D’Rabann (Pri Megadim ?)
In the case of a D’Orayasah the Chazon Ish is not a factorOctober 18, 2010 8:22 pm at 8:22 pm #703392AinOhdMilvadoParticipant
A few months ago I started getting a leak in my “water blech” (kedaira al gabai kedairah) and instead of replacing it I got a “plata” (Israeli electric hot plate).
I place right on top of my stove top burners, so there is nothing under it that can burn. It does get very (evenly) hot.
According to the Rav I spoke to in Israel if one wants to place (only dry) food on this plata on Shabbas morning, to warm for lunch, one can do so IF you have an upside pan or tray on the plata, and put your food on top of that.
Personally, I put my old (leaky) water blech (without any water of course) on top of the plata before Shabbas (it covers the whole surface of the plata) and place my food on top of that…
This solves TWO problems –
1) My food still gets plenty hot, but does not burn or get dried out, and
2) I can put (dry) food on it Shabbas morning.
BTW… Very few frum Israelis use our American style blech, MOST frum Israelis use a hot plate, and this is the accepted way of doing so.October 18, 2010 9:20 pm at 9:20 pm #703394
Which Drabban is it? The Posek I spoke to was not making a snif with psik resha. Without the Chazon Ish, there is no issur. Please tell me which Drabban it would fall under?
( Psik Reisha D’Lo Nicha Ley is a machlokes Rishonim (if it’s d’orasayah) and we pasken that it is a snif. )October 24, 2010 12:01 am at 12:01 am #703395need clarificationMember
Thank you for all your input.October 24, 2010 8:06 am at 8:06 am #703396rebdonielMember
R’ Yosef Dov Soloveitchik holds it is mutar.October 24, 2010 2:59 pm at 2:59 pm #703397
???’ ????? ???? ????
?’ ????’ ?”?
Since you have the resources please do a search on the topic at http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/some-basic-halacha-that-is-ignored-in-100-of-shuls-by-99-of-the-kahalOctober 24, 2010 10:30 pm at 10:30 pm #703398Yanky55Participant
HaRav Yosef Dov Soloveitchik has ruled that one may take cold dry food which is fully cooked out of the refrigerator and reheat it on the blech on Shabbos, provided that this food was on the blech as Shabbos began and was first removed on Shabbos.
In this case, returning the food to the blech (Hachzorah) is simply a continuation of the activity known as Shehiyah, that is, placing food on the fire before Shabbos and leaving it there until needed on Shabbos, which is permissible if there is a blech (See Shulchan Aruch Ibid. Sif 1). Regarding the other three conditions cited above, the aforementioned Ramo (Ibid.) quotes from the Ran that the last two, namely still having the pot in one’s hand and having the intent to return it, are not required when the food is removed from the blech on Shabbos and is to be returned on Shabbos. It appears that the Vilna Gaon (Biur HaGra to Sif 5 Ibid. s.v. U’Bilvad) as explained by the Mishnah Berurah in the Biur Halacha (Ibid. s.v. U’Bilvad), holds that in such a case, even the other condition, that the food must still be hot, is also not required if it’s a dry cooked food.
HaRav Soloveitchik extends this view to allow reheating on the blech a fully cooked solid food even if it has been completely cooled off in the refrigerator, because this is still just a continuation of the original Shehiyah.
It is noteworthy that Rav Ovadyah Yosef (Sheilos U’Teshuvos Yechaveh Da’as Chelek 2 Siman 45) allows this as well, but for a completely different reason.October 25, 2010 6:04 pm at 6:04 pm #703399rabbiofberlinParticipant
dear yanky55- thank you for your input. This is how I remember it too from my old days, with two “shinuyim”- are you saying that you can put the actual food (dry ,I imagine)back on the fire on the blech? I remember that we could only put it on the side to warm up- not directly on the fire. Maybe this is why R” Joshe Ber uses the logic of “shehyah” to allow that. (omly with dry food) Thanks for your input.
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