Why do some Americans not eat the OU hechsher in E”Y?

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  • #1769772

    takahmamash
    Participant

    I’m curious – Americans who eat food under the OU in America come to E”Y, and suddenly the OU hechsher isn’t good enough for them here. I’m curious as to why that is. Any thoughts? (And yes, I know people who do this; I’m not making it up.)

    #1770161

    To answer this question one has to know the hahgacha situation in EY which is totally different than here in the USA. It’s not simply “its good enough here” its not good enough there”. My children have explained it to me as that the OU in EY relies on certain kulos and other hashgachos on ingredients that are not as reliable.

    #1769942

    Joseph
    Participant

    OU is stricter in the US than in Israel.

    #1769964

    laskern
    Participant

    Maybe in the palace of King they adhere to a higher standard.

    #1770035

    zahavasdad
    Participant

    Frummer than Thou

    #1770078

    lakewhut
    Participant

    The OU in E”Y isn’t supervised properly. Why would a reliable restaurant in EY not use an Israeli Hechsher?

    #1770230

    Sorry ZD it is not that simplistic. See my previous post in this thread. My shver’s aunt and uncle and family lived in EY. When my children spent time in EY my shvigger spoke to the cousins about uinviting my children.They told her that they didn’t think my children would eat in their house because of the hashgacha they relied upon is not acceptable in the yeshiva velt in EY.

    #1770291

    Neville ChaimBerlin
    Participant

    In Israel, kashrus is completely different. There are considerations like sh’mittah, chadash, maaser, chillul Shabbos, etc. that don’t necessarily come up in America. That’s the actual answer.

    Now that you have that to ignore, here’s the answer you actually wanted: because we’re dumb, crazy Chareidim and we think we’re so much better than you, but really we’re just crazy and stupid and can’t get over ourselves. Is that good?

    #1770328

    DrYidd
    Participant

    papagaio has OU hashgakha. those who so quickly can be motzi laaz on the OU, can stand around and see who relies on the OU hashgaha. israeli hashgaha depends to a large extent on the competence of the mashgiach. In a particular hotel without hareidi hashgakhot but an expert masgiach you will see distinguished Jews who know enjoying dinner,

    #1770334

    jdb
    Participant

    I have written to the OU about this. OU Israel is the same standard as OU Kosher in the US. With the added hallachos of EY. Standards in Israel are different overall, and kashrus preferences often include political considerations.

    Tachlis, it’s the OU. Please stop with the motsi Shem rah.

    #1770358

    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    “we’re dumb, crazy Chareidim and we think we’re so much better than you, but really we’re just crazy and stupid and can’t get over ourselves”

    One of the few times I’ve agreed with Neville. Yes, that is an excellent explanation.

    #1770377

    kasher
    Participant

    “If” OU standards in EY were lower or different than in the US, Do you really believe that the OU would say so?

    #1770383

    Neville ChaimBerlin
    Participant

    “Tachlis, it’s the OU. Please stop with the motsi Shem rah.’

    Please copy and paste one thing from this thread that you think was motzi shem rah about the OU. Nobody has said anything other than explaining that different halachos apply in the boundaries of Eretz Yisroel.

    #1770419

    Avi K
    Participant

    I was told by someone in the business that the only difference between mehadrin hechshers is the wrapper.Someone else claimed that there are specific chumrot that some groups have. However, anyone who will not eat in someone else’s house, especially parents, because of this is a chassid shotteh. This is typical of some people. They violate Torah mitzvot ben adam l’chaveiro for some chumra. Avraham Avinu, on the other hand, accepted gifts from Avimelech so that he could pay his debts to the hoteliers

    #1770469

    Neville ChaimBerlin
    Participant

    ““If” OU standards in EY were lower or different than in the US, Do you really believe that the OU would say so?”
    They aren’t lower. It’s a meikel hechsher in the US as well, but the halachah is simple enough in the US that it doesn’t pose a problem for most people.

    For example, relying on heter mechirah is not something surprising and/or out-of-line for the OU to do. It’s exactly what you would expect them to do. In the US, non-modern people eat OU. In Israel, no non-modern people hold by the heter mechirah, and therefore would not eat the OU (btw, shmittah treifs dishes).

    But, I’m not sure why I waste my energy. Comment’s like Avi’s just further prove that you guys only start these threads because of the inferiority complexes you MO folks all seem to have.

    #1770486

    hml
    Participant

    If you’re worried, do what I did: call the OU in US and get all your questions answered and all the information you need. I was satisfied after speaking to a Kashrus supervisor & I eat OU glatt here.

