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i know this is quite a digression from my usual topics but just wondering about this. i was waiting for the train this morning and since the clock changed, there are very few frum men on the train @ 650am. so i’m there with my friend waiting and i see 1 bachur run to buy a ticket before the train came, then i saw a second then a third bachur. so i nudged my friend (to point out the stupid looking kooky nerd glasses). then we realized there were like none of the regulars cuz they were at minyan but there were 3 bachurim on break. so my q is
A-was it possible they davened early enough for a 650am train
B-would they get to the manhatten with enough time to catch a minyan
C-do most bachurim on bein hazmanim continue going to minyan the way they did during zman
(i have no bro’s to ask so asking all the dudes/guys/men/gentlemen of the CR)
Is this really any of your business? Aren’t you supposed to be dan l’kaf z’chut?
It isn’t bein hazmanim in any American yeshiva until rosh chodesh. And it isn’t rosh chodesh yet (I don’t think).
In any event, maybe they needed to go somewhere and weren’t able to daven with a minyan. It happens.
Girls think minyan is this hugely big deal. For many guys, meh. You win some, you lose some, you get plenty of chances. I ain’t talking about what it should be–I’m talking about what it is.
This often comes up in shidduchim, where a girl’s side will want to know whether the guy goes to minyan on time every day. It is a silly irrelevant question, and should not be asked. If you want to know whether he is responsible and productive- ask about something else.
I wouldn’t call it silly and irrelevant. I do agree that unfortunately often an otherwise responsible productive guy will be lax in this area, and you therefore won’t get the complete picture from this detail.
PBA, what would you suggest to ask about to check a bochur’s middah of responsibility?
I dont know where you live, or what logistics are involved in getting from shul to the train. in my neighborhood the 5:50 minyan ends early enough to first stop for breakfast at the bagel store with time to get to the platform by 6:50.
To answer your questions.
A-was it possible they davened early enough for a 650am train
It is possible.
B-would they get to the manhatten with enough time to catch a minyan
Depends. Where are they leaving from? what minyan are they trying to make?
C-do most bachurim on bein hazmanim continue going to minyan the way they did during zman
Lets put it this way. The retirees in my neighborhood cant wait for bein hazmanim, it is when the shteeble has a 9:00 weekday shachris as well 🙂
PBA, what would you suggest to ask about to check a bochur’s middah of responsibility?
That’s a good question. There isn’t really a lot you are responsible for as a guy living in the dorm. I don’t know. I’m just pretty sure that going to shachris is not a good proxy for that.
PBA isnt the time someone arrives at and leaves the minyan a good indicator of whether or not they are a dolt…
Sorry, dolt that I am, I meant to write ‘nerd’ not dolt. Its coming up to that time of year again… Long chol hamoed morning davenings again! Popa watch out… Lol
POPPA BAR ABBA:”If you want to know whether he is responsible and productive- ask about something else.”
I vehemently disagree with your post. Minyan= consistency. Those people who daven early in the morning every single day are the ones that are sucessfull and responsible. They have a set schedule and and will not deviate from anything. My father has been davening at the same 6:30 minyan for the past twenty years and always underscores the importance of minyan.
However, the people who show up to an 11:00 minyan are those that don’t have a plan or set schedule. They are inconsistent. How will they show up at 9am every morning when/if they get a job? Those are the people whom I would not want to marry if I was a girl.
I vehemently disagree with your post. Minyan= consistency. Those people who daven early in the morning every single day are the ones that are sucessfull and responsible. They have a set schedule and and will not deviate from anything. My father has been davening at the same 6:30 minyan for the past twenty years and always underscores the importance of minyan.
However, the people who show up to an 11:00 minyan are those that don’t have a plan or set schedule. They are inconsistent. How will they show up at 9am every morning when/if they get a job? Those are the people whom I would not want to marry if I was a girl.
Sounds like you are a girl, since you refer to your father instead of yourself. So, for purposes of this discussion, just imagine that minyan to you is like childbirth to men–you will never know what it is like and will have to rely on others to tell you.
I’m not talking about people who get up at 11. I’m talking about people who come on time to seder at 930, but don’t go to minyan at 730 on time every day. Rather, they come at 740, and occasionally at 750, and occasionally daven in the laundry room. Or, they always daven in the laundry room. Or, they go down the street to the other minyan which davens at 815. Or, whatever.
So, you’ll say you can just ask about if they come to seder on time. Unfortunately, there are very many people who don’t come to seder on time. Within 20 minutes is basically regarded as on time, in many places.
And the people I am talking about, are often the guys who if you asked me–and I decided to answer honestly–are the responsible guys in yeshiva. Often, the people who come on time every day are not the most responsible guys. I have not seen a very direct correlation between guys I consider responsible and guys who come on time to shachris.
And when they leave yeshiva, and need to get something done–they do it. Well.
Minyan = Consistency. For some it is consistently on time, for others it is consistently 15 minutes late and for others it is consistently at the kosel (of their dorm room).
Agree with popa.
Girls think minyan is this hugely big deal. For many guys, meh. You win some, you lose some, you get plenty of chances. I ain’t talking about what it should be–I’m talking about what it is.
This is what it is:- Get used to attending a Minyan now, during your youth; and of-course arriving on time at the Minyan, which for Schachris means 5 minutes before the Minyan is called for, so that you are clad with Tallis & Tefillin when services commence.
Don’t wait for the unfortunate day you have to recite Kaddish, and then you have 2 tragedies 2 contend with concurrently:- The loss of the parent, and having to acclimatize to attending each & every Minyan, and always getting there on time.
Watching women reading some Siddur on the subway with all the Tumoh around,{which men don’t do out of respect for their Tallis & Tefillin} & watching for their stop, so that they don’t have to make a time allowance at home to Daven before commuting, really cheapens the concept of “Da Lifnei Mi Atoh Omed”
“Watching women reading some Siddur on the subway”
Even when they are greasing the wheels…
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