OOT vs. NY

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  • #599361

    Queen Bee
    Member

    Can someone please explain the difference in mentality between someone from out of town to someone from the NY area? Examples of what one would/wouldn’t do vs. what another would/wouldn’t do is appreciated. Thanks.

    #810616

    shmoel
    Member

    New York is saturated with many of the ultra frum.

    #810617

    TheGoq
    Participant

    We are all Hashem’s children people from different places may appear different but we are all part of one people lets find the things that unite as rather than divide us, As for me born oot but i’ve been her a dozen years and consider myself a New Yorker now and i wouldn’t go back.

    #810618

    rc
    Participant

    its one of those things if you have to ask…..

    #810619

    shmoel
    Member

    Why wouldn’t you go back OOT, The Goq?

    #810620

    bein_hasdorim
    Participant

    An out of towner, after being aware that the light turned green,

    would give the car ahead of them at least 20 seconds before politely tapping their horn,

    as opposed to a New Yorker who would blast a full “Tekiah Gedolah” as soon the light turned green, having counted down the seconds till blast off themselves. 🙂

    #810621

    Queen Bee
    Member

    I didn’t start this thread to prove how one is “better” than the other. I honestly just want to know, since I’m a NYer and I’ve never felt like I belong here. Maybe I fit in better with OOT, or maybe I just don’t fit in anywhere.

    #810622

    sam4321
    Participant

    I find oot people to be more relaxed and not on edge.People from New York are always on the move.That being said,everyone is different and no generalization can be made(just from my experience).

    #810623

    always here
    Participant

    Queen Bee~ I’m curious about your curiousity.. where are YOU from?

    #810624

    always here
    Participant

    (I see you answered my question in the meanwhilst).

    #810625

    ☕️coffee addict
    Participant

    I have a perfect example!

    My wife and I went to a vort in miami beach and my wife was suprised that no one was wearing fancy clothing

    Before my wife and I setted in florida she thought she had to go everywhere with her sheitel on, little did she realize that no one wears sheitels, only tichels (except on very special occasions)

    #810626

    aries2756
    Participant

    You do realize of course that anyone OOT, meaning out of NY, refers to the rest of us as OOTers. NY is not necessarily THE town. Chicago is a big town and so is California, not to mention parts of Canada and of course Israel. So OOT depends on what perspective you are looking at.

    Maybe the question should be NY’ers vs NON-NY’ers.

    #810627

    gefen
    Participant

    shmoel – you don’t think there are ultra frum anywhere else? here in chicago we actually do see some shtreimels and even veisa zoken. I’ll admit it’s not like ny but we do have it.

    i must also admit that being a new yorker myself, i never thought there were frum communities oot. in fact in camp and seminary when a girl said she was from “place x” we would always be surprised and ask “wow – they really have frum ppl in that city?” even so, we couldn’t imagine they knew as much about frumkeit as we did. how naive we were!

    i also never thought i would live anywhere else but ny. but like they say “never say never”.

    bein hasdorim – i like ur example about the green light. unfortunately though, i’ve been seeing more and more impatient honking here than i used to. i think the ny mentality has reached here 😉

    queen bee – i’m not sure where i fit in either. in fact just recently we were discussing the possibility of moving back east. why don’t u feel u don’t fit in ny? what are u looking for? maybe if you give us an idea, someone here on the cr might have some suggestions.

    #810628

    TheGoq
    Participant

    Shmoel its not that i didnt like my hometown i did but i was running away from something and i couldnt stay there.

    #810629

    MiddlePath
    Participant

    I can’t generalize, but here’s some interesting stories. First of all, I have lived all my life well out of NY, so I would consider myself quite an “out of towner”. And even so, I went to a high school that was even more “out of town” than what I was used to, and I saw some things that surprised me. One example was actually something similar to what someone brought up already, but it happened on a more extreme level: A woman sitting by a red light actually dozed off and the light turned green and then red again before she woke up, and the cars behind her just waited patiently till she woke up! Another example was when I was in a supermarket there, and the people walking by kept saying to me “good afternoon!” And they said it to everyone! I actually found it really nice. Everyone greeted everyone else.

