latest shidduch data

Meir, you can’t mix/compare Litvish and Chasidish.

interesting. could you also collect ages of both, numbers over time, year of marriage (so that we can compare different years), and similar numbers for boys.

many BYs and loal shuls put out newsletters with mazal tovs. You can probably count there. Record year of publication and year of graduation

These type of unscientific “studies” devalue the prestige of a getting a doctorate in the eyes of the Yeshiva community. Not good PR for Touro.

Given that the textbook “How to lie with statistics” seems to be the basis of most statistical discussions, the best way to evaluate a statistical hypothesis is to test it against real world data. If there is a serious “shiduch problem” (frum people unable to find spouses), it should be resulting in frum elementary schools having a problem of a shrinking pool of students, and having difficulty filling classrooms,since it our community, the minhag is that women start having children only after a successful shidduch. Furthermore, that can’t be faked, and is easy to confirm. If there is a “shidduch” crisis, frum schools should be closing, teachers should be being laid off and schools will be charging lower tuition since they are desperate to attract a shrinking pool of students; if this is not happening, it is highly unlikely there is a “shidduch crisis”. Note that everyone has a “shidduch” problem until they get married, and except for Adam ha-Rishon, whose problem was indeed unique, these tend to be resolved in a very mundane way.

There are a few issues with the study:
1) It doesn’t factor in the fact that single girls oftentimes marry divorced men, preventing divorced girls from finding a shidduch;
2) It doesn’t factor in that fact that FFB girls often marry Baalei Teshuva, preventing Baalos Teshuva from finding a shidduch (the study didn’t study Baalei Teshuva);
3) When girls are single for many years surrounded by secular people – e.g., working in a law firm for twenty years – they no longer categorize themselves as “Yeshivish,” considering themselves either Modern Orthodox. So if data were to show that “100% of Yeshivish girls get married,” it’s a tautology. Girls who aren’t married at 40 no longer consider themselves “Yeshivish” per se (e.g., they wouldn’t want to marry a learning boy).
4) There really are two Yeshivish communities. There are Touro College families and there are BMG (freezer) families. Touro College types use the internet; BMG types use it less so, and their computers are filtered. So when you do an INTERNET survey which largely excludes the BMG-freezer types, you are omitting the community that one would assume suffers the most from the shidduch imbalance.
5) As the Chofetz Chaim says, (Nidcei Yisrael, perek 25), people who are single are prone to die young. So if data shows “95% of Yeshivish people are married by 40” we should consider the fact that some single people are no longer with us, caused by the fact that they couldn’t find a shidduch.
6) Even taking the study’s conclusions, the study points to a serious issue: the ultimate age gap is around two years, despite the fact that in the Yeshivish community there’s a two year gap. This is good news, but also is bad news. Good news, because there’s less of an imbalance. Bad news, because it highlights the fact that girls have to wait to EXTRA years, in addition to the regular waiting that boys go through. These two additional years apply to everyone, on average, although of course some way 6 EXTRA years, while others way zero EXTRA years. This additional waiting is devastating to girls, not knowing whether they will ever get married.

You aren’t even a part of this discussion. Why jump in just to insult someone?

True, I am not claiming that all, or even most, girls who work in a law firm for 20 years automatically wouldn’t classify themselves as “Yeshivish.” But it does chip away at the percentages.

Indeed, part of the problem is the word “Yeshivish.” Many wouldn’t necessarily classify themselves as Modern Orthodox, if not for the fact that the only alternate term offered was “Yeshivish,” a term that they wouldn’t apply for themselves either. Remember, many girls never go to shul or any shiur. Their connection to Yeshivish orthodoxy is very tenuous, and depends on being surrounded by other Yeshivish people, which obviously doesn’t exist in the law firm.

I spoke to the lead author of the study about a year ago and he mentioned that THE central factor of the shidduch crisis is the fact that as people remain single, they longer classify themselves as Yeshivish.

“girls who work in a law firm for 20 years automatically wouldn’t classify themselves as “Yeshivish.”

AR: Nor would they classify themselves as “girls”. If you’ve been working as an attorney in a law firm for 20 years, you are likely in your mid-40s; even an LA would be in her late 30s/early 40s. Either way you are a WOMAN. Otherwise, I would agree that most frum women working in a law firm would likely identify as MO.

Personal Anecdote:

Regarding these girls/women who have worked 20 years in a law firm and are still single.

Mrs. CTL died 3 months ago, I have already been approached by shadchanim about 4 of these females.
I am not interested in remarriage at this time and certainly not to someone younger than my own older daughters.

That said, some of these past their 20s females need to open themselves up to the idea of making a marriage, home or family OOT. It adds to the available pool of single men.

Reb CTL,

On the somewhere brighter side, you’re making Are Roster (see comment above) happy by alleviating his #1 takeaway from the study; namely that single girls who marry divorced/widower men take away shidduchim from divorced girls.

That vital point made,

edited

Are Roster:

Only the first two per Yeshiva get a monetary prize? That’ll be enough? Afterwards the rush might peter out.

And every small Yeshiva and large Yeshiva will get the same two?

My deepest apologies to all the age-gap proponents, but your time is up. You have had two decades to prove your point. You claimed to have all the data to back it up. Yet, you couldn’t ever confirm that a proper survey was transformed to an actual study. The founding ‘fact’ has never been demonstrated to be the driving factor of the ‘crisis’. Graphs with no real mathematics, was not enough to convince the masses. And of course, how your ‘solution’ is not at odds with the age-gap ‘fact’ of the ‘crisis’ has never been addressed. Enjoy a nice break, while some other crowd tries to educate the public without trying to be educational. You could use the time to catch your breath before yelling at the sky again.

with much sympathy,
All Yidden That Can Manage Their Own Lives.

PS If you are anxious that yeshiva bochurim may continue to learn in the interim, there are many other groups dedicated to stopping them. You can join them for moral support. They will be glad to take you in because they are in desperate need of your faux-sincere facade.

@UJM
I had a long and very happy marriage. I know that our life end is determined by HaShem, but as the members of my family in the USA the last 150 years tend to live into their mid90s, I would not like to be alone the next quarter century.
That doesn’t mean I am open to a shadchan soliciting my business. In a year or so I might be open to
Meeting someone.
I have not set up parameters or a wish list, but don’t imagine interest in a woman less than 60 years of age. I definitely am not going to be looking to have more children at this stage of life, so it would be unfair and unwise to marry a woman in a lesser age group.
The companionship and friendship needed to sustain a marriage in retirement years calls for similar life experience and age and backgrounds.

That said, I am sure that my children, siblings and their spouses and in-laws are already discussing possible candidates. I am in no rush

That said, some of these past their 20s females need to open themselves up to the idea of making a marriage, home or family OOT. It adds to the available pool of single men.

Totally agree, just additionally I would say date ooters even if those ooters are willing to live in NY