October 21, 2010 8:42 pm at 8:42 pm #592730ChossonMember
Are men allowed to shave the hair in their armpits, Chest?October 22, 2010 1:05 am at 1:05 am #704591sof davar hakol nishmaMember
chosson, you know that if your truly seeking an answer this is NOT the place to look for it… correct? ask your posekOctober 22, 2010 3:42 am at 3:42 am #704592benaliyahParticipant
I heard there are special heterim for chassanim…lol
Honestly, go ask a rov this is not the place to ask such a question.October 22, 2010 6:21 am at 6:21 am #704593bein_hasdorimParticipant
Chosson; besides for it being a shtickle metro, (I’m being careful here)
could be included included in the issur of “V’loy Yilbash Gever Simlas Isho”… look in rashi in the parsha (ki Teitzei) that states thr reason sheloy yelech,etc..
see Nazir daf Nun Tes Amud Alef, Toisfos etc..
…..Then ask your local posek.October 22, 2010 7:50 am at 7:50 am #704594so rightMember
No.October 22, 2010 10:02 am at 10:02 am #704595whatrutalkingabtMember
How about waxing a unibrow? Is that muttar?October 22, 2010 12:57 pm at 12:57 pm #704596cshapiroMember
i thought men view their hair as symbol of their masculinity….why would they wanna shave??? unless ur dating a hairy guy im not sure why ud even ask?!?!October 22, 2010 1:02 pm at 1:02 pm #704597
“Are men allowed…?”
It depends on the reason for doing so.October 22, 2010 1:10 pm at 1:10 pm #704598
“could be included included in the issur of “V’loy Yilbash Gever Simlas Isho”
What if its become acceptable by men, is it then still considered beged isha?
Also, what if the wife likes it? Shalom Bayis 😀October 22, 2010 1:33 pm at 1:33 pm #704599
Kitzur Shulchan Aruch:
?????? ??? – ????????? ??????????? ???????? ??? ????????? ?????? ???????? ??????
???? ???? ?????? ??? ???-???? ????-????? ???? ??????? ???? ???, ????? ?????? ???? ???? ???, ???? ???? ???? ?????. ????? ??? ???? ???? ???-???? ????-????? ??? ??????. ??? ?? ??? ????, ???. ??? ??? ?? ????? ????-???? ?????-????? ?????? ???? ??????, ??? ???????October 22, 2010 1:43 pm at 1:43 pm #704600
Thanks for posting!
(I didnt understand half of that)October 22, 2010 2:11 pm at 2:11 pm #704601
Bein Hasdorim, you got this one nailed!
Yes, this is beyond weird. The only instance I could see a man getting their chests shaved is prior to surgery. But for cosmetics?
Boy, I guess you never can tell, can you…..?October 22, 2010 2:19 pm at 2:19 pm #704602real-briskerMember
sac – What type of heter is shalom bayyis? You cant be oiver on the gtaryag mitzvos for “shalom bayis” Where are you getting this source from?October 22, 2010 2:22 pm at 2:22 pm #704603
No where. I was phishing.October 22, 2010 2:27 pm at 2:27 pm #704604
If a man’s chest hair is mee’es to his wife, and it’s a real problem, a posek will probably matir to shave. The main problem for a man concerning cosmetics is to make himself look younger.October 22, 2010 2:41 pm at 2:41 pm #704605
mee’es to his wife?
Don’t bother with the heter… convene a bais din and avoid the holiday rush.October 22, 2010 2:44 pm at 2:44 pm #704606Ben TorahParticipant
And cutting off your few strands of white hair (only)…?October 22, 2010 2:50 pm at 2:50 pm #704607OfcourseMember
Has it occured to anyone that once a person shaves anywhere, it requires maintenance, unless they’re willing to live with the stubble, a far less attractive situation, I would think.
What a question! What a website! I wonder what’s coming next.October 22, 2010 3:10 pm at 3:10 pm #704608
Moderators must be at a moderators convention the things that have been making it online lately. The CR is degenerating into a supermarket tabloid. I think its time to rejoin fantasy football league, and use my travel time that way instead of the CR.October 22, 2010 3:26 pm at 3:26 pm #704609real-briskerMember
sac – try better. cherrybin – Anything thats meias somone you can give them a heter to be oiver a lav? Is it pikuach nefesh?October 22, 2010 3:42 pm at 3:42 pm #704610
I love the new YWN!October 22, 2010 4:29 pm at 4:29 pm #704611
I agree with APY.. some of the stuff that’s making the cut lately has been, uh, shall we say, “on the edge”?October 22, 2010 5:09 pm at 5:09 pm #704612WIYMember
Well this topic is discussed in Halacha,does that make some Halachos “on the edge?”October 22, 2010 5:23 pm at 5:23 pm #704613
Living on the edge is so much fun, no? 😀October 22, 2010 5:58 pm at 5:58 pm #704614yitayningwutParticipant
I really can’t believe the blatant ameratzus going on here. Please do NOT make up halachos if you never learned the sugya at all and never even looked up the Shulchan Aruch.
