What does “Yeshiva World” mean?

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  • #2015943
    Yabia Omer
    Participant

    To me it just seems like a way to give the site a fake air of Frumkeit. But let me ask, what exactly is the Yeshiva World? Does it mean that people who were not zoche to go to Yeshiva are part of a separate world?

    Also, what about the “Torah World”? The Torah is not the inheritance of only a select few people. It is the inheritance of all of Kehilas Yaakov, whether they are close to Torah or not.

    And “Torah Judaism”? Vechi yesh Judaism without Torah? It’s redundant.

    My conclusion is that these expressions are modern, artificial concepts that were invented by certain groups in Klal Yisrael (whom I won’t mention) and they have no place in authentic Judaism. And certainly not the Judaism of my holy ancestors.

    #2015998
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    There are people who unfortunately do not care about Torah and halachas, so this website is not for them. This is not kiruv website.

    #2016000
    CTRebbe
    Participant

    I think you need to chill out a bit.
    Yes, it is a modern term that stems from a label. Labeling is not a new invention and in the previous generation, we just had different labels. For the last generation, they created labels based on country of origin(Litvaks, Yekkes, Morrocan, Galicianer), city of origin (Brisk, Warsaw), or religious/philosophical affiliation (Chasidishe, Conservative, Mizrachi).
    As time goes on less people care about these labels so we created new ones. Essentially the label “yeshiva world” is based on self-identification. There are also degrees of how closely a person will want to affiliate with his chosen label. This will be demonstrated in his dress, manner of speech and other external manifestations.
    Keep in mind none of this is related to a person’s personal Judaism which has solely to do with his/her closeness to G-D.

    #2016027
    ubiquitin
    Participant

    “and they have no place in authentic Judaism.”

    Vechi yesh Judaism without authenticity? It’s redundant.

    eleh mai, you are jelous of the Torah Judiasm tm branding.

    don’t be jealous make your own, Authentic Judaism led by YO. start a publication sharing al your authentic Jewish ideas

    Of course dealing only wit hTHE MOST pressing issues facing kala yisorel. nothing other than the most pressing, just the way you like it

    #2016037
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    What does “Yeshiva World” mean?
    Its the name given for an “Internet advertising services” business which filed a trademark application with the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office back in 2008. This trademark is owned by Yeshiva World LLC domiciled in Suffern, NY. The USPTO website notes that “the foreign wording in the [trade]mark translates into English as seminary”.
    In simple terms, 13 years ago it was a name selected for an advertising supported internet news site, nothing more or less.

    #2016040
    Yabia Omer
    Participant

    CTRebbe’s response was the most level headed so far. But I wonder, why do we HAVE to make new labels?

    Ubq….in what way is jealousy manifested in what I said? But you make a good point. So called “Torah Judaism” is a brand. That’s all it is.

    #2016094
    CTRebbe
    Participant

    We do not HAVE to make labels but it seems that people like to make them for various reasons I am sure people can add to this list but here are a few thoughts

    1. People like to feel like part of a club. If everyone else in the club is good I must be good too. If I am a Yankee fan and the Yankees are doing well I must be a winner.

    2. It helps us categorize things in life. The same way we deal with all people we meet. You meet someone and try to decide if you want to get close to them. You slap a label on their forehead and say in your mind “you are a nerd, greasball, frumak, JAP, rich, weird, smart, black, cool, bad dresser etc. and therefore I will or will not associate with you”

    3. It is easier on the brain. When you read an article or listen to a speaker, you don’t need to think about the points they make. You can just label the writer or speaker by saying that he is a liberal, a frummy, chasidishe, not frum, etc. and therefore I do not need to consider the intellectual points he is making.

    4. It gives us a sense of identity to make us think we know ourselves

    5. It gives us a false sense of pride (e.g. “everyone knows that Yekkes have the most authentic mesorah and therefore I must be doing the right thing)

    Labels are not used exclusively by Jews but it could be that we rely on them more than the rest of the world and that our labels are much more detailed than any one else. Try explaining to a gentile that you can judge a person’s religious affiliation by looking at the size, material, color of his yarlmuka. He will think you are nuts

    #2016135
    Lostspark
    Participant

    Haha and I thought I was a troll, my hat is off 10/10.

    #2016140
    Yabia Omer
    Participant

    Judging people’s religious level or affiliation by their kippa is something that is only practice by a certain segment of the Jewish population, whom I shall not name. It’s a “fundamentally Jewish” practice.

    #2016183
    ubiquitin
    Participant

    “Ubq….in what way is jealousy manifested in what I said?”

    your tone
    (not just in this post )

    “Judging people’s religious level or affiliation by their kippa is something that is only practice by a certain segment of the Jewish population, whom I shall not name.”

    Lol, how do you identify that certain segment. Hopefully not by their kippot

    #2016170
    ujm
    Participant

    YO: Are you Orthodox?

    #2016163
    AviraDeArah
    Participant

    Torah Judaism is la’fukei other streams of people who believe that they represent judaism, but do not. Whether it’s admixtures of heresy from goyim in the form of tikun olam social justice, tolerance of the alphabet squad, or mixing in 19th century European Nationalism, “knowledge for its own sake” or any other sort of mixture of Torah with something else.

    Torah Judaism shouldn’t have to be; it should be as you say, a redundancy, but there became a need to distinguish ourselves from the less observant or non-observant “denominations” that call themselves representative of Judaism.

