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This is the nightmare thread. I know we would all rather use this space to denigrate each other’s leaders, and even on occasion wish the worst on those with whom you disagree, but discussing Halacha, or even sources is terrible.
And so, it a fit of non-conformity, I would want to discuss Halacha questions here.
For starts, what Bracha do you make on wraps?
Haleivi,
You don’t know how deep your question is
I work with wraps and there are some wraps that are Hamotzi and some are Pas Habah Bkisnin and really the place that sells the wrap should specify the bracha (or if it is pas Habah Bkisnin or not)
Mezonos. If eating more than two, hamotzi.
Just to get into the spirit of CR, as you describe it above, if you’re non-Orthodox like none2.0 and GadolHadofi, the answer to the question at the end of your OP is they make no bracha at all.
Joseph,
I’m “non-Orthodox”? You made that claim once before and weren’t able to back it up but feel free to do so now.
You on the other hand are not even Jewish based on what I once read on this site about your mother. Quite consistent, given that you’re the biggest Nazi on YWN.
Like Gadol Hador said “if you have 2 wraps then it becomes hamotzi with Benching full birchas hamazon after” this is all due to being Kovea Seuda which means that the amount of wraps enough to be considered a full meal so the bracha changes from eating just 1 wrap of melons to 2 or more of making hamotzi followed by full birchas hamazon after.
Which is the same reason why 2 full chocolate or cinnamon etc….. danishes also require hamotzi and full birchas hamazon after. Versus just one danishes is just a mezonos.
Ask your LOR for more explanations if this isn’t enough to know the difference when it changes from mezonos to hamotzi with full birchas hamazon after.
Any prayer you say by route is a spell not a real “prayer” as prayer fine mentally is something that comes from the heart
It’s like when they got saved in the sea and they came out of the other side they sang “Shira”. No dear they were so greatful to G-d for saving them and miraculously passing over the sea they from deep within their heart they started to praise G-d it’s such a simple thingHaleivi
Im saying that they make hamotzi made with water and mezzo is made with fruit juice yet they don’t specify when you buy a ready made wrap what bracha it is
Btw i make hamotzi on wraps too
none2.0 –
My understanding is that prayer is a service of the heart not of the lips. When you see people run through the amidah as fast as they can that’s sad. I’m not sure TBH it even counts as an amidah. I think it’s like going to a fancy dinner and your host pulled out all the stops. The first course you linger. WOW! The best soup I’ve ever had! You spend half an hour enjoying it. How it feels on your lips. The taste, the texture, etc. THERE’S MORE!?!? Then comes an appetizer. Later a salad. Later something to freshen your palate. And so on. This person who went to such trouble to make such an elaborate meal, do you rush through? It’s an insult. Now too often I DO in fact rush through. And it’s sad. I know it doesn’t make G-d happy the way sitting and really talking with Him from my heart does.
None
The best prayer directly from the heart is called Hisbodedus and involves speaking directly to Hashem in any language with anything bothering you on your mind.
Breslov Chasidus are big into Hisbodedus coming originally from Rav Nachman of Breslov their Rebbe ZT”L.
Also let’s clarify. I don’t use prayer when I don’t need it I don’t do it cuz I was told to do it. I don’t jump to prayer just because. I do it because I’m human and falible. Unlike our religious matrix that doesn’t even let you make mistakes cuz it controls the whole playing field I’m real enouph to be imperfect to need God..it also bleeds into my relationships where I’m alot more understanding of others but harshly judged and cruelty looked down on by religious stuck up people. It’s a sad controlled life you all live that you don’t have something important a deep connection to real forgiveness. Forgiveness of self and forgiveness of mistakes
@None2.0
Please understand that I say this without any judgmentalism, but with compassionate sadness.
You clearly did not develop a healthy and proper understanding about Judaism, Torah, Mitzvos, Halacha, and their underlying principles. I don’t know whose fault that is, but the fact of it remains the same regardless of who is to blame.
All of the questions, complaints, problems with Torah Judaism (which is the only Judaism) that you raise in your posts are clearly answered and explained, in a clear and rationalist way that requires no leaps of faith, by Rav Shamshon Rafael Hirsch.
If you have an open mind and are willing to put in the time and effort to grow, I recommend that you read his works, starting with the Nineteen Letters.
May Hashem, in His infinite mercy, open the gates of wisdom for you.
The Torah is made up two parts the written law and oral law. This is similar to a king who commands his servants to follow his will and rewards but gives his children the key to unlock the cabinet where the explanation lie. It says על פי הדברים האלה according to these words uttered by the mouth implying that the words were said.
😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊
@None2.0
Your assumptions about me are wildly inaccurate, but I’m in good company there.There is no need to respond to any of your vitriol.
You have quite clearly set yourself outside the pale of Torah Judaism. You can call me names, but the fact remains.
I have nothing more to say to you.
none2.0- Why do you think catch yourself never struggled? Do you know anyone who never struggled? Maybe it looks on the outside, but not really.
And honestly, despite you saying that people are only happy once they are free, unshackled, and use morality as a guide, you seem unhappy, bitter, and angry at the world. You have a twisted view of frum people. Frum people are not perfect.
