Sources for shidduch nisayon

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  • #1778049

    Lucy
    Participant

    I always think about how there are so many places in Tanach where people daven to be bentched with children.
    I’m wondering if there are any places where people daven for a shidduch. Is this a new nisayon?
    The only one I can think of is leah davening to not marry eisav.

    #1778136

    ☕️coffee addict
    Participant

    People weren’t as picky back then

    #1778134

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    Avraham davened that Yitzchok should find the proper shidduch through the help of Eliezer and so did Eliezer.

    #1778133

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    David Hamelech davens מאין יבא עזרי – as we find עזר כנגדו will she be earthly (knowing how to deal with people) or heavenly (how to behave towards Hashem) עזרי מעם ה’ עושה שמים וארץ if she is G-d sent. she can be both heavenly and earthly.

    #1779025

    CS
    Participant

    Laskern that’s a great interpretation there. Where’s it from?

    #1779121

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    CS, it can be found in a Sefer Maharam Sofer from the nephew of Rav Chaim Sofer (Machnei Chaim) student of the Chasam Sofer in a different fashion for someone who wants to sit and learn and be supported through the wife. If she is G-d sent, you can have your cake and eat it, by her having a business and you sitting and learning.

    #1779132

    GRATEFULBLAC
    Participant

    The Possuk in Bereishis Chapter 24.63 says, “Yitchok went out to supplicate in the Field.”

    The Baal Haturim says on that Possuk – to supplicate in the field – “he Sages said that it meant that Yitchok ordained Mincha – the afternoon Prayer. – And it was then that he met Rivka his wife to be. This recalls the verse in Psalms 32.6 – For this let every devout one pray to You at a time of finding.. That word finding refers to a wife as it is written in Proverbs 18.22 – who has found a wife has found a good thing.”
    The Baal Haturim, I would suggest, is telling us that Mincha is a good time to pray for a shidduch.

    #1779203

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    Grateful, thank you for pointing that out, but it doesn’t say he davened for her only that he found her there. The Klei Yokor says that propably he davened then for her.

    #1779568

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    The prayer above about finding a mate is applied to Yaakov Avinu, who wanted to sit and learn without worries for his livelihood as he went to Lavan poor without a penny. Elifaz cleaned him out from his wealth in order to obey his father Aisov’s command to kill him, and by making him poor he fulfiled his father’s wishes.

    #1780284

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    To understand why Mincha: Eliyahu Hanovi was answered at mincha time. It reflects the poor worker who designates time when he is very busy, by sacrificing his time to Hashem showing love to Him, as the poor sacrifices his small sacrifice which is accepted by Hashem as the greatest sacrifice. This is the time to pray for what one requires most. He gives up some of his needs and Hashem fullfils all of his needs.

    #1780527

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    Grateful, the pasuk above to pray to you ar the time of finding is no proof thar you pray for a mate, because it could mean after finding as a hakoras hatov.

    #1780587

    GRATEFULBLAC
    Participant

    laskern – I would suggest you look at the first word in the Possuk – “Vayetzei” Yitchok. It is my suggestion that the Bal Haturim is comparing it to Motzei and Motzoh that the Baal Haturim brings in his explanation. The Baal Haturim is commenting on the odd phrasing. The possuk could have just said Yitchok met Rivka. What is all this going out of the field after supplicating there and then he met his bride to be!

    Although the Baal Haturim does not say that mincha is a most beneficial time to daven for a shidduch, I think there is a smattering of that in his explanation. Also although the Shidduch had been worked out some time before that Mincha prayer – Yitchok didn’t know that!

    #1780634

    Lucy
    Participant

    But those examples are all about davening for a shidduch, like we daven for everything. Are there examples of shidduch being a nisayon, like there are of people who have difficulty having children.
    I’m not sure if im being clear..

    #1780638

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    Grateful, look at the Rav Sapurna and what I said above about mincha and the Klei Yokor.

