January 21, 2018 1:01 am at 1:01 am #1453287
Shall you do the hishtadlus required for your level of bitachon or for that of your spouse?January 21, 2018 7:11 am at 7:11 am #1453324
Mostly, for yourself.
If it’s a joint decision you compromise, and if you can’t go to your Rabbi and explain the situation to him.
Just like anything else spirital you will disagree on, like minhagim, schools, and many other topics.January 21, 2018 9:31 am at 9:31 am #1453357
Who says the amount of hishtadlus necessary depends on your level of bitachon?
(Yes, I know Rav Dessler speaks about it, but I don’t know that we’re talking about people on that level.)January 21, 2018 10:12 am at 10:12 am #1453403GadolhadorahParticipant
We are individuals, each in the imgage of the Ebeshter but projecting different values, strengths, and weaknesses. There is no reason for couples either to expect or aspire to have matching readings on eiher the bitachon or hishtadlus meters. We should individually aspire to be the best we can but not stress out our partners or being viewed as constantly giving musar on how the “other” can improve.January 21, 2018 12:11 pm at 12:11 pm #1453476Takes2-2tangoParticipant
How can u know that you have less or more bitachon then your spouse? Just because you are verbal by saying i have bitachon means nothing. There is a very good reason for rabbeim and teachers push so hard for reading and understanding shar habitachon because its not simply s good read. Its a hsrgasha that has to become ingrained in a person. Its not like learning gemorah or chumash or halachos and then saying you know it. So how can someone know whether their spouse is less or More then them when it comes to bitachon.January 21, 2018 12:15 pm at 12:15 pm #1453497DisillusionedParticipant
The question is left very vague…. are you equating the man’s responsibility to provide for his family with that of the wife who is kind enough to help out but is not required? If the responsibility is the husband then let him figure it out and be supportive.January 21, 2018 1:36 pm at 1:36 pm #1453661
The same question could be asked regarding business partners partners in which one partner insists on actions that require more hishtadlus than the other business partner feels necessary.January 21, 2018 1:39 pm at 1:39 pm #1453664
The same question could be asked regarding business partners partners in which one partner insists on actions that require more hishtadlus than the other business partner feels necessary.
My unanswered question applies to that as well.January 21, 2018 2:11 pm at 2:11 pm #1453680SteveParticipant
Is this question the same as if one spouse is chilled out and the other is more tense? For example if it’s erev sukkos and 1 spouse doesn’t know where they’re gonna go for a chol hamoed trip and is bugging out and the other says don’t worry well figure it out after shachris on chol hamoed. By bitachon one says how are we gonna get the money for…. and the other says don’t worry hashem will take care of us.
You left your question very vague so if I didn’t understand your question maybe leave am example of what your referring to.
Hatzlocha raba and may your shalom bayis work out very well even though you’re on different levels of bitachonJanuary 21, 2018 9:41 pm at 9:41 pm #1454150Uncle BenParticipant
The answer can be learned from the following story which took place with Rav Avigdor Miller זצ”ל. In his older years he was told that he needed surgery to replace a valve in his heart. He refused to have the operation, insisting that he had bitachon that Hashem would heal him. His wife and family pressured him to undergo the operation but he steadfastly refused. This went on for a period of time, I don’t recall for how long. One day he suddenly announced that he would proceed with the procedure. When he was asked about his change of heart (pun intended) he said that as far as he was concerned nothing changed however he realized that he had no right to practice his bitachon on his wife’s cheshbon!January 22, 2018 6:23 am at 6:23 am #1454214
Uncle Ben’s story sums it up IMHO. When I read the OP I thought about a money scenario as an example. A man runs a new business and he claims he must be working on it 24/7 “It’s new, it needs a lot of work to get it up, that’s how it is in the beginning” But he’s never home and his wife needs him. She sees he’s exasted, frustrated, stressed, etc. She says to him “Hashem will send us parnassa, but do you really think your hishtadlus is to work like a dog and go to bed at 4am and wake up at 7am?!”
So what does the man do, does he continue his schedule, or not?
That’s the question we are asking.
The answer, to me at least, is that again, I see this like any other disagreement in marriage. You need to compromise, and if you can’t do it alone, get a Rav or objective mediator involved.January 22, 2018 10:59 am at 10:59 am #1454385SteveParticipant
Shopping: what you described is a classic case of doing too much hishtadlus. Is there no difference between bitachon and hishtad
lus??January 22, 2018 11:35 am at 11:35 am #1454419
Bitachon is trusting in Hashem.
Hishtadlus is the amount of effort you put into something.
2 different things.January 22, 2018 11:35 am at 11:35 am #1454420hujuParticipant
Neither I nor my wife has any bitcoins. I think it is a fraud and when it crashes, many people will be hurt.January 23, 2018 8:12 pm at 8:12 pm #1456018hujuParticipant
What’s wrong with you people? I made a very funny post more than 24 hours ago, and nobody responded. You could say how funny I am, or at least tell me how stupid I am. But please don’t ignore me.January 23, 2018 8:25 pm at 8:25 pm #1456025🍫Syag LchochmaParticipant
“Neither I nor my wife has any bitcoins. I think it is a fraud and when it crashes, many people will be hurt.”
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣😉January 23, 2018 8:26 pm at 8:26 pm #1456026
Who Jew, honestly I thought you were a Chinese troll ☺
[It took me a minute to chap your huju screen name]
Truthfully, my father always expressed disdain at jokes made of Jewish /Torah ideas.January 23, 2018 8:41 pm at 8:41 pm #1456031
Huju, you seem to have LB’s issue in reverse.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.