August 17, 2011 1:26 am at 1:26 am #598671
Can we generalize and say that there are fundamental differences in the mentality of fathers depending on where they come from, culturally? The Sephardic, middle eastern arch type vs. a Eastern European type.
I don’t want to disclose personal details but suffice my example, to say, my father was of one cultural background and my husband is of the other type.
I feel let down many times because of the way my husband interacts or speaks with our kids. I was not brought up that way, a father means something else to me. I wonder if I am basing my reaction of disapointment on what I was brought up to consider normal, culturally?
Can one reasonably expect another’s behavior (which is influenced by cultural inclinations) to change …ever???? Or are we a product of our environments?August 17, 2011 1:40 am at 1:40 am #800082
too deep for meAugust 17, 2011 1:49 am at 1:49 am #800083
too vague for me.
but remember that the some of the roles of a father has changed over time, too.August 17, 2011 1:52 am at 1:52 am #800084
yeah, me too, and this is all I do all day, as I fold laundry, wash dishes, and change pampers. You’d think I could think up more light sophisticated thoughts.August 17, 2011 2:22 am at 2:22 am #800085
I chaap what you are implying. I have seen (among friends) that there are indeed fundamental differences, because there are cultural differences. BUT, generalizing can be a dangerous thing. Suffice it to say, that frequently, we will see a paternal predisposition to interacting with one’s children more in one cultural group than the other. Nonetheless, there are exceptions to every rule. There are some terrific hands-on dads in the group thought to not be so involved, and plenty of dads in the other group who ignore their kids.
If you are bothered (and clearly you are), TALK to your husband about your concerns in a non-judgmental way, i.e. “Reuvein LOVES when you play ball with him! He had such a good time with you today. I know he would love to spend even more time with his dad.” Focus on the good interactions. Anyway, that’s my two cents.August 17, 2011 2:27 am at 2:27 am #800086
my uncle’s Ashkenaz and married my aunt who’s Sephardic, and all the time ppl say he acts just like a Syrian [ but maybe it was because he wasn’t religious when he was young so maybe culture didn’t make such an impact on him]August 17, 2011 2:31 am at 2:31 am #800087
dont watch what the neighbors spouse does and belittle what your spouse does.
what you see on the outside is not always the way it really is on the inside.
the grass is not always greener on the otehr side.August 17, 2011 2:32 am at 2:32 am #800088
i have another cousin who married an Ashkanaz man who is not like Sepharadim at All. And my cousin wasn’t really a typical Syrian Sephardic woman Beforrre she got married , so i wouldn’t say she changed to be like him either.August 17, 2011 2:35 am at 2:35 am #800089
when u married him u thought he was going to handle the children differently than he is now?August 17, 2011 3:34 am at 3:34 am #800090
I’m ashkenaz and I married a guy from sephardic background. I see “what always runs with scissors fast”, is saying about dealing with the children. I am (ashkenaz) is a more soft and loving mother to my toddler while my husband (a sephardic background) is a more strict no playing games type to him. I don’t really like it so I’m trying in a nice way to get him to soften up a bit.August 17, 2011 3:43 pm at 3:43 pm #800091
and by telling him in the crAugust 18, 2011 2:18 am at 2:18 am #800092
hmm my father is sephardic and he’s not like that at all , i think it depends on the person.August 18, 2011 2:32 am at 2:32 am #800093
Wow. mra01385 finally someone understands me!
Everytime my husband uses his harsh sefardic tone of voice, serious-i-am-not-playing-games I wince because my ashkenaz father was so opposite. My father was always clowning around with us, and being soft and gentle. I guess its not so bad, i always ask and explain nicely that it bothers me.August 18, 2011 4:26 am at 4:26 am #800094
I feel you may be revealing a lot about your identity on here.
I have noticed this over the last couple of weeks.
E.g. In your OP, you said “I don’t want to disclose personal details but suffice my example, to say, my father was of one cultural background and my husband is of the other type.”
and then a few posts later “Everytime my husband uses his harsh sefardic tone of voice”
I hope I have not offended you!
About changing people………
People basically do not change. (don’t take this personally but I can guarantee you that your husband would like you to shed some pre-marital notions that you definitely have not yet got rid of)
Reb Yisroel Salanter said that it is harder to change even the smallest Middah than learning Shas.
So if your husband has not yet finished learning Shas, he probably has not yet changed his habits.
But let me tell you a secret your Kallah teacher did not tell you. Ready? Are you sure? Sitting? Ok, here goes. “He is normal”August 18, 2011 1:20 pm at 1:20 pm #800095
Reading the book “all for the boss” by ruchoma shain, Her father, R’Herman zt’l, was strict on the children, not even a kiss, but for her a pinch on her cheek, which left a mark, which she wore as a badge of honor. You can still be loving and strict at the same time. There are all types and sterotyping doesn’t apply.August 18, 2011 1:26 pm at 1:26 pm #800096
Perhaps you can introduce to him, in a non-judgmental way, an alternative way. There’s no law that says he can’t relate differently to your kids if the two of you decide that works better. Perhaps speak to a trustworthy Rav that knows you both and see what ideas he has.August 18, 2011 1:28 pm at 1:28 pm #800097
As far as the mussar stuff, I disagree that it is applicable here because what you seem to imply has nothing to do with personal middos but is rather a cultural issue, not a personality issue, from your description.August 18, 2011 2:49 pm at 2:49 pm #800098
Living in a mixed marriage family (father’s ashkenaz, mothers sephardic) I’ve seen more soft fathers than strict ones from BOTH sephardic and ashkenaz.
And to the OP, my fathers ashkenaz and he is/was probably stricter than your husband. But that never made him a bad person and he’s actually pretty normal.August 18, 2011 3:15 pm at 3:15 pm #800099
Who says your husbands style is not better than your fathers style? Perhaps he is correct.August 18, 2011 3:34 pm at 3:34 pm #800100
This is a personality thing, not a Sephardic – Ashkenazic thing. I know several Ashkenazi and Sephardi fathers of both types.August 19, 2011 3:08 am at 3:08 am #800101
I was fully aware (when I disclosed my husband is of sephardic background) that I was doing so, despite my OP saying I wouldn’t.
Gee…I hope that noone knows my name and address now? LOLAugust 19, 2011 10:17 am at 10:17 am #800102
You seem to have an expectation that your husband can and should change his behavior to be more like your father’s. This is a mistaken approach and will cause you serious trouble in the future. The attitude that needs to be changed is yours, not his.August 21, 2011 3:13 am at 3:13 am #800103
You know what? ITs funny but ever since writing this….I have noticed a dramatic change in my perception. Let me explain..
My kids are leibedig and know how to manipulate me. Lately I have started noticing how under control my husband seems to manage them. I have grown in the last few days to come to respect some of the way he is “Different” than my father because of this.
I told my husband shabbos, I like your way of making them control themselves.
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