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After witnessing the ANTiFA and BLM riots to the recent college mobs(they’re all really the same), how can any Jew who isn’t a self-hater like Soros and Nadler still stick with the Democrats after a week of mob violence toward Jews to blinken saying they won’t support Israel entering Rafah(because winning elections is more important than a fellow Jews existence) to Biden denouncing islamophobia? There isn’t a good reason.
@lakewhut
From the Democrats / Leftists / Liberals that I came across on this site I created a list of groups that they can fall into (although some may fall into more than one):
1. Those that were voting Democrat for 50+ years and are in denial that their beloved party fell off the deep end.
2. Those that are willing to throw Hashem and the Torah under the bus for a couple of extra $$$ so they don’t need to work.
3. Those that don’t think for themselves and
4. Those that are only claiming to be a Democrat / Leftist / Liberal and post ridiculous stuff to make the party look bad.
Lakewhut doing the good work in changing hearts and minds on YWN
Its psychological.
1. For some Jews, they convince themselves that maybe the Jew-haters have a point. (Bibi is bad, Israel could do better, its those extreme right wingers, proprtionality, etc). These Jews feel that by publicly denouncing Israel, or at least by associating themselves with Dems, they will be perceived as being more American and less Israeli. They feel safer more secure in America this way.
2. For other Jews, the thought that a major American party is antisemitic is just too much to bear, so they are in denial, and convince themselves that all the Jew-hatred is just a small minority and a blip and that the right wingers are worse.
3. For other Jews, their hatred of Donald Trump is so great that they’ll vote instead even for Hitler, as long as it isn’t Trump.
I think we can all sympathize with the first group, although they are wrong in thinking that they will be safer if they publicly align themselves with the Dems.
The second group is in denial and needs emotional help.
The third group suffers from TDS. They are beyond hope. They are psychotic. (They also think a man can give birth)
I agree with you that people shouldn’t support the Democrats. Republicans have become the party of common sense on so many issues (gender, Israel, etc.)
But there are still moderate pro-Israel Democrats like Ritchie Torres and John Fetterman. And the fact is, some people will remain Democrats no matter what because it’s part of their identity or they care about particular issues the Democrats support.
Although the majority of frum Jews vote Republican, there are also plenty of us who vote Democrat. There are even Orthodox elected officials who are Democrats. I even know chassidim who vote Democrat and agree with them on most issues.
Our political diversity is important for people to know about, because there are some people who are on the road to becoming ba’alei teshuvah, and the one thing about their former lifestyle they won’t drop is their political opinions. That’s fine. They should feel welcome among us even if they vote Democrat.
Your comment is imbecilic. Any self respecting Jew would prefer John Fetterman and Josh Gotheimer over Tom Massie and Rand Paul. It’s time to move past FOX News talking points and educate yourself on the issues. And many Jews would obviously have serious misgivings supporting a candidate who unapologetically dines with Kanye and Fuentes. As Americans we should all be weary of a candidate who undermined and undermines the peaceful transfer of power and tried to force his VP to violate his oath to the constitution.
How come democrat and satan share the same gematria value?
Crazykanoi is in the third group cited by qwertyqwerty
Twenty one Democratic Congressmen signed a public letter spearheaded by Dan Goldman and Josh Gotheimer calling out Columbia University and it’s failure to dismantle the pro-Palestinian encampments. Meanwhile Trump says that people chanting “Genocide Joe” have a good point. Go educate yourself before you slander.
Vote Republican so that people like MAGA hero and Trump NSA director Mike Flynn who publicly call for a Christian America with only one religion can be given the levers of government power.
Yes crazykanoi,
They really made America a Christian country during Trump’s first term
I identify as non bidenary
What nonsense one guy posted in a previous post here. If a person is a Baal teshuva but still vote democrat then they are not a real Baal teshuva! They are frei in their mindset. WE DO NOT NEED people who say they became frum but still support (particularly the social and moral) democrat ideals. You can’t be frum and be pro acceptance of toeiva. Choose, but don’t you dare say that a person who started keeping Shabbos is frum if they support that.
Unless you are part of left wing modern orthodoxy which is not really orthodox, you are not welcome
I always considered myself a political independent. I would assess the candidates on their individual merits and ideas. I registered democrat in order to vote in a primary and I never got around to undoing it until January. After being disgusted with Schumer and the others I am formally unaffiliated again.
I recently read an article in a Jewish publication talking about how in every generation there are Jews that side against their own in order to be accepted by goyish society. The Jonathan Glazer’s of the world who disavow their Jewishness. The one’s who sided with the communists, the one’s who aligned with the Hellenists. To fit in, to have power, for selfish ends they turn their backs on the rest of us and on hashem. They are the wicked son.
I always assumed since one of our Democratic Senators was Jewish (I’m not in NY) it would be safe to vote for him. He’s one of us right? He’s a good guy right? He’d watch out for his own right?
