September 27, 2010 9:56 pm at 9:56 pm #592463leftbrooklynParticipant
I just moved to Eretz Yisroel and heard that minhag E”Y is not to wear tefilin on chol hamoed. My minhag in Chutz le’aretz was to wear tefilin. Anyone know the halacha?September 27, 2010 11:11 pm at 11:11 pm #975663
If you keep one day YT and intend to stay in EY, then you should stop wearing tefillin on Chol HaMoed as you are ??? ???? ????? (as I have done). If you keep two days and intend to return then you should put on tefillin at home privately after davening, since you are still obligated by your original minhag but since NOONE in EY wears tefillin Chol HaMoed it would be ?? ??????? to wear them in shul.September 27, 2010 11:55 pm at 11:55 pm #975664kosherkosherMember
You should wear them in private say shema with them and then daven without them. It should have nothing to do with keeping one day or 2 days. If its your minhag you are have to wear them. Its a D’arisa. Just not in public to avoid Lo Tisgodado.September 28, 2010 1:17 am at 1:17 am #975665apushatayidParticipant
My family minhag is to wear tefillin on chol hamoed. Some family members moved to E’Y and were told by their Rav that they should continue to do so, only “bitzina”, in their case, at home.September 28, 2010 5:46 am at 5:46 am #975666
Many people wear tefillin on chol hamoed in Eretz Yisroel, including some gedolim. However, some do it betzinoh so it is not so well known.
One such godol is the Erlau’er Rebbe. You can go in his beis medrash and see him with tefillin. He keeps the minhogim of his zeide, the Chasam Sofer, to wear tefillin on chol hamoed and daven nusach Ashkenaz.
There are even some minyonim where people wear tefillin on Chol Hamoed, like a Yekkishe minyan in Bnei Brak that I know of.
Bekitzur, Al titosh toras imecho, keep on following your minhog and Al yisbayeish…., as the Rama says in beginning of Shulchan Aruch Orach Chaim.September 28, 2010 6:23 am at 6:23 am #975667
Following is some more info on this inyan.
Here are a few names, a sampling of some past gedolim who wore tefillin on chol hamoed IN ERETZ YISROEL (either betzinoh or otherwise) –
Moreinu HaRav Schach, Rav Isser Zalman Meltzer, Rav Michel Feinstein (eidem of the Brisker Rav), Pressburger Rav, and Rav Duschinsky, ??”?.
The ??”? ????? was in Eretz Yisroel. In his siddur Shaarei Shomayim, he has tefillin on chol hamoed.
Rav Moshe Feinstein ??”? writes in a teshuvoh that he knows of thousands of bnei Torah who put on tefillin on chol hamoed in Eretz Yisroel.
?????? ???”?, ??? ???? ????’ ????? ????”?, ???”? of Edah Charedis was heard also taking the position that someone whose minhog is to put on tefillin on chol hamoed cannot just suddenly drop it totally in Eretz Yisroel.
The above and previous post is based on what I heard about this inyan ??? ?? ?????? ??????? ????”?, ??? ?????? ??????? ??????? ??????.
I think there is an Oberlander minyan in Yerusholayim where they wear tefillin on Chol Hamoed as well, if I recall correctly.September 28, 2010 6:53 am at 6:53 am #975668shlomozalmanMember
The minhag of the Gaon was not to wear tefillin chol hamoed. This has become the minhag of all of Eretz Yisroel. Even so, if you feel you must, do it betzin’a and don’t talk about it. No matter what you do, yesh al mi lismoch, see above posts. After all, it is difficult to abandon the Rama.September 28, 2010 11:38 am at 11:38 am #975669
The minhag in E”Y was not to put on tefillin long before the Vilna Gaon.September 28, 2010 2:12 pm at 2:12 pm #975670
Shlomo Zalman – So you know better than Rav Schach who put on tefillin there? And the Erlauer Rebbe shlita, lihavdil bein chaim lechaim, who wears tefillin in his beis medrash?
Charlie, what is your source?
Actually, that is not correct. The Shalah was in Eretz Yisroel before the Vilna Gaon and he has tefillin on chol hamoed in his siddur.September 28, 2010 2:16 pm at 2:16 pm #975671
A friend of mine (Reb A.) sent me the following information a short while ago, about minyonim where they wear tefillin on chol hamoed in Eretz Yisroel bifarhesia.
