October 29, 2008 8:44 pm at 8:44 pm #588467Joe SchmoMember
Anyone have any good ideas?October 29, 2008 9:15 pm at 9:15 pm #1216628
safeeyes.comOctober 29, 2008 9:29 pm at 9:29 pm #1216629halavaiMember
Number One: If you need to have internet in your home, get KosherNet or some other filtering program, a serious one that is not so easy for the to get around.
Number Two: If you have a study in your home to do your work, and the kids don’t enter that room, then keep the computer there; if you don’t have a study, keep the computer in a public area of the house where every can see what you’re doing, and set rules that the children cannot log on without adult supervision.October 29, 2008 11:13 pm at 11:13 pm #1216630marinerMember
if you have money, the best way would be to get a heavy duty firewall, which will allows for user settings. when you try to go to a site, the firewall login pops up. one of the best is sonicwall. it allows for users, and you can pay for services that block certain sites.October 30, 2008 12:04 am at 12:04 am #1216631T.BlackMember
Do not have a computer in your home.
Problem solved.October 30, 2008 1:27 am at 1:27 am #1216632
Why would you want to block the internet from your children? There is good and bad in everything. Do you know how many people are killed in cars each year? Maybe you should block people from using cars. You have to be sensible about it and monitor them while they use it. What makes it ok for you to use the internet but not your children?October 30, 2008 2:04 am at 2:04 am #1216633
“Do you know how many people are killed in cars each year? Maybe you should block people from using cars.”
we do that now, in every state. they’re called childrenOctober 30, 2008 2:20 am at 2:20 am #1216634
Zevi8, you sound like one of these liberal, openminded wannabes, who love to play the devils advocate!. YOu know good and well how much gross, dirty and immoral stuff can be accessed with the click of the mouse. Do you really want your children (or yourself) to be exposed to this even by mistake!!! What on earth are you saying? It says “Ain Apotropus L’Arayos”, even the holiest of holy can be caught in this trap, and you say you should trust your children?!!October 30, 2008 2:26 am at 2:26 am #1216635
I did not say you should trust them. Their internet activity should be monitored. You cant live in a bubble. They go outside, they see stuff you dont want them to see. If you sit here and ban everything like they do in Lakewood, eventually it will come back and bite you. Then you sit here and complain about your kids going off the “derech”. You push kids too hard, thats what happens.October 30, 2008 4:07 am at 4:07 am #1216636eric55Participant
i found this filter to work flawless and it has alot of options and its freeOctober 30, 2008 3:25 pm at 3:25 pm #1216637gavra_at_workParticipant
Get a Laptop with wireless (password protected).
Lock the router in the safe.
Home computer has no internet/wireless (remove USB cards from PC). Turn on wireless and use laptop for needed internet.
To monitor is a different issue.October 30, 2008 5:41 pm at 5:41 pm #1216638
ok heres wat i think if you want to keep your kids away from the terrible affect the internet can i have a few suggestions firstly if the envirement in the house is a solid torahdig one that will be a positive affect on your children however we live in a generation where watever is in the non jewish world seeps into the jewish world and we get trapped into it sometimes without even notiicing if you have the internet in your house that is a huge yetzer harah right there cuz your kids will say theyr going on to shop and could be thats where it will start but then slowly theyl be looking at different things that they probably shoulnt be im not saying this will for sure happen but it happens alot gradually if your child has already fallen into the trap and is going downward already my suggestion would be not to be very hard on her shel find her way back just tell her wat is right do it out of love and hopefully it will be okOctober 30, 2008 6:30 pm at 6:30 pm #1216639tzippiMember
Yes, Gila, whatever is in the outside world does tend to seep into the Jewish world, doesn’t it.October 30, 2008 6:43 pm at 6:43 pm #1216640
it 100% does its a sad realityOctober 31, 2008 2:11 am at 2:11 am #1216642teenagerMember
when i was younger, we had that we could only acsess the internet with a passwordOctober 31, 2008 1:43 pm at 1:43 pm #1216643
thats y kids tend to look at wrong things wen there is internetOctober 31, 2008 9:26 pm at 9:26 pm #1216644HashemYishmorMember
GILA: You would make it easier for everyone, and make yourself sound a lot more credible if you used some simple grammar rules. I am not talking about anything major, nor am I professing to have the best grammar in the world, but some periods, commas, writing the full word, and even the occasional capital word at the beginning of a sentence would go a long way towards making your posts more understandable. I am seriously just trying to be helpful, so please do not take this the wrong way.November 1, 2008 10:38 pm at 10:38 pm #1216645
I agree with zevi8. It’s impossible to shelter children from everything. And the likelihood of them accidentally stumbling upon some immoral site is slim to none. Websites with offensive material always have screens requiring the user to click a button certifying that he is over 18 and does not object to pornographic material before they show anything.
