April 19, 2020 11:38 pm at 11:38 pm #1850563commonsaychelParticipant
Similar question, different twist.April 20, 2020 12:04 am at 12:04 am #1850775
The same as when Clinton lost. The Dems will never accept their loss.April 20, 2020 12:05 am at 12:05 am #1850779JosephParticipant
Democrat rioters burning cities. Baltimore-style.April 20, 2020 9:35 am at 9:35 am #1850899Reb EliezerParticipant
Joseph, I see that happening if Trump loses.April 20, 2020 10:03 am at 10:03 am #1850907
Democrat rioters burning cities. Baltimore-style.
They didn’t do that last time. They made utter fools of themselves with those stupid pink hats, and diiscredited themselves with their refusal to accept the result, and with their #resistance and the whole shtick painting him as “literally Hitler” and as having some the very few character flaws that he actually lacks, but they didn’t riot.
Now if the convention is held live, and especially if Biden has to withdraw and Sanders still doesn’t get the nomination, expect Milwaukee to burn.April 21, 2020 10:20 am at 10:20 am #1851336MistykinsParticipant
4 more years of people chanting “not my president” and millions spent on another impeachment trial.
Newsflash- you don’t have to support him, but as long as you’re on American soil he is, in fact, your president.April 21, 2020 4:23 pm at 4:23 pm #1851541
Actually, no, he isn’t my president. He’s president of the United States. There are 50 of them, and I am not one of them. That’s the whole point of the USA — he is not a king; some people seem to think that’s just a matter of a different title, or of being limited to a certain term, but it’s not. It’s a fundamental difference.
That’s why I very strongly object to those shuls who say Hanosen Teshu’a Lam’lochim, simply substituting “The President and Vice President” for “His Majesty the Kaiser”; that entire tefillah is completely inappropriate for any American shul. It’s literally un-American. If you want to say some prayer Lishlomah shel Malchus, find or write one for the United States themselves and for their constitution, not for the functionaries who are currently employed to manage them. That is precisely what makes them special.April 21, 2020 8:11 pm at 8:11 pm #1851609JosephParticipant
Milhouse: You could make that argument for every democracy. Including, in fact, constitutional monarchies where the “King” is merely a figurehead.
You’d be left making the bracha for the dear leaders of North Korea and Saudi Arabia.April 22, 2020 3:02 am at 3:02 am #1851683
Joseph, even in a constitutional monarchy, if it’s a real monarchy the king is the master, and the people are his subjects. People swear loyalty to the king, and attempting to kill him is treason. He is bound by rules, but that’s nothing new; even the kings of Beis Dovid were bound by rules.
The elected government governs on his behalf, so that he can stay out of politics; but they work for him, not for the people. “L’etat c’est moi” is not just about Louis XIV; it is a plain factual statement of how a monarchy is organized. Just as in the USA the “executive branch” is the president, in a monarchy the “state” is the king.
(In the UK, since about 1700, there has been a separation between the king and the Crown; but the Crown is not a personification of the people, it’s a personification of the monarchy. It’s a sort of abstraction of the king’s “kingness”, as opposed to his personal attributes. The Crown is the king, just not him personally.)
The founders of the USA did something very different, and made the president a servant of the people, not the other way around. We are not his subjects, he is ours. Just look at how criminal cases are brought. In the UK or Canada, it’s “R v Smith”. In the USA it’s not “The President v Smith” but “The People v Smith”.
This makes it appropriate for a king’s subjects to pray for him and honor him, whereas doing so to the president is just the same as doing it to a janitor. He’s just an employee doing a job.April 22, 2020 3:14 pm at 3:14 pm #1851884charliehallParticipant
It is a very American prayer, probably the first contribution of the American diaspora to Judaism. It was definitely in use in 1789 and it was originally in English.April 22, 2020 3:14 pm at 3:14 pm #1851885charliehallParticipant
It is very clear that Trump wants to have all the powers of an absolute monarch and that he has packed the courts with judges who won’t stop him. There are only two bits of good news here. One is that he isn’t smart enough to pull that off. The second is that we can replace him with Biden this fall.April 22, 2020 4:13 pm at 4:13 pm #1851980
No, Charlie, Hanosen Teshua Lam’lochim is NOT American. It’s centuries older than America, and is written specifically for kings, NOT for republics.
Trump may wish he were a king, but he isn’t one, and he knows it. Biden will think he is a king. The common factor is that neither of them has ever read the constitution, as was painfully obvious during Biden’s debate with Palin in 2008 — back when he could still remember what he had read. Nowadays even if he had read it it wouldn’t matter.
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