“There is one in Katamon by the Erlauer Rav (that one has a chassidish taste to it). I travel there on the 1st day Chol HaMoed. There is another one near Belz in the Minchas Yitzchak neighborhood, called Kehillas Vien. It is an Oberlander minyan, according to Minhag Pressburg. I go there for the other days of Chol HaMoed.”September 28, 2010 3:10 pm at 3:10 pm #975672shlomozalmanMember
MHY: Your exceptions prove the rule. Sorry you are unfamiliar with minhagei eretz yisrael. They are esentially minhagei Hagra, brought here by the famous “prushim” clan, and these minhagim have been accepted throughout Israel, with some exceptions.In Yerushalayim , they are accepted almost uniformly. The Tukotchinsky Luach for minhagim of the davening is a reflection of this and it is accepted by almost all. True, here and there, as your friend noted, there is a minyan that puts on tefillin. To each his own. But there are thousands of minyanim that don’t, and many of them do not hesitate to unceremoniously throw anyone out that dares put them on, even in the corner or in another room. I have seen this myself.
Rav Schach’s custom, and certainly the Erlauer Rebbe indicate that the general custom is not to put on tefillin. None of the yeshivas, including Rav Schach’s yeshiva, adopted his minhag.None of the chassidim here do either except the relatively small numbered Erlauer. That in itself proves the aberration here;everyone knows that the overwhelming minhag amongst chassidim is not to wear tefillin chol hamoed.September 28, 2010 3:53 pm at 3:53 pm #975673
Shlomo Zalman – I was replying to your initial post that contained the words that “…not to wear tefillin chol hamoed. This has become the minhag of all of Eretz Yisroel.”, which implied that absolutely no one, wore tefillin in EY, either betzinah or bifahesia. I am happy to see that you are maskim now that that is not the case, that tefillin are indeed worn in Eretz Yisroel by choshuve Yidden. Some privately and others publicly.
By the way, re Chassidim and tefillin on chol hamoed, I have seen a minyon of Chassidishe bochurim in NY at Bobov, where they wear tefillin!September 28, 2010 5:41 pm at 5:41 pm #975674
“Charlie, what is your source?”
The Shulchan Aruch.September 28, 2010 5:43 pm at 5:43 pm #975675
” But try putting on tefillin in Shaarei Chessed today and you may be shown the back door if you’re lucky. “
I know a rabbi who took his tefillin to a Sefardic synagogue in New York on Chol HaMoed and was firmly asked to leave.
I know another rabbi who took his tefillin to a shul in Jerusalem on Chol HaMoed; he said that the congregation acted like they wanted to kill him.September 28, 2010 5:45 pm at 5:45 pm #975676Ben TorahParticipant
Going against the minhug hamokem is a breach in both halacha and proper etiquette.September 28, 2010 6:22 pm at 6:22 pm #975677The chamelonMember
MHV Minahg Zans ls for Bachurim up to age 18 to put on Tefilin (w/o beracha & seperate Minyan).if I remember correctl the rational is that since young men under 18 do not work they do not have the OS of Yom Tov on Chol Hamoed.September 28, 2010 6:28 pm at 6:28 pm #975678The chamelonMember
Shlomo Zalmen wote …either except the relatively small numbered Erlauer. That in itself proves the aberration here.
Bulls eye!! The term “Erlauer Chasidim” is an oxymoron. Ealu is a contnuatio of Presburg-Minhagei H’Chsam Sofer. Hunagarian Ashkenazim are very simillar in style to ChasidimSeptember 28, 2010 11:06 pm at 11:06 pm #975679
I am not saying here that people should go into a Shul where they don’t wear tefillin on chol hamoed and put them on. That is another issue. Of course we must respect each other and minhag hamokom.
I am saying that there is no single minhag hamokom in Eretz Yisroel that makes it ossur to wear tefillin on chol hamoed, or have a minyan for people wearing tefillin then, which is what was stated or implied earlier.
Eretz Yisroel is a melting pot (or gorgeous mosaic). There is no single minhog. There are different eidos with different botei dinim and different minhogim. Do Rav Ovadia and all the Sephardim follow minhogei haperushim/minhogei HaGR”A? Of course not! Do Chassidim follow all minhogei haGR”A? No.