Feivel, just because children cannot operate cars does not mean that they are not in danger when they ride in them, even in booster seats. I currently live in Israel where the rate of car accidents is alarmingly high and injures a great number of children- just go look in Alyn Hospital, and you will see all the children who are mentally and physically handicapped from these accidents. Yet people still drive in Israel, and they still put their children in cars. The solution is not to stop driving, it is to drive less recklessly. So too, the solution here is not to block the Internet from children, but to find a working system of monitoring their usage of it.November 2, 2008 12:38 am at 12:38 am #1216646
I think that we are like minded in alot of areas. I live in Lakewood and the things i see everyday is just absurd. People here talk about how the internet is treif and they lock their kids out of it. These are the same people that dont use car seats for their kids, dont buckle up, smoke in front of their kids and let their kids just wander and play in the street. Somehow, these things to them are not a danger to their kids but using the internet is. I completely understand parents not wanting their kids to look at inappropriate things. You make rules, you monitor them. To completely ban something is just foolish. You cannot stop progress. Its been tried in previous years.Be sensible about it. Of course nobody is obligated to have the internet or tv. Thats a personal choice. I dont agree what is going on in Lakewood though. They have placed a ban on the internet in homes and if you have the internet in your house, it has to be for business, otherwise your kid cannot attend school.November 2, 2008 1:18 am at 1:18 am #1216648
zevi8 stop stereotyping, your are talking nonsence.November 2, 2008 1:30 am at 1:30 am #1216649
Zevi8, maybe you should consider moving to a place, that you don’t feel so negative about. Most people who live in Lakewood, actually appreciate the place. You sound like you have a huge chip on yur shoulder.November 2, 2008 1:42 am at 1:42 am #1216650
chalish: you are 100% correct. why do these people move to lakewood and then kvetch when their children dont get into schools? come on! lakewood is a yeshivisher place for the most part, please dont move here if you wont fit in (for your own sake). would you move to harlem and then bash the people there for not “shtelling tzoo” to you? Also, these “open minded people” are only open minded to the ideas of the gentiles and apoikorsim however they are not open minded to the ideas of the torah and our gedolim, whom which they constantly question. and they bash lakewood as if that the life they are leading is so much superior than the benei torah.November 2, 2008 4:22 am at 4:22 am #1216651
Thank you sammyjoe for speaking my mind!!November 2, 2008 2:48 pm at 2:48 pm #1216652ModernGuyParticipant
It just so happens that a lot of “non” yeshivish jews lived in lakewood before the yeshivah crowd came in here, so to say that we shouldn’t move here if we dont want to fit in is ridiculous. I am a 3rd generation lakewood resident, and my grandparents were here way before this town was yeshivish, perhaps the yeshivish people who moved into our town should mold themselves to fit our lifestyle?November 2, 2008 2:53 pm at 2:53 pm #1216653JosephParticipant
Modern, BMG came to Lakewood in 1943.November 2, 2008 3:22 pm at 3:22 pm #1216654
zevi8- Never heard such rubbish in my life. Kol Hakavod to them if they managed to keep the internet away from their kids. Okay they have work on not smoking or car seats but to let a kid have access is like stabbing them directly how can you compare?November 2, 2008 3:34 pm at 3:34 pm #1216655
Like i said before, having the internet or tv is a personal choice. I’m not forcing anyone to have it in their home but the yeshivas here are forcing people not to have it in their home. Schools should not get involved in home life. Thats what parents are for. These yeshivas are hypocrites. If you make a large donation to the school, they look the other way. Why is the internet ok then? If something is wrong, then its wrong. Lakewood was not this bad when i moved here 8 years ago. The population has double, the rudeness has increased 10 fold. There is no excuse to be rude just because i dont wear a black hat and a white shirt everyday.November 2, 2008 3:37 pm at 3:37 pm #1216656
zevi8- But it is if you have weird ShittosNovember 2, 2008 5:08 pm at 5:08 pm #1216657
zevi8: i live in lakewood and i havent seen anyone acting rude towards a blue shirted hattless guy b/c of ibid.u r probably very paranoid about how people treat u. whenever someone cuts u of on rt. 9 u prob. think its b/c u r “modern”.
where did u get ur info that the yeshivos look the other way if there is $?
