Tu Beshvat, Bracha and Shecheyonu Which Comes First

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  • January 27, 2021 1:18 pm at 1:18 pm #1942964
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    There is an argument between the Ashkanazim and Sefardim what comes first, the bracha or shecheyonu? The Sefardim, Halochas Ketanos, hold that the bracha comes first because of todir. The Levushei Mordechai quotes the Shagas Aryeh, 27 that todir does not apply if one is a reshus like a rabbinic and biblical mitzva. So, it narrows itself down if scheyonu on new fruits is a reshus or chova. The Ashkanazim hold it is a reshus and therefore the MB O’CH 225,3 says that we make shecheyonu first in order not to be a hafsek between the bracha and eating. Also, the Pri Megodim says that shecheyonu comes before eating by seeing it. This does not apply by a bracha of a mitzva where all agree that it is a chova as explained by the Hagohus Chasam Sofer there and the Shut Ksav Sofer O’CH 25.

    January 27, 2021 8:19 pm at 8:19 pm #1943179
    maskildoresh
    Participant

    Chazon Ish and others seem to hold that the Minhag Haolam follows the Be’er He’teiv (225 6) who says the Brocha comes first.

    Perhaps readers should ask their rov?

    January 27, 2021 9:14 pm at 9:14 pm #1943182
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    The Beer Hetev brings the sefard halacha from the Halachas Ketanos see the Chasam Sofer above.

    January 27, 2021 9:14 pm at 9:14 pm #1943183
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    There is a question whether to make sheyonu at all as the fruits are available the whole year.
    See Igros Moshe O’CH 3,34 and Teshuvas Vehanhogas Krach 1 siman 201 from Rav Sternbuch Shlita.

    December 17, 2021 9:30 am at 9:30 am #2042679
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    The shaila above could be if shecheyanu is bracha for the availability to the individual or the world. They might be available to the world but not to him because it is too expensive. So what does one care?

    January 7, 2022 10:20 am at 10:20 am #2049036
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    FYI for Tu Beshvat

    January 15, 2022 9:05 pm at 9:05 pm #2051438
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    For a greater detail see Yechaveh Daas (3,15).

    January 16, 2022 7:34 pm at 7:34 pm #2051684
    Always_Ask_Questions
    Participant

    we missed an obvious connection between rumors and hashgaha:
    R Ralbag (senior?) is quoted somewhere regarding kashrus mossdos mutual attitudes: “I think it’s sometimes more important what comes out of someone’s mouth than what goes into it.”

    January 17, 2022 2:30 pm at 2:30 pm #2051855
    takahmamash
    Participant

    There’s no Shehecheyanu on skipping Tachanun? Or maybe I would have skipped anyway because the Steelers lost?

    January 17, 2022 3:08 pm at 3:08 pm #2051908
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    The Aruch Hashulchan O’CH 225,5 says that he makes shecheyanu before the bracha because of the Pri Megadim above.

    January 17, 2022 6:36 pm at 6:36 pm #2051964
    TS Baum
    Participant

    Most poskim (Rav Moshe included) hold that since nowadays all fruits are available all year round, you can’t make a shecheyanu.

    January 17, 2022 8:07 pm at 8:07 pm #2051997
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    The Dirshu MB O’CH 225,11 brings an argument between the Shevat Halevi, Rav Wosner ztz’l who says, if having simcha make it, otherwise don’t. The above Aruch Hashulchan explains that we make a shecheyanu by eating because we are not on the level to enjoy it just by seeing it. So, if is around all the time, does not affect us until we have it in front of us to be able to eat it. Rav Elyoshov ztz’l says that we should praise Hashem for giving us the new fruit. So, even if we don’t feel the enjoyment directly but unconsciously we feel it, and therefore, we should making in any case.

    January 17, 2022 8:22 pm at 8:22 pm #2052003
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    Rav Moshe ztz’l says that for the second day Rosh Hashana, we use a new fruit even when available the whole year. Why does not the one who makes Kiddush were a new suit. There is an argument on safek brachos lehakel, to say it or not. Maybe, the argument might be if going after Rabbenu Tam, Rosh Hashana 33, that an unnecessary brachacha is a derabonon or the Rambam that it is because of Lo Sisa.

    January 24, 2023 10:30 am at 10:30 am #2159033
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    The argument whether it is a reshus, optional or chova, obligatory might be whether we have an option to eat it but maybe, once you eat it, you must make a shecheyanu, so it might be a chova.

    January 26, 2023 5:46 pm at 5:46 pm #2159996
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    bump

    February 3, 2023 11:51 am at 11:51 am #2162239
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    Tu Beshvat can be related to the Torah. The Chasam Sofer left in his tzavoah. will that the spring should not dry out and the tree cut. The Torah we learn be nosei peros, should bear fruits.

    February 6, 2023 5:27 pm at 5:27 pm #2163078
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    The Hagohus Chasam Sofer O’CH 225 differentiates between birchas hamitzva and birchas hanehanin. The Ksav Sofer O’CH 25 tries to explain the difference. He says that when eating a new fruit, the bracha comes when one swallows the food but shecheyanu comes when one puts it in the mouth before. A mitzva is obligatory so we make the bracha before as todir whereas a new fruit is not.

    February 9, 2023 9:07 pm at 9:07 pm #2164375
    Shalom-al-Israel
    Participant

    To R.E. re Shevet-haLeivi, is “simcha” and “choviv” close by definition/meaning? Or does it mean more of an excitement at the new Pri.

    February 10, 2023 5:04 pm at 5:04 pm #2164753
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    I would think that chaviv brings to simcha.

    February 11, 2023 8:40 pm at 8:40 pm #2164989
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    It can also be that when we see an old fruit, we are use to it but a new fruit does create an excitement and we love to taste it which generates a simcha.

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