So obviously there are different minhogim.
The same ligabei tefillin on chol hamoed, one may wear them, and many do so, including gedolim.September 28, 2010 11:09 pm at 11:09 pm #975680chofetzchaimMember
I heard that since in Yerushalayim everyone keeps minhag haGra, therefore even a guest shouldn’t wear tefillin. When I was there I was told not to even wear them bitzina. I got the impression that this was just for Yerushalayim, not necessarily the rest of Eretz Yisrael.
This year in the US I davened at a minyan that officially wears tefillin although some of the people davening there do not and they sit mixed together with those who do. It is less of a lo sisgodidu problem to not wear them at a minyan that does then to wear them at a minyan that does not. If you daven at a minyan where most do not wear then you should preferably sit separately, I know some places where they sit in the back or the ezras nashim.September 28, 2010 11:10 pm at 11:10 pm #975681
Chol Hamoed guest: My recollection re minhag Sanz for bochurim to wear tefillin on chol hamoed is that the explanation is that it is supposed to be worn on chol hamoed, al pin niglah and regular halochoh, as it says in Shulchan Aruch, as the Rama says (note to Charlie Hall – Ashkenazim follow the Rama in Shulchan Aruch).
Chassidim don’t wear it because of the Zohar/Kabboloh.
Since bochurim are not involved with kabboloh (kabboloh being restricted to married men, people of a certain age…), they follow the straight halocho of the Shulchan Aruch/Rama, al pi nigloh, and wear them.September 29, 2010 1:29 am at 1:29 am #975682
Chofetz Chaim: “I heard that since in Yerushalayim everyone keeps minhag haGra…..”
I think that would be big news to the Sephardim, Bnei Eidos Hamizrach, Teimanim, Chassidim, to learn that they are actually noheig the same as the perushim….Have you told Chacham Ovadiah the news? As I posted above, there are at least two Charedi minyonim in Yerusholayim where tefillin is worn. The Erlauer Rebbe is a Yid a zokein, a talmid chochom, einikel of the Chasam Sofer, not just stam a Yid. I think he knows what he is doing.
“I heard that since in Yerushalayim everyone keeps minhag haGra, therefore even a guest shouldn’t wear tefillin. When I was there I was told not to even wear them bitzina. I got the impression that this was just for Yerushalayim, not necessarily the rest of Eretz Yisrael.”
Yerusholayim has different eidos withe different minhogim, as above. It is not only talmidei HaGR”A, ????? ?????? ????.
There is no single, unified minhog Yerusholayim. It is like a city with shnei botei dinin.
Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach related that he had a kabboloh, from Rav Dovid Baharan (a poseik in Yerusholayim in the old days), az oib einer vet kumen tzu eich un vet zogen ‘dos iz minhag Yerusholayim’, zolst vissen,September 29, 2010 1:54 am at 1:54 am #975683mw13Participant
leftbrooklyn: As always, all halacha li’maseh shailos should go to your LOR, not some anonymous commenter who may or may not have an idea what they’re talking about.September 29, 2010 11:16 am at 11:16 am #975684
This is a hotly contested topic in E”Y. Rav Elyashiv is quoted as saying (that does not imply that he said it) that someone who moves here should stop putting on Tefillin on Chol HaMoed.
However, Rav Tuvia Weiss, the head of the Eida Chareidis told me personally that he puts on Tefillin on Chol HaMoed privately and cannot believe that there is a Rav in the world that could tell someone whose Minhag is to put on Tefillin, to discontinue doing so. I told him that there are Rabbonim that so instruct and he said that in his opinion they have no Heter to so Pasken.
I myself have davened with the Erlauer Rav in Katamon in his Minyan of Tefillin wearers. I go there almost every 1st day of Chol HaMoed. The other days I daven with the Viener Minyan (they are a branch of the Schiff shul in New York) of Jerusalem. Their Kehillah wears Tefillin on Chol HaMoed and they have a Minyan for that purpose with the express permission of: Rav Shmuel Wosner (of Bnei Brak), Rav Nosson Gestetner (of Bnei Brak), Rav Ulman (of Bnei Brak), the Erlauer Rav (in Jerusalem), Rav Scheinberg (in Jerusalem).
