Milchigs and/or fleishings on Shavous

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  • #596882

    Sender Av
    Member

    What is your custom and why?

    #770046

    am yisrael chai
    Participant

    Kiddush, milchig, wait, wash, fleishig.

    Every meal.

    You know why!

    #770047

    charliehall
    Participant

    Dairy and Pareve. We are vegetarians.

    #770048

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Kiddush, fleishig, wait, wash, milchig.

    Every meal.

    We’re Dutch.

    j/k

    #770049

    am yisrael chai
    Participant

    I thought vegetarians needed to have a “token” of something fleishig to be yotze ????? ????

    #770050

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Charlie, do you eat fish?

    #770051

    Imaofthree
    Participant

    This year I am planning on serving fleishig for the evening meals and dairy for the two lunch meals. cheesecake here I come! 🙂

    #770052

    charliehall
    Participant

    “Charlie, do you eat fish? “

    Yes.

    #770053

    charliehall
    Participant

    ‘I thought vegetarians needed to have a “token” of something fleishig to be yotze ????? ???? ‘

    In my experience it is quite rare for the seudah after a brit to be fleishig.

    #770054

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Yes.

    Then I think that’s also considered “basar”, although it’s something I haven’t (yet) researched thoroughly.

    In my experience it is quite rare for the seudah after a brit to be fleishig.

    There are some who do serve meat, because it is, IIRC, considered preferable. The reason most don’t is because most people (including the guests) are unaccustomed to eating meat in the morning.

    #770055

    bezalel
    Participant

    Kiddush, fleishig, wait, wash, milchig.

    Every meal.

    We’re Dutch.

    j/k

    IIRC milchig is never allowed after fleishig in the same meal regardless of how long the meal takes (or how short your minhag is to wait).

    #770056

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    IIRC milchig is never allowed after fleishig in the same meal regardless of how long the meal takes (or how short your minhag is to wait).

    I remember it as a machlokes. I’ll bl”n look it up over Shabbos and get back to you.

    #770057

    mewho
    Participant

    we do one dairy meal in honor of tradition. the rest are meat

    #770058

    In EY, the seuda after a bris is almost always fleishig, even if it’s served at 8 am.

    #770059

    I heard a shiur from Rav Yitzchok Berkowitz, SHLITA, several years ago about how in the case of shavuos, milk reperesents the Torah, and so the Simcha is through milchigs, NOT basar v’yayin like in all other yomim tovim. It was deeper than that, but that’s the gist. I wonder what his personal minhag is, but since then I think that people are misguided in their eating meat every meal for this Yom Tov.

    Does anyone agree with me that it’s become another thing that is the ‘frummer’ thing to do totally based on nothing?

    #770060

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Bezalel,

    The machlokes I remembered is about fleishigs after milchigs. Since you were responding to my post about the reverse, you’d be right, one would need to clear the table and say a bracha acharona first (this is actually a machlokes rishonim, but this is how we pasken).

    #770061

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Does anyone agree with me that it’s become another thing that is the ‘frummer’ thing to do totally based on nothing?

    I can’t answer your question, since I don’t know of anyone who agrees with you. I can say that I disagree.

    #770062

    amichai
    Participant

    milchig both meals.

    #770063

    s2021
    Member

    ramat- No, its not based on nothing. Most men I know seriously dont tolerate dairy meals- its simply not FOOD in their dictionary Yom Tov or not…

    #770064

    am yisrael chai
    Participant

    “Does anyone agree with me that it’s become another thing that is the ‘frummer’ thing to do totally based on nothing?”

    No. It clearly is stated about basar for seudas YO”T.

    There is an additional inyan of milchig on Shavuos for several reasons, only one of which you bring up.

    So some do both, not either/or.

    #770065

    am yisrael chai
    Participant

    “In EY, the seuda after a bris is almost always fleishig, even if it’s served at 8 am.”

    Mostly where I am, too. I was totally stunned to hear that it’s not mostly the case, as Charlie says.

    #770066

    charliehall
    Participant

    “Then I think that’s also considered “basar”, although it’s something I haven’t (yet) researched thoroughly. “

    My rabbi says just that.

    #770067

    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    Kiddush, wash, meat, wait, more meat, wait, more meat, wait, more meat.

    #770068

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    popa,

    Have some bread after you wash.

    Otherwise, I do the same as you, except for the waiting part. ?

    #770069

    mamashtakah
    Member

    Milchigs at night, because who feels like eating meat when the chag starts so late?

    Milchigs during the day, because who feels like sleeping until noon and then eating a heavy meal?

    (Besides, if one can have ice cream or cheesecake for dessert, why eat meat?)

    And that’s it – one day, as it was meant to be.

    #770070

    always here
    Participant

    Kiddush, milchig, wait, wash, fleishig.

    one year I made a milchig lunch.. everyone in my family was very happy, except my husband. ..my husband says fish & meat for seudas, including for a morning bris.

    #770071

    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    This is important:

    If you are going to eat milchigs and then fleishigs, you need to remember to not taste the meat when you are cooking it on erev yontif. (My brother and father did that last year, and were fleishig.)

    #770072

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    If you are going to eat milchigs and then fleishigs, you need to remember to not taste the meat when you are cooking it on erev yontif.

    Unless you’re Dutch.

    #770073

    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    Unless you’re Dutch.

    Are Dutch really Jewish?

    #770074

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Are Dutch really Jewish?

    Some of the men are.

    For example, Rabbi Ralbag is Dutch.

    #770075

    Pac-Man
    Member

    Rabbi Ralbag from Triangle-K?

    #770076

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Yes. Does that ruin the joke?

    #770077

    The lists of reasons for milchigs is out of control. I heard a shiur once…mamish like 20-25 reasons, likely not an exhaustive list.

    Nonetheless, the Rema in Shulchan Aruch gives the reason because one is supposed to eat both challahs in lechem mishna, as a rememberance the bringing of two loaves in the Beis Hamikdash. In other words, one will eat dairy, which now makes the bread unusable for a fleishig meal (din in Shulchan Aruch), then bentsch/wait/wash, eat fleishigs now with the other challah. Therefore milchigs is really at least outwardly just to remind one to eat both loaves of bread.

    Again there are other reasons, but the most “codified” is worthy to take note.

    DQB

    #770078

    Sender Av
    Member

    How did this thread end all the way down here?

    #770079

    Sender Av
    Member

    Ramateshkolian , I think I may agree with you and does anyone else have any information similar to what was said by Rav Berkowitz???

    #770080

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Ramateshkolian , I think I may agree with you and does anyone else have any information similar to what was said by Rav Berkowitz???

    Let’s assume that R’ Berkowitz said that milk represents the Torah, so the rule which applies to other Yomim Tovim doesn’t apply to Shavuos. Now, if anyone goes according to the simple understanding, that Shavuos is the same as other Yomim Tovim, it’s “totally based on nothing”?

    Anyone who doesn’t follow this little known opinion which deviates from simple understanding (although I’m not c”v belittling it or R’ Berkowitz) must definitely be motivated by sinister motives (trying to do the “frummer” thing, meaning ga’avah)?

    Sorry, I most definitely disagree.

    #770081

    You know why there are only pareve and fleishik korbanos? Because the men couldn’t be trusted to maintain two separate mizbeyachs. (mizbeychos?)

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