September 20, 2016 8:07 pm at 8:07 pm #1198420
I once heard a very smart line, “If you can’t explain it, you probably don’t understand it”September 20, 2016 8:37 pm at 8:37 pm #1198421feivelParticipant
Sparkly, look up “ubiquitin”September 20, 2016 8:37 pm at 8:37 pm #1198422
Meno – i 100% agree. i like memorizing and NOT understanding the concepts but ONLY if i need to understand it does it take me ages to do so.September 20, 2016 10:06 pm at 10:06 pm #1198423
There is a lot of memorization that is required for organic chemistry. There is no way around that. Obviously understanding the key concepts is incredibly important too, but there is no way to apply the concepts without memorization, and your organic chemistry exams will invariably ask you to apply what you know.September 20, 2016 10:17 pm at 10:17 pm #1198424
WTP -“But Health, how is the pharmacist supposed to know who is the competent one and who is not? Even if the incompetent are only, say, 1% – that is still a huge amount of potential error, especially for those whose Dr happens to be in that 1%. Isn’t it better to have the extra check in place? And even competent people can make mistakes.
And as you said, you are checking up on the pharmacist. Better to waste the Dr’s time, and the pharmacist’s time, then to harm a patient!”
You’re correct! My point was that e/o can make mistakes! She/he was saying that the pharmacists’ are the bottom line of protection to the public! It’s a group effort for the public to get better when they’re sick! Not one segment of health professionals!September 21, 2016 12:05 am at 12:05 am #1198425
you are very correct. The same applied when I took OChem 1 and 2 in 1982.September 21, 2016 2:47 am at 2:47 am #1198426
This is the Borrower of Some Common Sense’s account.
This discussion of the double slit experiment and resonance structures is eye opening. Yes, I know exactly what each one is and how to explain them.
Sparky, overconfidence is the number one cause of mistakes.
Health, I don’t know what your credentials are so I can’t gear my explanation to your specific field. But to answer your questions, every single drug, vitamin and supplement (even ubiquitin) that passes through our hands is checked. Be it simple drugs like Tylenol or Motrin or complicated drugs like vancomycin and phenytoin (the PK on these drugs gets extremely complicated).
You ask why bother checking for simple drugs? But did you know that Zyvox, a wonderful antibiotic, interacts with psych meds? Not many do. Would you consider a drug interaction between high dose Tylenol with valproic acid and carbamazepine (two common mood stabilizer and anti-epileptics)? I would. How about Contrave (weight loss) and Percocet (pain relief)? Okay to take together? There are interactions between even the most common drugs that we are concerned about.
In terms of mistakes, no one is perfect; we have several check points to ensure we get everything right but human error does occur. How many times would you mix up hydroxazine and hydralazine? Clomiphene versus clomipramine? And yes, we are the last line of defense – how often to patients know what drugs they’re taking? Research says that most patients do not know a whole lot about their meds. Take a look. Should they know – absolutely; but do they know – uncertain.
Everyone makes mistakes; the question is how serious and how permanent. Everyone – doctors, nurses, technicians, pharmacy – makes mistakes, everyone.September 21, 2016 3:25 am at 3:25 am #1198428
FFG – when your referring to memorization are you referring to the concepts that im learning NOT memorizing? what do you mean by memorization?September 21, 2016 3:27 am at 3:27 am #1198429
Some Common Sense- how am i overconfident? im scared for my grades NOT overconfident of them!!September 21, 2016 3:52 am at 3:52 am #1198430
isnt organic chemistry suppose to be harder than general chemistry. why am i doing so much better b’h in organic chemistry than general chemistry when i almost failed out of general chemistry and now doing well in organic chemistry? isnt that a bit strange?
common sense – in pharmacy school will i be using more general chemistry or organic chemistry (im hoping organic since apparantly im better at that)?September 21, 2016 4:11 am at 4:11 am #1198431
Some common sense -“Everyone makes mistakes; the question is how serious and how permanent. Everyone – doctors, nurses, technicians, pharmacy – makes mistakes, everyone”
Now you got my drift! I don’t know why you needed your whole Droshoh!
You mentioned vancomycin – there’s a good reason to give it. It and one other drug is used for MRSA.
Now phenytoin (Dilantin), I’m at a loss, why it’s still prescribed.