    #810630

    cinderella
    Member

    question for all the brooklyners out there- is s/o who does not live in brooklyn but does live in ny and not in like buffalo or like rochester but like 5 towns considered OOT? cuz i was talking to s/o from brkln and she was like- oh ur such an out of towner and i was like huh??? also it’s annoying when ppl refer to brkln as the city. MANHATTAN is the “city”, people. living in boro park doesnt mean u live in the city. Sorry, it just irks me.

    also, funny story- i was with s/o from baltimore (which is def out of town) and we were in starbucks and after she ordered the coffee guy asked her name to write on the cup and she was so horrified and she refused to give her name till i explained to her…

    #810631

    collegegrad
    Member

    I grew up in the midwest and currently live in Flatbush. I have to say that I think the difference between the two is over rated. There are nice people, fast people, slow people and patient and impatient people in both places. As a general rule though the east coast is slightly more competitive than oot. I think the biggest difference I found in the two places is that oot the schools are much more of a mix so the yeshivish kids are exposed to less yeshivish kids and visa versa. Being that the kids grow up more exposed to all jews they come out more open minded and less in a bubble of their “type”

    #810632

    ☕️coffee addict
    Participant

    Collegegrad,

    Don’t generalize the whole east coast from ny

    #810633

    Queen Bee
    Member

    Thanks for all the responses :). Sorry if I offended anyone with the term “OOT.” It’s just what I hear everyone refer to places outside NY.

    Responding to some posters:

    bein_hasdorim, LOL. How true!

    coffee addict, thanks! That’s a great example.

    gefen, I’m not really sure. It’s possible the way I feel has nothing to do with living in NY. So I’ll give some examples, though I’m not sure they portray exactly how I feel:

    A) I don’t like conforming. If I do something different than what’s considered the norm, I get the looks, the judging eyes, the “Ummm. Okay.” For those who’ve known me since I was a kid, they know that I am the way I am. But for those who don’t, I always get those looks. And just in general, people always do whatever everyone else does, even if they don’t agree. People drive themselves nuts doing what’s “normal” just so they won’t look bad and ruin their futures. Like taking a break said in her thread http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/its-all-about-shidduchim , every little decision is weighed on what people are SUPPOSED to do rather what they WANT to do. I’m not talking about halacha, of course, since that’s nonnegotiable, but just behavior in general.

    B) I’m not a serious person. I like comfortable, so I’d rather come to work looking more comfortable and less “fancy” (but put together, of course). Same with a wedding. I’d rather not have to dress up so much, but of course my mom would have a heart attack if I showed up not looking my best. I’d like to leave the house dressed as I want to be and not have to constantly wonder if the person across the street is staring at me because I’m dressed more casual. I care so much more about personality rather than looks.

    C) The whole people watching you like a hawk. Every time I leave the house I always look across the street to see if the neighbor on the porch is watching me. If she is…grrr, I have to act a certain way or else she’ll call my mom. If she’s not…breathe.

    G) Do non NYers also categorize themselves? Like Yeshivish, (chasidish is chasidish), Litvish, MO, blah blah, I don’t even know the categories. I have no idea which I belong to. I call myself “undeclared.”

    H) Please don’t throw rocks at me (stuffed animals will do just fine :)), but I feel like men in NY are a little offensive to women. This might just be me being exposed to the wrong type of people.

    I hope I’m not blowing things out of proportion! It’s possible, like I said earlier, that this has nothing to do with living in NY or not. It may just be a “people” thing, which is a whole other discussion. Mostly, I just want to be myself, however “strange” that might be, and not have to feel scared/nervous/ashamed of what others think of me.

    The Goq, hm…it’s possible I might want to run from a few things, too.

    MiddlePath, that’s pretty cool about the cars waiting until the woman woke up. Thanks for the examples 🙂

    cinderella, I don’t understand the name on the cup thing.

    Sorry for the long post! It probably makes no sense, but I tried…

    #810634

    cinderella
    Member

    queen bee- thts cuz ur prob from out of town

    #810635

    Queen Bee
    Member

    cinderella, no I’m from NY. So am I OOT at heart…or just plain clueless? 🙂

    #810636

    cinderella
    Member

    idk maybe i’m the only one who gets it 🙂

    #810637

    aries2756
    Participant

    cindy, I get it.

    #810638

    kapusta
    Participant

    IME, OOT is more laid back than in town.

    QB-

    A few comments:

    1. I could have written what you wrote under “B” myself. For weddings I like to dress a little “under” what everyone else might be doing. I’m guessing you’re also one of those with a good supply of long skirts (as opposed to short) and sweaters.

    2. (E) I don’t think its a MO thing but today everyone loves labels. If you do ______ you’re obviously such and such. I think its just that someone with (I don’t want to put anyone down) ___ Hashkafos may take issue with movies, books etc (in and out of NY) and somehow people who don’t fit that mold are called MO. I think the group in between MO and Yeshivish somehow melted into the other two groups.

    3. (G) From what I’ve seen, OOT there may also be the same “groups” but the borders are flexible.

