Living Wage

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  • #618397

    playforfun22
    Member

    How much money does a frum family need to earn pre-tax to live “comfortably.”

    Let’s assume 3-4 kids, paying full tuition, cover all bills, 1-2 vacations per year. Use NY as a starting point, but feel free to add what it would be in whatever city you live in.

    #1181169

    DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Full tuition has a large range. Vacation costs probably do as well.

    #1181170

    Joseph
    Participant

    You can forgo vacations and still define it as a living wage.

    #1181171

    Sparkly
    Member

    at least $200,000 which means mommy working as pharmacist and daddy in computers for example (because many guys like working with computers and girls as pharmacists) so that would give about at least $230,000 per year for the family then youve got tuition about $100,000 per year depending how many kids your sending usually a lot if its a frum family, then youve got to pay for the house i would assume at least $50,000 per year at least on the house, then youve got your car payments and your electricity bill and food bill with the rest of the $80,000 and maybe some people might need more even!!

    #1181172

    keeps changing as economy changes & all depends on which schools you send kids to, also depends on renting or paying mortgage.

    definitely somewhere between 80-120g minimum

    perhaps its time to go just on summer vacation versus twice a year.

    #1181173

    Sparkly
    Member

    Mashiach Agent – i agree it MAINLY has a LOT to do with the economy.

    #1181174

    Bored_on_the_Job
    Participant

    MA – 80 G in NY is not even close – you need double that.

    #1181175

    Joseph
    Participant

    Chareidim need less than non-Chareidi Jews since chareidim minimize expenses, including not demanding a private prep school quality secular education.

    #1181176

    Sparkly…you need a reality check.sorry

    #1181177

    Sparkly
    Member

    Happygirlygirl – about the fact that these stem jobs make lots of money?

    #1181178

    Excellence
    Participant

    Heaven sets your yearly and daily income. Technically, the more children you have the more parnasathey send down…

    #1181179

    Excellence
    Participant

    I read a frightening story of the Chofetz Chaim about a destitute man who tried to pray for more $$….

    #1181180

    Meno
    Participant

    “Sparkly…you need a reality check.sorry”

    “about the fact that these stem jobs make lots of money?”

    No, about this:

    “because many guys like working with computers”

    I know very few guys who work in computers.

    #1181181

    apushatayid
    Participant

    I do most of my work in front of a computer, but in one would be way to cramped and uncomfortable.

    #1181182

    Bored_on_the_Job
    Participant

    whats the story – i am not familiar

    #1181183

    Meno
    Participant

    “but in one would be way to cramped and uncomfortable”

    I agree, especially all these newfangled computers all the kids are using. They’re all so tiny. How do you even use such a thing?

    #1181184

    Yserbius123
    Participant

    Everyone here is ignoring tuition breaks. Which I think is fine, as there are very few families that can afford a full tuition for more than one or two kids in Yeshiva. One kid in school can get by on a 100k salary. This is also obviously talking about the US. In Eretz Yisroel, having multiple children doesn’t add too much to the financial burden as there are much larger tax breaks and tuition for most Chedarim is less than a fifth of the US.

    #1181185

    akuperma
    Participant

    Define comfortably. Some people would not be comfortable with a spacious home with a room for each child, central air conditioning, multiple cars, vacations, ability to pay full tuition for yeshiva and college, going out to restaurants, buying new clothes, etc.

    Some people are quite comofortable with beds for each child, adequate access to transportation to get to school and work, ability to finance education even if it involves creative use of scholarships, enough food to eat, ability to afford respectable clothes even if some of them were bought second hand and have been patched.

    Seventy-five years ago, most frum Jews would be comfortable with a roof over their head, enough food so they weren’t starving, and not having someone actively trying to kill them.

    Of course religious fanatics hold by: “????? ???? ???? ?????”

    #1181186

    👑RebYidd23
    Participant

    Is Mashiach Agent okay with creative use of scholarships?

    #1181187

    Today people are living with 3 cars and3 vacations a year and then they approach me with budgeting issues and wonder why they are broke

    GET WHAT YOU NEED NOT WHAT YOU WANT

    Start preparing for next summer by only eating out once a week versus twice and only taking 1 vacation trip this year and all your children’s camps will be covered with no stress or worries

    #1181188

    Joseph
    Participant

    MA, there is absolutely no need to eat out once a week. That is a luxury. And so is going on even one costly vacation. A cheap drive to a farm or country setting for a couple of days a year is more than sufficient.

    #1181189

    Abba_S
    Participant

    Are you taking Federal, State & Local Income Tax together with Social Security Tax which in NYC all together can run as high as 33% of gross income into consideration? Also let’s not forget health insurance cost and expenses ie co-pays.

    #1181190

    Joseph

    Your absolutely right. But sadly today we are living in a spoiled generation. Ladies feel the pressure to wear same expensive clothes as their neighbors etc…

    #1181191

    apushatayid
    Participant

    You can eat out 10 times a week and take 30 vacations a year, if you can afford it (of course this includes discussing with ones Rav their tzadaka obligations and they meet those as well, all part of “afford it”). “Live comfortably means different things to different people. Nobody can answer that except you. Sit down with pen and paper, list all those things you believe are included in “comfortably” then we can discuss what your salary needs to be.

    #1181192

    I. M. Shluffin
    Participant

    Maybe we should start a kibbutz

    #1181193

    I know a family who moved to a new frum community from a different frum community. They moved 5 or more years ago but they are still living with the mentality and way of life of the former town they used to live in-game from where they currently live-and that way of life makes them look like they are living in denial cause where they live now there’s so much more but they choose to continue living simply in the style and ways of their former community.

    Hope they wake up soon to reality

    #1181194

    Lightbrite
    Participant

    MA: I’m confused. What’s the difference between that and Jews that are still living like their in Eastern Europe on American soil?

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