8 yrs ago the internet was not as pervasive as it is today
ModernLakewoodGuy: its true what u r saying but times have changed. u DID NOT move into lakewood so noone can question why u moved here. u have a good “tayneh”, however i wish u luck, and a brocha that u should start to appreciate bnei torah and the good influence they bring.November 2, 2008 5:24 pm at 5:24 pm #1216658
Sammyjoe, maybe you haven’t seen people being rude to blue-shirted hatless men because there simply aren’t very many of them in Lakewood! (Aside from zevi8, that is.) I can sympathize- I come from Baltimore, which is also very right-wing and yeshivish because Ner Yisroel attracts that crowd. I don’t think I’m being paranoid when I say that often, when walking around the frum neighborhood on Shabbos, people would not say “Good Shabbos” to me or even not respond when I said it to them. I don’t feel the need to wear ankle-length skirts or avoid bright colors, which differentiates me from the “Bais Yaakov crowd.” I’m all for open-mindedness, and this DOES go both ways. All I’m asking for is open-mindedness in return from others. I accept that some people don’t wear red, or don’t own computers, or whatever the case may be, and I have no issue with it. People can make their own decisions in life. So why don’t they let me make mine, rather than judging?November 2, 2008 5:37 pm at 5:37 pm #1216660
jewishfeminist02 i disagree with u on that point.the are plentyof them
there is no prob with a man not responding to a gut shabbos to a woman. second some people (im surprised to here this append in baltimore) just dont say gut shbbos to anyone.November 2, 2008 5:39 pm at 5:39 pm #1216661JosephParticipant
sorry about that, i was thinking “knee-leghnth skirts”.November 2, 2008 5:42 pm at 5:42 pm #1216662
jewishfeminist02 face it, you are paranoid!November 2, 2008 10:14 pm at 10:14 pm #1216663
I really don’t believe I am. A man who does not respond to a woman’s greeting is embarrassing her, plain and simple. Shouldn’t we go to whatever lengths possible to avoid such embarrassment? It’s fine if a man doesn’t want to initiate the greeting, but to turn one’s head and not respond seems wrong to me.
Why don’t some people say Good Shabbos to anyone? I don’t understand.
Baltimore is overall a friendly community, but in certain parts I have seen this rudeness. One memorable occasion that does not have to do with saying Good Shabbos involves an interview I once had to be a Bais Yaakov Camp counselor. The woman who interviewed me was very rude and basically judged me from the get-go because the high school that I went to was not “frum enough.” And when I told her that I wear pants, the expression on her face could not have been more disdainful. No matter that I was prepared to wear skirts the entire summer, even outside camp as per her request.November 2, 2008 10:23 pm at 10:23 pm #1216664poshiteryid1Member
To answer the question how to block it, here is the simplest way:
go to internet properties,click the content bar on the top,by the content advisor click settings. mark the box which says “supervisor can type….” then click onthe password box underneath to activate a password of ypur choice.
You need to click on the ratings top left of the same window to put the slider to the left and the word “none” will come up. then you will be able to enable or disable the internet just by going on the internet properties and content adviser in contents to block the use iof internet. hope this is useful.November 3, 2008 2:22 am at 2:22 am #1216665
JewishFeminist, just like you expect the whole world to be openminded to your way, you have to be openminded to men who are shomer aynayim and maybe feel very uncomfortable looking and talking to women they don’t know (or do know!) It’s not that these men are lacking in middos tovos, that they can’t say good shabbos to you, they are just putting extra guards on themselves so as not to be nichshal. Please understand that being more stringent in Halacha does not mean that they are lackin in Derech Eretz. Believe me I’m sure they don’t ignore their wives, daughters, mothers or shviggers! It’s you who is so farnummen with your “feminism” you can’t be openminded to those who are maybe not feminist extremists, they are just extremists in fearing G_D.November 3, 2008 12:19 pm at 12:19 pm #1216666
I’m sorry that you feel that I am an “extremist”. I would never view myself that way and I hope I don’t come across that way.