    4. (H) Sounds like a regular NY/everyone in a rush kind of thing.

    Hows that for rambling?

    *kapusta*

    #810639

    The issue to me isn’t New York vs every place else. It’s is more of a large community vs small community issue. To me, there is very little difference (besides accents) between the large Jewish communities in NYC, Chicago, LA or Miami. All of those places have large enough Jewish populations to have developed separate communities of Jews, chareidi, MO, chassidic, etc.

    Compare that to the Jewish communities in, say, Birmingham Alabama or Omaha Nebraska. There, the most striking difference from big city communities is the fellow feeling that the entire community has for each other. the various denominations of Judaism come together and cooperate in ways that would be unthinkable in places like Flatbush or Skokie. For instance, you will see the local Lakewood kolel receiving support from Federation. Try that in BP!, Heck, try that in Lakewood.

    #810640

    MiddlePath
    Participant

    Queen Bee, in regard to your post which lists many reasons you feel ‘out of place’, I feel exactly the same way about A, D, E, and I.

    I loved the community where I went for high school. It is really tiny (Maybe 40 Jewish families), and even though they are very diverse, they all consider themselves one group, all daven at one shul, all invite each other to their simchas, all get along beautifully. Some wear black hats, some wear jeans, some wear white shirts, some have never worn a white shirt in their lives, some women wear shaitels, some women don’t cover their hair. And none of them consider themselves “better” than someone else. No one is “yeshivish”, “MO”, or any other worthless label. Everyone is simply “Jewish”. That’s the type of community I want to live in, because I, like you, don’t like conforming, have very different views about many things, and I also feel like I don’t really belong in the CR. I know I’ve offended people here when discussing my views on certain things. So I guess it’s not really because you live in New York that you feel this way. It is probably more of a personality and values thing.

    #810641

    adorable
    Participant

    love out of towners. they are so chilled and so not judgemental. i was walking down the street on shabbos once when I was OOT, and so many women stopped to ask me if im new to the neighborhood!

    #810642

    Queen Bee
    Member

    Thanks for the responses 🙂

    cinderella, aries2756, can someone explain the name on coffee cup thing please? I’m so curious! (the reason I probably don’t know what this is because I don’t drink coffee or go to Starbucks.)

    kapusta, yes, I love long skirts! How did you know? I think I enjoy wearing them because I’m really short and (to me, at least) long skirts look better on me than short ones. I look like a little kid in short skirts. I don’t like the labeling because I really don’t fit in any category. The way I dress to some people puts me in the “yeshivish/litvish” category because I’m always dressed tznius (I’ve never had a problem in this area), but my hobbies and behavior might put me in the “MO” category, but people in the “MO” category would say I’m too frum. If you don’t mind me asking, where are you from, Kapusta?

    Raphael Kaufman, thanks! Maybe years ago there was a bigger distinction between NY vs. non NY, but today we’re probably all mixed.

    MiddlePath, yeah, I noticed you seem different than most posters here. We feel basically the same on all the bullet points I put up (other than the “girly” ones lol). I’m still trying to figure out if I’d like a small community rather than a large one. On one hand, you don’t have to feel ashamed for being you because there is more acceptance, but if you want to avoid someone…yeah, that’d be tricky. There are too many people I’m trying to avoid here. Also, others may be a little too much into your business. Not sure I like that. Also, if something happens (like your situation), it’s hard to escape from it, right? (sorry if I was offensive).

    I went to a small high school and I didn’t like it at all. Maybe I like it better when I blend into the crowd, but no matter what I do, I always stand out…so I’m still not sure.

    Yeah, I think living in NY or not NY has nothing to do with how I feel. It’s probably just me. This CR might not be the best place for me, but I really like that it’s a Jewish environment. It’s really the only frum forum I belong to.

    #810643

    cinderella
    Member

    queen bee- my friend thought the coffee guy wanted her name cuz he thought she was cute and wanted her number…to ask her out… get it???

    #810644

    Queen Bee
    Member

    cinderella, no not really. What did he really want? (what did you explain to her).

    #810645

    Toi
    Participant

    NY is always in a rush. always double parked. and get the heck out of my way. oot isnt.

    #810646

    Tums
    Member

    OOT is lifeless.

    #810647

    ☕️coffee addict
    Participant

    I see you haven’t been to miami beach (even when the snowbirds aren’t there people act like its their road)

    #810648

    MiddlePath
    Participant

    Queen Bee, yeah, we do feel the same about pretty much all the bullet points you mentioned. And about living in a small community, your concerns are definitely valid. But chances are there won’t be as many people you would want to avoid, anyway…And about the concern of people being in your business, that may depend on your outlook about it. You’ll definitely have your privacy, but yes, people will generally be more concerned about you and involve you more in their own lives, and probably expect you to involve them a little in yours.

