Home › Forums › Eretz Yisroel › Ku Klux Karta..or Ku Klutz Karta?
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September 25, 2008 10:54 am at 10:54 am #588346Itzik_sMember
BS”D
In other words, are these characters a real danger and potential roidfim or moisrim, or are they, as I believe, a bunch of immature (fill in your favorite pejorative term) who never grew up and just seek attention? Are they worth bothering with or are they just fun to have around to have someone to demonize and perhaps as the object of a little bit of Purim Torah type leitzanus?
While I did coin the phrase Ku Klux Karta based on the presence of Duke ymach shmo at the conference in Iran that was disgraced by the Teheran Five and a Half (Herr Oberrabiner Freaky Freedy – Imam Moussa Assad al-Faraj al-Majnoun – who is a flyweight in every sense of the word and who is even more intent on getting negative attention than the other leitzim, is the half), I hereby bestow upon these wannabes the more realistic name of Ku Klutz Karta.
I don’t think that they do any damage to anyone anymore, even if they once attracted negative attention with their antics. I certainly don’t think there is any reason to argue with them or demonstrate against them when they show up to make fools of themselves – unless you want to hand them bags of screws to replace the ones they are missing (but remember to toivel the screws).
September 25, 2008 2:18 pm at 2:18 pm #622726Itzik_sMemberBS”D
That is why I won’t refer to them by any name that includes both Neturei and Karta. I’ve also called them Nutter Kartel and Neturei Creedmoor, Creedmoor being a mental institution in Queens, NY so if you don’t want Karta, take your pick of those 2. I know full well they have no right to the name Neturei Karta and if Reb Amram Bloy ZYA were alive now, I would probably consider myself a follower of his.
The first hijack was that of Moshe Hirsch which was a family dispute with his father in law R’ Katzenellenbogen, whose followers are the closest thing to those of Reb Amram but I think they too are loosely organized these days and attract a few bad elements.
The best information I have is that the Teheran Five and a Half and those who demonstrate alongside one or more of them are a collection of oisvorfen from communities as diverse as Vizhnitz, Satmar, Chaim Berlin, Skvere, and yes, YU, along with a couple of leftover Malochim who were not absorbed elsewhere. I won’t malign the various communities by noting which freak came from where but I think I know the score :).
I think Cohen in Manchester is in cherem as per the Manchester Beis Din unless the cherem was removed when he apologized. Freeky Freedy is in cherem in Vienna (not sure by which beis din); he is not allowed to shop in community stores.
They’re not shoitim al pi halacha though so they are subject to cherem if a beis din decides to act accordingly.
September 25, 2008 4:57 pm at 4:57 pm #622727BogenParticipantItzik,
On what basis could they be put into cheirim?
I’ve seen some comments that they are “rodfim”, but I see no halachic basis for that.
September 25, 2008 6:13 pm at 6:13 pm #622728Itzik_sMemberBS”D
I don’t know but Cohen has been disallowed use of the cemetery in Manchester and Freeky is not allowed to have any interaction with the Vienna community at all. I think Freeky is not in official cherem – it may be an action of the Vienna kehilla as opposed to the beis din.
September 25, 2008 8:45 pm at 8:45 pm #622729bein_hasdorimParticipantI apologize for using the title “niturei karte” in the past,
i was always referring to the nutjobs breakaway party.
I believe that they are potentially dangerous,
& fall into the category of “Oy L’rasha Oy L’shcheinoy!”
They’re also Mischaber to R’shoim & Rotzchim.
& Desecrate the Holy Shabbos,(not literally but in essence)
by showing up to these Asifas Rotzchim & Tzmei’ei Dam!
September 26, 2008 8:47 am at 8:47 am #622730Itzik_sMemberBS”D
Freeky Freedy was outright mechalel shabbos on Shabbos Bereishis 5767 when he used a microphone (held by a ben yishmoel) to address a crowd of Arab tzoirerim in Berlin. If my Yiddish were better I would write a Purim song about this based on the fish song by Michoel Schnitzler that begins erev shabbos bryshis, fynem fish in flyshigs etc LOL.
Freeky, however, does not qualify (yet) as a shoiteh al pi halacha. If a couple of shtarkers would hit him over the head with a twenty five kilo dumbbell (which is what Freedy is at the end of the day), one of two things would happen. Either he would become a shoiteh al pi halacha, or more likely they would knock some sense into him and he would stop his shtus and apologize.
