Lev Tahor – what now?

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  • #1184438

    nishtdayngesheft
    Participant

    “Reform and Conservative don’t believe in Yoshke or Shbtai Zvi either, Maybe they decided that was a good derech for them to hold by”

    Reform and Conservative do not believe in Torah min hashomayim. Or in Hashem entirely. Your comparison is not in the least congruous.

    OO seem to rever yoshke, Avi Weiss has Christian ministers lead singing (yes those are services) in his synagogue. Shlomo Riskin called yoizel a great Rabbi.

    #1184439

    I heard recently that A Dayan went down and helped them out with Askanim and lawyers. Apparently things are settled. They have legal rights to remain in Guatemala.

    #1313249

    YesOrNo
    Participant

    @always runs with scissors fast
    Do you or anyone else have any info regarding the situation now?

    #1313323

    Health
    Participant

    I think either the cult will collapse or some of his second in command will try to take over!

    #1313878

    Lightbrite
    Participant

    Sad. 💖 May his family and friends and people find comfort with the Mourners of Zion.

    #1314151

    Yserbius123
    Participant

    His sons will probably run the show from here, but I have a feeling they will no longer be able to sustain themselves and be unable to recruit new members.

    #1315051

    Joseph
    Participant

    Has anyone heard where the rebbe’s mishpacha is sitting shiva?

    #1315141

    Mammele
    Participant

    More On The Death And Levaya Of ‘Lev Tahor’ Cult Leader Shlomo Helbrans That Drowned In Mexico

    Joseph: no info here on the shiva, but hopefully enough to set you straight.

    From this article it’s very clear how messed up ideologically this group is.

    Please stop with the pandering!

    #1315162

    Joseph
    Participant

    There’s nothing new there other than a repetition of the same media babble of false allegations by detractors that’s been printed previously.

    #1315189

    Theo
    Participant

    Hopefully b’ezras Hashem the whole thing will collapse and the poor Yidden this maniac misled will, with the help of genuine Torah true Yidden, find their way back.

    #1315196

    Yserbius123
    Participant

    Joseph: Did you read the שטרות and קול קורא? I think it’s pretty obvious that this is a cult operating outside the bounds of Torah.

    #1315223

    Sam2
    Participant

    By the way, if you actually read the Hebrew “Takkanos” in the YWN article I cited it’s beyond disturbing. Among the highlights (and I’m not editorializing here):

    6) If you see a talented young person, you must do everything possible to convince them to break off from their families and join the group. After all, if the Communists and Zionists used that tactic for evil and it worked, Kal V’chomer we have to do this for Kedushah purposes.

    10) You have to gather money and give it to Rabbeinu for him to give out to “Tzadikim Nistarim” and you must say that the money is for Pidyon Shevuyim, because the money that has not yet been given to Rabbeinu is like a prisoner in that it hasn’t yet fulfilled its purpose of being used for Tzedaka by Rabbeinu.

    11) (This one is translated in its entirety for the sheer disgustingness of it. Hebrew is provided in places where even I can’t believe that my translation isn’t an exaggeration.) Everyone should understand and realize that a woman is a very disgusting thing (דבר מתועב מאד; it actually calls all women “a disgusting thing), and one has to distance her and abuse her (לענותה) as possible, Mamash like someone in Nidui, and not to help her in the house at all, and not to give her any money other than to live a bare life (חיי דוחק). She should wear worn-out clothing, she should sit alone in her house. If she is giving birth then he (I think this means the husband but I’m not positive) should travel to collect money for Rabbeinu’s needs. She should cook for the needs of the students of Lev Tahor and also must host a certain number of students for set times. Even if they are wild and crazy, this is how you should continue to abuse her (לענותה) and whoever increases in this is more praiseworthy (וכל המרבה הרי זה משובח). And also to hit her if she questions Rabbeinu. And Rabbeinu also practiced this way, to hit the Rabbanit, sometimes himself and sometimes by the Chassidim and his friends… and through all of this the sin of Chava is Metukan.

    14) Don’t ever lie, but if it is for the Kavod of the Kehilah and Kal V’Chomer for Rabbeinu, then it’s a Mitzvah to lie.

    15) Rabbeinu sees through an Apaklaria Ham’ira like Moshe Rabbeinu and RaSHB”I did, therefore only he can suggest Shidduchim and even mentioning a Shidduch idea is disrespectful and deserving of lashes.

    16) The reason members of the Kehillah seem crazy is because the Satan is jealous of them. Also, Rabbeinu is the only one who understands צדיק ורע לו (like Moshe Rabbeinu and RaSHB”I understood it), and therefore the crazy members of the Kehillah are part of צדיק ורע לו.

    19) Every new member must take a Shvua D’Oraisa with Nekitas Tefillin (holding Tefillin while swearing) not to reveal anything that happens here. And if anyone comes to see what happens in the Kehillah, we have to deny all that we do.

