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Just wanted to make sure we’re all aware that some things on this planet are not Avodah Zarah.
Thanks for that information.
Can you notes tell us what *is* Avoda Zora?
Joseph
Learn for once. Start with Shulchan aruch Y”D 139
If you have some time learn YD 178 which seems to confuse you greatly.
ubiq: Why are you opposed to having Torah discussions and learning here?
Joseph
I would never oppose discussion and certainly not Torah discussion. however you have shown to not be interested in discussion, Torah or otherwise.
Ive often cited to you sources on the topic of chukas akum including with English translation in case your Hebrew isnt up to par. Yet you are still under the mistaken assumption that simply because it is “goyish” makes it chukas akum.
If you are actually open to discussion by all means. I love learning new things
ubiq: Aside from putting words in others mouths, as you’ve done to DY, myself and others, and your lack of comprehension for answers you are repeatedly given including broken down in very simple terms after your third and fourth request for an answer already given, you also misrepresent the position of others.
Joseph
“Aside from putting words in others mouths, as you’ve done to DY, myself and others,”
Never done intentionally, perhaps Ive misstated an opinion or carried it to a logical extreme. If pointed out that I misinterpreted I always retract an apologize.
“and your lack of comprehension for answers you are repeatedly given”
Never occured. PErhaps you have trouble picking up on a subtle distiction or refusal to read a source I provide
“including broken down in very simple terms after your third and fourth request for an answer already given,”
Never. In fact quite the opposite
” you also misrepresent the position of others.”
As mentioned never intentionally.
You on the other hand frequently lie as ive proven to you on countless threads
You also repeat yourself even whe I patiently explain why you are mistaken see here please
“Thanks for that information.
Can you notes tell us what *is* Avoda Zora? “
Rambam AZ 2:1
???? ?????? ?????? ???, ??? ????? ??? ??? ???????–?? ????, ??? ????, ??? ????, ??? ??? ????? ???????, ??? ??? ??? ??????? ???. ??? ?? ?? ?????? ???? ??’ ??? ???????, ???? ???? ????? ??? ?? ??? ???? ???? ????? ???? ?????–??? ?? ???? ????? ???.
In school we always had teachers tell us “when you are too in to your clothing you are turning it in to avoda zara” or ” the avoda zara of todays generation is technology or iPhone’s”.
So I have a problem with that. Because it was probably that same teacher who said that there is no more avoda zara in this generation because the anshei kineses hagidola asked Hashem to remove the taiva.
So there is no Avoda Zara now, right? And its probably apikorsus to say that there is.
(Not to take away that I firmly believe that iPhones are harmful to both mind and soul).
So I think this thrad should be renamed “NOTHING is Avoda Zara”
Rebyidd: No, but one of my sister’s seminary teachers taught her that it’s Apikorsus to say that neopaganism exists because it denies the Gemara that HIR referenced.
Did I miss something? Why did ubiquitin just start rudely freaking out at Joseph with no provocation?
Hashemisreading: I 90% agree with you. The analogies between materialism and avodah zara and really annoying, and are probably one of the catalysts for this thread.
However, it’s not correct to say there is no avodah zara today. There are sects of far Eastern religions that absolutely bow down to idols. I know a Tibetan Buddhist (wasn’t always Buddhist since I’ve known her), and they put food in front of idols. I also met a Neopagan who poured libation wine to his false gods. Indisputable avodah zara.
I think the point was people are throwing Avodah Zarah at almost anything they dislike .
Rebyidd: No, but one of my sister’s seminary teachers taught her that it’s Apikorsus to say that neopaganism exists because it denies the Gemara that HIR referenced.
Seminary IS AVODA ZARA 🙂 :-p
Seriously, just another example how Sem teachers really don’t know anything.
Yes, and the point was saying that Avoda Zara exists when it does not.
Sam2, if the sem teacher said that then I think she’s wrong.
Please correct me if I’m mistaken, but the gemara HIR referenced refers to the overwhelming taiva for a”z being removed, not the removal of any form of idolatry.
HIR -“”when you are too in to your clothing you are turning it in to avoda zara” or ” the avoda zara of todays generation is technology or iPhone’s”.”
They’re exaggerating! Don’t take everything so literally.
“So I have a problem with that. Because it was probably that same teacher who said that there is no more avoda zara in this generation because the anshei kineses hagidola asked Hashem to remove the taiva.”
That’s the problem when women learn Gemorrah. The Gemorrah only says that there is no more desire. Who says you can’t do it even without any desire?!?
Could be the Gemorrah does say -no more avoda zara, but the Pshat is like I just wrote!
Health, the problems arise when women And men misunderstand or misinterpret the words of our holy Amoraim.
Whether women are more prone to do so due to their lack of proficiency in these studies is another discussion.
Health: Maybe their exaggerating, but they still meant their point that they are finding physical manifestations of things that can be used a Avoda Zara today.
golfer: The Gemora gives a reason other than women’s lack of proficiency in Gemora studies as to why they’re more prone to misinterpret it.
HIR -“Maybe their exaggerating, but they still meant their point that they are finding physical manifestations of things that can be used a Avoda Zara today”
I understand the point that they’re trying to make. A good teacher doesn’t have to exaggerate to make a point!
BTW, these issues of Tznius & technology, whether Osser or Mutter, have nothing to do with Avodah Zora.
Ohr gedalyohu explains the Machlokes rambam and ramban about the reason for Korbonos based on gemoro (cant remember source as I’m at work) which says – Eizehu Avodah Zoro She’B’Odom, Havei Omer, Zu Yetser Hora. Basically, the Ohr Gedalyohu learns this as being the ego (lots of maarei mekomos for this), so what the Rambam means is that a Korban is supposed to distance oneself from the Avodah Zoro of “I,” the ego – this answers why Odom ha’Rishon brought a Korbon even though there was no Ovodah Zoro then. When he did the Aveiroh he felt an “I” inside himself and immediately wanted to draw that closer to Hashem. (I’m not doing justice to one of the most brilliant pieces in the Sefer – go look inside). As such, everything that involves putting, “I” above Hashem is Avodah Zoro. But this is borderline Chassidishe Torah 🙂
aquestioningjew -“As such, everything that involves putting, “I” above Hashem is Avodah Zoro.”
I didn’t start this topic, but it looks like it was based on Halachah. Your post is Mussar, not Halachah!
I did say it was borderline Chassidish 🙂
But, that said, the gemoro does say the Avodah Zoro inside a person is the Yetzer Hora. But yes, halachically, learn Sanhedrin and the definitions are there.
However, most people commenting here are also talking Mussar – like teachers saying etc.
But (again) point well made 🙂
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