Rav Binyomin Hamburger of Bnei Brak has a Minyan where they wear Tefillin on Chol HaMoed. There is also one in Beitar.
According to Rav Hamburger, anyone who is of Ashkenaz persuasion should at least put on Tefillin privately at least out of doubt, because it is a shaila of a Safek D’oraisa and according to many opinions, one who misses putting on Tefillin even one day may get the title of a Karkafta D’lo Manach Tefillin.
Anyone who is interested in joining such a Minyan in the future or is interested in organizing such a Minyan in his area is asked to write to <[email protected]>.
The Pupa Rav zt”l (a well-recognized Rav in Jerusalem at the time of Rav Yosef Chaim Sonnenfeld) has a Minyan of Tefillin wearers on Chol HaMoed.
Rav Gedaliah Eisemann (Mashgiach of Yeshivas Kol Torah) always put on Tefillin in the Ezras Nashim of the Yeshiva.
Rav Nosson Tzvi Finkel of the Mirrer Yeshiva instructs those bachurim with the Minhag to wear Tefillin on Chol HaMoed, to do so in the Ezras Nashim of the Yeshiva.
Rav Scheinberg goes on record to say that there is no such thing as Minhag E”Y or Minhag Yerushalayim today because it is today one huge “melting pot”.
In Toronto, Rav Shlomo Miller does not allow a non-Tefillin Minyan in his Kollel building.
The uncle of the Beis Yosef writes in a Tshuiva that in Spain, before the popularization of Kabbalah, the custom was to wear Tefillin on Chol HaMoed because they followed the Rosh in everything.
Therefore, no Ashkenazi should follow the cue of the Sefaradim, just as the Rosh did not, saying that his customs were more well-rooted that those of the Sefaradim, because his Torah was heritage from the Chachmei Ashkenaz and Tzorfas since the time of the destruction of the Beis HaMikdosh and that they had an uninterrupted established Yeshivos since then, a claim the Sefaradim could never replicate.
Have a Godd Yom Tov
SRSeptember 30, 2010 10:46 pm at 10:46 pm #975685
It is evident from the Third Perek of Pesachim and from the Chochmas Adam 92 that minhag hamakom has precedence over minhag avos, that is also why 1 or 2 days YT depends on where you currently live. While it is true that Minhag Yerushalaim is exaggerated, in this case there is a confluence of the Sefardim, Chassidim and the Litvaks who were talmidim of the Gra and there IS a near unanimous minhag not to wear tefilin Chol HaMoed. Therefore one who is a permanent resident of Yerushalaim MUST follow minhag hamakom and stop wearing tefillin.
Please bring a source for this teshuva from the “uncle of the Beis Yosef” because the way you quote it has numerous inaccuracies.October 1, 2010 6:19 am at 6:19 am #975686
Rav Gedaliah Eisemann (Mashgiach of Yeshivas Kol Torah) is the exception that proves the rule. Kol Torah was founded by and for Yekkes, and only one individual in the entire yeshiva wears tefillin.
Rav Finkle tell the BACHURIM to wear in the Ezras Nashim. They are ???? ????? and keep 2 days.October 1, 2010 8:40 am at 8:40 am #975687
The Minhagim of Eretz Yisroel are not of Minhagei HaGra.
First of all, there are dozens of Kehillos in Eretz Yisroel and they are all different from each other.
Secondly, Rav Scheinberg holds that there is no such thing as Minhag Eretz Yisroel, because of the first of all, because Eretz Yisroel is a big “melting pot” where every Rav and Rebbe that comes here does whatever he wants.
Thirdly, what people think is Minhag HaGra is more often a set of customs that the Talmidei HaGra established when they arrived in Yerusalayim. It was not totally Minhagei HaGra, but rather a hodgepodge of customs cooked up as a compromise between them and the Sefaradim. From the beginning of their settlement here, for at least 60 years, Ashkenazim could not have their own Kehilla or shul, due to the aftermath of the ill-conceived Messianic craze led by Rabbi Yehudah Chassid and Chaim Malach.
