June 23, 2014 4:36 pm at 4:36 pm #613061
If you did very well on lsat and like law is it a bad idea to go to law school right now in terms of getting a job? I know everyone says it is, but does anyone have a different opinion or more experience? Or is it true that going to law school today is as good as throwing away money for a useless degree? Does it make a big difference if you have connections or not?June 23, 2014 4:57 pm at 4:57 pm #1020854
1. Define “very well.” If you mean 170+, it may be worthwhile to go to law school, if you want to be a lawyer.
2. See above.
3. True, unless see above.
4. Depends on the connections, and that can be the only exception to above. If your father has a small firm and will hire you and give you the firm when he retires, it could make sense to go to a lousy (read “top 20”) law school and do that.June 23, 2014 5:28 pm at 5:28 pm #1020855
If you want to be a lawyer, law school is an excellent idea (the alternative of “reading law” is only bedievad – few people do it any more). You might end up working for a big firm and get rich, you might end up with a respectable government job, and you might end up going into private practice dealing with real people (great if you feel a bit entreprenurial, and like the idea of doing what lawyers do).
Would you want to be a lawyer if lawyers weren’t well compensated – if the answer is yes, then go to law school. If you are asking if law school is worth the time and cost in terms of getting a job which you won’t enjoy but will make you rich – the answer should be obvious. Becoming a lawyer since you think it is a meal ticket shows you are quite dumb. Pick something you enjoy and figure out how to make a profit at it.
Especially if you prefer to be a neighborhood lawyer (rather than a Wall Street “Big law” firm type), going to a fancy law school isn’t that important. Indeed, the graduates of non-elite law schools are usually better qualified to “hang out a shingle” than those in the elite schools. The non-elite law schools are often more liberal with financial aid, and of cource, in many states there are low cost public law schools (e.g. CUNY and SUNY in New York, UB and UM in Baltimore, Rutgers in New Jersey).June 23, 2014 5:32 pm at 5:32 pm #1020856Veltz MeshugenerMember
Not this discussion again. It makes no sense to go to law school because the reasons are obvious:
1. Law school is a terrible decision for people who want to make a living.
2. Law school is very hard, and does not result in a living wage for most people who go unless they go to Harvard and have lots of pull and protektzia.
3. You can’t make a living unless you pass the bar exam and you really have to be at the top of your class in order to do that and even if you do, you won’t get a job. See above.
4. Don’t believe PBA and UBENIGNman who are always trolling for people to go to law school. I happen to know for a fact that both of them have close relatives who work at law schools and that’s why they pretend that it’s not as awful an idea as it really is an awful idea.June 23, 2014 6:39 pm at 6:39 pm #1020857
Veltz Meshugener: If you want to be a lawyer, go for it. There are plenty of people in need of legal services. In New York one would say “in the outer boroughs” – but really it is a function of class more than geography. The bar exam isn’t that hard – most people pass it and those who go to “bad” law schools usually do better than the “good” (probably since “bad” law schools prepare you for practice in one jurisdiction, “good” law schools are bigger on theory). If you idea of a “living wage” involves six or seven figures (US dollars, no decimal point), most lawyers don’t earn a living wage – indeed the only fields in which you get that sort of incomes are professional athletes in major league sports, seucessful businesses, and many people who follow the Madoff career tract — but if you like the idea of being a lawyer, and are content to be middle class, go for it.June 23, 2014 6:54 pm at 6:54 pm #1020858benignumanParticipant
Don’t listen to Veltz, he is trolling and casting aspersions on fine noble advocates of the legal profession.June 23, 2014 6:58 pm at 6:58 pm #1020859
Yes, I am a lawyer lawyer. I represent the interests of lawyers to the wider public.June 23, 2014 7:00 pm at 7:00 pm #1020860☕ DaasYochid ☕Participant
Yes, I am a liar liar. I represent the interests of liars to the wider public.
ftfyJune 23, 2014 7:36 pm at 7:36 pm #1020861👑RebYidd23Participant
Why would anyone want to be a lawyer when they can be a marine biologist or a tailor?June 23, 2014 7:48 pm at 7:48 pm #1020862
rebyidd23 who said: “Why would anyone want to be a lawyer when they can be a marine biologist or a tailor?”