    20) Listen to Rabbeinu if he tells you to break a Shidduch or divorce your wife, because he has seen that the person involved needs a Zivug Sheni, and by breaking the Shidduch or divorcing you are saving the life of the one who would otherwise die in order to bring about the Zivug Sheni.

    21) It was revealed to Rabbeinu from on high that only our members will merit to greet Mashiach.

    24) Rabbeinu has a special obligation to be Marbeh in beating his wife (both in כמות and איכות) in order to fix the sin of Chava.

    25) Rabbeinu lies a lot, but it’s a Mitzvah because [something Kaballah having to do with the letters of Kesher and Sheker being the same).

    27) Rabbeinu eats a lot and has fancy meals because he tastes death in every bite, and by his eating fancy meals he is tearing up the bad Gzar Dinim from Klal Yisrael.

    How can anyone even think of defending this?

    #1315279

    Mammele
    Participant

    Thanks Sam. I was trying to figure out which paragraph is most damaging/offensive and post it in response to Joseph, but couldn’t copy paste — and your translating skills are way better than mine.

    Now Joseph will probably deny that it’s true, but only someone that’s truly indoctrinated can come up with such drivel, ostensibly based on Torah logic.

    Joseph, if you keep on defending them I’m afraid you’re joining the ranks of מגלה פנים בתורה שלא כהלכה.
    There’s no way this is correct Torah thought or behavior.

    #1315267

    Joseph
    Participant

    Yseribus: How long would you guess it would take a detractor to write up that stuff? An hour? Two hours?

    Oh, there are signatures. Then it *has* to be real! How could I have missed that??

    #1315296

    Mammele
    Participant

    Joseph: There are literally lives at stake now, to convince the oilam to take proper action, as now can be a שעת הכושר. STOP PUTTING YOUR HEAD IN THE SAND. It’s no joke!

    #1315313

    Mammele
    Participant

    And Joseph, since you’re way smarter than any of his detractors, can you please come up with a similar manifesto in support of Donald Trump or whoever, complete with מאמרי חז״ל etc.?
    It shouldn’t take you more than an hour, tops 2… Just to show how simple these תקנות are to create.

    #1315386

    Yserbius123
    Participant

    Joseph: We’ve been through this before. Lev Tahor’s <i>only</i> defender is Frankfurter from Ami magazine. And in that article, he confirms nearly every major allegation made against the cult but tries to play it off like there’s nothing wrong with taking kids away from their parents or marrying off 14 year olds. I don’t know why you are so insistent on defending them. Do you think it’s normal for a guy with a minimal Yeshiva education to declare himself an Admor, become a huge kiruv macher, but insist that everyone live in extreme seclusion from the rest of the frum world and hold of an invented chumradicke standard of tznius and halacha?

    #1315394

    Joseph
    Participant

    That’s complete hogwash. He’s far from the only defender. And he does not confirm any of the false allegations that you claim he verifies.

    #1315400

    Kotlorism
    Participant

    @joseph is actually a member of this sick deranged cult. Helbrans was a rasha and a cult-leader. If anyone hasn’t yet noticed, Joseph loves the radical terrorists of Neturei Karta, the extreme (and dead wrong) Satmar shita, Lev Tahor, the fake-news Peleg Yerushalmi (even though his Chaim Berlin Rosh Yeshiva where he learned has publicly started calling the Gadol Hadol by the title “Reb Chaim ZT'”L”.

    Joseph is sick. Very very sick. It’s tragic.

    #1315405

    ColumbiaGrad17
    Participant

    Hopefully the cult now dissipates with their evil overlord now deceased.

    #1315449

    a fellow arab
    Participant

    kotlorism: a nicer term for that would be devil’s advocate

    #1315458

    Yserbius123
    Participant

    Joseph: No, you conveniently “forgot” all the pertinent portions of the article. Specifically, on the third page, about halfway down and right above the picture of a smiling little boy, Frankfurter asks this guy about the allegations that kids would be taken from their parents and the guy responds with “Not anymore”. He further inquires about teenage marriages and the response is “A gadol is someone over 13”. You also conveniently have no way of explaining the bizarre behavior and dress of this group. Nor can you name any of these defenders you claim exist.

    #1315499

    GAON
    Participant

    Mammele – whilst I would hate to agree with Joseph lol.. Parts of the Tekanah is surely made up as I have posted on the news site.
    While they might have acted so, but you have to be naive to believe someone would put it on paper.

    #1315503

    GAON
    Participant

    Now regarding the lost souls there, I think someone from the far right, someone these people would respect, even a half-normal Neturei Karta should go in there and start guiding these people. This is Pekuach nefoshos!

    #1315558

    Mammele
    Participant

    I wish it were that simple to get them to change and voluntarily flee from their shackles, but Hatzlacha rabbah to whoever tries it.

    No one would be allowed to guide them against the cult’s doctrine from within their enclave, so the only way out is physical removal from the group and its leaders. Unless perhaps if ALL the leaders are removed.

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