August 31, 2011 3:16 am at 3:16 am #599026
SO the whole shidduch system is totally messed up!!there could be somone who’s an amazing girl and really wants a great boy who’s a serious learner. One problem. her family isnt wealthy!and ALL the learning boys r looking for money!so who is she supposed to marry???August 31, 2011 3:21 am at 3:21 am #804260am yisrael chaiParticipant
Hashem is the Master Shadchan & He will find a way.
Emuna and bitachon.
Easier said than done.August 31, 2011 3:22 am at 3:22 am #804261golden momMember
well not necesserly true if she has a good job and is willing to work even after iy”h having a family and willing to tough it out…some boys are maskim also i feel that it also depends (dont shoot me) if ur livish or chasidishAugust 31, 2011 3:23 am at 3:23 am #804262collegegradMember
Tell the girl to go to school so she can support her learning husband.August 31, 2011 3:25 am at 3:25 am #804263
It is a very hard situation.
At the same time, in Europe very few people could afford to learn. Now, many more can so it seems more common. But at the end of the day, if you can’t afford it- you just can’t afford it.
There is no reason to feel bad about that.August 31, 2011 3:29 am at 3:29 am #804264
SO you’re trying to say that if you cant afford it you cant marry a learning boy??so the girls should give up on their dreams and marry a working boy?like i said the system is messed up!August 31, 2011 3:34 am at 3:34 am #804265Sam2Participant
There is the oft-forgotten Gemara on Chagigah 6b where two of the things that Hashem cries for are “one who can learn but doesn’t” and “one who can’t learn but does”. If you just can’t afford it, then maybe you’re not supposed to be learning full time.August 31, 2011 3:37 am at 3:37 am #804266CheinMember
Boys have the same exact problem. If they want to learn full-time but can’t afford to.August 31, 2011 3:37 am at 3:37 am #804267
Why is that messed up?
The point of life is to serve Hashem. Hashem provides us with the tools we need to serve Him. If Hashem placed you in a certain situation, He just wants you to do the best under those circumstances. If that means marrying a working guy, then that is how you will serve Hashem.
I don’t see anything messed up.August 31, 2011 3:41 am at 3:41 am #804268
It’s not that you can’t afford it. just you cant give full support, nice apartment, car, vacations..I think the boys have too much demands!what happened to living the real kollel life?now all boys want $ and gashmiyus..anyone else agree?August 31, 2011 3:44 am at 3:44 am #804269
Chein, why do boys have this problem?the girls are the one who are expected to support.
Popa, Its a totally different life, marring someone working or learningAugust 31, 2011 3:53 am at 3:53 am #804271
Popa, Its a totally different life, marring someone working or learning
Sure is. It is also totally different being a doctor or a farmer. But you can be an ???? ? in any one of them.
This is not controversial; everyone agrees to this. Even the biggest learning people agree that if you can’t live you should work.
If you can’t find a learning boy to marry, then you should marry someone else. Nobody disagrees with this.
The focus here is “what does Hashem want”. That is the only thing that matters in the world.August 31, 2011 3:54 am at 3:54 am #804272MiddlePathParticipant
Sometimes, it is better to be realistic, and save yourself from the possibility of constant stress and worry, than to rely on dreams, and realize too late that you are miserable.August 31, 2011 3:55 am at 3:55 am #804273msseekerMember
Your system is messed up because you date like prostakkes while you learn like Bnai Torah.August 31, 2011 2:22 pm at 2:22 pm #804275babygooseParticipant
that’s what always makes me wonder why those are the ones considered good boys!!!!
if they’re learning but their prioreties are mixed up, then what’s going on?
i understand that one needs money to live life, but isn’t it supposed to be “pas bmelach tochal, umayim bamsura tishte, val hooretz tishan vchayey tzaar tichye?”
i understand that’s not the most pleasent way to live, but what don’t we do for torah????????
so if these guys NEED the money so badly, what’s wrong with them?August 31, 2011 3:00 pm at 3:00 pm #804276mytakeMember
Chassidim don’t have this problem because no chassidishe boy would demand support from a father-in-law who doesn’t have the money. It’s simply unheard of. There’s no concept of “I can only marry a girl who can offer x years of support…”
Either his father can support them, or her father can, or both sides can split the couple’s expenses, or the girl can support them (and they’ll live on a veeeery tight budget), or the guy will just have to work part/full time and learn early morning and late afternoon/nights. But I’ve never heard of a chassidishe shidduch where monetary support was a dealbreaker.August 31, 2011 3:46 pm at 3:46 pm #804277
I didn’t read all the posts so I apologize if I’m repeating anyone’s.
I don’t think that ALL full time learners are looking for rich girls – think about it – a rich girl will be used to luxuries and it will be much harder for her to give them up when her rich father can no longer support her and her family. It may even cause shalom bayit problems down the road when she MUST have a new diamond necklace for every birthday, anniversary and holiday and he simply can’t afford it. (and a diamond necklace is only one luxury, think about her wardrobe, car etc)August 31, 2011 3:47 pm at 3:47 pm #804278
babygoose, thats exactly my point!