Fourth, people only follow Minhag HaGra (and Minhag Arizal too, for that matter) here when it is convenient. For example, I see a lot of Litvishe saying Tashlich for a long time. They don’t follow Minhag HaGra in that. Most people make two Brachos on their Tefillin, not like the Gra. Just go through Maasei Rav and you will see just how many Minhagei HaGra are not practised.
And lastly, there are more Sefaradim and Chassidim here than anyone else, so who established that Minhag HaGra is the rule?October 1, 2010 8:47 am at 8:47 am #975688
Rav Schach said (it is quoted in the Introduction to Shorshei Minhag Ashkenaz, vol. 1) that in Vilna, on Chol HaMoed, everyone put Tefillin on with a Bracha, except in the Gaon’s Kloiz. Also, in the time of the Vilna Gaon, he was the only one to run a Minyan that did not put on Tefillin, despite the local custom.
If the Gra could flaunt the local custom with a separate Minyan, this shows that running a separate Minyan, is not in violation of Lo Sisgodedu and is permitted. Thus, one can run a Minyan for Tefillin wearers in Israel without reservation. And don’t say that the Gra was an extremely holy man and thus he is permitted things that we are not, because that is a Christian concept and has nothing to do with Judaism.October 2, 2010 5:14 pm at 5:14 pm #975689
HaRav Moshe Feinstein zatzal writes in Igros Moshe OC 4:105.5 exactly as I have been saying. That one who intends to remain in EY and keeps 1 day YT should NOT wear tefillin Chol HaMoed, and he proves that we follow minhag hamakom even to be lenient on a d’Oraisa. I am surprised that the Gaavad didn’t acknowledge this teshuva.October 3, 2010 6:02 pm at 6:02 pm #975690
If you really hold there is NO minhag hamakom in EY and only minhag avos, then you get into a big problem. When Beis Din determined Rosh Chodesh based on eidim, chutz l’aretz kept 2 days YT as a safek. ~1500 Hillel HaKatan authored our calendar and since then 2 days YT in CLA is a minhag, in EY the minhag is to keep one day and in CLA 2. If one moves from CLA to EY with intention to remain we say his new minhag hamakom trumps 2000 years of minhag avos and one starts keeping only 1 day. If there is NO minhag hamakom today, as some here have maintained, then all Ashkenazim and most Sefardim who came to EY from other countries should maintain their minhag avos and keep 2 days YT.
Now that we have proven that there IS minhag hamakom in EY even today, it only remains to debate if the few individuals who wear tefilin prevent the 99.9% who do not from obtaining the status of minhag hamakom.October 3, 2010 9:30 pm at 9:30 pm #975691yosrMember
I can tell you that there are numerous people in Israel (my self may be included) who put Tefillin in secrecy. I was in my apartment in my room this chol hamoed and I did not realize anyone was home, my roommate peaked in and his draw dropped to the floor.October 3, 2010 10:35 pm at 10:35 pm #975692
“HaRav Moshe Feinstein zatzal writes in Igros Moshe OC 4:105.5 exactly as I have been saying. That one who intends to remain in EY and keeps 1 day YT should NOT wear tefillin Chol HaMoed”
That is a distortion of what Rav Moshe z”l says there. While part of what you wrote is correct, you left out a very important part of the teshuvoh. If you proceed a bit further there, you will see that it says explicitly that one MAY put on tefillin on chol hamoed in Eretz Yisroel now since many moved there from Europe in recent times, some of whom do so.October 3, 2010 10:43 pm at 10:43 pm #975693
hello99 : “If there is NO minhag hamakom today, as some here have maintained, then all Ashkenazim and most Sefardim who came to EY from other countries should maintain their minhag avos and keep 2 days YT.”
Good question there, but I think there is a difference.
Ligabei yom tov sheini, everyone who learns the Torah shebiksav and understands it, knows that the ikkar is that there is only one day yom tov. In chutz laaretz there was a gezeira to keep two days and it is continued to this day. But it’s not like there is a machlokes bichlal if yom tov is two days or one. In Eretz Yisroel, however, there is no such gezeira.
