July 29, 2013 8:53 pm at 8:53 pm #610199pixelateMember
What is the issur for lying, and is it permitted to lie to save your reputation, or if the question is none of their business in the first place?July 29, 2013 9:09 pm at 9:09 pm #968493
See Kesubos 17a and the Rishonim there as well as the Rishonim on Bava Metzia 61a (give or take).July 29, 2013 9:36 pm at 9:36 pm #968494
You can lie for sholom. Like if the truth will make someone mad at you. Like if your wife wants to know why you are late for dinner and you were at the pub so you say you were at work.July 29, 2013 9:49 pm at 9:49 pm #968495
Also see Bava Metzia 23a.July 29, 2013 10:17 pm at 10:17 pm #968497
Also see Bava Metzia 23a.
Also see sanhedrin 75c which I have convinced my wife says that it is a mitzva to eat meat and drink beer every night of the week.July 29, 2013 10:48 pm at 10:48 pm #968498
PBA: That is not what it means when it says you’re allowed to lie in learning. See the Yam Shel Shlomo Bava Kama 4:9.July 29, 2013 11:19 pm at 11:19 pm #968499
I’m not using that heter. I’m using the mipnei sholom heter. Otherwise she’ll be mad at me for drinking so much beer.July 30, 2013 12:33 am at 12:33 am #968501HaLeiViParticipant
You can lie to spare embarrassment.
The Pasuk in the Torah is talking about Eidus. When the Gemara talks about not meaning a promise you are making to someone we Darshen Hin Tzedek, that your yes should mean yes and no should really mean no.
Simple conversational lying is a bad Mida, and is included in the Pasuk in a general sense. On this the Gemara says that Kat Shakranim are not Mekabel Pnei Hashechina.
When a nosy person is intrusively asking you something personal, you do not have to answer. It is best to avoid or skirt the issue if possible, or try to give misleading or hollow answers. When left with no choice, having said something that isn’t true, when the person doesn’t deserve the truth, does not place you in the Kat Shakranim.July 30, 2013 12:54 am at 12:54 am #968502
Popa: My Makor still applies. Look it up.July 30, 2013 1:01 am at 1:01 am #968503
I won’t. Unless you link to hebrewbooksJuly 30, 2013 6:24 am at 6:24 am #968504jewishfeminist02Member
There are definitely situations in which it is permitted to lie (see Kesubos 16 for the Hillel/Shammai machlokes on keitzad merakdim). However, I am not certain whether or not a heter exists for the situations you mentioned.
Credit to my husband.July 30, 2013 9:08 am at 9:08 am #968505Shopping613 🌠Participant
YI dont lie, i just convince the other person that i didnt do it.July 30, 2013 12:02 pm at 12:02 pm #968506supermeMember
The only time that I heard that you can lie is for shalom bayis!!
(plus to save your life- its not one of the 3 things you should die..)
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.