February 24, 2011 2:07 am at 2:07 am #595273
What is the point of the Shiur Klali? Every Yeshiva has one day a week that the learning comes to a halt, most people empty out, and a few remain to listen but don’t really incorporate it into their learning. It seems to me that it is just a relic of something that once made sense. In the old Yeshivos they learned much faster than we do, today. Therefore, it made sense that once a week they were exposed to a real Pilrul. These days, the Bochurim have a penetrating Shiur every day, and the Shiur Klali is not in sync with the way the Magid Shiur learned the Gembra, and is often less intense, too. The whole thing seems preposterous and a Bittul Torah Dirabbim.February 24, 2011 4:06 am at 4:06 am #744116
Every Yeshiva has one day a week that the learning comes to a halt, most people empty out, and a few remain to listen but don’t really incorporate it into their learning
why do people empty out when they shouldn’t,
if they are bums then they wouldn’t be learning anyway (probably just shmoozing which they cant do during shiur klali)
:p> mbachur <d:February 24, 2011 6:25 am at 6:25 am #744117
You don’t have to be a bum not to be interested in something extra curriculum, which is what it turns out to be, for the reasons I mentioned. Secondly, what about the Kollel, that doesn’t learn the same thing as the Bochurim? The fact is that during Seder, most people are learning. Most of them leave by Shiur Klali.
As a Bochur, did you attend Shiur Klali? Did you pay attention and write it down the way you did at the regular Shiur?February 24, 2011 3:08 pm at 3:08 pm #744118
YesFebruary 24, 2011 5:31 pm at 5:31 pm #744119
I don’t know where you learned. Where I was, although most of up stayed, it was against our will. Many had their own Seforim in front of them so as not to be wasting time. Where I went after that, it emptied out. How many others were like you? When you look back at those Sugyos, do you recall what your Maggid Shiur said, or what was said at the Shiur Klali? Even if you again answer what I don’t expect, do you actually find the whole thing necessary?February 24, 2011 6:50 pm at 6:50 pm #744120
No i don’t,
It was probably specifically made so people can feel chashuv that they’re hearing shiur from the magid shiur (imagine hearing shiur from R Shach, if he was still alive) but, I truly hear what you mean (I go to the shiur, the question you should’ve asked is do I stay up for it)February 24, 2011 7:26 pm at 7:26 pm #744121
When I was in yeshiva, we didn’t have a shiur klali once a week. We usually had it the last week of a zman, sort of to wrap up the sugyah we were learning. Everyone stayed for it.
There were also occasionally other times, such as on Chanukah or before Purim, where there would be a shiur klali about the chag. They were always well attended.February 24, 2011 7:42 pm at 7:42 pm #744122
truth be toldMember
That shiur did not have any of the concerns you mentioned.February 24, 2011 8:42 pm at 8:42 pm #744123
When I was in Yeshivah, Shiur Klali took the place of regular shiur and I’m pretty certain the kollel there was learning the same thing or at least had learned the material. There was also a chazara shiur given by each Rebbe to his shiur later on in the day. I think whoever fell asleep in regular shiur fell asleep there too and those that wouldn’t didn’t. Those that weren’t interested at all usually stayed in their rooms.February 25, 2011 2:21 am at 2:21 am #744124
What about it made it different than what I described. What it uniquely different than the regular Shiur?February 25, 2011 4:27 am at 4:27 am #744125
truth be toldMember
I once met a Tezer in the bungalow colony I spent a summer in. He had gone with Rav Gifter when he opened a Yeshiva or a branch of Telz in Eretz Yisroel. He claimed Rav Gifter told the bochorim to bring along “bats and gloves” to play baseball as well.
Once they were in EY, people explained to RG that ball playing for older Yeshiva Bochrim was unacceptable in EY. So, RG told his talmidim to take walks for exercise. What about excitement? He told them he will give them a Minchas Chinuch Shiur on Fridays. This person told me it did indeed add excitement.
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