July 29, 2011 2:58 am at 2:58 am #598293splendaMember
What does ????? ???? mean? Where does it say we should be Tikkun HaOlam? What is the practical meaning of it?July 29, 2011 4:01 am at 4:01 am #792389shlishiMember
Tikun Haolam is what the Reform use to excuse every time they r”l repeal a portion of the Torah that no longer fits into contemporary Western values.July 29, 2011 4:50 am at 4:50 am #792390charliehallParticipant
It is in the Mishnah in Gittin chapter 4. It refers to something far more radical than anything the Reform movement would propose today.July 29, 2011 5:25 am at 5:25 am #792391quark2Member
You are mistaken. It doesn’t say that “we should be tikkun haolam.” Its only a reason for several Takanos derabanan. They used this reason where they saw fit. We do not learn things from the reason of takanos, only the takanah itself applies to us.July 29, 2011 1:13 pm at 1:13 pm #792392CheinMember
Which takanos from the rabbonim are based on tikun haolam?July 29, 2011 3:58 pm at 3:58 pm #792393MiddlePathParticipant
While it is true that Tikun Olam is an idea that the Rabbis used to institute several decrees where they saw fit, I think we can learn something from it. We can learn that it is important for us to make sure that whatever we do to follow our G-d and the Torah, we cannot use it as an excuse to degrade anything else in the world.July 29, 2011 4:16 pm at 4:16 pm #792394gavra_at_workParticipant
If one steals, they can pay back value if the item was used (Marish). That is due to Tikun Olam.July 29, 2011 4:30 pm at 4:30 pm #792395ItcheSrulikMember
There are several others, such as allowing a woman to remarry based on a single witness.July 29, 2011 4:33 pm at 4:33 pm #792396IUseBrainsParticipant
There is nothing radical in the holy words of chazal.
Anyone who fiddles with chazal is radical.July 29, 2011 5:00 pm at 5:00 pm #792397nishtdayngesheftParticipant
Tikun olam as referred to in maseches gittin has nothing at all to do with the krumkeiten of the reform. And much more to do with what it says in Alenu and preserving yidden. Not preserving manatees, nor tearing down jewish companies. Nothing of the sort that the reform and others who want nothing to do with the Torah would describe as “Tikun Olam”.
In fact the items included in the mishna is in direct opposition of how the Reforma and their ilk define tikun olom.July 29, 2011 5:02 pm at 5:02 pm #792398midwesternerParticipant
Marish is takanas hashavim, not necessarily tikkun olam. Tikun olam is used primarily in terms of Pruzbul and one or two other simiar inyanim.July 29, 2011 5:24 pm at 5:24 pm #792399gavra_at_workParticipant
Marish is takanas hashavim, not necessarily tikkun olam.
You are correct (BK 94-95). Thank you.July 29, 2011 5:24 pm at 5:24 pm #792400mosheemes2Member
Many members of Chazal (and at times, literally all of them) were involved in open rebellion against their governments. For the last 600 or so years Jewish teachings have been used by non-Jews to justify the idea that people have rights separate from the government. In what sense is Chazal not radical?July 29, 2011 6:02 pm at 6:02 pm #792401midwesternerParticipant
And the Tikkun Olam in Pruzbul was not to save lenders. It was to make funds available for borrowers in pre-shemita years. If lenders can’t collect, they won’t lend in the first place.July 29, 2011 6:43 pm at 6:43 pm #792402ItcheSrulikMember
Who says that (Rabbi?) Dr. Hall was saying anything about reform?July 29, 2011 7:42 pm at 7:42 pm #792403charliehallParticipant
“There is nothing radical in the holy words of chazal.”
To the contrary, there is EVERYTHING radical in the holy words of Chazal compared to almost every society in the world. Communal authorities were obligated to provide education, food, and health care for those who cannot afford it, and also to maintain public works. Women and slaves are to be treated as humans, not as chattel. A system of government is set up that is not biased towards the wealthy and powerful. And the rabbis themselves can make changes in the rules — the “Tikun HaOlam” in Gittin — when the rules are creating injustice. Some of this is directly from the Torah, but some are rabbinic decrees such as the mandate for schools from the time of Ben Gamla.
“Anyone who fiddles with chazal is radical.”
I was not fiddling, chas v’shalom.
“Tikun olam as referred to in maseches gittin has nothing at all to do with the krumkeiten of the reform.”
I didn’t say that it did! The Reform movement fails to appreciate the beauty and power of the Torah She Bal Peh and one of the best manifestations of these are those examples in Gittin.
“Who says that (Rabbi?) Dr. Hall was saying anything about reform?”
For the record, I am not a rabbi, but I did earn a Ph.D. The OP didn’t mention Reform. With their misuse of the term, we can forget that it was Chazal who first referred to “Tikun HaOlam”.July 29, 2011 11:29 pm at 11:29 pm #792404CheinMember
How do the reform/conservatives abuse the concept of tikun haolam? What are they claiming it as?July 31, 2011 3:31 am at 3:31 am #792406YW BandMember
I just heard a Pierkei Avos shiur on Shabbos. The speaker said it means changing your immediate surroundings by making sure you conduct yourself properly (practice what you preach). If people see you conduct in the Torahdige manner, they will flock to you like a magnet!July 31, 2011 4:57 am at 4:57 am #792407mw13Participant
I don’t think there’s anything wrong with saying that Chazal’s positions were “radical” compared to those of the society they were in.
However, I think IUB was just saying that calling Chazal “radical” in an insulting sense is wrong.July 31, 2011 2:58 pm at 2:58 pm #792408shlishiMember
Rav Elyashev shlita somehow tied in “tikun ha’olam” to allow reporting abuse when there is “raglayim la’davar”. Does anyone know how tikun ha’olam figures into this teshuva? (That also might go a long way in explaining what tikun ha’olam means.)August 1, 2011 4:45 am at 4:45 am #792409HachamMember
What did that teshuva say about tikun haolam?
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