October 30, 2016 12:15 am at 12:15 am #618587
There have been some posts recently that may have misrepresented Rav Avigdor Miller zatsal which is unfortunate as he was a big Tzaddik. I came across a Sefer of his this Shabbos and I would like to quote some other things he said (and hopefully restore his good name):
THE TENTH COMMANDMENT OF MARRIAGE IS: DON’T BE A TYRANT.
THIS IS SO FREQUENTLY DISOBEYED, it’s not the major cause of tragedies in the home, but IS A FREQUENT CAUSE. Sometimes, among Frum people, they learned a little bit Gemara, so they learned ?? ????? ??? ??? ???? (????? ??? – the money that a woman acquires belongs to her husband. Therefore, whatever money she gets, let’s say, when she earns money from her little job, he appropriates it for himself.
THAT’S SOMETHING THAT SHOULDN’T BE MEASURED BY THE HALACHA, YOU HAVE TO USE COMMON SENSE. IF A WOMAN WORKS, YOU HAVE TO GIVE HER LEEWAY WITH THAT MONEY.
Here’s a man who didn’t trust his wife’s shopping ability, for year and years, he never allowed her to go to the grocery store or the butcher shop. He did the shopping himself. Among all of her friends, she was the only woman who was not allowed to shop. NOW, THAT’S A TYRANT. Who cares if his wife would lose a few dollars a week? IMAGINE IT’S AN EXPENDITURE TOWARDS HAPPINESS.
IN MANY WAYS, MEN ARE TYRANTS. As I mentioned before, he demands services as if she was his private slave. Many things even Frum people transgress. THEY DON’T UNDERSTAND THAT YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO BE ARROGANT. A WIFE SHOULD RESPECT HER HUSBAND, BUT TH ARROGANCE OF MANY HUSBANDS IS REALLY INTOLERABLE….But the chet (sin) on the part of the husband is unforgivable. HE DIDN’T MARRY TO MAKE HER A SLAVE.
…. OF COURSE IT’S MORE FREQUENT THAT THE HUSBAND IS A TYRANT. Sometimes, the wife is bossy in details, but this business of tyranninizing one over the other that’ one of the “Ten Commandments” that must be avoided.
Marriage is not a full partnership, the husband is the captain and the wife is the first mate. BUT A CAPTAIN THAT’S GOING TO TRAMPLE ON THE FIRST MATE IS ASKING FOR MUTINY. Therefore, among the great principles which are required of a married couple, they have to realize that each one has rights and never to forget that after all, you are partners that make one entity. It could be, you walk first, and walks after you, but you’re together one personality. And a body cannot be divided against itself, that you’re arrogant over a part of yourself.October 30, 2016 12:40 am at 12:40 am #1187978
Source: “Q & A, volume 3, Thursday nights with Rav Avigdor Miller” by Betzalel T. Miller, p. 315-316.October 30, 2016 12:54 am at 12:54 am #1187979
I am bringing the following quote in order to prove that some of the things that people have been saying in Rav Avigdor Miller’s name can not possibly be true (or else they are grossly taken out of context). The person who said the quotes below can not possibly have said some of the things that have been said in his name in the CR.
“Q&A, volume 3, Thursday nights with Rav Avigdor Miller”, p. 153-154
Q- How can one help a friend who goes to movies and doesn’t want to listen to your rebukes?
A – Many times, the treatment of a fellowman is done in amateurish ways. Why is it, if a fellow man has an illness, you probably wouldn’t undertake to give a prescription?
You would send that ill person to some professional in that line, a specialist, or even a general practitioner. So why is it, when it comes to dealing with a fellow man who needs spiritual advice that we should treat him rough-shod as if it’s all simple and nothing complicated?
Spiritual ailments are even more complicated than physical ailments. So how to stop a person from going to the movies requires a great deal of professional advice, so go to somebody who knows that person and explain all the details, and have that competent person advise you how to wean your friend from the movies.
… Now who is a professional…find some old Talmid Chaacham who is willing to listen, not everybody has time..But the message is this, you should consider it a spiritual problem for your fellowman, a complicated matter which deserves the very best advice that you can get. Therefore, don’t expect to be answered on the floor here, how to deal with that person.
You wouldn’t ask me any advice about medicine on the floor, so don’t ask me advice about spiritual problems in a general way. You must know the person, you must even see the person, you have to hear his story, and you have to dicover what valuable substitutes are possible to offer that person.October 30, 2016 1:38 am at 1:38 am #1187980Person1Member
I don’t see the point of your third post, unless you had a Hava Amina he was an unreasonable fanatic, which you you probably didn’t as he is considered Adam Gadol.
