Think Before Doing
Home › Forums › Inspiration / Mussar › Think Before Doing
- This topic has 13 replies, 10 voices, and was last updated 13 years, 2 months ago by oomis.
March 21, 2010 7:52 pm at 7:52 pm #591431sm29Participant
Just want to mention a couple situations that someone told me about. It might be a rare sitution, but it’s good to learn from;
It either happened to my friend or a friend of theirs. They were giving shaloch manos to someone and the receiver said they only eat chalov Yisrael, and the receiver put in the garbage. Firstly, the giver felt hurt. Secondly, it’s baal tashlich. – What they should do is say ‘thank you’, and later give it someone else.
Another thing that happened is that my friend went somewhere and was talking to someone. Then the lady mentioned something negative about my friend’s outfit. My friend wore a tznius outfit, it just didn’t look the same as others. We should respect those who are differentMarch 21, 2010 9:36 pm at 9:36 pm #681894volvieMember
As a note, if you only eat Cholov Yisroel you cannot give someone else (who is Jewish) non-Cholov Yisroel.
That being said, what was done was rude (to put it mildly.)March 21, 2010 9:40 pm at 9:40 pm #681895Be HappyParticipant
Wow, you are so so right. The stupid remarks I have had to “endure” in the last 9 months while undergoing chemotherapy is beyond belief. If those people would have given a little thought before saying, it would have saved a lot of aggro.March 21, 2010 10:53 pm at 10:53 pm #681896HealthParticipant
What people say at a shiva is a wonder. People say the stupidest things even when you lost a kid.March 22, 2010 12:16 am at 12:16 am #681897ChachamParticipant
volvie, actually according to Reb Moshe Feinstein the din Lifnei Eiver by giving food to somebody else is not a problem if that person has a respectabloe rov to be soimech on.March 22, 2010 12:58 am at 12:58 am #681898Yanky55Participant
Yes, Health they do. The one positive thing that came out of my loss of a child, is that I am more sensitive about what to say to someone else in a similar situation.
Even a friend and a family member said some terrible things, though they meant well. I think if people would think things through a little more about how it might affect the other person, they might keep their mouths closed.March 22, 2010 2:21 am at 2:21 am #681899
“As a note, if you only eat Cholov Yisroel you cannot give someone else (who is Jewish) non-Cholov Yisroel.”
Why not? It is not unkosher. If you give it to someone who does eat cholov stam, why should there be any problem? It certainly IS baal tashchis to throw perfectly good food away. Where is it written that you may not get hano-ah from it by giving it to someone who MAY eat it? Source, please.
Health, you are also quite right – people say really stupid things when they pay a shiva call. The most offensive things were said to me and also to my sister when we sat shiva for my dad and my mom O”H, respectively. I won’t repeat it again, as I already posted this once, but the two comments were extremely insulting and hurtful, and uttered by longtime friends of the family, people who should have known better than to make embarrassing comments to aveilim.
Esther, one can only hope that you were made stronger in the zechus of what you had to endure, both by these foolish remarks and by the actual treatment you underwent. May your refuah be complete in every way, and may you enjoy only good health and much simcha ad meah v’esrim shana. Then put on a good pair of headphones and tune the insensitive clods out.March 22, 2010 3:39 am at 3:39 am #681900bein_hasdorimParticipant
It is best to think before thinking,
then think again before speaking,
imagining yourself saying those words out loud, then imagine what the reaction
of the people around you will be, to your comments, then if you’re sure they will
be appreciated go ahead and speak.
I’ts easier typed then done though!March 22, 2010 6:23 am at 6:23 am #681901anuranParticipant
Sm29, the people who did that were unmannered louts, completely lacking in common decency. If someone gives you a sincere gift, especially one for that purpose, it’s the depth of bad behavior. They might as well have slapped the givers in the face and spit in their eye. And it’s a waste of perfectly good food.
