What is Chasidus?

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  • #1729041

    Joseph
    Participant

    Chasidim often give each other a brocha that they should grow in Torah and Chasidus (among other things.) Litvaks don’t give a brocha to grow in Litvishkeit.

    What is Chasidus and why such a brocha? If he grows into a Brisker is that a loss to Chasidishkeit?

    #1729204

    Yserbius123
    Participant

    Following all of אורכת צדיקים until you’ve reached the final level.

    #1729701

    Meno
    Participant

    Litvaks don’t give a brocha to grow in Litvishkeit.

    I do.

    #1730516

    Joseph
    Participant

    I do.

    What is Litvishkeit?

    #1730931

    laskern
    Participant

    I think the difference is the cause and effect. For the litvish, cause is Torah and effect is Avodah, i.e. Torah brings to Avodah, whereas for the Chasidim is the reverse, cause is Avodah and effect is Torah, we daven to understand Torah . It says עת לעשות לה’ הפרו תורתך, they differ how to interpret this pasuk. The litvishe say that we must accomodate and show leniency when people disrupt the Torah whereas the Chasidim see the reverse הפרו תורתך עת לעשות לה. When people want to disrupt the Torah, we must be steadfast and not budge an inch strengthening customs and beliefs for the sake of Hashem Yisborach.

    • This reply was modified 3 weeks, 6 days ago by  laskern.
    • This reply was modified 3 weeks, 6 days ago by  laskern.
    #1733589

    The litvishe say that we must accomodate and show leniency when people disrupt the Torah

    Source, please.

    #1733615

    Neville ChaimBerlin
    Participant

    “Growing in chassidus” could mean middos chissidus, unrelated to the sectarian meaning.

    #1733680

    laskern
    Participant

    Rand0m3x,, saying י’ג מדות at night where most say that he is doing more harm than good.

    #1733971

    Neville ChaimBerlin
    Participant

    “Rand0m3x,, saying י’ג מדות at night where most say that he is doing more harm than good.”
    Where have you seen litvaks do this?

    There are far better examples you could have used. Litvaks are much more willing to be meikel to avoid offended others, eg. eating over at a household with different kashrus standards, possibly shaking hands with a female, etc.

    #1734002

    laskern
    Participant

    The Young Israel says slichas 10:00 PM according to Reb Moshe’s psak Igros Moshe O’CH 2:105 mentioned by the Yechaveh Dass 1:46
    There is a Shaarei Teshuva in the beginning of Hilchas Rosh Hashono SA O’CH 581

    שערי תשובה סימן תקפא
    באשמורת. וכת’ בר”י בשם מהר”ם זכותה ז”ל בתשובה שיש מקומות שאומרים סליחות בערבית וישתקע הדבר שאין ראוי להזכיר י”ג מדות כ”א בעת רצון והיושב שם בעת שאומרים ישב וידום או יאמר מזמורים אך הווידוי יכול לומר אך במוצאי שבת אסור עד אחר חצות משום קדושת שבת

    #1734008

    laskern
    Participant

    The chasidim don’t follow many of the psokim of Reb Moshe rather the Chasam Sofer for example cholov stam, mechitza and bima in the middle etc because he mainly wrote them for Lithuania were keeping Torah and mitzvas was more complicated. He did not want his Teshuvas translated into English.

    #1734054

    laskern
    Participant

    Where it comes to a mechitza, (height, holes) there seems to be an argument if required for mixing (Rashi) or looking (Rambam and Tosfas Yom Tov on the mishna in Sukkah.

    #1734129

    TomimTihyeh
    Participant

    Laskern – cherry picking sources doesnt make those who dont follow them mekilim (despite the late unlamented RGP). No less an authority than the Shlah saysthat it is a SAKANA to say Mizmor Shir Leyom Hashabbos after shkiah. How many shuls do you know that are makpid to ALWAYS finish kabbolas Shabbos earlier than shkiah?

    (And if you know some that are, they are almost certainly being meikil in other areas such as saying Shema before the zman….)

    #1734190

    oyyoyyoy
    Participant

    Probably lots of semantics but my guess is the one making the bracha means “learning of torah and following in the the ways of the teachings of chassidus.”

    Pretty silly to use this discussion to argue if chassidim or litvaks are right.

    #1734242

    laskern
    Participant

    TT, what shkiah? See Teshuvas Chasam Sofer O’CH 80 where he paskens like RT even erev shabbos.

    #1734247

    laskern
    Participant

    oy, the gemora at the end of tractate Brochos mentions both expressions on above pasuk of עת לעשות וכו’ so I say אלו ואלו דברי אלקים חיים.

    #1734259

    Neville ChaimBerlin
    Participant

    “The chasidim don’t follow many of the psokim of Reb Moshe rather the Chasam Sofer for example cholov stam, mechitza and bima in the middle etc because he mainly wrote them for Lithuania were keeping Torah and mitzvas was more complicated. He did not want his Teshuvas translated into English.”

    Neither Reb Moshe nor the Chasam Sofer wrote their teshuvas in Lithuania. I would add to TT’s rebuttal that you haven’t even been talking about cherry picking. You’re giving examples of Litvaks following Reb Moshe, our posek, to the letter. How is that bending for those who disrupt the Torah?

    And, by the way, the Chasam Sofer was a central European posek, Reb Moshe was Eastern European, which is part of why who follows whom in some of those disputes. It’s nothing to do with strictness.

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