Also I’m curious what quotes do you believe were taken out of context. I’ll understand if you prefer not to bring this up here though.October 30, 2016 1:40 am at 1:40 am #1187981LightbriteParticipant
May you marry someone in good time who is good to you always and avoids this type of negative behavior.
I wonder how one can prevent this marrying a man who behaves in this manner once married. Sometimes there are red flags. At the same time, some people marry quickly, and this type of behavior may become progressively more dominating in time.
It’s important for there to be consequences to such actions. Technically this is called financial abuse, and is a legitimate problem in a relationship, G-d forbid.
Thank you for sharing LU.October 30, 2016 1:55 am at 1:55 am #1187982AgantzyoorpeerimParticipant
I agree marriage is like entering an institutionOctober 30, 2016 2:04 am at 2:04 am #1187983
Person1 – your last sentence is correct.
lightbrite – Amen and thanks!
I think that you can find a lot if you do your checking well and then if you look carefully for red flags while dating. There are no guarantees though, and at the end of the day, “Hakol b’dei Shamayim”. Personally, I am very emotional, and I think I could see myself being the type of person who could easily get emotionally involved, and if I then found out something negative about the person, it would be hard for me to break up with him.
Hashem has spared me many times either by making sure that I found out about the person before I went out with them, or by making sure that they broke up with me. There was one guy who I went out with who it was obvious on the first date that he was clearly nuts but I got pressurred into going out with him on a second date. A lot of pressure was put on me to go out with him a third time and I probably would have given in, but Boruch Hashem, he backed out and by the time he decided he wanted to go out with me a third time, I had spoken to the RIGHT people who discouraged me from going out again. Which was really good because I could have ended up marrying him if I had gone out again.
So Hashem has spared me many times!!
I do think it’s important to do good research beforehand. There are no guarantees, but Boruch Hashem, I am usually able to find out a lot.October 30, 2016 4:03 am at 4:03 am #1187984147Participant
as he was a big Tzaddik What an understatement:- Rav Avigdor Miller ZTKLLH’H was The Godol haDor.October 30, 2016 5:25 am at 5:25 am #1187985Avi KParticipant
Lilmod, I would add that one must specify what type of movies. Disney, Westerns,
SciFi, classics (the original version of “Twelve Angry Men” does not have one woman – IMHO it is also a very interesting character study of people from different walks of life and how they interact when confined together)?October 30, 2016 5:44 am at 5:44 am #1187986LightbriteParticipant
147: Gadol = Big or Great
HaDor = Of the generation
Tzaddik = Rare privileged title reserved for a pretty big deal Torah scholar, leader, and righteous person and the world stands on only 36 of them
So yea… Maybe I am taking your post the wrong way, but imho LU gave reverence and respect to Rav Avigdor Miller ZTKLLH’H
Furthermore, if you still believe that this title is an understatement, then given his nature, wouldn’t Rav Avigdor Miller ZTKLLH’H prefer and appreciate the humility?October 30, 2016 1:32 pm at 1:32 pm #1187987gofishMember
“as he was a big Tzaddik What an understatement:- Rav Avigdor Miller ZTKLLH’H was The Godol haDor.”
Oh really? According to whom? Is there some objective criteria to determine who exactly is the gadol hador, that this meets?
I went to a very chareidi school and my principal had a bookshelf filled with Rav Avigdor Miller’s books, but I never heard anyone reference him as the gadol hador, ever. He was a big talmid chochom, he had a lot of influence and inspired many people, but I don’t know anyone who considers him to have been the gadol hador of his generation – and I’m talking about yeshivish people who greatly admire and respect his work.October 30, 2016 1:41 pm at 1:41 pm #1187988
147- I assume you are joking. Rav Avigdor Miller was a Tzaddik and Talmid Chacham but not the Godol Hador, and it is inappropriate to refer to him as such.October 30, 2016 1:50 pm at 1:50 pm #1187989
Avi K. – I am just quoting from Rav Avigdor Miller, so I don’t know what type of movies he was referring to. I would tend to assume that he would say there is a problem to some extent with any movies, but that there is no comparison between one category of movie and another.
I am not an expert on movies, although I have seen a few in my life, but from my knowledge of movies, I think that most movies, even Disney movies, are likely to have some pritzus. Even if there is a movie without pritzus, there is still the issue of hashpa’a from the goyim, and there are always subtle hashkafic messages given over that are likely to be k’neged haTorah.
Our purpose in life is to serve Hashem and we want to try to make sure that everything we do is L’shem Shamayim, and we also want to try to live lives that are “kulo Torah” without any outside influences. As a general rule, watching movies is going to detract from that.
That being said, each person has to know himself and what his needs are. And if someone feels that he really needs to watch a movie in order to relax and he is able to find a movie without pritzus or kefira, maybe that is what he needs to do.
But as a general rule, someone who is striving to be an Oveid Hashem should probably try to avoid movies.
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