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Snowbunny3318, most of the kids who take high level courses at a young age are not doing it because they are obsessing over their grades. They’re doing it so they won’t be bored out of their minds. And, Mensa is a society, not a classification. You mean gifted.
Torah, it sounds like you’re working hard. But, it doesn’t sound as if you’ve pinpointed the actual problem. Is the style of teaching working for you? Size of class? atmosphere? Were you put into this class because you are gifted? Do you enjoy math? Basically, is your only problem the fast pace of the class or are there also other factors? It’s great that you did better on the quiz, but make sure nothing will interfere with it staying that way or getting even better.:)
shnitzy- I took an iq test in eighth grade and got 124. I nearly skipped kindergarten, but didnt end up doing that because I still had the kindergarten maturity level. I am not saying that to brag, because unfortunately, i am also a bit learning disabled, but if I was more organized in real life and had a better attention span, i could have done much better in school to the point where i would have been able to take APs in high school.
Good for you! Did you think I was insinuating that you wouldn’t be capable of that? Hey! You missed the Mensa mark ;)…
I did take all AP/Dual enrollment courses, some even in junior high. I was just pointing out that if you haven’t done it yourself, you can’t knock it or the people who do it because it is quite necessary for some…
i understand, but you only belong in those courses at that age if you can get an A or a B in them. Otherwise, why mess up your transcript before entering high school?
True. And that is why I’d like to know what the real issue is with Torah`s course; if Torah was indeed capable of taking this course to begin with, etc.
My younger brother was initially taking high school algebra one in seventh grade, but he had to drop down to higher seventh grade algebra one because he was flunking, and until then, he was in gifted math classes his whole life (although he also has mild learning differences as well- much more mild than mine) and then he ended up taking honors geometry his freshman year.
His mild learning differences could have had something to do with that. There you go: every case is completely different. I had no issue with that course, it was quite interesting and fun.My question still stands about Torah.Did your brother step into something over his head? Evidently. Did Torah?
They both probably did. Torah, if you drop down to the higher middle school level math course, you will most likely still be able to take honors math in high school. And on top of that, you get the privilage of still having a childhood for a bit longer.
I think Torah is in college…
Snowbunny3318, our work is done here I believe ;).
Happy to hear, Torah. Enjoy it, math is fun! (believe it or not)
A Freilechin Purim to both of you! 🙂
shnitzy-
ur supp 2 step into something a LIL over ur head, its good 2 be challenged.. i was taking 9th grade math in 7th grade and at the end of 8th switched out.. regret it till this day!!
To this day, purple? What’s that, almost two weeks now?
Are you just going to keep dropping in on this thread to make snide comments and not address any of your responders?
Pretty much. Whoops, there I go again.
HA you responded. 😛
Now that you’ve done so, will you tell me why you think I am ignorant and talking about things I don’t know I don’t know using imprecise language?
Not you OOM. I actually pretty much agree with the viewpoint that you’ve expressed in this thread, but most, or at least many people, disagreed.
Just to break down what I wrote; people who admit to not having studied much (and it would be clear without the admissions) talk about how unimportant it is to explore new areas of knowledge. But you can’t know that without having the foggiest idea what it is that you don’t know. In support of those points, people post that Hashem will be happier if you do other things; which is an assertion that is so bizarre that it is hard to begin to address.
FWIW, I take this somewhat personally, because I bought into that attitude for too long and I strongly regret it. Even if there were no value at all to any secular studies, it would still be worth studying them just for the exercise. It is very difficult to minimize and denigrate effort in one area while sustaining effort and production in another. It’s pretty clear to me that the message that secular studies are unimportant doesn’t teach people to allocate resources to avodas hashem; it teaches them to be slackers.
umm it was a whole yr actually.. and wow u cud be just a LIL nicer if u tried..
Yes yes yes. It always irks me when people dismiss what they have trouble with as “not worth knowing”–math most of all. It is by far the most seminal discipline in the pursuit of knowledge. And I am an English major with limited mathematical breadth, so this opinion definitely isn’t coming from some puffed-up sense of self-importance I have on the matter. But I do have enough background to recognize how vital the bigger picture of mathematics is.
In general, I am a firm believer that the “how will this help me in life” view is most guaranteed to fence you in and prevent you from ever achieving any sort of meaningful success. And I don’t see at all how that self-centered assumption is somehow “what Hashem wants.”
Agreed entirely.
OneofMany: “It always irks me when people dismiss what they have trouble with as ‘not worth knowing’ . . ..” Always? The sour grapes fable is often right on but that doesn’t prove that the grapes aren’t sour. Additionally, it irks me when people take a dismissal as a presumptive indication that the dismisser had or would have had trouble with the dismissed.
VeltzMeshugene: “[Y]ou can’t know that without having the foggiest idea what it is that you don’t know.”
Yes you can. By hearing it from someone who does know.
“It teaches them to be slackers” – Any empirical evidence to provide an informed basis to that undefined generality?
I’m not against a high level of secular education. There might even be an inherent value to some of it. However, the idea that Hashem would prefer that one should engage in more religious pursuits if one can, may be the furthest thing from “bizarre” I have ever seen on this website (granted, that is not saying much).
What constitutes behavior that is “more” religious may be up for debate. Additionally, I’m operating with the assumption that religion is good and that y’all share my assumption.
VeltzMeshugene: “[Y]ou can’t know that without having the foggiest idea what it is that you don’t know.”
Yes you can. By hearing it from someone who does know.
“It teaches them to be slackers” – Any empirical evidence to provide an informed basis to that undefined generality?
1. No, you still can’t, because you have no idea what the person is basing his claims on. Furthermore, it’s pretty obvious that one person’s opinion of the general usefulness of a subject is not indicative of its usefulness to other people. Every day in colleges worldwide, there are people studying math who think it’s a waste of time because they are going to become psychologists. But the people who appreciate math will never find that out if they never try it.
2. I have not done a study, and I am sorry if my post gave the impression that I had. However, it is reasonable to imagine that encouragement of apathy toward secular studies would have at least some effect on engagement with other pursuits. Anecdotally, I feel that it affected me that way strongly, and my social circle to an uncertain extent.
frumnotyeshivish:
Always? The sour grapes fable is often right on but that doesn’t prove that the grapes aren’t sour.
Was I trying to prove that they weren’t? I am pretty sure I was making it my premise there.
Additionally, it irks me when people take a dismissal as a presumptive indication that the dismisser had or would have had trouble with the dismissed.
No, I don’t presume that. I am talking about people who have demonstrated/stated that they have difficulty with something, then belittled said something. You are referring to people who think they are smart and decide to reject knowledge out of their infinite wisdom and prescient understanding, whom I discuss in my next paragraph.
And please point out at which point I declare myself against religion or religious intellectual pursuits.
Hey T613 I’m posting this just to sympathize with you… im taking calculus based electricity and magnetism this semester, and I feel like it’s the toughest subject I’ve ever had the pleasure of studying. It’s basically just a Russian physicist integrating Greek letters on the board and mumbling to himself… I miss multivariable calculus 🙁
Torah, which course are you taking?
Most advanced math books are written by people who know their stuff but don’t know how to teach.
I like Stroud’s Engineering Math books (vol2 is called Advanced). Work on them at your own pace and master each phase before you go on to the next one.
Ari-free, I definitely agree. The situation could be ameliorated if there were more mathematician writers. Unfortunately, I don’t see too many of those around. It’s interesting that other courses of study have been significantly improved by writers specializing in these subjects, and yet we haven’t seen much of that in the math dept.
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