    #1770536

    yeshivishrockstar2
    Participant

    For example, relying on heter mechirah is not something surprising and/or out-of-line for the OU to do.

    This is false. They don’t.

    #1770579

    lakewhut
    Participant

    jdb it’s not motzei shem ra. No normal yeshiva in israel would recommend relying on the OU in Israel.

    #1770580

    lakewhut
    Participant

    Newsflash: people in the U.S. avoid OU restaurants as well.

    #1770596

    asimpleyid
    Participant

    the obviously modern people looking to bash chareidim here are ridiculous. the people who dont eat ou dont do it because their rebbeim tell them not to and thats it. theres so much more to look out for in eretz yisroel and to say that we just want to look frummer is ridiculous. i had rebbeim that checked out rabbinut meats and it came out they were suffek treif, am i a chossid shoita if i dont eat by parents house when they serve it? or am i just keeping kosher? where do you draw the line. “we’re dumb, crazy Chareidim and we think we’re so much better than you, but really we’re just crazy and stupid and can’t get over ourselves” so, GadolHadorah, Rav Chaim Kanievsky is dumb and crazy? Rav Gershon Edelstein is dumb and crazy? the rabbonim who tell us we cant eat certain hecsherim are dumb and crazy? who should i follow instead, HaGaon HaRav Avi K shlit”a? geeze you guys are nuts.

    #1770598

    Avi K
    Participant

    Neville, FYI the OU does not rely on the heter mechira as Rav Soloveichik opposed it. BTW, both Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach and Rav Chaim Pinchas Scheinberg said that it like any other heter. I do not though understand your reaction to my comment. Perhaps you are one of those chassidim shottim.

    #1770687

    apushatayid
    Participant

    ” kashrus preferences often include political considerations.”

    this is not unique to e’y

    #1770724

    jdb
    Participant

    To imply that OU Israel is not reliable is motsi Shem rah. To suggest that they accept Heter Mechirah is motsi Shem rah. I have a neighbor who is a mashgiach for the Rabbanut that won’t allow OU products into his home. We have discussed this at length. The rumors he has heard about OU Israel and for that matter, OU would be laughable to anyone that knows the world class organization they run.

    The top hashgachos in Israel often maintain standards well beyond what one is accustomed to seeing in the US. But to suggest that OU in the US is acceptable but in Israel they are not is often ignorance or politics.

    I have discussed this behind closed doors with leading Yeshivish rabbonim. For example, when I made Aliyah I sat with my Rosh Yeshiva to ask him what standards I should keep. Behind closed doors, he said amazing things about many hashgachos, but he also doesn’t bring them into his home because he wants neighbors to be comfortable eating in his home.

    Please do not confuse the issues. There is a reality, and there are rumors and hearsay. Don’t jump to conclusions without doing your own research.

    #1770903

    Nechomah
    Participant

    I am confused. On what products or restaurants does the OU give a hechsher in EY? My understanding was that it was an American organization and the products that are brought to EY get a stamp from Israeli Rabbanut in addition.

    #1770943

    lakewhut
    Participant

    The OU in Israel might have good standards but if a restaurant in Israel uses the OU, it’s a red flag.

    #1771000

    Neville ChaimBerlin
    Participant

    “To imply that OU Israel is not reliable is motsi Shem rah.”

    Your insecurity is laughable. Would it be motzi shem rah for me to say the Triangle K is not reliable?

    Of course not. Your definition of “motzi shem ra” is “anyone who disagrees with my MO shittah and makes me feel inferior.” Pathetic.

    #1771028

    ubiquitin
    Participant

    NC

    ” Comment’s like Avi’s just further prove that you guys only start these threads because of the inferiority complexes you MO folks all seem to have.”

    I do agree about Avi’s strange inferiority complex, but your comments only serve to worsen it, as it is built on a blatant dishonesty. You say “For example, relying on heter mechirah is not something surprising and/or out-of-line for the OU to do.” Yet a quick google search shows “Though many great Rabbis advocated in favor of this sale (known as the Heter Mechira), other great Rabbis stood in strong opposition, and the OU sides with the stringent opinion when endorsing Israeli produce. ” From the OU’s website.

    Thus if your answer to the question “Why do some Americans not eat the OU hechsher in E”Y?” is because they rely on the heter mechira. then its fair to conclude your opposition isnt grounded in fact.

    I

    #1771145

    lakewhut
    Participant

    An American organization on Israel that doesn’t o serve the laws of shmittah is a problem

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