What brocho is hydroponic lettuce

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  • #1717652

    Loshenhora
    Participant

    Not being an expert on brochos or
    hydroponics could it be that
    because no earth is involved its
    not technically a hadoma????

    #1717720

    places
    Participant

    My Family doesn’t use it for the seder since there is a shitta that says it is Shakol.

    #1717724

    Yabia Omer
    Participant

    Shehakol. Rav Ovadia rules that mushrooms are shehakol since mostly they are hydroponic

    #1718851

    Hold on a minute!

    Although most follow the opinion that it is she’hakol…There are TWO opinions!!

    People, don’t make up answers based on partial knowledge! If you don’t know ALL about it, your little knowledge is dangerous!

    These are the opinions –

    She’hakol: Chayei Adam 51:17 & Nishmas Adam 152:1, Yechaveh Da’as 6:12, and Machzeh Eliyahu 25-29

    Ha’Adoma: Chazon Ish, Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach (Vezos HaBracha, Birur Halacha #24), Shevet HaLevi (1:205), Teshuvos V’Hanhagos 2:149, and Rav Shmuel Kaminetzky (Kovetz Halachos, Pesach 24:6)

    #1718882

    Milhouse
    Participant

    Yabia, mushrooms have always been shehakol. It’s got nothing to do with hydroponics. And no, mushrooms are not grown hydroponically; they’re not plants, so I’m not sure the concept even applies.

    #1718952

    places – “My Family doesn’t use it for the seder since there is a shitta that says it is Shakol.”

    Although you should respect your family minhag, that is not the ruling of other poskim.

    Chazon Ish (Kilayim 13:16) conclusively proves from Gemara, Pesachim 35b that wheat that grew unattached to the ground (e.g. in a flowerpot) may be used for matzah at the Seder. Since many of the requirements for marror, including that it must be produce of the “land”, are derived from the halachos of matzah (see Gemara, Pesachim 39a) it follows that hydroponically-grown marror may surely be used at the Seder.

    #1719036

    DovidBT
    Participant

    mushrooms … they’re not plants

    Why not? I’ve personally seen mushrooms growing out of the ground.

    #1719044

    Loshenhora
    Participant

    The Chazon Ish and Reb Shlomo Zalman
    is good enough for me

    #1719050

    LerntminTayrah
    Participant

    The future of produce is vertical farming, with everything hydroponically grown and bug-free.

    #1719069

    Loshenhora
    Participant

    Blue star of David is good enough
    for me but Reb Shlomo Zalman
    and the Chazon Ish is perfect
    Reb Shlomo Zalman paskans
    that a fruit can not change its
    brocho and he used to make
    hoetz on chocolates (me thinks)
    before anyone rips my head off
    in any event he advises that if
    one were eating choc and an apple
    one should make the shehakol
    1st as if one makes the brocho
    on the apple it might include the
    choc

    #1719045

    Loshenhora
    Participant

    The Chazon Ish and Reb Shlomo Zalman
    is good enough for me

    #1719093

    Loshon -” a fruit cannot change its brocho”, going down that road, you need to make a HaEtz on coffee. (comes from tree!)

    #1719234

    Loshenhora
    Participant

    rebbitzen
    Its obvious that this is not my
    understanding
    Perhaps drinks are different
    The question is what brocho
    is a minced fruit bar ?
    unrecognizable but on the
    package it says 100% apricot

    #1719238

    So loshon, pshat is like this: It is the derecch of using that fruit that matters. No one eats coffee pods. The way it is used is in coffee, which is a drink. Likewise, cocao peas are not eaten but used in chocolate. = where they are unrecognizable. Therefore it is shehakol on coffee and also on chocolate. Got it?

    #1719240

    Milhouse
    Participant

    DovidBT, mushrooms are not plants. That is a biological fact. You are not entitled to your own facts. They are fungi. They grow on the ground, not from the ground. And that is why lechol hade’os they are not and have never been pri ho’adomo.

    #1719242

    Milhouse
    Participant

    Coffee would be ho’etz if one were eating the coffee itself. It’s only shehakol because one throws out the coffee after cooking it, and one drinks the water, which is halachically considered not to contain any of the coffee’s substance (ta’am ein bo mamosh).

    Which leads me to consider the odd question of what exactly is in a jar of instant coffee. It is simply the “ta’am” that was infused into the water when it was brewed, so if halocho considers it not to exist then the jar must be empty! And if it doesn’t exist then how can there be a problem with cooking it on shabbos?

    #1719276

    loshon – “The question is what brocho is a minced fruit bar ? unrecognizable but on the package it says 100% apricot”

    Potato starch is also 100% potatoes but the brocha is she’hakol

    (as with any product of fruit/veggies that is unrecognizable e.g. Pringles made from dehydrated potato flour and reshaped into “chips”))

    #1719277

    Milhouse, your analysis is slightly off. It isn’t that the coffee does not exist!

    Brochos 39a: Mei Silka K’silka-the water that beets were cooked in has the same berachah as the beets themselves. Basically, this means that when you cook vegetables in water, the water itself is infused with the essence of the vegetable.

    This would apply too to coffee and tea and beer, EXCEPT –

    Rosh explains that the water will only acquire a new Berachah-identity if, and only if, one is cooking the soup in order to eat the vegetables also. Therefore, by coffee and tea, when we do not eat the vegetables (pods / plants) the water/soup remains she’hakol.

    Magen Avraham 202:22: Dried fruit such as apples, pears and plums that are poached in water you say “Borei Pri Ha’etz” on drinking their water (juice), and this is how I behave.

    Even though coffee and tea are specifically grown and used exclusively as a beverage (which would cause a brocha of ha’etz or ha’adoma, in contrast to beer that barley is used not exclusively for drinking), the poskim state: brocha is she’hakol because the water is the main ingredient (see Shulchan Aruch Harav 202:12, Kitzur Shulchan Aruch 53:3, Yechaveh Da’as 4:42)

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