I’ve been given treif food by ignorant but well-meaning friends. I thank them sincerely and quietly pass it on to a needy Gentile later. That is the only proper response. I might explain later that while I thank them for their kindness my religion has a number of restrictions which don’t allow me to eat it, even though it looks and smells delicious.March 22, 2010 12:37 pm at 12:37 pm #681902hereorthereMember
I remember learning in yeshivah that if for example someone has guests the host is not allowed to have one level of kashrus for themselves and a lower one for guests.
For one thing that is rude as if to say “We are better then you so we get the higher kashrus”.
I do not remember learning about giving to someone else when neither party is eating it at that moment as in Shaloch Mannos but personally I would feel not very kind if I
went out and bought non Cholov Yisroael for someone else when I am strictly Cholov Yisroael for myself.
As far as it being “perfectly kosher” Well that is too big a machloikis to get into and I am not scholarly enough to discuss it, but even with the teshuvah that people use to quote Rav Feinstien, I have STILL heard from others who say it is still a machloikis.March 22, 2010 2:37 pm at 2:37 pm #681903
“I would feel not very kind if I went out and bought non Cholov Yisroael for someone else when I am strictly Cholov Yisroael for “
How a person “feels,” is halachically irrelevant as to whether or not something is in fact kosher. Someone who holds by Breuer’s shechita, for example, might not “feel” another schechitah is reliable. That does not mean he is correct, only that he is correct for HIMSELF. I personally would feel EXTREMELY unkind if I knew someone else could eat something that I myself cannot use. Just because you eat C”Y does not mean the person who does not do so is inferior to you in some way. If he eats C”S, then you would be doing him a TOVA to give him the item you yourself cannot eat because it is not C”Y.
Let’s take the argument away from kashrus for the moment. Suppose you are a borderline diabetic and someone invited to your home for a dinner gives you a beautiful store-bought cake that is 100% certain kosher. You absolutely hold that you cannot eat it yourself, much as you would love to. Should you throw it out, or maybe give it to a friend who (assuming there is no weight problem) can eat sugary foods? If you think this is nothing like the issue of kashrus, IMO you are mistaken. Kashrus is all about what we theoretically CAN eat but MAY not eat. Halachically we all CAN eat C”S products, but some of us hold to a standard that says they MAY not do so. That doesn’t mean that the rest of us are unkosher, and it surely does not mean that kosher C”S foods should not be given away to kosher C”S-eating Jews. You don’t throw out good food, especially when someone else can use it. If it were not kosher, there is no question.March 22, 2010 3:17 pm at 3:17 pm #681904volvieMember
The shitta that you cannot eat non-Cholov Yisroel, is held because al pi shitta non-Cholov Yisroel is non-kosher. Therefore, a subscriber to this shitta of Cholov Yisroel would mandate that such person neither eat non-Cholov Yisroel nor facilitate (i.e. provide) non-Cholov Yisroel to another Jew — since al pi shitta non-Cholov Yisroel is non-kosher.March 23, 2010 3:29 am at 3:29 am #681905sm29Participant
so maybe give it to a non JewMarch 23, 2010 4:42 am at 4:42 am #681906
I am sorry, Volvie, but C”S in the USA is NOT non-kosher by any stretch of the imagination. Perhaps in Europe, where mare’s milk might have been substituted for cow’s milk, it was a problem decades ago, but there is no such problem with USDA grade A milk, which can only be certified as such if it comes from a cow.
I am not telling you to drink C”S, as I respect your decision to use only C”Y. But to refer to it as non-kosher because of a shitta that you choose to follow, is unfair to the hundreds of thousand of KOSHER Jews who do NOT drink only C”Y, as per the shittos of other Gedolim, who matir C”S. We get into this argument with the C”Y drinkers on a semi-regular basis, and IMO it is wrong to assert that C”S is not kosher. You hold to a different standard. Fine. Your standard is your decision The milk we drink in this country all comes from a cow. And the last I heard, all cows are kosher animals. So the milk from every one of them is only milk.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.