    Concerning a situation like mine, I don’t think that is unique to an “out of town” community necessarily, but rather to the particular situation I was in. I think the problem for me was that I didn’t receive enough care and support, and in a smaller community, chances are there would have been more care and support.

    And yeah, I also feel like I stand out in a crowd. But that’s just how I am. When I was in bais medrash, I would be the only one in my shiur wearing a colored shirt, let alone an ORANGE or GREEN shirt. I actually don’t like blending in.

    About the CR, what you said is actually why I think it’s a great place for you. And me, for that matter. We get to discuss things in a Jewish environment, hear others’ opinions that we may have never thought of, and discuss our own opinions (when the mods let) that others can appreciate.

    Hmm, some of my other interests…I pretty much love anything that involves creativity. So that includes art, music, architecture, literature, product/car design, film, animation, gaming, cartoons, plays, performances, sports, public speaking, cooking, and many other things that I can’t name right now. But yeah, I love creativity. What are some of your interests? (Besides taking online algebra quizzes.)

    #810649

    cinderella
    Member

    queen bee- in starbucks when u order a coffee, they ask ur name so they can write it on the cup so when its ready they call out ur name and u get it from the pickup counter. don’t u ever go to starbucks??? I am addicted. try it.

    #810650

    cinderella
    Member

    queen bee- in starbucks when u order a coffee, they ask ur name so they can write it on the cup so when its ready they call out ur name and u get it from the pickup counter. don’t u ever go to starbucks??? I am addicted. try it.

    #810651

    kapusta
    Participant

    QB: Are you my long lost twin or something? I’m from Brooklyn.

    *kapusta*

    #810652

    Queen Bee
    Member

    MiddlePath,

    2) Writing. Not essays, articles, or poems, but fiction mostly. Novels. Reading, too. Oh, I used to write plays.

    4) I used to play piano. I wish I had more time to play. I do play a little here and there.

    5) Needlepoint.

    6) I love to learn new things and I love learning chumash and navi. I try to learn some every shabbos.

    7) I enjoy helping others.

    9) I like to sleep! Lol.

    11) Almost everything from your list (NOT public speaking, though. *faint*)

    cinderella,

    I have been to Starbucks a few times, but I’m not a coffee drinker. Thanks for explaining.

    kapusta,

    Sorry I already have a twin. You can be my triplet!

    #810653

    MiddlePath
    Participant

    Queen Bee, nice list!

    If I may ask, what are your favorite games? I’m a bit of a gamer myself. I’m mostly into fantasy/mystery RPG’s, racing games, and a few FPS games.

    And I see nothing wrong with a frum girl pursuing a career in animation. I think that’s really cool, and something that I would have chosen as a second or third career option. I’ve made many animations over the years, including cartoons. I love it. And there are so many job opportunities in animation, and it just keeps on growing. And keep up the piano playing! It’s such a great thing to play an instrument.

    #810654

    Queen Bee
    Member

    Will the mods chop our heads off (in other words, close the thread) if we start listing the names of the games?

    I don’t know about the animation thing. I know a guy (non-Jew) who majored in graphic design and he’s looking to work in game design or cartoon, or something like that. But he can’t find any jobs since they’re all in LA. Is it appropriate for a frum girl to work in Hollywood, plus video games is a male dominated industry. I’m not really good anyway. But still, you never know what will happen.

    What programs do you use for animations? And what kind of animations do you do?

    #810655

    MiddlePath
    Participant

    Hmm, probably best to stay safe and not mention any games by name…

    Concerning animation: true, it would be quite difficult for anyone, especially a Jewish girl, to work in game design. However, there are many other types of animation-related career options available which are easier to pursue, and most are able to be done (both schooling and jobs) online. Like web media design/animation, web advertising design/animation, graphic design, computer simulations, product rendering, and many more I’m sure.

    I used to make cartoon animations and played around with 2D/3D graphics software. I mostly used Anime Studio, Photoshop, and Sketchbook. Now, for school, I use pretty hardcore programs, including Rhino, Maya, Corel, Illustrator, Graphite, and a few others. I also use a Wacom tablet to draw with.

    If you have any questions please ask!

    #810656

    kapusta
    Participant

    Sorry I already have a twin. You can be my triplet!

    Ooh, yay!