I do try to be as open-minded as possible and I have nothing against those who wish to be more stringent, even if I don’t necessarily agree with them. I also try to be dan l’kaf zechut when people don’t say Good Shabbos to me and assume that they belong to this group who chooses to “put extra guards on themselves.” However, I do think that concern for others’ feelings should override these extra guards. After all, they are EXTRA guards, and it is a direct mitzva not to embarrass someone. Let’s say, hypothetically, that I were a ba’alat teshuva and did not have the background I have. In that case, I might not know about the existence of these stringencies and might think that these men were simply being rude. Wouldn’t that be a chilul hashem?November 3, 2008 2:49 pm at 2:49 pm #1216667SJSinNYCMember
To go back to the original question: I think it would be better to teach your children how to filter the internet for themselves. There is nothing inherently wrong with the internet – it is merely a “place to put information.” Teaching your children right from wrong is a big part of chinuch – you cannot always just cut your children off from the outside world.
For example, you teach your children how to keep kosher. Aside from not mixing milk and meat, in your kosher home, what do they have to worry about eating kosher? Nothing! Because all the products are kosher. But still, you make sure they understand what makes things kosher to ensure that when they leave their home, they can still eat properly.
If you teach your kids how to use the internet for kosher things, then they can learn to stand on their own two feet. That does NOT mean you should leave them unsupervised, but it means you should help them with support.
By the time they are adults, the world will be even more dependant on the internet and virutally all jobs will require computer/internet knowledge (for the most part they already do). You are not doing them a favor by shutting them out.November 3, 2008 2:54 pm at 2:54 pm #1216668
jewishfeminist02- you have to r4ealise that these people who prefer not to answer should be respected, they don’t mean to hurt your feelings rather they are very close to G-D and they feel that it might distance them from Him to speak to a woman even if it’s only two words.
I probably would answer actually but at least i can see where these people are coming from…November 3, 2008 3:57 pm at 3:57 pm #1216669
I know they don’t mean to hurt my feelings- but the bottom line is that they do. How are they any closer to God than you or I simply because they choose to avoid speaking to women? I don’t believe in a God who would distance Himself from such a man just for observing what I feel is common courtesy.November 3, 2008 5:12 pm at 5:12 pm #1216671
jewishfeminist02 there are also some frum men and boys who are terribly shy of woman, have rachmunis on them. (please dont take this the wrong way)November 3, 2008 5:32 pm at 5:32 pm #1216672dovid_yehudaParticipant
“I don’t believe in a God who would distance Himself from such a man just for observing what I feel is common courtesy.”
Please do not take this the wrong way, but I cannot help but sense some confusion on your part about some aspects of being Torah observant. Hashem does not need our observance, stringencies, or good deeds – all mitzvot are there solely for our benefit entirely. In order for us to achieve closeness to Hashem, we must strive to be as pure as possible. Hashem is absolutely holy, and we can only aspire to some form of holiness as best we can by putting distance between ourselves and anything which is not holy in order to hope to establish some closeness to Hashem.
For many men this means to avoid interaction with women other than their immediate families and those women they must communicate with for work. Not because the women are not holy, but because the men find themselves having inappropriate thoughts. Yes it may seem like “all or nothing” but sometimes the best path to consistent observance is to make blanket exclusions in order to avoid what may really be the rare and passing failure to maintain a holy mind.
If you take this as rudeness, I feel you are making it too much about yourself and not about Torah, Hashem and kedusha. If you want to wish everyone you meet Gut Shabbos, go ahead, but if all your greetings are not returned, I respectfully suggest that you not focus on that and detract from the joy of that Shabbat, but go on your way, and keep a kind thought in your mind for the man you passed and know that his intention is certainly not to be rude to anyone, but to be as close to Hashem as he can.November 3, 2008 8:57 pm at 8:57 pm #1216673
I already know that mitzvot are for our benefit. That is not my issue. But I find it hard to believe that a simple two-word greeting, which serves the basic purpose of acknowledging me or whatever woman is present, could cause “inappropriate thoughts.” I am not trying to “make it about myself”, but I do try to greet everyone I pass on the street. It’s part of the joy of sharing kedushat shabbat and being social. I do not judge these men for their lifestyles and points of view, but I do wish they would think about the possible negative consequences of their actions. If they can’t bring themselves to speak to me, even just a brief smile or nod would make me feel so much better. (That should help the “shy” men as well.) I’ve already stated that ignoring a greeting from a woman can embarrass her. Doesn’t a man who embarrasses a woman distance himself from God?November 3, 2008 9:56 pm at 9:56 pm #1216674
“I don’t believe in a God who would distance Himself from such a man just for observing what I feel is common courtesy.”
that is your fundamental tragedy
you want to make Hashem be what YOU think He should be.
you should, instead, be working on making yourself what He wants you to be. yes even if it clashes with the attitudes you have absorbed from this illusory modern world, and it’s modern movements.
you dont seem to understand the most basic and crucial fundamentals of what it means to be a daughter of Hashem.November 4, 2008 1:28 pm at 1:28 pm #1216675
I think you misunderstood me.
