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i hear many teenagers saying words like
yo, dude, mad(as in mad old, it means extremely), beast (an adjective that can be used in many ways like, beastly shot which means that was a very good shot), sick.
i think these words ruin communication skills. what do u think??
Yo, dude, using those sick words is mad beastly.
i think u should avoid textspeak and lazy typing shortcuts like “u” for “you”. and stick to standard capitalization when you use the first person singular pronoun dont forget to punctuate the end of a sentence with a period
how about: “duh”, sometimes pronounced “du-uh” or “duhhhh!”
in israel, the teens say sabbabba, which means gr8.
how about “HELLO”??? I forbid my kids from saying that and I cringe when adults say it. makes my blood boil for some reason, LOL!
Ya think?!
At first i was going to say-come on-it’s all normal teenage stuff, like farout,cool,fab,awesome, but i have heard some of them trying to communicate, and it is kind of pathetic-so I agree with you-
Of all the words used above, the only one I hear from any of my kids is “awesome” — and the one kid of mine who does so has made that word her word to overuse. 🙂
The Wolf
Why instead of yes,do folks use “ye” or “ya”?
Does an “s” take that long to add?
If you started talking like that,you’d look nuts!
In other words, “normal teenage stuff” from thirty years ago is ok, but “normal teenage stuff” is suddenly terrible and destructive when it’s actually being used.
What bothers me so much is the word “hey” that became the new “hello”. Hey Mrs. ___ how u doin’ or Hey Rabbi ____ are you busy now? The generations are changing so much. I dont think anyone ever said Hey Reb Moshe how are you. But I have heard people talk to Rebbeim like that nowadays i think its such a lack of derech eretz.
Whatever!
WOLF it could be they dont say the words around you but do say them in the presence of friends
Granted, that’s possible. But there are two additional factors to consider:
a. The personalities of the kids. I KNOW that one of my kids does not use words that way — it’s just not in his personality. So, I’m pretty confident that he doesn’t use them out of my presence too.
b. Unless I plant a microphone on my kids so I can listen to them 24/7, I can only react to what I hear or hear about them from others.
Oh, and one last point… if this is the worst thing your kid does, you’re on pretty solid ground.
The Wolf
chayav: and then there are teenagers who specifically use these words in front of their parents just to confuse them!
(and then said parents roll their eyes in a “amusement”)
wolf i dont think its a bad thing, its normal for a teenager but i think it ruins communication skills
I’m not certain that I believe that using cultural idioms is a cause of the ruination of communication skills.
The Wolf
In every generation there is teenage lingo.
In this generation, a lot of the lingo is rude.
Hey,Yo,Man,dude,is just the intro.
Then comes hello???Ya think???etc.
I don’t understand what the problem is with these words- are they really so bad? My friends and I manage to communicate IM(not so)HO… 🙂 (not trying to be C”V facetious-I’m honestly trying to chap) Besides, as long as people understand, why is it any different than when bochurim start talking “yeshivish” and nobody can understand them? 🙂
To chayav inish livisumay: I meant exactly what I said, regardless of how inexactly I said it. I was well aware of every “error” in my post – they were deliberate. I made them to imitate the errors you made in your post, to highlight the irony of your complaining about adolescents’ use of incorrect speech, while you, yourself, failed to express yourself in proper English. Yes, I think that use of cliches, buzzwords and slang weakens communications skills. The text of most posts in the Coffee Room is a good example of the harm that comes from that kind of speech.
Years ago, when I first saw the low quality of the English in the comments in the YWN web site, I initially attributed it a high percentage of posters for whom English is a second language. However, more recently, I have seem some mediocre writing from people whom I believe are native speakers of English, but who are poorly schooled in standard English, or who choose, for reasons I do not know, to write in a slovenly way when posting on line.
I would like the YWN editors to consider a Coffee Room discussion of the quality of English instruction that takes place in American yeshivas. I believe it is essential that yeshivas and early Jewish education give major emphasis to proper language, whether it is Hebrew, English, Yiddish, Ladino, Farsi, Arabic or any other language. Since the end of the Holocaust, the percentage of Yiddish and Ladino speakers in the world Jewish community has declined, and English and modern Hebrew have become the primary languages of the Jewish people. The quality of Torah scholarship, as well as the ability of frum Jews to engage with the rest of the world, depends heavily on the ability to communicate. Most Torah scholarship outside Israel takes place in the United States, among people for whom English is their native tongue. It is therefore critical to the quality of Torah scholarship that the Talmidim speak and write with precision, accuracy and clarity. Likewise, for frum Jews to engage with the rest of the world in worldly matters, it is no less important that they do so is proper English. English is the language of the US, and Jews should learn standard English as well as any other Americans. With the current and continuing dominance of English in world commerce, industry, science and technology, it is essential that all Jews – frum, not-yet-frum, and otherwise – speak English as well as possible.