popa, of course you could still be and oved Hashem!and I’m not saying working boys are 2nd class at all!just if someone wants to live that kind of life of learning why should she not be able to because of the messed up priorities of our society??August 31, 2011 4:37 pm at 4:37 pm #804279TomcheMember
I am a poor boy and I want to marry a rich girl. Why is society and the shidduch system so messed up that all the rich girls refuse to date or marry poor boys?!?August 31, 2011 4:47 pm at 4:47 pm #804280EphraimParticipant
My Wife says that everyone should stop with the Norishkeit! Even Moshe Rabeinu was a sheperd and still the RBS”O chose him to be Mekabel the Torah. Also, raising our children to take responsibility for their families will help eliminate much of the stress and Shalom Bayis issues.August 31, 2011 5:10 pm at 5:10 pm #804281brooklynnyParticipant
stop and think to yourself. make some lists. how many boys who married rich became talmiday chachomim? how many who married poor became talmiday chachomim? how many of those who married rich would not have become t.c.im w/o the money? how many of those who married poor lost out because of lack of money. vdl.August 31, 2011 5:21 pm at 5:21 pm #804282bptParticipant
What makes her say that a working boy is not a serious learner? You can learn 60 minutes a day after work, and be more “serious” than the loafer who fakes his way thru a 6 hour day.
There are plenty of quality boys out there. Its her job / her parents job to find them. The biggest problem they face is overcoming the “what will the neighbors say” syndrome.
Take it from someone who was a “working boy”; we are fine bnei torah, and make terrific husbands / parents.August 31, 2011 5:35 pm at 5:35 pm #804283ToiParticipant
if a guy is demanding cars, vacations, and a lif eof luxury; get a job and go for it. But i happen to be in kollel, and i can tell you that alot of us are squeezing budgets to learn and not demanding the high life. dont stereotype. and if you (girl) wants a good learning boy then by df. the money has to come from somewhere else.August 31, 2011 6:03 pm at 6:03 pm #804284leftbrooklynParticipant
If the “Learning Boys” you are dreaming to marry are demanding all that money/gashmiyus than are you really dreaming of marring those boys????August 31, 2011 6:28 pm at 6:28 pm #804285mommamia22Participant
It’s not true that all learning boys only want girls with money. It’s just not true. There are those who do, and those who that’s not their priority. I wonder why you’re being exposed only to those who want money??
I know many boys from chofetz Chaim yeshiva are not looking for wealthy wives. They’re taught to want to learn and go into chinch and many that I know of married regular women from normal families who’s families did not support. The women also didn’t have amazing careers. They became bookkeepers, secretaries, teachers, worked in offices etc. they were prepared, both of them, to be moser nefesh letorah.August 31, 2011 6:41 pm at 6:41 pm #804286
popa, of course you could still be and oved Hashem!and I’m not saying working boys are 2nd class at all!just if someone wants to live that kind of life of learning why should she not be able to because of the messed up priorities of our society??
Sometimes being an ???? ? means you don’t get to live exactly as you want to.
Sometimes being human means that also.
If you really think that you will be serving Hashem to your ability marrying a working boy, and you just like the kollel lifestyle because you think it’s fun or your friends are doing it, then I really have nothing to say.August 31, 2011 6:41 pm at 6:41 pm #804287TomcheMember
mmm22: CC boys seem to look for a working wife.August 31, 2011 7:03 pm at 7:03 pm #804288Queen BeeMember
Why would a girl want to marry a guy who demands things from her?August 31, 2011 8:08 pm at 8:08 pm #804289
Bee, it may not be the guy who is demanding but the guy’s parents.August 31, 2011 8:21 pm at 8:21 pm #804290collegegradMember
If a guy wants to sit and learn he has to be realistic. Someone has to pay the bills. I have a brother who is learning and in shidduchim and my parents just said no to a girl who works 5 hours a day as a preschool assistant and her parents don’t have money. Realisticly speaking how is this girl who wants a learning boy expecting to support her family?August 31, 2011 8:28 pm at 8:28 pm #804292gavra_at_workParticipant
Have no fear! Tell the guy that you have a rich uncle who will support!
Later, after they are married, you can inform that the uncle is not biological, but he will support anyway. His name is Sam, and he is one of the largest supporters of Torah in the world, if not the Largest. 🙂August 31, 2011 8:33 pm at 8:33 pm #804293
Gavra – lol! Exept there is just one problem: dear old Uncle Sam is trillions of dollars in debt 🙁August 31, 2011 8:45 pm at 8:45 pm #804294stam36Member
a few points…
1-and now for a dose of reality…..do you know what its like for a woman to be the only/primary breadwinner at a good job and have a family….its very tough….personally I work with one and its not a happy situation…..corporate america is demanding and if you dont work hard and produce there are 1000 other people who will take your job
2-dont take the attitude and complain we are not wealthy why cant we get boys for our daughter and then say but my son….ohhh he is special he needs major bucks so we will balance out
3-lets face it-money begets kavod, friends (as long as the check clears-yes thats a life lesson but true). You do need money to live, pay bills, tuition and its not cheap
4-sounds great in seminary, kollel long term, you know what that means or you looked at your teachers apt in Israel who is being supported-defrost a little so that you dont wind up marrying at 37
By all means to I address this to woking people and Kollel people be an oveid Hashem, work on your bitachon and emunah, work on simchas HaChaim, being happy with what you have (by the way many poor girls have big demands like Tory Birch, Prada etc so it depends on the person), always remember to contribute to the Klal your unique talentsSeptember 1, 2011 3:57 am at 3:57 am #804295mommamia22Participant
Letova writes that the boys want money and wealth. Wanting a wife who will work is different than demanding wealth. Kamuvan the wife should work if her family (and his) has little or no money to contribute. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with their expecting that.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.