Would you take a Russian vaccine?

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  • #1891134
    huju
    Participant

    Putin just announced that Russia has a safe and tested vaccine. If Trump authorizes the US buys that vaccine, without going through the usual tests for safety and efficacy, and Trump says it’s as safe as hydroxichloroquine, and Fauci says he knows nothing about the safety or efficacy of the vaccine, would you take that vaccine?

    #1891239
    Quayboardwarrior
    Participant

    Bonus question:
    If Trump recommends playing Russian Roulette, and says it is safe, would you play?

    #1891248
    kollelman
    Participant

    I wouldn’t even take any US vaccine unless it was proven safe for over 18-24 months.

    #1891293
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    If they are transparent with the vaccine components, protocols, and testing results, the origins of the vaccine are irrelevant. We seem to be rushing our own vaccines and hopefully the FDA will have the backbone to stand up to pressure from the Trumpkopf to approve anything before election day. Overall, I’d be reluctant to take the beta version of ANY vaccine, whether Russian, American or whatever.

    #1891309
    charliehall
    Participant

    I would take a vaccine that has been proven safe an effective even if the FDA has not approved it. I almost took a non-FDA-approved yellow fever vaccine last year before a trip to Africa but it turned out that the countries I had planned to visit did not have endemic yellow fever. However, I have yet to see any evidence other than Vladimir Putin’s word that the Sars-COV2 vaccine is safe or effective.

    #1891311
    som1
    Participant

    ” hopefully the FDA will have the backbone to stand up to pressure from the Trumpkopf to approve anything before election day.”
    there you go another example of an evil leftist who wants covid-19 to stay until the election to hurt trump at the expense of people dying

    #1891340
    charliehall
    Participant

    “there you go another example of an evil leftist who wants covid-19 to stay until the election to hurt trump at the expense of people dying”

    The Trumpies can’t get a consistent message. On the one hand they agree with his anti-science nonsense and question the efficacy of ALL vaccines. On the other hand they want to believe Vladimir Putin when he says he has a vaccine and want people to take it even though it hasn’t been proven safe, much less efficacious.

    #1891351
    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    I am all for vaccines, but not from russia. Even if it’s true that we know it works cuz they pre vaccinated their cirizens begore the outbreak and therefore avoided cases til months later. I still wouldn’t want to take it. Not a lot of trust there.

    #1891396
    Emunas1
    Participant

    I would take any vaccine after we know for sure that it’s safe. We do not currently have any way of getting if it’s safe. Even a US Vaccine would need time to prove safety in my mind before I would be willing to take it. But after it’s proven safe, I don’t care if it was made by the Russians it anybody else, sure if take it.

    #1891369
    reform rabbi
    Participant

    Vaccines aren’t dangerous at all. You could pump babies with them with no side effects. Any “reaction” is just coincidence! Science!

    #1891409
    DovidBT
    Participant

    would you take that vaccine?

    Of course not. It’s obviously got stuff in it to turn you into a commie.

    #1891406
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    “Vaccines aren’t dangerous at all. You could pump babies with them with no side effects”
    Your statement is NOT correct so I’d be careful with repeating it outside the questioning framework of the CR. Certain vaccines CAN trigger very violent and life-threatening reactions in younger children. I understand your general point that vaccines ordinarily would not be very harmful to most of those inoculated, even if they lack efficacy for their intended target but DON’T make absolute statements.

    #1891413
    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    GH – it’s an anti vaxxer being sarcastic. Nobody else would ever use the phrase ‘pump babies with them’

    #1891441
    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    Emunas – yes, I do agree with that statement that once it is proven safe I won’t care where it came from.

    #1891451
    anonymous Jew
    Participant

    Charlie, unfortunately there will never be a vaccine for Trump Derangement Syndrome
    Neither Trump or most of his supporters are anti science or anti vaccine. Ironically, the progressives argued follow the science only when it supports them. Now that the American Academy of Pediatrics ( among others ) has supported school reopening, the unions have dismissed science.