The sugya is in mainly based in Nazir 58b-59a.
It is %100 muttar, l’chol hade’os, to shave chest hair using anything but a razor, and that is the STRINGENT position of the Shulchan Aruch. Many rishonim hold even with a razor, but for all practical purposes, the SA in YD 182:2 says it is muttar without a razor, i.e. the same as shaving the face.
Regarding armpits, the SA follows the stringent opinion in the rishonim that any kind of shaving is assur, but qualifies that this is only ????? ???? ??????? ???? ??? ????. The Rema says that in a place that men also do it, it is muttar l’chatchila. R’ Akiva Eiger on the spot says that with regard to this we look at the goyim to see what is normal and follow that. Please do not dismiss what I am saying without seeing it inside. I am not sure if in America it is possible to say ??? ??????? ???? ??? ????. Therefore I do not think even the issur on armpit hair is so clear-cut.
The ikkar is you should ask a rov, but please everyone, stop making snap judgments about halachos you apparently have no clue about.October 22, 2010 6:08 pm at 6:08 pm #704615mybatMember
Should definetly wax, much smoother and no stubble!!!!October 22, 2010 6:09 pm at 6:09 pm #704616yitayningwutParticipant
Ok maybe I was a bit rash and shouldn’t have snapped at everyone like that. I could have made my point in a nicer way, and I sincerely apologize to everyone. But I still stand by my point.October 22, 2010 7:10 pm at 7:10 pm #704617
For reasons of Sholom Bayis or even better hygiene – why not? And if women have a mustache or chin hair, are they committing the aveira of beged ish if they likewise remove that hair?October 22, 2010 7:59 pm at 7:59 pm #704618
Halocho or not, take it from a male… the very question raises suspicions. End of story.
And Sac,, I gotta admit, you make the CR interesting!
Still, I can’t seem to reconcile the Sac who “lives on the edge” with the Sac that wrote such a nice thing about her father in another thread.
And I’m still waiting for your answer to the “heimish-chassidish-modernish-flexidish” question.
Or are you too complex to be limited to either of these tags?October 22, 2010 8:00 pm at 8:00 pm #704619
And no, Oomis; that sort of grooming is in the 100% clear for a woman. But for a male to consider shaving his chest? Feh.October 22, 2010 8:25 pm at 8:25 pm #704620mw13Participant
I’m pretty sure it’s assur. But as always, all halacha li’maseh shailos should be asked to your LOR, not to anonymous CRers that may or may not have a clue what they’re talking about.
“For reasons of Sholom Bayis or even better hygiene – why not?”
If it’s assur, its assur regardless. If it’s muttar, there’s no need for these reasons. I’m not sure what difference these justifications should make (or, for that matter, what hygiene issue there is with chest hair).
“And if women have a mustache or chin hair, are they committing the aveira of beged ish if they likewise remove that hair?”
No, its beged isha for a man precisely because women do it. If something is assur because of beged ish/isha to one gender, by definition it’s muttar (as least beged ish(a) wise) to the other.October 23, 2010 11:35 pm at 11:35 pm #704621Mother in IsraelMember
Most women with facial hair remove it–that’s a completely different issue.
I have no idea what the halacha is regarding chest hair (I would assume that armpit hair may not be removed since women generally shave their armpits, but halacha isn’t based on my assumptions, so AYLOR), but why on earth would a man want to shave his chest? I can’t imagine any woman wanting her husband to shave his chest hair.October 23, 2010 11:54 pm at 11:54 pm #704622
BPT, would you say “feh” if a girl is turned off at the sight of chest hair, and asked her husband to shave it off? Obviously it is not something she would know about him before they got married. I am just interested in the halachic aspect of this. I am not in favor of men doing this, but if it is not up to me or you, AND if the halacha could be found to be matir in this area, then what business is it of ours if it is done, especially if it would be for purposes of Sholom Bayis, and not for z’nus?October 24, 2010 12:16 am at 12:16 am #704623
“Still, I can’t seem to reconcile the Sac who “lives on the edge” with the Sac that wrote such a nice thing about her father in another thread.”
Why does it have to be a stira?