Now I have no idea which way is up?! If I can’t inherently trust another Jew then who can I trust? Neither Trump nor Biden will protect us. If our Jewish congressional representatives like Schumer and Sanders act against us then who is with us?completely agree with you
MAGA darling Marjorie Taylor Greene voted no to the bipartisan house bill on antisemitism because she wants to protect her right and the right of her coreligonists to say that Jews killed their savior. It is a sad day when Jewish people chose to put their political affiliation ahead of their Jewishness. Yidden should not be Democrats or Republicans they should be Yidden only and vote on a case by case basis solely based on a proper evaluation of the issues.
@crazy
Have to disagree with you about hidden not being Democrats or Republicans.
Without party affiliation one loses a great deal of power. In most states primaries are not open to non-members of the party and you have no say in who is nominated to run for office.
I have repeatedly stated that all politics is local. I have been a member of my town’s Democratic Town Committee for years. I have been an elected member of town government. That could not have happened if I was unaffiliated.
I have been a delegate to the past twenty state conventions and 4 national party conventions. I have given up those seats and hope younger people get involved.I always vote candidate not party line, splitting my ballot.
I will vote against a particular candidate for President this year, but don’t consider myself a supporter of the other.
Unlike 2016 and 2020 I shall not contribute to a Presidential campaign fund@Yanky1988 You took Reagan’s 11th commandment a little too seriously. Voting Republican is not an actual commandment. Perhaps with more time their views will change, but either way of course they should start keeping shabbos! Why would you discourage someone? One is a mitzvah the other is an opinion on others’ aveyros. It’s like telling someone they shouldn’t keep kosher because they don’t think shoplifters should go jail.
Two words: Tucker Carlson.
crazykanoiy:
If you wish to comment on this forum, please restrict your comments to ad hominem attacks, sweeping generalizations, tribalism, and binary thinking.@Crazykanoiy you’ve clearly proved to everyone that you are but a simple troll, so no one has to take your words seriously or try to answer you.
@Shlomo2
😂🤣😂@Yanky1998 Your response is complete nonsense. Are you aware there are literally frum Democratic elected officials? That both Satmar rebbes officially endorsed Hillary for president? That polls of charedim show at least 20% vote Democrat? The idea that one must vote Republican to be a “real” ba’al teshuvah is completely ridiculous and absolutely false. People vote for all kinds of reasons. Political diversity is a fact of frum life and people need to be tolerant enough to accept that, even if it doesn’t make sense to you.
Someone who doesn’t think shoplifters should go to jail is an immoral human, and cannot be a baal teshuva. I have personally seen this in out of town communities, where some of these liberal “baalei teshuva” look frum but still think toeiva marriage should be legal and shoplifters should be given a break. The result when they send their kids to our yeshivos is that the kids get depressed, mixed up and at worst they could ruin other kids to think the way of their parents. WE HAVE STANDARDS, we do not want these hashkafos infiltrating into the frum society in the name of kiruv.
Every statement I made is a hard fact. Trump with Fuentes, MTG voting against antisemitism bill, Michael Flynn and one religion, 21 Democrats sending letter to Columbia. Sadly my detractors cannot address the points and instead continue to slander just like the person who made the grotesque statement to start this thread. What is even sadder is that one poster says one can’t be a baal teshuva if he votes Democrat. This is simply insane but sadly indicative of the MAGA illness that has taken over yiddeshkeit .The GOP does not stand for the zayin mitzvos. The GOP does not advocate banning the LGBTQ lifestyle. The Christian position on abortion is not synonymous with that of the Torah. One who supports the GOP is not a heretic because much of the GOP advocates for religion that according to many shitas is avodah zarah and one who supports Democrats is not a heretic because of Dem support for LGBTQ rights. The issue is not registering as part of a party for practical political gain the issue is when one’s identity becomes defined by a non-Jewish political philosophy. This is the churban of our time and this is what any self respecting Jew should abhor.
everything in Crazykanoiy’s last post is true. Marjorie Taylor Greene really did vote to protect antisemitism. She said she did so because she wants to protect the right to accuse Jews of murdering yashka.
When he says
This is absolutely true.
@yanky1998, Well, phrased that way I actually agree with you 98%.
However I’d still caution you are mixing up political parties and Jewish religious moral values.
Our moral values don’t change over time with “progress.” Political parties reflect what the majority of Americans support at any given time.For example, Republicans as a party don’t uniformly oppose gay marriage being legalized (that ship has sailed) and 20 years ago the democratic party generally did. Congress passed the Respect for Marriage Act because there was bipartisan support with 13 Republican senators and 39 Republican house members voting for it.
The republicans overall may be more in line with our traditional religious moral values, but don’t confuse that with thinking they represent Torah values. Party platforms are not written by Rabbanim. A blue state republican and a red state democrat may actually have a lot in common in what they support. The litmus test for frum morality should not be whom you vote for, but if you accept that morality is absolute and comes from hashem.
One could mistakenly think that @crazykanoiy would be honest and mention the rabid antisemites in the Democrat party like Rashida Tlaib, AOC, and Ilhan Omar.
But no…. he only mentions MTG.