Because they lack manual dexterity and like needles (but are good with words and logic) and don’t like fish (but do like helping people with their problems).June 23, 2014 7:52 pm at 7:52 pm #1020863👑RebYidd23Participant
Then they can do something useful, not be a lawyer who doesn’t even have a job.June 23, 2014 8:10 pm at 8:10 pm #1020864
rebyidd23: 1) Lawyers can be very useful; 2) Unless a lawyer works for the government, a big non-profit or “Big law”, lawyers don’t have jobs – they are self-employed business people whose success largely depends on their own energies and wits.June 23, 2014 8:17 pm at 8:17 pm #1020865dial427436Member
You would also need to pick the type of law you would want to go into. Real estate, divorce, elder, bankruptcy, litigation and much more.June 23, 2014 8:24 pm at 8:24 pm #1020866benignumanParticipant
“Pick something you enjoy and figure out how to make a profit at it.”
That’s nice if you are single and don’t have serious financial responsibilities. Many people need to do what is necessary to support their families whether they enjoy it or not.June 23, 2014 8:40 pm at 8:40 pm #1020867writersoulParticipant
Tailors for marine biologists are always in demand- WATERPROOF LAB COATS!June 23, 2014 8:47 pm at 8:47 pm #1020868
I once met a lawyer who worked for a big corporation and he was doing lawyer stuff for them. Maybe you can do that, but then you have to work for a big corporation.June 23, 2014 9:11 pm at 9:11 pm #1020869newhereParticipant
“bad” law schools usually do better than the “good” (probably since “bad” law schools prepare you for practice in one jurisdiction, “good” law schools are bigger on theory).”
That’s a nice theory but is completely refuted by the data. The better law schools tend to do better on the bar.June 23, 2014 9:52 pm at 9:52 pm #1020870Veltz MeshugenerMember
“That’s a nice theory but is completely refuted by the data” is best described by which of the following:
a. Logically correct
b. Incorrect because there ought to be a comma after the word “theory”
c. Fails to account for the possibility that even “bad” schools also teach theory
d. Fails to account for possibility that factors other than preparation play a role in success on the barJune 23, 2014 9:58 pm at 9:58 pm #1020871
Here is the thing. I do like law and would be content shelling out the big bucks and taking 3 years to have a job that i like doing with 6-8 hour days and 80k-120k a year. But I do not want to take 3 years and go into dept and then have to work 10 hour days and only make 100k a year or work 8 hour days and only make 60k a year but I would be happy with 100k and 8 hour days. Is this realistic?
Why is this not posted?June 23, 2014 10:02 pm at 10:02 pm #1020872
Preferably though, I would prefer 6 hour days and make 70-80k.June 24, 2014 12:15 am at 12:15 am #1020873frumnotyeshivishParticipant
kedushaskohen- in the real world, people will only pay you if they think you are worth it. Being worth it means being perceived as better [for the money] than your competition.
The problem currently for law grads is that there are so many grads for so few entry-level positions. This makes [hyper-competitive] people feel desperate.
In order to get employed out of law school you need to persuade a potential employer that:
1. You will work harder than your competition
2. You will do better work than your competition
3. You will make the firm look good
4. You will bring more money in to the firm than you will take
If any one of those four are lacking you will have a hard time finding a job working for anyone else.
6 hours to make 70-80k? Why only 6? I think 2 is realistic. ‘Cuz everyone else is only offering 1…June 24, 2014 3:04 am at 3:04 am #1020874squeakParticipant
Open your own law school. Not only will you rake it in (think of the tuition per student, you only need a couple of students a year to hit your income goal), but the hours are amazing! Your job is under 10 hours a week, and that’s only during the half a year that school is in session.
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