    #1780666

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    קשה זוויגו של אדם כקריעת ים סוף the matching of a person with their mate is as great as the splitting of the sea. Explains the Chidushei Harim that splitting of the sea was unexpected, similarly to parnasa the shidduch comes unexpected. We must apply our effort but we don’t know if it will bear fruits, so we must pray for it. To have children, there is segulah to wear the hebrew letter ‘heh’ הא לכם זרע.

    #1780667

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    Chanah said that if You, Hashem don’t give me any children, I will (could) make myself a sotah and I will drink and be innocent and You will have to bless me with children.

    #1780675

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    Having shalom bayis is a nisayon. The Mezuzah is put up slanted. There are two views, horizontal and vertical. We make a compromise to satisfy both views, This is something that both the bride and groom should keep in mind when they enter the house. The wedding is called nisuyin which means elevation. Each one of the mates should elevate the other by putting each other on a pedestal.

    #1780814

    GRATEFULBLAC
    Participant

    Lucy – on page 114 of Advice – Rabbi Nachman of Breslov, (Breslov Research Institute publication), it says-
    no.6 -” When a person is unable to find his Marriage partner, it can help if he goes to hear original Torah teachings from a man of deep wisdom”.

    #1780835

    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    “I’m not sure if im being clear..”
    If it’s any consolation I totally get your question and I think it’s a good one

    #1781076

    Lucy
    Participant

    Rev Eliezer, What’s the source for that, I’ve never heard that.
    Thanks syag, i think about this alot before rosh Hashanah

    #1781190

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    I don’t know what the source is. The mezuzah part I heard, nisuyin I said myself.

    #1781211

    familygirl
    Participant

    The shidduch crisis is not from Hashem. Hashem lets people go in a bad way if they want to, and by being unreasonably picky, as well as not allowing boys to date until they are 23, we are bringing suffering on ourselves with our own hands. This is not a nisayon from Hashem.
    Not having children is a nisayon from Hashem.
    This is not.

    #1781538

    GRATEFULBLAC
    Participant

    familygirl – Moden day Shidduchim can be a nisayon – The crisis is not only because everyone is so picky. You cannot choose to which family you were born into. If your family have disadvantages that others reject them for shidduchim, then that is not the fault of the particular boy or girl in the shidduch.

    Money is a particular problem. If you are born into a poor family, or a family whose parents do not have a regular job, you are going to be rejected or at least looked down in the shidduch market place.

    Likewise if you are not particularly good to look at, or physically not beautiful, there is not much you can do about that.

    I would say both of these things and other factors as well are a nisayon from Hashem.

    Likewise of you were born into a non frum family, and are a baal(as) teshuvah, you may be rejected from shidduchim. This is another type of nisayon.

    Just like Dovid Hamelech was ruled before he was King, that he could not marry an Israelite girl because he was a male Moab descendant, that was his particular nisayon. The rejection led him to pour out his heart to Hashem in prayer as the Psalms. When Hashem heard his prayers, not only was the decision reversed but he became King of Israel!

    #1781573

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    fanilygirl, you must play with the cards you were dealt with and pray to Hashem that your effort will bear fruits in shidduchim and everything else.

    #1784764

    Lucy
    Participant

    Reb Eliezer- whays the source for the part about chana
    Gamily girl- thats what i was asking. Do you have any way of knowing that, like a source, or this is your personal feeling on the matter

    #1784822

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    Chana said that Hashem will see. Samuel (1,11) One way or another He will see. In Tractate Brochas 32. The Torah has to be true. It says that a women who hides herself by giving the impression that she is commiting adultary, must drink the bitter water to verify if truly she did it. If she was accused falsely, she will bear children. So Chana could make it look that she commited adultary and thereby drink the water and have children.

    #1784953

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    The above reference should be Broxhos 31,2.

    #1784987

    yochy
    Participant

    correct this is a nisayon that is totally self inflicted and can be rectified by following the words of the gedolim as they did in the old days before the crisis began by boys marrying earlier. See pirkei avos.

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