    #2016215

    all yidden have one god, one eibershter, one king, one tatty, one father. just as a brother cannot divorce his brother so too we cannot divorce our brothers. our brothers will always be yiddne and labels to change us.

    #2016227
    Yabia Omer
    Participant

    “Torah Judaism shouldn’t have to be; it should be as you say, a redundancy…”

    Well said.

    Am I Orthodox? Yes. But one can argue that even that term is a modern invention….

    #2016427
    CTRebbe
    Participant

    I did not say religious level-YO said that. There is a big difference between that and affiliation. Perhaps “societal religious affiliation” would be more accurate.
    We all choose how we want to dress and that choice is a reflection of how we want others to view us and with whom we want to afilaite. Someone who wears ripped jeans and a t-shirt is making a statement that he would like to affiliate with a certain segment of society and someone who regularly wears a suit and tie also makes a statement. It is the same with yarlmukas. If a person wears a white kippa seruga he makes a statement and if he wears a big or small one he is also making a statement as to how he would like to be classified. These are self classifications. If you wear the yarlmuka of gerrer chasidim or those of Toldos Aharon chasidim that is also a statement.

    I agree that anyone who would try to judge a person closeness to G-d, his level of Torah knowledge or yirat shomayim by looking at his kippa is and idiot bec. he thinks HE is G-d (i.e. only G-d really knows this stuff).

    It all goes back to the same principle of the OP- we choose to affiliate and label ourselves with the group that WE choose. If a Livak wakes up one day and decides to become a Chabad chosid that will be his decision on which society he would like to affiliate. Hopefully most people decide to label themselves based on the path in avodos Hashem that he feels he can best accomplish his own personal mission in life and achieve his greatest potential.

    #2018319

    Literaly yeshivah means: an Orthodox Jewish college or seminary.
    literaly world means: the earth, together with all of its countries and peoples.

    does that answer the question?

    #2018362
    ujm
    Participant

    Why are some girl schools named “Yeshiva”?

    #2019844
    Yabia Omer
    Participant

    I think day schools in the tristate area often call themselves Yeshiva

    #2019933
    AviraDeArah
    Participant

    Farby, that is not the way chazal define a yeshiva. It says by chizkkyahu “heshivu yeshiva al kivro” that they “seated” a yeshiva on his kever. Yeshiva means a place where people sit and learn; ze hu.

    #2020867
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    Higher level schools are called Mesivta the equivalent of Yeshiva in Aramaic.

    #2021110
    Yabia Omer
    Participant

    Metitva means high school yeshiva IN AMERICA.

    #2021202
    ujm
    Participant

    Why do some places call their school for younger children “Cheder” whereas others do not?

    #2021219

    Aveira
    when I searched up what it mean, google gave me the English definition, I thought that google was Frum so it would give me chazals definition but i guess google is otd. (:

    #2021234

    > Why do some places call their school for younger children “Cheder”

    technically, it should only be if it fits in a room. Many old school did. I think in many places, a teacher would teach a class at his home, possibly with different ages going to different teacher. I am not sure how widespread this was, but I saw this described in several books, including R Kamenetsky’s biography by his son.

    I wish we could re-adopt this system. It creates more competition – between independent teachers, rather than schools, and competition is envisioned by Gemora and later poskim as an appropriate approach to education (guilds and competition restrictions are generally allowed in business, except education and perfumes). So, you would then be able to mix & match a Chumash class from a litvishe yeshiva, a Tanya class from a Chabad Rebbe and a math class from a MO school. And reduced overhead.

    #2021335
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    In Hungary we only had one room, so we went to cheder.

    #2021358
    ujm
    Participant

    Reb Eliezer, how did life in Hungary change between 1945 and 1956 compared to Jewish life in Hungary before World War 2? And how did it change after 1956?

    #2021553
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    Hungary had a big inflation requiring them to change their currency from Pengo to Forint. My father told me that they took an egg to the movies as money was not accepted for admission. My father had a confection business. The Germans marched into Budapest March 19, 1944. My father lost his wife and two children in Aushwitz. He was in labor camp in Mauthausen which I saw after the war. Horthy stopped deportation on July 8, 1944 and was forced to resign by kidnapping his son, so he abdicated October 15, 1944 having the Arrow Cross, who were worse than the Nazis, take over. My father remarried in 1946 (the sister of his dead wife, my mother). I was born in January 1948. I did not know that the Russians were in charge until the revolution in 1956. There is currently no yiddishkeit in my hometown Sopron which was a big kehila before the war.

    #2021596
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    My mother, being single and viral (32 years old) was sent by Mengele to the right and put to work filling granades with ammunition, escaped Aushwitz.

    #2021663
    Yabia Omer
    Participant

    Reb Eliezer, did you know the famous Reichmanns? I think they were from Sopron.

    #2021729
    ujm
    Participant

    There’s a big Sopron kehila in Williamsburg.

    Did Yiddishkeit survive in Hungary until 1956 and after ’56 the frum left the country?

    #2021731
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    I did not but my rebbi the Wiener (Hadhauser) ztz’l was together with him in Tangier.

    #2021763
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    I am familiar with the Sopron kehila at 217 Hewes St, What you said is correct Rav Shimon Posen ztz’l the father of Pinchas Shlita at the above kehila left already in my time. My Rav in Sopron was Rav Aaron Meir Krausz who became Rav in Sydney, Australia and then lived in Monsey, NY.

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