Ma she’ein kein by tefillin on chol hamoed, there are two different shitos bichlal and the shitos are not tolui in geography, whether it is Eretz Yisroel or chutz laaretz.October 3, 2010 11:08 pm at 11:08 pm #975694
MHY: reread the Igros Moshe, because you are the one distorting his words. In the continuation of the teshuva what he REALLY writes is that “perhaps” now that many have moved to EY from Europe it is now common for many to wear tefillin CHM in which case it would be muttar. However anyone who has ever been in EY for YT can tell you that despite the waves of immigration the past 60 years, it is still unheard of to see one wearing tefillin in shul CHM.October 3, 2010 11:09 pm at 11:09 pm #975695
MHY: Reb Moshe did not hold of your chiluk. He writes that the minhag of which shita to follow goes by minhag hamakom.October 3, 2010 11:40 pm at 11:40 pm #975696
hello99: “MHY: reread the Igros Moshe, because you are the one distorting his words. In the continuation of the teshuva what he REALLY writes is that “perhaps” now that many have moved to EY from Europe it is now common for many to wear tefillin CHM in which case it would be muttar. However anyone who has ever been in EY for YT can tell you that despite the waves of immigration the past 60 years, it is still unheard of to see one wearing tefillin in shul CHM.”
Rav Moshe says that one is allowed to put on tefillin on chol hamoed in Eretz Yisroel. The word efsher in the teshuvoh is not connected to where he allows it, it appears only later on. Whoever is interested should look in the teshuvoh inside to see the exact lashon, ??? ???? ??????.
Also, you are mixing two issues, one is wearing tefillin on chol hamoed in Eretz Yisroel bichlal and one is wearing them in Shul. Those two things are not exactly the same.October 4, 2010 12:03 am at 12:03 am #975697
Shu”t Beis Yosef, published in Jerusalem 5720, T’shuvos Rav Yitzchak Karo, siman 1.October 4, 2010 12:07 am at 12:07 am #975698
I think you need to read the Tsuva from R’ Moshe in OC 4:105.5 more carefully. He tells the questioner that he is permitted to desist from putting on Tefillin and is also permitted to continue doing so.October 4, 2010 12:13 am at 12:13 am #975699
It is not unheard of to have Tefillin worn in shul on Chol HaMoed. There are already three complete Kehillos that do so. One in Bnei Brak, Beitar and Jerusalem. And there is an additional Kehilla that has two minyonim, one with and one without, and the Rav davens with the one that does put on Tefillin. That Kehilla is the Erlauer Kehilla. The Erlauer Rav is a recognized Talmid Chacham and is a member of the Moetzes Gedolai HaTorah. He is a direct descendant of the Chasam Sofer and follows all of his minhagim.October 4, 2010 12:21 am at 12:21 am #975700
The Gaavad of Jerusalem was asked by someone if he may make a Minyan of Tefillin wearers on Chol HaMoed.
The Gaavad suggested not doing so but rather putting them on privately.
Thereupon the questioner asked if it was Osur to do so.
The Gaavad answered that he would not say that it is Osur, just that he recommends otherwise.
But as I pointed out before, that three big poskim of Bnei Brak have ruled that one may put on Tefillin on Chol Hamoed with a mniyan and so Rav Scheinberg rules as well.October 4, 2010 8:28 am at 8:28 am #975701
MHY: You are the one mixing issues. I have clearly stated that wearing tefillin IN PUBLIC is assur and in private is permitted but not required, as Reb Moshe writes. And yes “it is it is still unheard of to see one wearing tefillin IN SHUL on CHM”. Now do you understand that Igros Moshe permitts tefillin privately even if no one wears them but forbids them publicly except “efshar” if MANY communities began wearing them, which is clearly not the case.October 4, 2010 8:31 am at 8:31 am #975702
Rainus: “R’ Moshe in OC 4:105.5 tells the questioner that he is permitted to desist from putting on Tefillin and is also permitted to continue doing so”
Yes, but ONLY IN PRIVATEOctober 4, 2010 8:50 am at 8:50 am #975703
It is true that the Yekke minyan in Beitar wears tefillin CHM, however one of the organizers told me that the Yekke minyan in Ramot, Yerushalayim does NOT because R’ Elyasiv told them it is assur. Also, the Yekke minyan in Kiryat Safer does not, based on a psak from R’ Ulman, a talmid of R’ Vozner. The minyan in Beitar is only ~15 men and would be difficult to classify as “following minhag avos”, since the majority of them are Baalei Teshuva or Geirim.