There are so many better AE’s!September 21, 2016 4:35 am at 4:35 am #1198432
NO MORE talking about drugs thats boring!! back to organic chemistry and a and p interesting stuff!!September 21, 2016 4:39 am at 4:39 am #1198433
I’m not Some Common Sense.
Health – the point that you’ve missed is that we do much more than most health professionals think. The attitude of “count and pour – lick and stick” that the public and many professionals hold of the function of pharmacy is absolutely false. We aren’t a roadblock for patients to have their medication; we check patient’s drugs/vitamins/supplements from a unique point of view.
MRSA? Two antibiotics? I can think of six! Which two are you thinking of?
Phenytoin is not that common but is used because it works. Just like clozapine. The pharmacokinetic dosing of phenytoin, on the other hand, is a function unique to pharmacy.September 21, 2016 6:04 am at 6:04 am #1198434
Sparkly- “NO MORE talking about drugs thats boring!! back to organic chemistry and a and p interesting stuff!!”
I hope you are joking, since you plan to spend the rest of your life talking and thinking and handling drugs!
And by the way, a ligase is any enzyme that catalyzes a ligation reaction- i.e covalently conjugates 2 molecules- it could be in the context of adding nucleotides to DNA (DNA ligase), or it could be joining a ubiquitin molecule to a Lys residue on a protein (E3 ligase).September 21, 2016 12:35 pm at 12:35 pm #1198435
“NO MORE talking about drugs thats boring!!”
Another classic Sparkly lineSeptember 21, 2016 3:15 pm at 3:15 pm #1198436
I’m not Some Common Sense. – Get yourself your own SN. It’s not that difficult to get one YWN!
“MRSA? Two antibiotics? I can think of six! Which two are you thinking of?”
I didn’t make myself clear – sorry. I was thinking about pneumonia.
MRSA pneumonia is treated with Vanco &/or Zyvox.
PMC is treated with Vanco or/& Flagyl.September 22, 2016 2:46 am at 2:46 am #1198437
i love organic chemistry (for right now!). who else does?September 22, 2016 11:08 pm at 11:08 pm #1198438
how should i know that im ready for my orgo and a and p test?September 22, 2016 11:30 pm at 11:30 pm #1198439
By memorization I mean exactly what it sounds like. I will give you an example. Conceptually, you need to understand oxidation of alcohols. You need to know the difference between primary, secondary and tertiary alcohols and understand how oxidation of alcohols works. Which ones get oxidized to ketones, which to aldehydes, which to carboxylic acids. Understanding that is conceptual. The memorization aspect comes into play when you are asked HOW to actually do that. Which oxidizing agent should you use if you want to generate butanoic acid from 1-butanol? Which would you use if you wanted butaldehyde instead? What if you wanted to oxidize 2-butanol to butanone? This involves you understanding the concept of oxidation, of course, but also requires that you have memorized a list of oxidizing agents and memorized which is appropriate to use in which situations.September 22, 2016 11:34 pm at 11:34 pm #1198440
Also, I can’t think of any condition that would be treated by EITHER vancomycin OR flagyl. That doesn’t make sense. Unless you’re talking about cdiff, in which case you should specify that the vancomycin is oral, not IV.September 23, 2016 1:08 am at 1:08 am #1198441
FFG – to me it feels more like conceptual.September 23, 2016 2:08 am at 2:08 am #1198442
FFG -“Unless you’re talking about cdiff,”
“PMC is treated with Vanco or/& Flagyl”
Now what do you think PMC stands for?!?September 23, 2016 4:15 am at 4:15 am #1198443
Well I was assuming it stood for pseudomembranous colitis, but that’s a term that people in the know don’t really use, so…September 23, 2016 4:30 am at 4:30 am #1198444
FFG – So what? – go on.September 23, 2016 4:51 am at 4:51 am #1198445
Nah. I don’t see the point.September 23, 2016 8:35 pm at 8:35 pm #1198446
FFG – please dont remind me of microbiology i got an a in it but it was too hard for me.September 25, 2016 10:00 pm at 10:00 pm #1198447
please daven for me to do well on my HARD organic chemistry test.September 27, 2016 2:22 am at 2:22 am #1198448
is 80 bad for a and p?September 27, 2016 4:08 am at 4:08 am #1198449
why is a and p and organic killer classes?September 27, 2016 12:44 pm at 12:44 pm #1198450
“is 80 bad for a and p?”
