Missionary tactic?

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  • #602783

    Announcement
    Participant

    I was standing with my teenage daughter on a train platform, waiting for the train to come. While a woman passed us by, she threw something down at our feet. I looked down and saw what looked like a very large gold key around 6 inches long, a regular sized key, and a bill that was at least $20. The woman walked past us and then stood observing us. My daughter spontaneously started to bend down to pick it up to give back to her, when I fast told her not to pick it up and I pulled her away. Then the woman in a low voice said a bit nastily “you couldn’t pick it up?”. She then asked a man who was passing to pick it up. Smiling to himself, he picked it up and returned the items to her. Though it looked like they didn’t know each other, I am sure they were together and it was planned.

    While I’m not certain what her intentions were, I believe the large gold key was something of an avodah zorah. And she wanted one of us to bend down and pick it up thereby bowing down to her a”z.

    Just wanted others to know, because I sure this is not the first time she tried it,nor will it be the last time.

    #866831

    apushatayid
    Participant

    Is it possible you have an overactive imagination?

    #866832

    wanderingchana
    Participant

    I wonder if this is related:

    “A golden key can open any door

    Meaning

    Money opens any door.

    Origin

    This notion must be as old as money itself. The first person who is known to have written it down is the English playwright John Lyly, in Euphues and his England, 1580:

    Who is so ignorant that knoweth not, gold be a key for euery locke, chieflye with his Ladye.

    The proverb was the basis of the 1969 British comedy The Magic Christian, in which characters played by Peter Sellars and Ringo Starr use large amounts of money to bribe people to humiliate themselves by doing things completely out of character.”

    #866833

    oomis
    Participant

    I doubt this was a missionary tactic. Maybe she just dropped her key and the money. But if you felt uncomfortable, it is always a good idea to trust your gut.

    #866834

    gefen
    Participant

    Announcement: Are you sure she threw it and didn’t just drop it? Then you say she walked passed you and stopped to observe you. Were you watching her from the moment she threw/dropped the item? Are you sure this is the way it happened? If so, then, yes, it sounds weird. There are a lot of strange people out there. Guess you might have met one (or two, if the man was really part of it) of them.

    #866835

    menucha12
    Member

    yikes thats all there is to it

    #866836

    Announcement
    Participant

    I only wrote what occured so that if it happens to someone else they should be aware.

    #866837

    Announcement
    Participant

    Were you watching her from the moment she threw/dropped the item?

    I wasn’t in watching mode, I was in instant decision mode and trying to determine what was going on. And looking at the floor to see what she dropped and looking at my daughter to see what she was doing.

    I felt her staring at me, so I automatically looked at her. Her gaze was not friendly so I looked away. Then I felt her throw something at me. My first thought was she is an anti-semite and threw some garbage at me. So I turned to look at her (she already walked away) expecting her to continue on her way, but she didn’t. She had turned around and was watching us. Her behavior was not of someone who just dropped something. So I looked down to see what she dropped. Then I saw my daughter starting to bend down to pick it up. I told her not to, and we walked away.

    I am certain that it was a ploy. What the ploy was I can only guess.

    In any case, like I said, I only said it for others to be aware, should it happen to them.

    #866838

    gefen
    Participant

    Announcement- I’m getting confused.

    First you wrote:

    “I was standing with my teenage daughter on a train platform, waiting for the train to come. While a woman passed us by, she threw something down at our feet. I looked down and saw what looked like a very large gold key around 6 inches long, a regular sized key, and a bill that was at least $20. The woman walked past us and then stood observing us…”

    Then you wrote:

    “I felt her staring at me, so I automatically looked at her. Her gaze was not friendly so I looked away. Then I felt her throw something at me. My first thought was she is an anti-semite and threw some garbage at me. So I turned to look at her (she already walked away) expecting her to continue on her way, but she didn’t. She had turned around and was watching us…”

    Which was it? Did she first pass by and throw it? Or did you first feel her staring at you and then she threw it from where she was standing? Or did she throw two things? Please clarify your story.

    #866839

    QuestionForYou
    Participant

    Your instincts were correct.

    If the woman really dropped something,

    why didn’t she come back to pick it up?

    Was there something physically wrong with her,

    that she couldn’t pick it up herself?

    #866840

    zahavasdad
    Participant

    It was NOT Avodah Zarah, you need to step back a bit and realize not everyone is out to get you

    Today people seek converts which means joining their religion (and pay dues to the hirearchy)

    If the person had you do this and then took your name and number for “information” then id be concerned. Or maybe tried to give you a Flyer or Pamphlet.