As CHM guest pointed out while true minhag Erloi is to follow minhagei Ashkenaz of the Chasam Sofer, today most of Erloi have become “Chassidim”. For example, minhag Erloi is to daven nussach Ashkenaz, but a neighbor of mine who is a chassid of Erloi told me that the only people in the shul with Ashkenaz siddurim are the chazzan and the Rebbe. I doubt if the cassiim wear tefillin CHM. So I will bl”n ask my neighbor, but I imagine only a VERY small number of people in Erloi actually are wearing tefillin.October 4, 2010 7:23 pm at 7:23 pm #975704
There are different shitos obviously, but, as Reinus, posted, gedolim of this dor have given their approval for tefillin to be worn in Eretz Yisroel with a minyan, so they can be followed.
Additionally, Rav Moshe z”l was not a resident of Eretz Yisroel and maybe he did not know the Matzav there so well. Also, things have changed since Rav Moshe was niftar, which was a long time ago, app. twenty five years already.October 4, 2010 7:28 pm at 7:28 pm #975705
Why don’t you go speak to the Erlau’er Rebbe about your concerns?
There are also other minyonim that wear tefillin in Yerusholayim and Bnei Brak and perhaps elsewhere as well.October 4, 2010 10:54 pm at 10:54 pm #975706
MHY: please list the “other minyonim that wear tefillin in Yerusholayim and Bnei Brak and perhaps elsewhere as well”
I question which Gedolim TRULY gave permission for tefillin in public. R’ Scheinberg and R’ Finkle were talking about bochurim who keep 2 days YT, R’ Vozner and R’ Ulman forbade the Yekke minyan in KS from wearing tefillin. The Gaavad only permitted in private as did R’ Eisemann.
So who are we left with? Only the Gaavad Erloi. So if you are a member of his community you should certainly follow your Rav, though it seems even the vast majority of his own community does not. If you are not Erloi there does not seem to be any grounds to wear tefillin in public.October 4, 2010 11:03 pm at 11:03 pm #975707
Rainus: “Shu”t Beis Yosef, published in Jerusalem 5720, T’shuvos Rav Yitzchak Karo, siman 1”
Beis Yosef is teshuvos from R’ YOSEF Karo and siman 1 of the volume you mention is 7 pages discussing the minhag of sending sivlonos to a kalla. The entire volume seems to only be on Even HaEzer.October 4, 2010 11:06 pm at 11:06 pm #975708
MHY: before being motzi laaz on R’ Moshe that he would pasken a sheila without knowing the metzius, please read the teshuva. He writes, as I have quoted previously, that only if MANY people in EY wear tefilin it would be permitted. That is still not the case today.October 5, 2010 12:02 am at 12:02 am #975709
hello99 : Much, if not all of the info you seek is in the thread above if you read through it.
If you think the gedolim (in addition to the Erlauer Rav) that paskened that it is okay to have a tefillin wearing minyan on chol hamoed in Eretz Yisroel made a mistake, and you know better, why don’t you go and discuss it with them?October 5, 2010 12:08 am at 12:08 am #975710
hello99: “before being motzi laaz on R’ Moshe that he would pasken a sheila without knowing the metzius, please read the teshuva. He writes, as I have quoted previously, that only if MANY people in EY wear tefilin it would be permitted. That is still not the case today.”
Hello Mr. hello99 –
You are not accurately reporting what Rav Moshe wrote. Rav Moshe said clearly that one may wear tefillin on chol hamoed in Eretz Yisroel, and didn’t have a big IF before those words. Whoever wants to know the emes should see the teshuvoh inside.October 5, 2010 4:51 am at 4:51 am #975711
MHY: “You are not accurately reporting what Rav Moshe wrote. Rav Moshe said clearly that one may wear tefillin on chol hamoed in Eretz Yisroel, and didn’t have a big IF before those words”
IN PRIVATE! We are discussing in public
I never said nor implied the Gedolim made a “mistake”, I am challenging Rainus’ implication the the names he mentioned approve of wearing tefilin at a public minyan CHM. Most of the names mentioned only permitted individuals in private or for visiting guests from Chutz l’Aretz.
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