What is IMHO? (Or is that supposed to be LMHO?)
IMHO= in my humble opinion
It is highly important not to use texting language. I see the outcome of this.I am currently attending a community college and in one of my english classes a girl turned in a paper with the letter ‘u’ as opposed to the word(which does not go in a formal paper anyhow).She still got a ‘b’ somehow. So much for the public school system.
my kids use all the strange words, and I’m like What???? 🙂
To chayav inish livisumay: No, I am neither a proffesor nor a professor, though I do profess to have an above-average knowledge of standard English grammar, usage and punctuation. And someone once called me the “Professor of Punctuation”, but I do not believe it was intended only as a compliment.
To Smile E. Face: Your equation of “yeshivish” with textspeak is correct, and both are unwise because they lack the precision of a standard language, whether that language is English or Yiddish.
As for your ability to communicate with your friends using textspeak: the content of your communications with friends may be extremely limited. If you want to communicate outside your circle of friends, textspeak and yeshivish won’t work. That is why, for example, Sarah Palin’s use of Twitter for public discussion is appropriate for her: she is so simple-minded that 140 characters is all she needs to for her to believe that she has expressed a coherent thought, e.g., foreign policy i can see russia.
my opionion on this is if your talking to the person and they understand you what is the problem? why should it make a diffrence how its said? i feel, as long as your understood, whoopidoo. lets not be so on top of them……..
If you started talking like that,you’d look nuts! “
Ya, we would!
I am with nfgo3 in this regard. I believe that today’s youth, just as yesterday’s, do not speak properly. Part of that is because their parents do not, and a large measure of that can be directly placed at the feet of the yeshivah systems that do not require excellence in communication skills.
When my mother O”H was in school, one of the grades she received was for proper elocution. My father O”H grew up in a home where only Yiddish was spoken, yet he managed to learn to speak English perfectly, and was a great orator. Both my parents set that fine example for me, and as a result, I, too, spoke grammatically correctly (most of the time, anyway). There is no excuse for poor language skills.
While it is true, deiezooger, that the ikker is to be able to communicate with another person, why can we not communicate as intelligent-sounding human beings, rather than sounding as though we grew up in a barn? Would you want to send a letter to a Rov or to your President, written in childish lingo? I can see it now…
“Hey, Dude,
What’s happening? I got a beastly question 4 u, Reb. Is it, like, um…kosher 2 eat from some meat that got mixed with a drop of milk? I mean, HELLO????? Yo, I need an answer ASAP. That would be totally awesome, Dude.
Shlumiel”
good good yes sounds no good to sent such a letter to a rabbi or boss or president, ok but to plain ppl?? fine.
“Professor of Punctuation”,
Professor – the comma should have preceeded the final quotation marks, should it not?
i had a teacher once upon a time who in response to someone saying
“Hi Mr.
“he would say- no , nor have i ever been, what makes you think that.
I used to say ‘hi’ to my in-laws,A’H, & they would always say “shtroy” (straw?)
deiyezooger writes, in part: “my opionion on this is if your talking to the person and they understand you what is the problem? why should it make a diffrence how its said? i feel, as long as your understood, whoopidoo. lets not be so on top of them……..
I agree in part with your first sentence. The purpose of writing in standard English is, in part, to enable you to communicate to someone to whom you are not speaking face-to-face, or someone who is outside your circle of friends, business colleagues or kollel. If you are talking to someone face-to-face and he/she does not understand you, he/she will interrupt you for clarification, or his/her facial expression will reveal that you have not made yourself clear to him. That is not possible in written communication, such as the Coffee Room, or a written commentary on a Torah passage, or a business report, or an article in a scholarly journal about the history of algebra or the treatment of dyspepsia in whales. Your last sentence uses language that is unfamiliar to me, but I think you are saying, among other things, that one should not be critical of a person who fails to write in proper, standard English.
Ya here are a couple:
dude
man
mad chiller (chilled)
what up
cool
bro
goat on water skies (for those of you that get that: )
To oomis1105: First of all, thank you for agreeing with me.