The same MTG who, by the way, has a point. She doesn’t support antisemites or antisemitism. But she supports her right to practice her own religion. And her religion claims that Jews killed her savior, and she wants to be able to say that. I am also against that antisemitism bill that Congress passed, because it will eventually be used as a stepping board to pass a similar anti-LGBTQ bill. And if the anti-LGBTQ bill is worded similar to the anti-Semitism bill, we will no longer be allowed to bring a Chumash into a college, since the Chumash is anti-LGBTQ.
So, MTG has a very good point. It behooves, as frum Yidden who cherish the Chumash, to give consideration to her point. Many askanim have said the same thing.
But this is all besides the point. The main point is that @crazykanoiy for some strange reason, didn’t mention all the raging antisemites in his beloved Democrat party. I don’t know why. Maybe he’s hiding something? maybe he’s in denial? Or maybe he’s just plain psychotic and thinks a man can give birth. Who knows?Of course there are antisemites in the Democratic party. I in no way support Tlaib, Omar or Van Hollen. At the same time there are some excellent members of the Democratic party as well such as Gotheimer, Federman, Rosen and Goldman. The same holds true with the GOP there are the good guys like Mike Lawler and Dan Bacon and the antisemitic ones like MTG and Tom Massie. The extremes of both parties hold highly problematic positions. The centrists of both parties are generally reasonable and work hard to get things done. My only point is that political parties should not define the identity of a yid. We should be wise enough to see the pros and cons of the issues and decide accordingly and we should stay far away from the grotesque demagoguery of @lakewhut, @yanky1998, @qwetryqwetry.
The antisemitism bill is problematic, as it equates any, even legitimate criticism of Israel, to antisemitism…I believe as Americans we should be allowed to criticize any foreign country that we want to… Why would it be a normal thing to tell people they can’t criticize another country?
Yes a real BT is not someone who supports toeiva rights, that’s a fact. There are no frum people that support that, and if they do they are not frum. The two are mutually exclusive.
The frum politicians are not a rayah, they just joined that party to advance the goals of our communities, and do not actually believe in their policies. They are still wrong though, as per the horaah of rav Avigdor Miller ZTL and others, who said it’s a chillul Hashem to join that party
Hey Jackk and crazy, can you guys tell your buddies not to burn cop cars in Portland again, it makes you party apparatchik look bad.
I like how ctrlawyer is remaining silent in his mansion while the party he so supported burns the world down around him. Are you seeing the light yet buddy?
Lostspark,
You are more my buddy than any of these people.
These people have nothing to do with the Democrat party. CTL’s silence is not a proof .
If you are saying that voting republican is seeing the light than you live in darkness.“I will vote against a particular candidate for President this year, but don’t consider myself a supporter of the other.”
It’s people with your attitude who are destroying this country.
Jackk every time there is rioting in the streets or campuses it is said that is only a loud fringe minority, but yet when a loud fringe minority did J6 it was declared a pervasive indictment of the Rebublican party.
Am I wrong to believe at this point the ideological shift to the left on campus is pervasive at this point?
These people will be running the world in less than a generation’s time, these our our officers in the military, elected officials, scientists and doctors etc….
I do see hope in a small segment of the right, and no hope in the left.
I’m also glad we can be buddies, I do give you a hard time!
jackk,
You are a brown-shirted, kapo, quisling who always defends your woke, democrat, anti-Semite buddies like these antifa, BLM, Pali-loving terrorists. On November 5th, they’ll all vote democrat, just like you.
It’s been days since you’ve lectured us on how much the useless turd Brandon loves Jews. Are you the least bit shocked by his withholding vital information and arms from Israel, or are you going to insist as usual in your ugly mah-yafis fashion that it’s all Netanyahu’s fault?
@Lostspark
“when a loud fringe minority did J6 it was declared a pervasive indictment of the Rebublican party.”
One correction to what you wrote, it was an “indictment of the Republican PRESIDENT.” I don’t think it reflected poorly on the party, it wasn’t their rally beforehand.The ideological shift is pervasive among the youth and the left (including many Jews) and one of the major reasons I decided to move my affiliations further right politically and religiously. I could see the extremism that has infiltrated the old moderate left and count me out.
The youth hate Israel and the next generation of leftwing leaders will hate Jews by association which is terrifying. All leftwing movements these days are antisemitic BLM, MeToo, Critical Race Theory, DEI, BDS, etc. (Plus the woke crazies are nuts and a threat to all humanity.)
BUT the Jews have space lasers lady is definitely an antisemite. Antisemitism protected by religious freedom is still antisemitism.This country is sunk.
The flower girl from my wedding who’s all grown up and just started college at the exact wrong time has had to endure being robbed at gunpoint and hamas supporter rallies both right outside her dormroom.
The presidential election is anarchy vs. fascism. I want to vote 3rd party.@Lostspark
CTLawyer has substantially removed himself from most of social media.
Preoccupied with upcoming marriage and disposition of a lifetime of stuff in the compound before my relocation to NY.
Effective this year, I no longer active in politics.
There are more important things in my life at this time..That said, I will not vote for Trump but am not a Biden supporter this time around. Wish we had better choices this year.
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