Rules for Davening

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  • #1206918

    Lilmod Ulelamaid
    Participant

    never happened to me, so I don’t know.

    #1206919

    Lightbrite
    Participant

    Joseph: Which kaddish? What day? How old are you?

    I’m no rav. So ask your LOR.

    This gist that I got from *Halachos of Tefillin*, online, by Shimon D. Eider, seems to say that…

    For either: Sounds like you need to keep your Tefillin on if they started kaddish, until after they finish kaddish.

    For mourner’s kaddish: Keep the Tefillin on until kaddish is finished, unless for some reason you may need to fluctuate.

    …You said “while you’re in middle of putting on Tefilin,” so I don’t know if you meant whether you should continue wrapping/etc, or stop in the middle to wait.

    For some reason, I feel like you already know the answer to this.

    If so, please do tell 🙂

    #1206920

    Lightbrite
    Participant

    If you wear them on Chol Hamoed:

    “Even without saying the brachos, one may not interrupt between putting on the hand tefillin and the head tefillin, but one may respond to Kaddish and Kedushah … [(]see Mishna Brurah 31:8.)” (OU)

    #1206921

    Lightbrite
    Participant

    A) Is it permissible to interrupt someone’s davening to ask for the page number?

    A1) Man

    A2) Woman

    B) Is it permissible to noticeably peer over into that person’s page to get the page number?

    B1) Man

    B2) Woman

    C) Is it permissible to show someone else the page in your book, pointing to the number, and/or whisper the number during davening?

    C1) Man

    C2) Woman

    D) Is it permissible to hand someone your siddur, which is open to the proper page, and get another siddur for yourself while davening?

    D1) Man

    D2) Woman

    E) Is it permissible to take the last siddur when you see someone else is going to the siddur shelf at the same time?

    E1) Man

    E2) Woman

    F) Is it permissible to tuck in someone of the same gender’s clothing tag that is sticking out while davening (in the case that this person is close enough to you and he/she would appreciate the gesture)?

    F1) Man

    F2) Woman

    #1206922

    Lightbrite
    Participant

    Is it permissible to chew gum while davening?*

    *In the event that your mouth otherwise gets dry. The alternative would be taking periodic sips of water for medical purposes.

    On Shabbos, carrying water into shul would be questionable and I doubt a rav would permit it. Even if it was allowed, taking a cup of water to one’s seat while davening is a recipe for a spill. Safety hazard.

    The gum would lose flavor if it was fresh at the start of davening.

    Would it be better to chew it enough first to lose the flavor, or would that require a separate Borei Nefashos while it’s still in the mouth?

    So at this point the flavorless gum may be considered, by a non-halachic authority who wishes to plea one’s case, to be a medicine of sorts used to alleviate dry mouth.

    #1206923

    WinnieThePooh
    Participant

    LB, I am not a posek, but based on what I learned:

    you can’t have anything in your mouth while davening. Eating/drinking while davening would not be permissible, but if there is a medical need, then a shaila should be asked about when it is permissible. I don’t think a Rav would have any problem with someone bringing a water bottle to shul, as long as there is an eruv for carrying it outside. many shuls set up food/drinks at the back for kiddush after davening, so there is no issue of bringing food/drink into the shul.

    As far as the post about pages in siddur, it all depends on where in the davening you and the other person is up to. There are parts that you are allowed to talk, and parts you are not, parts that you can interrupt with a gesture, parts that you cannot. Shemone Esreh and birchat Shema are more stringent in terms of interruptions than pisukei dezimra.

    As far as the last siddur issue, someone will get the last siddur, why shouldn’t it be you, especially if not having it means you will not be able to daven.

    #1206924

    Nechomah
    Participant

    I would just append to what WTP said about no interruptions during Shemone Esreh, that this would apply to the silent one. When they are repeating the Shemone Esreh, in what is known as Chazaras HaShatz, a person could motion to you during that time, except during Kedusha.

    #1206925

    twisted
    Participant

    Nechoma, if one reads the halacha and sifts and reads between the lines, it is plain that chazaras hashatz is the main event, and one’s attention should be absolute. Letzareinu, this is not commonly uderstood, halevai we should be zochim

    #1206926

    apushatayid
    Participant

    “it is plain that chazaras hashatz is the main event, and one’s attention should be absolute. Letzareinu, this is not commonly uderstood,”

    Sadly it has become a time for learning.

    #1206927

    Lightbrite
    Participant

    WinnieThePooh: Thank you for all of your answers 🙂

    “As far as the last siddur issue, someone will get the last siddur, why shouldn’t it be you, especially if not having it means you will not be able to daven.” (WTP)

    Why not me? Guilt.

    Reasons why I may feel guilty are situations where:

    -I’m younger.

    -The other person has been going to the shul longer.

    -I’m faster than the other person walking.

    -I don’t come so often, so who am I to claim territory?

    If I have a siddur and someone else doesn’t, I feel selfish and on alert until that person has a siddur and can daven too.

    Baruch Hashem, honestly I cannot think of a specific time and place this has happened. Yet I know this has happened.

    I feel weird about seats too. I don’t want to take up someone else’s space.

    Maybe it’s insecurity. I feel like this is someone else’s shul and who am I to just show up randomly and occupy space. Hmm… Thank you. It could also be where I’ve gone and whether I felt like I belonged and was welcome in that community. I could probably have the same siddur experience someplace else, but feel differently if it’s a different energy. Obviously, I bring my own energies and insecurities.

    Likely, feeling like “Who am I to take this siddur? Who am I to pray here?…” could be my guilt for driving to shul. Right away I feel like I don’t belong there, or Hashem is disappointed in me. So little things, to me, may be interpreted as a sign that, “Okay see, this is someone else’s seat or someone else needs this siddur, so clearly I should just go home.”

    Thank you for making me think about this.

    #1206928

    WinnieThePooh
    Participant

    LB, if you are really worried about the siddur issue and there is an eruv in your community, then bring your own siddur from home. It may even help your davening, if you mark places beforehand, insert notes to explain things, etc.

    As far as seats, there is a concept about having an established seat for davening. And it is hard to know that if you are not a regular and cannot interrupt the person in the next seat to ask. But generally, women’s seats are assigned only for Rosh Hashana/Yom kippur, and at other times, they sit where they want to. Maybe the front row is reserved for the rebbitzin or other important women. Naturally, the regular shul goers usually will sit in the same place, so it kind of becomes their seat unofficially. But women’s sections are not full as many women do not come since they have little kids to take care of, so there will probably be extra seats. Take one in the back, and you probably will be ok, or get there early enough when talking is still allowed and you can ask where you can sit without offending anyone.

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