I must respectfully disagree with you when you go on to write, in part: “why can we not communicate as intelligent-sounding human beings, rather than sounding as though we grew up in a barn?” If someone grew up in a barn, that is no reason to look down on him/her. For one thing, there is plenty to learn in a barn, starting with the an appreciation of the luxury of a heated home and a store-bought mattress, and including where farm animals come from (or, rather, the mechanisms by which Hashem sends them to this world). But the use of standard English as a means of showing off one’s social class, or financial good fortune, or formal education is abhorrent, in my opinion. There is no shame in being born in modest or impoverished circumstances, or in war-ravaged Eastern Europe, or drug-war-ravaged Mexico, nor is there any shame in being unable to obtain a good education. The real shame is having the opportunity to receive a good education but being too lazy or indifferent to do the work needed to get it. The sterling example of that is George W. Bush, BA from Yale, MBA from Harvard, both bought and paid for, but not worked for or earned or obtained.
As for your question about whether a punctuation mark should be inside or outside the quotation marks: it depends. If the punctuation is part of the quoted text, it always belongs inside the quotation marks. If the punctuation mark is not part of the quoted text, there are two different styles: the British style puts the punctuation in its logical place, i.e., outside the quotation marks; the American style is to put the punctuation mark inside the quotation marks, even if the punctuation mark is not part of the quoted text, because it supposedly looks better. Generally, I follow the American rule, but when discussing grammar, usage or syntax, I prefer to follow the British rule, as it is more logical and precise.
And last but not least, chayav inish livisumay: the fourth character of my screen name is the letter “o”, not the numeral “0”. My point is, “That’s not spighetti, it’s linguini.”
here is the latest
My teenager asked her friend for some water
her friend hands it to her and says “Knock yourself out!”
I almost fainted!
The worst is using the word “LIKE” 3 times in every sentence.
Horrible!! Whenever I happen to be listening to teenagers speak they use the word LIKE so often…it’s scary. The same sentence can be said without the word LIKE.
Here’s a sample:
“Like I was walking down the Avenue and Like I saw Shaindy across the street and Like she was wearing that great outfit and Like I wish I knew where she bought it”.
As someone who appreciates Literature and Good spelling…I get sad knowing that the future generations of kids will never know proper penmanship. The art of writing a handwritten letter to a friend is long gone. The quick texting language is taking over and proper english will be thrown to the wind. (Please do not comment on my English or spelling since I wrote this in haste)
i know this is not a teenage word, but everyone uses it on the computer nowadays, hate to sound so ancient, but what does lol stand for? lots of lice? loads of laundry? lots of laughs? licking orange lollipops?
laughing out loud
lol= laughing out loud 🙂
thanks.:)
“If someone grew up in a barn, that is no reason to look down on him/her. “
You are absolutely correct. I was actually referring to the animals that grow up in a barn, as the original comment implies, and didn’t mean for you to infer that I was talking about people. While I do agree that no one should be faulted for the lack of opportunity to be educated, there is no such lack for most of us; nonetheless, our school systems are NOT educating our young people to speak or even write properly.
There has been a tremendous dumbing-down of our educational system. Instead of elevating our young people and helping them rise to their best levels of ability, we are giving many of them a pass through the system, often to their detriment. This is most evident in many Yeshivas, but is found across the board in the public schools.
” goat on water skies “
WHAT does this mean?
I’m pretty much ok with slang/ teen / code words when spoken, but only amongst your own peer group.
Seeing people write in text-hand drives me nuts. I know at some point in time, people paid per charachter, but those days are gone, so can we please stop with the abbreviations?
Popcorn, I can more imagine the likes in the sentence as follows:
“I was, like, walking down, like, the avenue, and I, like, saw Shaindy, like, across the (like?) street, and she was, like, wearing that great outfit, and I like wish I know where she, like, bought it” – you were pretty lenient with the number of likes!
It’s amazing how ridiculous people can sound. Sometimes, when I catch myself using some of these words, I stop and rephrase.
I remember, several year ago, when I was in a car with a few people and a man was talking – he kept using the expression “you know” after every few words, and it was almost painful to listen!
using the expression “you know”
Perhaps you were in the car with Matisyahu?
bpt- Don’t know but I hear random terms like “you stink like a beast on wheels” or “you stink like a goat on water-skis.” Maybe it’s only the few teens I know.
^MONIS^
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