July 13, 2011 7:00 pm at 7:00 pm #597947
There should be hired ones, rather than friends, since they are paid,they will do a better job!July 13, 2011 8:33 pm at 8:33 pm #787505DroidMember
The best shidduchum (and the most shidduchim) come from friends and family and colleagues, NOT from “professional shadchanim”. For good reason too.July 13, 2011 8:37 pm at 8:37 pm #787506apushatayidParticipant
Shadchanim? It is difficult to make a statement about todays shadchanim since I am married more than 18 years and have no children in the “parsha” right now. My experience from 18+ years ago though tells me that your statement is ridiculous. Perhaps things have changed.July 13, 2011 8:56 pm at 8:56 pm #787507Legen-daryMember
I disagreeJuly 13, 2011 9:40 pm at 9:40 pm #787508adorableParticipant
hired shidduchim? can you explain how that would work?July 13, 2011 11:48 pm at 11:48 pm #787509bombmaniacParticipant
russian mail order brides…i get emails all the time about those.July 14, 2011 1:13 am at 1:13 am #787510dunnoMember
Totally disagreeJuly 14, 2011 5:08 am at 5:08 am #787511real-briskerMember
Iuse – Maybe you want to explain your idea a little better, and how it will work exactly, cause no one here seems to see it happening.July 14, 2011 9:07 pm at 9:07 pm #787512
Iusebrains, your’re speaking from 1 half of the coin and you give no basis to back up your blanket statement. As tempting as it would be to “blanketly” disagree with you, I would first like to hear what you have to say in more detail.July 15, 2011 2:38 am at 2:38 am #787513
Just because people are paid more doesn’t mean they do a better job. Look at union employees for starters.
My wife and I went out to eat once. After taking our order we never saw the waitress again. One of us had to go to the kitchen to get the food, keep refilling our glasses with water, clean up, get a waiter to ask for the dessert menu and get our bill. “At least we don’t have to leave a tip”, my wife joked. But they were one step ahead of us, the 18% gratuity was automatically included.
According to your theory the waitress should have done a wonderful job since she was getting 18% right?
(When I asked where she was so I can thank her I was told that she went home 90 minutes earlier.)July 15, 2011 3:31 am at 3:31 am #787514Pac-ManMember
Dr. P: You should’ve refused to pay the gratuity. Especially if there was no previous indication it was mandatory.July 15, 2011 5:10 am at 5:10 am #787515bezalelParticipant
Dr. P: You should’ve refused to pay the gratuity. Especially if there was no previous indication it was mandatory.
I did that once. Luckily I had the correct change at the time. (I usually don’t carry nickels and pennies due to their value/weight ratio.)July 15, 2011 1:20 pm at 1:20 pm #787516
Let Me explain, If u are a real freind u should be heavily involoved in Shidduchim, if not, then let the Shadcahnim run the show!!!!July 15, 2011 1:44 pm at 1:44 pm #787517
The next time we went we checked and on the menu it says in small letters that 18% gratuity is added. Since we were expecting it we watched the incompetence of the staff and got a kick out of it.
Please don’t get sidetracked though, the main point of what I was saying was that people will work harder when there is competition and their compensation depends on performance. Not when customers are throwing money in their direction.July 17, 2011 3:07 pm at 3:07 pm #787518
IUseBrains, not to argue which kind of shadchanim work better, but each person has a different mediation for meeting their bashert. What works for one might not work for another. A quieter boy/ girl might make a better impression on a (even a not close) friend, than on a shadchan he/ she meets only once. Shadchanim might have access to more people and more of a motivation, but a random neighbor might have the mazal to make the shidduch.
Dr. Pepper, and I thought those kind of things only happened to me!July 17, 2011 5:32 pm at 5:32 pm #787519
Dr.Pepper,thats what references are for.July 17, 2011 6:11 pm at 6:11 pm #787520
Another Name,thats what references are for.July 17, 2011 7:03 pm at 7:03 pm #787521just meParticipant
My best friend was my shadchan. I am happily married b”H 34 yrs. My next door neighbor’s son was my son’s shadchan. My daughter’s shadchan was a relative who happened to be a professional shadchan.
As far as I’m concerned, it doesn’t matter who the shliach is. Either one could be the right one. You have to check refrences no matter who the shadchan is.July 17, 2011 7:06 pm at 7:06 pm #787522AZParticipant
Dr. P, I couldn’t agree more. I guess the only thing we disagree on is how to measure results/preformance. I contend that date #4 is a measure of success as opposed to only recognizing engagements.
Do you disagree?July 17, 2011 7:31 pm at 7:31 pm #787523
IUseBrains, but you as the shadchan wouldn’t call up references. You would be setting the person up based on your limitted knowledge to people that might not be appropriate…July 17, 2011 9:44 pm at 9:44 pm #787524
The point is that a shadchan should be instructed by both sides what to ask and look for and releave all the headaches.