    About the animation thing- I was considering going into it at one point, and a teacher told me she’d had a student that did it at Brooklyn. Animations are starting to become more popular in the frum community (Oorah, some kids dvds etc) but its probably close to impossible to get work. If you ever hear of a way to do it for fun without breaking the bank, let me know!

    *kapusta*

    #810657

    mamashtakah
    Member

    You’ve all got it backwards. Outside of E”Y, you’re all OOT.

    #810658

    Queen Bee
    Member

    MiddlePath, hm…interesting. Thanks for the info!

    Okay, since we won’t mention games by name, I’ll tell you the kinds I like to play. RPG, RTS, some FPS, some PVP. I love adventure/mystery games (like Sherlock Holmes, detective types), where you have to think a bit. Some of the old old games I like are arcade games. I have some favorite online games, too. Uhhh, let’s try abbreviations and see if the mods let them through. AOE, LOL, GW, some WOW, I checked out AOEO, I want to start playing some COD. I love WC3…many more!

    kapusta, what’s up, triplet? Thanks for the info. Maybe one day.

    mamashtakah, lol.

    #810659

    MiddlePath
    Participant

    Quuen Bee, cool, so the games you like are very similar to what I like. And yeah, I used to spend a lot of time with MMORPG’s (WoW, AoE, EQ) but I got a little too addicted, so I cut down on those. I still play plenty of non-online games though, mostly RPG and FPS, like (I dunno if you’ll figure it out with the abbreviations): CS, UT, TES (all of them, but mostly O), PK, Q (all of them), BS, F (all of them), and many others. And COD is really awesome.

    #810660

    Boro Park Mensch
    Participant

    <b>cinderella</b>

    <i>question for all the <b>brooklyners</b> out there- is s/o who does not live in brooklyn but does live in ny and not in like buffalo or like rochester but like 5 towns considered OOT? cuz i was talking to s/o from brkln and she was like- oh ur such an out of towner and i was like huh??? also it’s annoying when ppl refer to brkln as the city. MANHATTAN is the “city”, people. living in boro park doesnt mean u live in the city. Sorry, it just irks me.</i>

    There should be a posted minimum age for using the Coffee Room, at the minimum to avoid silly text messages disguised as postings.

    The world for people living in the borough of Brooklyn is “Brooklynites.”

    Brooklyn has been part of the City of New York since 1898. You might wish to update your address book.

    #810661

    Queen Bee
    Member

    Oh, wow! You beat me :). I figured most of them out. I wanted to buy “O” a few years back. I forgot to mention that I like games like “C” (think roman empire RTS. C3, C4. It’s a series) and I love GAR (don’t think you’ll know this one, but it’s similar to “C”). Oh, I also play on another console: SMG and SMG2 and SMB (with italian brother characters). I love surgery games. I used to play RCT and RCT3 when I was younger. Now this one is super nerdy, but I love it anyway-STVEF (google it). It’s fps. Don’t make fun lol.

    Yeah, I’m getting bored and annoyed with the MMORPG ones. My favorites are the ones that are not online.

    #810662

    MiddlePath
    Participant

    STVEF is actually a cool game! I like a little Sci-Fi…not nerdy at all. (Unless I’m also a nerd.) And I definitely recommend TES:O, it’s really good. Actually, all the TES games are awesome. I know “C”, but I’m unfamiliar with GAR. Wow, so you play on a SMG console…your’e a hardcore gamer! I was thinking of getting one of those wheel controls for my racing games (like NFS, GT), but I decided against it. And I realized earlier when I wrote the game “F”, it can refer to two different games, one that rhymes with “callout” and one that rhymes with “table”, and I like ’em both. I used to have a laptop that couldn’t handle the graphics, but now I have an awesome laptop with really good graphics (I needed it for school) so games are so smooth and high quality, it’s awesome.

    #810663

    Queen Bee
    Member

    MiddlePath, LOL!!!

    I wanted to buy “table3”, but I bought an RPG and a mystery crime lab game instead. Is it good? I read some negative reviews, so I was hesitant. I loved NFS as a kid. It would be be really fun playing it on the other console, the “me”.

    I burned my video card a few years ago because I played games on the highest graphics. So I’m really careful now.

    #810664

    MiddlePath
    Participant

    I actually don’t own “table3” (So funny we’re calling it that!), but I’ve played the demo. It seems just as good as the first two (which I do own), which I thought were amazing. And yeah, NFS is so awesome, especially because I’m so into cars. I’ve literally played every NFS game that ever came out.

    And that sucks about your video card. What type of card do you have now? I use a nVidia Quadro FX card. Are you the type that always gets the new games when they come out, or will wait till it gets cheaper? I usually wait till they get cheaper. 🙂

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