    #866841

    Announcement
    Participant

    Gefen: I don’t see the contradiction. They are both correct. Seeing that the posters here are doubting me I simply gave more details as to what occurred.

    And as I mentioned: she threw three items. A very large gold key – studded with diamonds (i know I left out that it was studded with diamonds), a regular sized key, and maybe a $20 bill (it was folded in 4 – so I’m not sure the denomination)

    QuestionForYou: Thank you. There is no doubt in my mind that it was intentional and with a purpose.

    #866842

    gefen
    Participant

    Announcement: yes you said three items, but it sounded like she threw them all at one time. see your first post. So I’m not sure what happened when.

    #866843

    Announcement
    Participant

    Did she first pass by and throw it? Or did you first feel her staring at you and then she threw it from where she was standing?

    I reread what you wrote. I didn’t say she was standing in one place when she threw it. She was staring at me while she was walking towards my direction. I turned away, and then she threw the items while she was passing by.

    #866844

    WolfishMusings
    Participant

    Who worships keys?

    The Wolf

    #866845

    giggle girl
    Participant

    WolfishMusings:

    Who worships keys? I’ll tell you! Bnei Yisroel.

    Source: In Parshas Ki Sisa Perek Lamed Beis Passuk Zayin it states:

    Va’Yedaber Ha-Shem El Moshe “Lech Reid KEY Shicheis Amcha…”

    How was Bnei Yisroel “Shicheis”? By the Eigel (however you spell it in English – the golden calf) which was gold – hence a GOLDEN KEY! 😉

    #866846

    WolfishMusings
    Participant

    Heh heh… very cute.

    Seriously, however… who worships keys that you would think it’s an avoda zara? What if someone asks me to pick up an empty candy wrapper — do I have to suspect that that’s an avoda zara too?

    The Wolf

    #866847

    I’m thinking the same. What religion has anything with keys? Golden keys? This is so bizarre…

    #866848

    Announcement
    Participant

    Ok. Since you posters had your doubts, and I was very sure of my suspicions, I decided to search online and while I will not read much about it, I have discovered that the gold key is actually some kind of symbol in trinity (are we allowed to type that word?) which is part of the Catholic religion. And in fact, I believe I found online the actual key that I saw (or very close). And in that picture that I saw online, the part of key that gets inserted into the lock, had the outline of a cross!

    (The regular key and the bill that was dropped along with it was clearly a diversion that we shouldn’t become suspicious, which is what I understood right away.)

    #866849

    wanderingchana
    Participant

    Good for you for sticking by your intuition, and thank you for the warning.

    #866850

    Announcement
    Participant

    And the part of key that you hold on to has the symbol of trinity on it.

    Wonderingchana: Thanks and your welcome.

    #866851

    apushatayid
    Participant

    Those denominations that use icons, use them as prayer tools, they are not prayed to.

    #866852

    wanderingchana
    Participant

    Apy, depends on the icon. They have their saints and such they ask to intercede on their behalf.

    The funniest one I know of is the one they stick head first in the dirt in their backyard when they lose something. “Nope… I don’t see it here either…”

    #866853

    Sam2
    Participant

    Announcement: I hold, at the very least, that the trinity is Avodah Zarah Mamash and that the word should be Assur to say in the referring to Christianity, for whatever that’s worth.

    And just a question on this whole Ma’aseh. If you had picked it up, you wouldn’t have done anything wrong (unless you knew of this key thing beforehand). Why does it matter whatever Shtus this person had in mind?

    #866854

    Czar
    Member

    For the same reason Chana’s youngest (of 7) son refused to pick up Antiochus’ ring.

    #866855

    Nechomah
    Participant

    I would bet that she wanted to get you in trouble with the law, like maybe she would accuse you of stealing the things from her rather than that she dropped them and you were helping her by picking them up. Maybe in her mind you would have been “worshiping avodah zara” by bending your head to pick up the symbols, but for you it would not have been done with any kavanah, so what could it be considered?

    #866856

    WolfishMusings
    Participant

    For the same reason Chana’s youngest (of 7) son refused to pick up Antiochus’ ring.

    Oh, please. You’re comparing a case where (a) the intention of idolatry was known and (b) where the idol was right there to this case?

    The Wolf

    #866857

    Right Path
    Member

    The more logical explanation is, you were a target in the NYPD program called Operation Lucky Bag.

    Do a search on google keywords “Operation Lucky Bag”.

    #866858

    Announcement
    Participant

    Right path: I looked it up & no, what occurred doesnt seem anything like it “operation lucky bag”.

    #866859

    Right Path
    Member

    giggle girl: in Yiddish a cow is called a Key.

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