All ideas would then be re-directed to him/her.Additionally, he/her would do all the searching.Paid appropriately, this would be a great idea for klal yisroel!July 17, 2011 9:46 pm at 9:46 pm #787525
It doesnt mean, that the parents dont check,it just makes it much easier and can get the couple to the first date much quicker wheras many of the questions evaporate!July 17, 2011 9:47 pm at 9:47 pm #787526
The parents can then do follow-up checking!July 17, 2011 11:57 pm at 11:57 pm #787527
IUseBrains, interesting idea but what professional shadchan has time for all that work? The money does not match all the time that’s put in.July 18, 2011 12:45 am at 12:45 am #787528
A Shadchan does most of that work before every Shidduch is red!July 18, 2011 2:35 am at 2:35 am #787529
Which work? I never heard of a shadchan calling up the references, an intergral part of the search process. Besides, most parents would be wary to put all their faith in a shadchan’s research. Unfortunately, shadchanim seem to be getting a negative rep.July 18, 2011 1:57 pm at 1:57 pm #787530
Now u heard of one!July 18, 2011 2:22 pm at 2:22 pm #787531
We probably agree on many more things, if you would have had the decency to read my posts from beginning to end instead of just shouting back “You’re totally ridiculous” the second you saw something that challenged your position, you would have seen this.
As far as what the compensation should be for a shadchan, I never thought about this seriously. My first thought would be to have it the way it is where I work- no compensation until after the contracts are signed and the account is opened. True, this may mean that through no fault of the agent the client backed out at the last second, but that’s business.
Also, if the account is closed within a year the agent has to return the comission. If this happens too many times the agent gets audited to see what is going on. (In extreme cases agents have been let go, lost their license or even arrested when illegal activities were uncovered.)
At times, especially when one of the two parties flies in for a date, the two of them could rack up 3 dates without getting serious. If the shadchan knows that after one more date he/ she will receive compensation regardless of the outcome… I’ll let you figure out on your own what will happen.July 18, 2011 6:25 pm at 6:25 pm #787532shlishiMember
At times, especially when one of the two parties flies in for a date, the two of them could rack up 3 dates without getting serious. If the shadchan knows that after one more date he/ she will receive compensation regardless of the outcome… I’ll let you figure out on your own what will happen.
I don’t understand. A shadchan can’t force two adults to go on another date without their willing consent.July 18, 2011 6:43 pm at 6:43 pm #787533
I agree, but there were times that I was told that if I agree to go out with a girl- since she is flying out to meet me I have to commit to two dates. Saying “no” after just one would have been dishonest and highly offensive.
Also going out for a fourth time when one is not interested when compared to two weeks of non-stop harassment may be the lesser of two evils.
Imagine how much more prevalent these torture tactics will become once the shadchanim know that they will be receiving compensation.July 19, 2011 4:23 pm at 4:23 pm #787534
Let Me explain, If u are a real freind u should be heavily involoved in Shidduchim, if not, then let the Shadcahnim run the show!!!!
Hold on a second there- before giving shadchanim the green light to run the show, let’s set down a list of rules for them to follow:
(This is in now way an all inclusive list, it is strictly my opinion and copied from a different thread.)
1. Don’t lie- If someone asks a question it usually means that it’s important to them. It’s not up to you to decide what’s important or not.
2. Don’t stalk- I found it creepy when Shadchannim found out who I previously dated and who I was currently dating. It’s none of your business and if you “happened” to have found out somehow you are not allowed to share this information!
3. Don’t give my name out without my permission- If I never asked you to put my name on your list but you got it from my yeshiva please ask me before distributing it. It’s not fair to my friends, neighbors, Rabbeim and relatives to get numerous calls about me when I can’t possibly date all of them anyway. It’s also not fair to me to get a reputation as a guy who says “no” to everyone.
4. Don’t use excessive pressure- If it’s a “no” then it’s “no”, if I need more information then I’ll let you know.
It’s a shame these even have to be mentioned, it’s all common sense to me.July 19, 2011 6:31 pm at 6:31 pm #787535
I dont know wat ur talking bout, these Shadchanim are Erev Rav!July 19, 2011 6:44 pm at 6:44 pm #787536
However, I do disagree with number 3.
And as far as number 4,theres’ nothing wrong with some advice from an outsider!July 20, 2011 3:40 pm at 3:40 pm #787537
However, I do disagree with number 3.
That’s exactly why it had to be mentioned even though it should be common sense!
Let’s say we have a guy who has a dark secret that he doesn’t want anyone to know. His Rebbe suggests that he go to a shadchan that deals with singles that have sensitive issues.
Is it fair for you to throw his name around (which will ultimately lead to the secret being exposed) because you got his name from a yeshiva list, picked it out of a hat and want to make some money? Unless you got explicit permission, either by them asking you to put their name on a list or by you asking them first, you shouldn’t be mentioning their names.
When I was in my low 20s I spoke with my Rebbe about when a good time is to start dating. He suggested that I wait another year, despite many of my friends getting married, because I was doing good in learning and had a heavy college load. Some shadchanim got my name from a yeshiva list and gave it out to numerous potential dates (without my knowledge) and my friends where getting calls asking if I was “normal” or what was “wrong” with me that I hadn’t started dating.
It got to the point that my mother jokingly asked me to date one person just so that she could say I started dating!
You may also disagree with me on this, but I feel that a shadchan should first ask the guy if he wants to go out with the girl (assuming the shadchan has permission to give out the girls name), and only after he agrees should his name be given to the girl.
If you explain what you meant by
And as far as number 4,theres’ nothing wrong with some advice from an outsider!
I can try to discuss it with you.
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