May 3, 2023 4:17 pm at 4:17 pm #2186815eli levParticipant
“Who was in Israel first?
The Palestinians were in Israel first, then it was flooded with European Jews from the Holocaust.”May 3, 2023 5:01 pm at 5:01 pm #2186836yeshivaguy45Participant
I’m not exactly sure why google only took the first part of the article, but if you look at the source that google has you’ll see that the article is disproving that statement.May 3, 2023 6:06 pm at 6:06 pm #2186853Always_Ask_QuestionsParticipant
this is often a result of google-bombing: a group of people jointly click on their favorite answer and it rises to the top. Looks like there are more anti-semites than philo-semites in the world, or at least they are more active.May 4, 2023 11:05 am at 11:05 am #2187046akupermaParticipant
The fact is the Palestinians have been the majority group in Eretz Yisrael for over a millenia, long before the arrival of the Zionists (who are persons with Jewish ancestry but who have rejected Torah and Mitsvos). Humash makes it very clear that Ha-Shem’s grant of Eretz Yisrael to the Yidden was based on the Yidden accepting Torah, whereas the Zionists have the policy of “We won’t listen, and we don’t do”. Jews who reject Torah, can not logically avoid the fact they are rejecting the idea of a divine right of Jews to Eretz Yisrael.
One should note that the zionists who took control of the Yishuv after World War I, and went on to drive out the British and take control of the country, were in fact secular Europeans who as a matter of “faith” reject the idea the Ha-Shem has any say in what happens in Eretz Yisrael. The Yidden in Eretz Yisrael would be able to make a much stronger argument against the Palestinians if they evicted the Zionists and sent them back to Europe (or America), and then claim rights to Eretz Yisrael based on Torah, backed up by a state in which the Jews were all Bnei Torah (and a state known for its piety and Torah learning, rather than one known for its military prowess, tech startups and the many things we can’t discuss on YWN but for which Tel Aviv is world-famous). Of course that would deprive the Medinah of the ability to rule over the Palestinians, since a community of Bnei Torah would lack the economic and military means of exercising political control.
Except for a bunch of fanatical Hareidim, most persons of Jewish descent (including most who still keep Torah) support the idea that zionism and being Jewish are interchangeable, so one can hardly blame Wikipedia for confusing the terms. And in truth, the zionists who displaced the Palestinians, were and still are almost all secular Europeans so the statement isn’t all wrong other than confusing “zionism” with “Judaism”.May 4, 2023 1:44 pm at 1:44 pm #2187143Always_Ask_QuestionsParticipant
By now, and even then, ideological zionists you described are a part of Jews in EY. By now, they are similar to Jewish communities in any other country…
Also, we often blame divergent Jewish groups for everything wrong, but where did early secular, reform, etc came from? They are not some erev rav, they mostly came from same communities… granted behira and external pressures but what our communities were doing in part are responsible. Not just my opinion. Chofetz Chaim refused to greet rav from a town where Trotsky grew up. Berel Wein traces zionist attitude towards datiim to the history of Russian government forcing Kahal to provide soldiers into the army, leading to alienation between the poor and the community.May 5, 2023 2:04 pm at 2:04 pm #2187519ChatGPTParticipant
The land of Israel has a complex and multi-layered history that dates back thousands of years. According to archaeological evidence, various groups of people have inhabited the area that is now Israel for thousands of years.
In ancient times, the land of Israel was inhabited by many different peoples, including the Canaanites, Israelites, Philistines, Phoenicians, and others. The Israelites, who are considered the ancestors of the Jewish people, settled in the land of Israel around 1200 BCE.
Over the centuries, various empires and powers have conquered and ruled over the land of Israel, including the Assyrians, Babylonians, Persians, Greeks, Romans, Byzantines, Arabs, Crusaders, Ottomans, and British.
Today, Israel is a sovereign state recognized by the United Nations and many other countries around the world. The Israeli-Palestinian conflict, however, continues to be a complex and contentious issue that involves competing claims to the land by Israelis and Palestinians.
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