August 19, 2013 6:59 pm at 6:59 pm #971592jbaldy22Member
I personally am aware of situations where that was not the case, but even if I did agree with you it wouldn’t change the fact that if they are Jewish we have a mitzva of pidyun shvuyim regardless and it is typically smarter to be dan lkaf zchus.August 19, 2013 7:03 pm at 7:03 pm #971593apushatayidParticipant
“it is typically smarter to be dan lkaf zchus.”
It is not just a chumra.August 19, 2013 7:06 pm at 7:06 pm #971594
jbaldy22 – You’re probably right. However, see Rabbeinu Yona in Avos Perek 1 to “Vehevei dan es kol adam l’kaf zechus” to decide whether or not it applies here.August 19, 2013 7:06 pm at 7:06 pm #971595
LevAryeh(and all those who agree with the above statement): “iffy”? Maybe the person with an agenda, arranging for the person to be arrested on false charges is the “iffy” one??
Take it from me. The only ones who KNOW there was foul play are the cops and the D.A.’s office.
Few neighbors/press agents (whatever the case may be) ever bother to find out the truth.
It happened to me a few years ago, I will never totally forget that traumatic experience as long as I live, and as a result: I NEVER BELIEVE LOSHON HORA ABOUT ANYONE, no matter how “reliable” the source. I am the last person to whom anyone dares to gossip frivolously!August 19, 2013 7:08 pm at 7:08 pm #971596
Where there’s smoke there’s fire….or a stink bomb. And you never know who lit the match.August 19, 2013 8:51 pm at 8:51 pm #971597
Where there’s smoke there’s fire….or a stink bomb.
Right. Or fire.
I do truly feel bad about whatever happened to you, eclipse. I’m sorry if my comments hurt you at all; I did not mean to be pushy about my opinions.August 19, 2013 10:30 pm at 10:30 pm #971598
Lev: I’m not personally offended, but thanks. I guess I’ve said as much as I could say on this topic – if not too much – so to all posters on this thread: Let’s respectfully agree to agree/disagree, that’s all:)August 19, 2013 10:40 pm at 10:40 pm #971599YITZCHOK2Participant
I would assume Lev aryeh is still very young. In today’s court system many times it makes sense to just plea bargain than fight even if you are innocent. Let’s take this case which I don’t know much about but had the defendant been offered up front a plea bargain with the 6 months sentence she would have been a fool not to take it even is she was 100% innocent. The amount of months to prepare your defense is much more than 6 months. the cost of defending yourself even when you are innocent is astronomical. In addition no matter how innocent you are to leave your fate in the hands of 12 jurors is a big mistake. they can make the innocent guilty of the guilty innocent.August 19, 2013 11:42 pm at 11:42 pm #971600charliehallParticipant
She is a convicted fraudster and I can’t believe that so many commenters are declaring her “innocent”. Her behavior is the kind of nonsense that makes all frum Jews look bad. And the defense of that behavior makes us look silly and hypocritical when we talk about “morality”.August 20, 2013 10:24 am at 10:24 am #971602jewishfeminist02Member
“The government can threaten to bring anyone to the stand they want (elderly grandparents, wives etc.) and can completely destroy a persons livelihood and reputation.”
Nope. Spousal privilege.August 20, 2013 10:40 am at 10:40 am #971603TheGoqParticipant
Were Julius and Ethel Rosenberg sentenced to death because they were jews or because they were communist spies?August 20, 2013 11:43 am at 11:43 am #971604
eclipse – Thanks for the mature response; I think that’s the best option. Let’s all disagree to agree 🙂
YITZCHOK2 – I can try to prove to you that I’m not “very young”, but it will take too much time and effort, so I’ll just announce publicly that I’m fourteen.August 20, 2013 1:23 pm at 1:23 pm #971605gavra_at_workParticipant
Dr. Hall: I don’t know (and don’t care) if she is innocent or not. I can still be pleased that someone who did not commit a violent crime and has (hopefully) learned to be more careful in the future is united back with her family. Even more so since she is Jewish, and therefore a shitckel “Mishpacha”.
ZD: Please don’t use the term schv… Thanks.
That being said, it would depend if the crime was violent or not, if there was remorse, as well as other factors. If it was the same situation I would be pleased that we are no longer paying for a non-violent criminal to stay in our federal “hotels”.August 20, 2013 2:48 pm at 2:48 pm #971606metrodriverMember
@Crisisoftheweek: The issue here (In the case of Wendy Runge. as I understand it.) is not the guilt or innocence of the defendants, but the disproportionately harsh sentence that they drew. As in the Rubashkin and Pollard cases, even their most ardent supporters don’t deny that they did something wrong. It’s just that they had the proverbial book thrown at them. While others (of non-Jewish descent) in a similar situation received only a slap on the wrist.August 20, 2013 2:53 pm at 2:53 pm #971607jbaldy22Member
They can threaten to prosecute them …. Which is what I also meant in the case of the elderly grandparents.August 20, 2013 6:59 pm at 6:59 pm #971608crisisoftheweekMember
She received that “harsh sentance” because she was completly insincere in her allocution to her “non violent crimes” and then went on the internet and blogged about the anti semetic judge.
So in a sense she stuck her tounge out at the judge and the judge cut it off, and rightly so.August 20, 2013 9:36 pm at 9:36 pm #971609popa_bar_abbaParticipant
JF: Tell your husband he means spousal immunity. Spousal privilege refers to where it is about confidential communications between the spouses.August 22, 2013 4:50 pm at 4:50 pm #971610jewishfeminist02Member
jbaldy: Not if they did nothing wrong.
popa: Actually, that was me (I pick things up from him) and I did mean spousal privilege, although rereading jbaldy’s post I now realize that the line of questioning was not specified.
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