Bekitzur, the Ku Klutz Kartel (there, no more Karta either) are great to have around for a laugh or two at their expense.
In fact, last nitel nacht when I was watching a video of the Freedy speech at the rally I could not help but be reminded lehavdil a million times of a Lipa Schmeltzer performance.
The difference is that lehavdil when Lipa clowns around on stage, we laugh ALONG WITH him and all are besimcha. When Freeky Freedy reads from a prepared speech in German, making mistake after mistake and needing help from the Arab who is holding the mic for him on Shabbos, and his facial expression barely betrays the fact that he does not believe ONE WORD he is saying, we can only laugh AT the shmoiger (roshei teivois SHoiteh Menuval Ve Gas Ruach) as we see that his whole so-called ideology is but an inane show.
September 26, 2008 1:01 pm at 1:01 pm #622731Itzik_sMemberBS”D
Also, the Ku Klutz Kartel in perspective:
Who armed the “palestinian” “Authority” policemen, thereby giving bloodthirsty terrorists arms? Moshe Ber Beck? No. That would be the government of E”Y.
Who transferred 100,000,000 USD to the same “Authority”? Moshe Aryeh Friedman? Come on, he doesn’t even have a second pair of gotkes to transfer to anyone! That honor would go to Olmert.
Who was in charge of the miserable educational system in E”Y at the time of mass immigration, that led to the situation where so many tayerer Yidden were stripped from their Jewish roots? Yisroel Dovid Weiss? Moshe Hirsch? Nope – one was not even alive back then and the other one was a pisher in Chaim Berlin who got no respect unless he made a fool of himself as he did until senility set in and made a fool of him. That would have been Yaakov Sarid OLBM, father of Yossi Sarid may he soon do tshuva, and he was responsible for this shmad on behalf of Mapai, the forerunner of today’s Labor Party.
September 28, 2008 4:17 am at 4:17 am #622732coolestMemberItzik I dont know how you can say that they do no damage. They make a horrable impression on non religious Jews who than think that all chassidim are bad people. They are not harmless! They turn people off!
September 28, 2008 5:40 pm at 5:40 pm #622733Itzik_sMemberBS”D
Coolest, that may have been true years ago but at this point, largely thanks to the Internet among other forms of more accurate media coverage, these fools have been shown for what they are – fringe elements who represent no one but themselves. The ones who are turned off by them are those who really don’t want to be brought closer to Hashem at present and use them as an excuse (as well as a small core of equally fanatic secular Zionists who probably are outnumbered by the Kartel at this point).
What would probably put an end to the Kartel demonstrations once and for all would be a legitimate Satmar counter-protest where a group of solid and real Satmar chassidim and other anti-Zionist Chassidim would show that the antics of the Ku Klux Kartel are not legitimate even for those who oppose the state (and look the same as the Kartel members to the untrained eye). It would probably get out of hand, though.
September 28, 2008 5:50 pm at 5:50 pm #622734BogenParticipantcoolest,
What do they do any worse than Jimmy Carter? Yes, Jimmy Carter does no good. And he is the laughing stock of the nation. But what harm is ultimately done?
September 28, 2008 6:40 pm at 6:40 pm #622735Josh31ParticipantRosha Ba Le’Ir!!!
Apparently the one who presence smears the names of all upstanding Jews whose first names are Yisroel or Dovid or whose last names are Weiss was here in Dallas. He was here to speak at some Mosques. We can imagine what!!!
I have his “business” card in front of me.
It has “Jews United Against Zionism” in both English and Arabic, the language of his customers.
It is for those like him, that our Shemoneh Esreh is actually 19 blessings, and I have him specifically in mind when I come to that blessing!!!
September 28, 2008 8:12 pm at 8:12 pm #622736Itzik_sMemberBS”D
Did he speak on Shabbos the way his counterpart in Vienna does?
Something tells me that Sheikh Ismail Daoud al-Beyda does not speak English properly or speak any Arabic whatsoever. His Viennese counterpart Sheikh Moussa Assad al-Faraj al-Majnoun can barely speak the language of his adopted country, the same one that just elected his buddies of Jorg Haider’s party to a respectable showing in parliament.
However, the brocho is just as pertinent to the one who is ready to surrender E”Y to terrorists, thereby truly endangering Jewish lives.
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