I didnt see that question…October 24, 2010 1:06 am at 1:06 am #704624
oomis, if a girl is turned off at the sight or feel of chest hair, and asked her husband to shave it off, it may not fall within the criteria of beged isha. Again, I would think under these circumstances, a Rav would matir.October 24, 2010 2:01 am at 2:01 am #704625HomeownerMember
BP Totty, there are a variety of skin conditions that can be improved by shaving chest hair. A dermatologist can confirm this.
Also, swimmers shave their chests to improve speed. (What am I thinking? You’re probably going to asser swimming.) 🙂October 24, 2010 6:49 am at 6:49 am #704626Mother in IsraelMember
How does shaving chest hair improve speed? (And I always though those Olympic swimmers were just naturally hairless.)October 24, 2010 2:21 pm at 2:21 pm #704627
It helps swimmers by cutting down the resistance in the water. Take two male swimmers, same build, height and weight, and identical swimming ability. If one has shaved his chest and the other has not, the one with the shaved hair will have a slight advantage over the other.October 24, 2010 3:17 pm at 3:17 pm #704628anon for thisParticipant
Mother in Israel, swimmers shave (probably arms and legs too) to reduce drag.October 24, 2010 3:22 pm at 3:22 pm #704629
mw13 – “If it’s assur, its assur regardless. If it’s muttar, there’s no need for these reasons.”
Chazal have made special considerations for women in many areas knowing that women’s biological and emotional realities are different and more sensitive than the male’s.October 25, 2010 10:19 pm at 10:19 pm #704630
OK, I suppose if we had a frum olympic swimmer with sholom bayis problems, we could make a case for shaving.
But Oomis – for a wife to say she finds her husbands chest repulsive? Boy, have we got a dire need for a Rov to intervene. But not for the shaving heter.
Sorry, I’m just not on board with this one.October 26, 2010 3:37 pm at 3:37 pm #704631
A guy shaving his chest for cosmetic reasons, likely doesn’t have a wife (or want one). Is probably also a member of the local chapter of congregation ahavas achim.October 26, 2010 8:17 pm at 8:17 pm #704632
“congregation ahavas achim”.
Very funny APY!
And Homeowner – I should correct myself. In a case of medical necessity, I’m sure a heter would be forthcoming and proper.
But from the OP, it seemed to imply this was coming at us from a cosmetic view, not medicalOctober 26, 2010 8:46 pm at 8:46 pm #704633
Everyone knows the g’mara about the fellow who had an older wife and a younger wife. The older wife would pull out her husband’s dark hair so that he would appear older to the young wife and the younger wife would pull out her husband’s white hair so that he would appear younger to her. And of course, between the two of them he was left with no hair. So BP Totty, not so strange.October 26, 2010 9:41 pm at 9:41 pm #704634
Yes, I do remember that gemorah. But its the wifes who are doing the plucking, not the husband who thinks he’ll look better w/o body hair.
Besides, who in their right mind wants two wives? Between that story, and the “aishes yifas tohar / shtei nashim /ben sorre ‘umoreh senario, I can’t imagine the upshot to having an additional spouse.October 26, 2010 10:10 pm at 10:10 pm #7046351st timerParticipant
I know someone who got a heter to shave/wax his back hair-he was having back pains and the chiropractor recommended itOctober 26, 2010 10:14 pm at 10:14 pm #704636
Thats different. What tumult is about is a social / cosmetic move.October 26, 2010 10:16 pm at 10:16 pm #704637WolfishMusingsParticipant
I know a fellow who had his chest hair shaved off without asking a shaila.
Of course, the fact that it was for life-saving surgery might have been a factor.
The WolfOctober 26, 2010 10:31 pm at 10:31 pm #704638
But Oomis – for a wife to say she finds her husbands chest repulsive? Boy, have we got a dire need for a Rov to intervene. But not for the shaving heter. “
You should not be judgmental BP, about what women find attractive or not. And I would tend to think that no Rov would touch this one with a ten foot pole (and I do not know any woman who would be able to easily discuss this with a rov, anyway).
Plenty of men would be repulsed if their wives did not shave their legs and underarms. Why should a woman not likewise be allowed to have preferences in how her husband is groomed whether it is facially or otherwise? Thw bottom line is that he should be attractive to her (as is proper). The question is and was, it is ASSUR for him to shave his chest? It’s not for us to criticize any woman who doesn’t like chest hair. This is something a frum woman would not likely know until she is married. We are not talking about something outlandish here. Whether I think a guy should do this or not, if it is within halachic parameters, it is none of my business to say yea or nay.October 26, 2010 10:45 pm at 10:45 pm #704639vnishmartemmeodMember
Husband was told: shave your chest hair
He thought that was entirely unfair
It wouldn’t make a difference
And what was the inference
Obviously true ahava wasn’t there
Oh, this isn’t the limericks category? Oops..
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