I’m not trying to “make Hashem what I think He should be.” Rather, I am comparing my conception of Hashem- which is formed from Torah study- to this reality of frum men who ignore my greetings, and they don’t seem to match. The God I know does not want this to happen. I know you’re going to jump on me again for using the phrase “the God I know”, but you have to understand that I’m starting from the Torah. I’m not starting with my own “modern attitudes” and looking for ways to fit them in with God. I have spent much of my life studying Torah and based on this study- and not on anything else- I think that what these men do is wrong.November 4, 2008 2:55 pm at 2:55 pm #1216676
“I have spent much of my life studying Torah…I think that what these men do is wrong”
Well you better spend a bit more time studying because in MY Torah it says that it’s forbidden to look or speak to woman who aren’t related to you. And even if it’s not Ossur it’s defiantely a good thing not to greet woman so why can’t you accept it that some people want to be more stringent in Halacha???November 4, 2008 2:55 pm at 2:55 pm #1216677SJSinNYCMember
I think the “Good Shabbos” thing is rude, not a halachik thing. Where I grew up in Monsey, everyone said good shabbos to each other. We had a nice mix of people (though mainly MO) and everyone joined in. As the community got more and more right wing, people started ignoring others. In my opinion, sort of going against the “minhag hamakom.”
I really try not to say good shabbos to people who look like they dont want to answer me, but sometimes I “slip up” and when they dont answer, it does bother me. You dont even have to look at me, but please, do not ignore me.
Also, please do not cross to the other side of the street. I will avoid touching you. I will not reach out to grab you. I will make sure you have plenty of room not to touch me. Please dont make me feel like a leper though.November 4, 2008 7:10 pm at 7:10 pm #1216678
You said “Well you better spend a bit more time studying because in MY Torah it says that it’s forbidden to look or speak to woman who aren’t related to you”. That is totally made up. People of the torah and navi talked to and looked at women all the time.This is all recorded for you to read. Are you saying that all the prophets, moshe, aaron and all the forefathers were doing something forbidden? Rabbis of this generation look and talk to women all the time. Why are you making things up? Its not forbidden to look at a woman. Its not forbidden to talk to a woman.November 4, 2008 7:31 pm at 7:31 pm #1216679gavra_at_workParticipant
“”I have spent much of my life studying Torah…I think that what these men do is wrong”
Well you better spend a bit more time studying because in MY Torah it says that it’s forbidden to look or speak to woman who aren’t related to you. And even if it’s not Ossur it’s defiantely a good thing not to greet woman so why can’t you accept it that some people want to be more stringent in Halacha??? “
Are you insinuating that you have a different Torah then the rest of us?
If you are, please leave this site and go to Jews for J (C’V). Since you are not, is there a better way to state your point?
I reiterate what I said in the Lakewood elections post:
1: There is a difference between Chumrah (to the point of Chossid Shoyte) and Halacha. “The orthodoxy we know” includes much of the former, and not enough of the latter.
2: There is only one truth. Moshe Emes V’Toraso Emes. I believe jewishfeminist02’s point is that you (whomever you are, myself included) do not have that truth, as you are not G-d. To claim that you do have absolute truth or its interpetation to the exclusion of all others is extremely arrogant and borders on self deification.
Your Rav may be closer to G-d than you are and therefore may have a better idea of the “absolute truth”, but it is still not a “monopoly on truth”.
The daykan in me is Mechalek between shoel and mayshiv Shalom, as well as Roy’e and Mistakel. Please consider such as well.November 4, 2008 7:38 pm at 7:38 pm #1216680
“I have spent much of my life studying Torah and based on this study- and not on anything else- I think that what these men do is wrong.”
and you wear pants, and are proud of your mothers red wardrobe, and proudly use a word for an ism that has stood in direct opposition to Torah for 50 years (with a new modern derech of course, nevertheless you use the ugly word proudly) you think if you “learn” Torah that gives you the credentials to adopt Goyish attitudes. you have No credentials, you are just another unfortunate Yid destroyed by Golus, and you are so absorbed by it as to be proud.
im somewhat sorry if this is harsh, but when you dare try to use the Torah HaKodesh to defend your anti-Torah outlook, i am unable to just sit by such sewage quietly.
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