December 19, 2016 7:11 pm at 7:11 pm #618881
What happens when it rains?December 19, 2016 7:57 pm at 7:57 pm #1204276
They get wet. And every so often, a cleaner comes around and sweeps them all up. But I believe they are disposed of in a respectful way- I think they are buried.December 19, 2016 8:13 pm at 8:13 pm #1204277
ED IT ORParticipant
the kosel gets wetDecember 19, 2016 8:17 pm at 8:17 pm #1204278
I heard that a miracle occurs and they don’t get wet.
Or maybe they get wet, but Hashem has plenty of malachim to sort through them to figure out what they say.
Or maybe Hashem knows what you wrote, even without reading it.December 19, 2016 8:55 pm at 8:55 pm #1204279
I was once sitting at the Kosel learning, and there were some teenagers sitting there pulling notes out and reading them.
I was quite disturbed.December 19, 2016 9:09 pm at 9:09 pm #1204280
The periodically clean the kotel notes anyway. Otherwise the wall would be too full to take new ones. there was an article I saw on another site describing the process with photographsDecember 19, 2016 10:46 pm at 10:46 pm #1204281
The main point Hashem focuses on is the effort you put in writing and placing it their, it truly doesn’t make much of a difference what happens to the actual note after, Hashem knows whats on it before during and after it’s in the Kotel.December 19, 2016 11:01 pm at 11:01 pm #1204282
Are you allowed to put the notes or remove them as you are eroding the stones which was sanctified when it was built? Are you Mo-El Bi- Hekdosh? Are they undermining the stability of the wall? I know everyone does it but is it right?
If the notes are in a crevice they will probably not get wet, unless they are protruding.December 19, 2016 11:26 pm at 11:26 pm #1204283
Meno – I guess you don’t read Chaim Walder books.December 20, 2016 1:41 am at 1:41 am #1204284
There it snothing intrinsically holy about the kotel. Herod vastly expanded the mint by adding a platform and the kotel was part of the retaining wall.December 20, 2016 7:03 pm at 7:03 pm #1204285
Notes are permitted. The Western Wall foundation provides slips of paper and pens before entering the prayer section (at least at the women’s section).
I don’t get how they would have made a nonreligious women’s section. The women’s section is small as is. It would be disruptive imho to have women davening loudly. Women in the religious section would have loudness coming from both sides. Or be shoved into a corner.
I don’t know. That’s how I feel.
I wonder if the running ink stains the stones.
Is it open 24/7?December 20, 2016 7:24 pm at 7:24 pm #1204286
Yes, LB, the kosel is open 24/7. And there are probably people there at all times. For a real moving experience, I suggest you go at chatzos- halachic midnight and catch a Nishmas minyan.December 20, 2016 9:08 pm at 9:08 pm #1204287
Anyone know how to teleport?December 21, 2016 12:02 am at 12:02 am #1204288
Lightb, I don’t think Abba was asking if the WWFoundation allows the notes when he asked if it’s permitted.
AbbaS, I have heard people ask whether pushing notes into the crevices might be assur, not because you’re undermining stability of the wall, but because you may inadvertently approach an area that has Kedusha. I don’t know the answer; I’d be curious if anyone else has heard anything like that. For myself I didn’t feel the need to put my bakashos down on paper.December 21, 2016 6:48 am at 6:48 am #1204289
Writing helps me figure out and channel out my thoughts. I thought I knew what I was praying for until I sat down and started writing. Suddenly I remembered more and let that out. If I sit there crying just reading or talking it doesn’t have the same effect.
To do it at the Kotel is a blessing. I wouldn’t know what to do with the note had I not been able to leave it there. Maybe at a WWF genizah if they had one. Though that’s still the whole thing of writing in a holy place.
Prayer is focused on oral communication. However is our tefillah really limited to just words we speak?
We’re here on the CR for a reason. If we didn’t have this platform because this communication is not meant for a public forum, some would take it to another place. Would some not miss out entirely?
This is the only place where I can send written messages directly to Hashem.
I used to frequently send my letters to a Rebbe’s Ohel. I didn’t want to throw them out. Or keep them. Sending does something. Letting go of the offering.
We used to bring offerings to the Temple. We may not do that anymore but it is nice to offer our words to the memories and remnants of that holy place where we used to meet with Hashem.
editedDecember 21, 2016 9:30 am at 9:30 am #1204290
Golfer – that’s also what I always heard. I was always told not to write notes for that reason. I don’t know if it’s true or not.
I wonder where the whole idea of writing notes came from. Is there any valid source for writing notes to Hashem? We usually talk to Hashem with our mouths – we don’t usually write notes to Him.December 21, 2016 1:46 pm at 1:46 pm #1204291
Hello!!! I’ll repeat myself. The wall has zero kiddusha. It was not part of the Bais Hamikdosh. When Herod rebuilt the BH, he decided to expand the plaza on the Temple Mount to accommodate more people. To do this, he surrounded the Mount with four retaining walls , on top of which he placed a platform. The kotel was , for centuries, the only visible part of the retaining wall. It is NOT on the Mount and has no kedushaDecember 21, 2016 5:45 pm at 5:45 pm #1204292
Golfer AbbaS, I have heard people ask whether pushing notes into the crevices might be assur, not because you’re undermining stability of the wall, but because you may inadvertently approach an area that has Kedusha. I don’t know the answer; I’d be curious if anyone else has heard anything like that.
The amount of damage is minuscule,which is why it is permitted, but over time with thousand of people doing it the crevices are enlarged. As far as sticking their hands deeply in the crevice, I have not done it nor seen anyone do it, but I assume the just put it on the edge of the crevice and the next person does the same pushing the first one deeper into the crevice. I assume the notes dates from the times concept of writing when they use to write kvittles to the Rebbi. If it was good enough for the rabbi how much more so for Hashem.
As far as the wall itself it surrounded the courtyard and any expansion required the approval of the Bais Din of 71 and was paid out of the excess funds from the half Shekel poll tax and should have the same kiddusha as the Bais Ha”Mikdash.December 21, 2016 7:11 pm at 7:11 pm #1204293
Abba – I think Golfer’s point (and mine as well) was that we have heard that there might be a problem sticking your hand in the wall, since at some point past the beginning of the wall is an area of Kedusha. Since we don’t exactly where this point is, we have to be choshesh that it can start at some point past the beginning.
I don’t know if there is a basis for this or not and I think Golfer also wasn’t sure.December 21, 2016 9:06 pm at 9:06 pm #1204294
But the wall is still above the actual wall and is a remnant of what was.
We go to a holy person’s kever. It’s not directly the person’s body. There is a plaque that we rest stones on. The real body is under dirt. Maybe a withered skeleton at some point. May the holy ones and our family all be a blessing to us all.
Why is it that valid and this not?
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