July 28, 2013 6:17 pm at 6:17 pm #610185BilboParticipant
This is a question that I’ve wondered about for some time. I still can’t quite put my finger on whether or not there is any substance to the question. Should Americans (let’s go with Jewish Americans) feel allowance to postulate all over the web in regards to Israeli politics? Should they be free to condemn the politicians?July 28, 2013 6:40 pm at 6:40 pm #968546jewishfeminist02Member
Why not?July 28, 2013 7:03 pm at 7:03 pm #968547charliehallParticipant
“Should Americans (let’s go with Jewish Americans) feel allowance to postulate all over the web in regards to Israeli politics? “
If American Jews feel that strongly about things, they should make aliyah and get involved in politics in Israel. And American Jews especially should never second-guess Israeli officials on security matters. They are there; we are not. They have to live with the consequences of any decision; we do not.July 28, 2013 7:44 pm at 7:44 pm #968548ubiquitinParticipant
Of course people can and SHOULD speak up when they oppose a foreign governement’s decision or policy. This is true of any country and any policy.
Charlie, “If American Jews feel that strongly about things, they should make aliyah and get involved in politics in Israel” Did you feel the same way in 2001 when several hundred thousand americans showed support for Israel? Why the double standardJuly 28, 2013 7:45 pm at 7:45 pm #968549akupermaParticipant
Americans (not just Jews) meddle in many other countries politics, and the rest of the world meddles in American politics. It probably has to do with the fact that Americans come from countries all over the world.
In all fairness, the future of American Jews is very closely tied to Israel, and vice versa. Without US support, Israel would have been wiped out in all its wars (i.e. American objections kept the Brits for delivering Palestine to the Arabs, and kept the Soviets from marching in on behalf of their Arab allies). Even today, American neutrality would probably cripple Israel. What happens in Israel, the growing crisis between the hareidim and the dati leumi, and to a lesser extent, the gap between religious and secular, have a major impact on the American Jewish community. One should note that a high percentage of Israeli citizens live in the United States, and American Jews are an significant community in Israel (especially if you including returned yordim such as Netanyahu).July 29, 2013 1:25 am at 1:25 am #968550charliehallParticipant
“Did you feel the same way in 2001 when several hundred thousand americans showed support for Israel?”
That is a completely different situation. There was no intent, desire, or effect to second-guess the government of Israel on security matters. Today we have Jews from America pressuring Israel from the Left and the Right. If you feel that strongly, make aliyah and give up your US passport.July 29, 2013 2:43 am at 2:43 am #968551ubiquitinParticipant
charlie so support is ok but not critiscm? I think that is a double standard.
Does this rule apply to all countries or just Israel? Was it ok to protest the former USSR’s refusal to allow Jewish Emigration or if I felt strongly should I have emigrated to teh Soviet Union and gotten involved in politics there?July 30, 2013 7:57 pm at 7:57 pm #968552nfgo3Member
If Hashem did not want American Jews to blab their opinions about Israeli security and political issues, why did He give us words like “yenta” and “kibbitzer”?July 30, 2013 8:42 pm at 8:42 pm #968553rationalfrummieMember
he gave us those words, and those annoying people. He also gave us marijuana- that doesn’t mean you need to do it.July 30, 2013 9:19 pm at 9:19 pm #968554SpiderJerusalemParticipant
It’s mostly the American left that gets passionate in their anti- Israel rhetoric; Fourth-wave antisemitism (Hating the Jew Nation, rather than the individual Jew) is a staple of the left wing world. Even orthodox Jews that walk around in kipot and call themselves rabbi are required to criticize Israel as a token gesture of their commitment to the liberal hive mind. Half of them aren’t even aware of what they’re doing. All will support whomever the most dovish, left wing MK happens to be at the time.
Personally, I don’t criticize Israeli politicians or take sides in whatever battles are taking place because the subtle nuances are lost upon Americans such as myself. Akuperma has no idea what he’s talking about. This site will publish any drivel that guy comes up with. There is functionally no difference between Democrat and Republican. It’s a hegelian dialectic designed to create synergy between two opposing forces so that any and all talking points are framed and nothing real ever gets accomplished on the ground… just a slow roll toward totalitarianism.July 31, 2013 3:57 am at 3:57 am #968555takahmamashParticipant
Charlie Hall happens to be right, except about giving up the U.S. passport.July 31, 2013 4:12 am at 4:12 am #968556dovranMember
takah, are you holding on to that in case you need an escape hatch?July 31, 2013 6:03 am at 6:03 am #968557takahmamashParticipant
takah, are you holding on to that in case you need an escape hatch?
No, I am holding it because I have an elderly mother in America with health issues, and if I need to go, I won’t have time to make an appointment with the American embassy and wait to get a visa on my Israeli passport.
My late father was ill, and I ended up going back and forth 3 times while he was ill and once for the levaya. I was quite thankful that I had my U.S. passport so I didn’t have to deal with visas, and (of course) I was able to go through the faster citizen’s line at the airport in Newark.
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