What did the rest of the class get?September 27, 2016 3:15 pm at 3:15 pm #1198451
the average was 67.September 27, 2016 6:37 pm at 6:37 pm #1198452
Well if my calculations are correct, 80 is better than average.September 27, 2016 6:56 pm at 6:56 pm #1198453
Meno – ill be honest im so upset right now about what happened that i really dont care about anything anymore. i dont care if i did well or not.September 28, 2016 12:27 am at 12:27 am #1198454
That seems mature…September 28, 2016 1:54 am at 1:54 am #1198455
FFG – so upset since someone passed away. what should i say or do? but b’h i went to an amazing shiur and got some inspiration and i pray to G-d that nothing like that should happen EVER again and know that Hashem does everything for the best even tho i dont understand it.October 7, 2016 1:12 am at 1:12 am #1198456
organic chemistry! a and p! but i dont feel comfortable at school anymore:(October 7, 2016 2:10 am at 2:10 am #1198457
Huh?October 7, 2016 4:05 am at 4:05 am #1198458
FFG – because of everything that happened and its become depressing.October 7, 2016 10:52 am at 10:52 am #1198459
how do you expect someone to go back to school after someone who sholdve been in their class died?October 7, 2016 12:49 pm at 12:49 pm #1198460
Sounds like you’re going through something really rough. College is really stressful by itself, and even more so when you have other things going on with your personal life.
You had mentioned in another thread that you’re doing fine after a friend talked you through it, but it’s clear that you’re not doing fine.
I think you should try to get some professional help.October 7, 2016 9:24 pm at 9:24 pm #1198461
Meno – lets put some more upsetting news on it my dear frum friends whos sibling just passed away arent coming back to school this semester so ill be alone.October 10, 2016 1:21 am at 1:21 am #1198462
why am i studying to become a pharmacists if people died because of medicine? just to make me more upset and depressed?October 10, 2016 6:24 am at 6:24 am #1198464
In most cases, medicine heals people, or they die despite the medicine. There are rare cases of fatal side effects or drug interactions. Maybe the pharmacist can prevent/minimize these.
If you are referring to intentional overdose, you can’t blame the medicine or the pharmacist or the doctor. They are still there to help people. It is sad that the person who ODed could not be helped, that his pain was so great that he saw no other options. At this point, Sparkly, you need to try to remember that Hashem is in charge and that His plan for us is good, even if we don’t see it at the moment. Also, remember that you are studying to be a pharmacist to help people, to cure disease and alleviate pain and suffering. You may not have been able to help your friend, but you can help others in other ways. You have a purposeful life ahead of you. Try to keep that in mind, and it may reduce the sadness and loneliness you are feeling.October 10, 2016 7:09 pm at 7:09 pm #1198465
WinnieThePooh – edited. There is no way to know if this person had ever thought of marriage and out of respect for his family this will not be posted. It has been deleted over and over and it is time to stop finding ways to repost it.October 10, 2016 7:53 pm at 7:53 pm #1198466Lilmod UlelamaidParticipant
Sparkly, I will bli neder have you in mind in my tefilos on Yom Kippur.
Best wishes for a Gmar Chasima Tova and I really hope that things get better.October 11, 2016 2:18 am at 2:18 am #1198467
lilmod ulelamaid – thank you but please have me in mind that this year i should find the right guy – my basheret bezchus since the shidduch didnt work with that guy.October 11, 2016 5:03 am at 5:03 am #1198468
Sparkly-edited The more you write, the more I agree with others that you really should be working these issues out with a competent therapist, ASAP. Perhaps that would be the best tribute to your friend, and something positive to come out of this tragedy- to help yourself so that you can live a happy, productive life, I”YH.December 11, 2016 3:29 am at 3:29 am #1198469tzniusMember
I have taken both these classes and unfortunately did not do the best. If i apply to touro just because i want to be in a frum environment and i retake the classes how does that go (the univeristy of my state says i can retake it and they wont care, as in they wont count my first time i took it but theyll count my a) but what about touro? I passed but dont enjoy and not happy with my grades and will do better with the retake iy’h?December 11, 2016 3:53 am at 3:53 am #1198470Lilmod UlelamaidParticipant
Shouldn’t you ask someone from Touro?December 11, 2016 4:37 am at 4:37 am #1198471
Tznius -“but what about touro”
If you passed and Touro will accept you in their school – don’t retake anything that you don’t have to!
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