There may be a few elitist people, but the majority are good, hard-working humans who are juggling life, with its struggles and just trying their best.
And like all humans (Jewish and non-Jewish, frum and not frum), they were all born with different traits, good and bad. Some tend to be nasty, some selfish, some look down at others (though usually that comes from insecurity). And while rich people may get more kavod, nice (AND REAL) people are more well-liked and have more true friends.
Hopefully, frum people are constantly working to improve themselves, trying to be more connected with God and with themselves and trying to use their negative traits for the good.
If you think the non-Jewish world is a happier, better place to live, I ask you to look up where there are the highest suicide rates.Personally, at one of my jobs, I’ve dealt with many non-Jewish people and became friendly with some. One thing I learnt is that there is a different type of conformity. It’s just less visible on the outside. And their high school kids, forget it, must go to the right college, have the right sneakers, shop in the right stores. And the boyfriends/girlfriend system causes tons of pressure. I remember one of their kids telling me- “What- you had no boys in your school at all? Really, you’re lucky, cuz it’s massive competition and a huge pressure”
We (whoever you are) are all human, and peer pressure is something everyone must work on. Before every decision to think “am I doing this cuz I think it’s the right thing for me or because I feel like I must due to outside pressure?”
I ask you to look around and find frum people who value you for who you are. But I also ask you to be kind to other people (even elitist ones), because everyone is going through their own struggles.
none2.0
“Who’s right? humans that have an agenda driven need for power or Gods word?”Thats an easy one, In orthodox judaism humans are right
This is explicit in many sources classsic example being the tale of the oven of achinai in BM 59b “Lo bashamayim hi” Torah is not in heaven it was given to man. (of ciourse the phrase is a verse)
This is a pretty basic point in Orthodox Judaism. and is nt controversial .
You can believe whatever you want but you arent going to convince any Orthodox Jews – by definition, that you are right.
UJM/Halevai
I don’t understand why wrap would get a beracha. I dont understand the difference between a wrap and a icecream cone (non-sugared) wraps are tasteless plain and never eaten plain. it is just a holder for food, why does it require a beracha at all
IF anything its less than ice cream cone, ice cream can be eaten in a cup people choose cone – yet most poskim/berachos books say still no beracha on plain ice cream cone. why is a plain barley edible wrap different?(Ive asked aroung never got a clear answer , usually its along the lines of “takeh if people don’t eat it plain then should be no beracha – good point, but people do eat them plain no? and some taste good? no ?” )
The above # 2442847 is from the Rabbenu Bechaya in Parshes Ki Siso. If not for the Oral Law, we would not know when is Rosh Hashanah or Shavuos. The Chasam Sofer compares this to a father who has a goldmine. He has 3 sons and wants hi son to inherit it. He teaches him the act of goldmining. He then divides it equally but since the other sons don’t know what to do with it, it automatically falls to the youngesn. The written law is the goldmine and the oral law is the act of goldmining.
Should be above. He wants his youngest son to inherit it, so he teaches him the act of goldmining.
halevai
I’ve asked myself and many others tha question many times.
The answer I’ve (almost) always gotten is the same the wrap is just a “a convenient way to hold your eggs and avocado together.”Not sure how earlier times are relevant. metzius changes
If I’m wrong on the metzius, and most people eat a wrap (ie the wrap itself) because of the taste (???really?) or they find it filling (again???). beseder
My question is in din
1) If wrap is eaten as a holder for the tuna/egg/avacoda or as a “a convenient way to hold your eggs and avocado together.” what beracha if any does it get?
2) is this determined by the individual? most people? most wraps eaten? OR if its significant number who eat wraps this way even if not the majority (eg say 40%)ubiquitin:
Are you trying to argue that a wrap (and an ice cream cone for that matter) is only L’dabeik and therefore tafeil?I’m not a Baki in Hilchos Brachos, but (from the little I know) I think that’s quite a stretch.
IIRC, Hamotzi/Mezonos are never tafeil (except when the grain is only L’dabeik).
As far as an ice cream cone goes, I think the Poskim who say you don’t make a Mezonos only say so if you are not really eating the cone (you scooped ice cream on top of the cone and you won’t really eat the cone except for a possible incidental nibble.)
fakenews
“Are you trying to argue that a wrap (and an ice cream cone for that matter) is only L’dabeik and therefore tafeil?”So no. 1) I’m asking not trying to convince others Nobody agrees with me, and I’m not a baki so I assume I’m wrong I just dotn really understand why
2) Ice cream cone is nt controversial, Most say plain cones dont get a beracha .“IIRC, Hamotzi/Mezonos are never tafeil (except when the grain is only L’dabeik).”
You do not recall correctly. See MEchaber 212:1 when eating salty fish with bread, bread only eaten not to harm throat make a shehakol. MB limits this to when you have no interest in the bread/cracker at all, however if have some interest then make hamotzi/mezonos even though its “tafel”
Which I guess brings us to Halevai’s point “but pretty sure it’s because it is filling. ” If thats the case 100% needs a beracha probabl yhamotzi
Do you know if it depends on indiidual? OR do we say look at most people?
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