Home › Forums › Decaffeinated Coffee › S or T
- This topic has 11 replies, 8 voices, and was last updated 10 years ago by oyyoyyoy.
-
AuthorPosts
-
April 17, 2014 7:04 pm at 7:04 pm #612597Davar KatanMember
Was the original pronunciation “S” and the modern orthodox changed it to “T” or was it originally “T” and the yeshivish changed it to “S”?
April 18, 2014 12:25 am at 12:25 am #1012206RedlegParticipantActually the original pronunciation was closer to the “th” sound in “think”.
April 18, 2014 2:23 am at 2:23 am #1012207Davar KatanMemberI sink you’re wrong.
April 18, 2014 2:48 am at 2:48 am #1012208I. M. ShluffinParticipantI thought the original ? was “t” and it was the ? that sounded like “th”. However, I’ve been known to occasionally make a mistake. Feel free to correct me without hurting my feelings.
April 18, 2014 3:04 am at 3:04 am #1012209👑RebYidd23ParticipantThe Modern Orthodox were not involved.
April 18, 2014 3:29 am at 3:29 am #1012210akupermaParticipantThe original was probably a “th”, and the evolution into “T” (among Sefardi) and “S” (among Ashkenazim) occured well before modern times. The dialect spoken in Eretz Yisrael evolved naturally and combines all the mistakes of the leading dialects, which is logical since most languages evolve that way (that Israel Hebrew fails to distinguish between Aleph/Ayin, Saf/Taf, Daled/Thaled, Gimmel/Jimmel, kawmatz/patach, non-use of the thrid person future feminine, use of direct word order, etc.). Spoken languages tend to simplify over time (e.g. English having lost almost all use of gender, subjunctive, and the loss of its gutterals).
This is a fascinating subject for linguists, but of no theological importance.
April 18, 2014 3:36 am at 3:36 am #1012211wallflowerParticipantActually the ? was “th” as in “think” and the ? was “th” as in “this.” Go listen to some Yemenites.
April 18, 2014 5:46 pm at 5:46 pm #1012216HaLeiViParticipantThat’s only the soft Daled.
April 18, 2014 6:22 pm at 6:22 pm #1012217I. M. ShluffinParticipantInteresting… But Israeli Hebrew does recognize certain sounds by adding an apostrophe after the letter. Like, ?? is th, and ?? is j. For instance, ??? ??? (cup of joe, cafe joe, whatever it is – it has a j sound).
April 18, 2014 9:36 pm at 9:36 pm #1012218HaLeiViParticipantIn our (Ashkenazic, at least) system we have a Dagesh for the Beis, Kaf, Peh and Tav. Originally, there was one for the Gimmel, Daled and Resh. Temanim have the Gimmel and Daled but not the Reish, which I am told shows up exactly once in Tanach.
April 18, 2014 10:42 pm at 10:42 pm #1012219Davar KatanMemberand who invented the dot under the z and h ?
April 20, 2014 6:50 pm at 6:50 pm #1012220oyyoyyoyParticipantthe daled was “th” ish like yemenites, thats how they were maarich by daled of “hashem echod”
-
AuthorPosts
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.