    #1891541
    som1
    Participant

    “The Trumpies can’t get a consistent message. On the one hand they agree with his anti-science nonsense”
    YOU MEAN THE SCIENCE THAT SAYS COVID-19 IS JUST LIKE THE FLU THEREFORE ITS RACIST TO CLOSE THE BORDER TO CHINA,
    AND THE SCIENCE THAT SAYS DONT WEAR MASKS BECAUSE IT DOESN’T HELP THEN 2 WEEKS LATER EVERYONE WERE MASKS TRUMPS AN IDIOT FOR NOT WEARING MASKS EVEN THOUGH HES SOCIALLY DISTANT
    “and question the efficacy of ALL vaccines.”
    ANTI VACCERS IS NOT PARTISAN THERE’S PEOPLE FROM ALL SIDES OF THE POLITICAL SPECTRUM AND IF ANYTHING ITS MOSTLY PEOPLE ON THE LEFT ANDD I AM A STRONGLY AGAINST ANTI VAXXERS
    “On the other hand they want to believe Vladimir Putin when he says he has a vaccine and want people to take it even though it hasn’t been proven safe, much less efficacious.”
    YOU COULD KEEP HALLUCINATING OF WHAT A I SAID AND KEEP SPEWING FAKE NEWS, BECAUSE I ACTUALLY DONT BELIEVE RUSSIA IS CLOSE TO GETTING A VACCINE NOR WANT PEOPLE TO TAKE IT BEFORE ITS PROVEN EFFECTIVE!!!!!

    #1891552
    mdd1
    Participant

    Som1, how about Trump dismissing the virus at the beginning, wanting to open the country before it was safe to do so, claiming that the US did a better job containing the virus than others?!? Who caused the outbreak down South if not Trump and his rightwing pals? What was the story with that convention that Trump was planning to have in Florida? And then the Republican reshoim go and try to pick on Fauchi’s words to make an idiot out of him and invalidate everything he says? Sure, Carlson and and co. know more about science and medicine than the best doctors!

    #1891571
    2scents
    Participant

    Silly discussion, blaming politicians from the opposing party. As if the local politicians from your own party had any clue what they are doing.

    #1891594
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Som1: Do you really believe that shouting in ALL CAPS lends any greater credibility to your responses? The Trumpkopf has done everything he can to undercut his own Task Force and advisors. He mocks the experts and claims to “know better” than anyone else. He puts lives at risk by discouraging masks and social distancing which are the only current options for lowering the risk of infection. No, he is not to blame for 150, 000 American deaths from Covid19 but he certainly is accountable for some portion of that grim total by making viewing the world from his narcissistic, myopic political lens.

    #1891620
    Shimon Nodel
    Participant

    No, because Russia is a fake country

    #1891623
    som1
    Participant

    “Som1, how about Trump dismissing the virus at the beginning,”
    STOP LYING at the begining trump was the only one who did anything about the virus and all the left wing media and politicians called him racist for closing the border and saying it was just like the flu
    “wanting to open the country before it was safe, to do so,”
    THE WHOLE POINT OF LOCKDOWN WAS NOT TO OVERWHELM THE SYSTEM AND AT NO POINT ANYWHERE IN THE COUNTRY WAS ANY OF THE HOSPITALS OVERWHELMED! EVEN AT THE PEEK IN NY THE JAVITS CENTER TRUMP GAVE CUOMO AND THE HOSPITAL SHIP WAS HARDLY USED!!!
    ” Who caused the outbreak down South if not Trump and his right wing pals?”
    if you used your head for a second and not let the media program you what to think, then you’ll see that there’s a few week brake between reopening and the virus spike and you realize that before the spike there’s tens of thousands of protesters and rioters in the streets right next to each other without a mask encouraged by leftist media and politicians SO USE YOUR HEAD DONT LET THE MEDIA USE IT FOR YOU
    ” What was the story with that convention that Trump was planning to have in Florida? And then the Republican reshoim go and try to pick on Fauchi’s words to make an idiot out of him and invalidate everything he says?”
    FAUCHI HIMSELF INVALIDATES EVERYTHING HE SAYS AND KEEPS ON CHANGING HIS MIND AND HAS LITERALLY SAID THAT NEW YORK HAS DONE A GOOD JOB AND SHOULD BE AN EXAMPLE WHICH IS THE ONLY THING YOU NEED TO QUALIFY ANYONE AS EITHER INSANE OR A LIAR AT THE EXPANSE OF PEOPLES LIVES

    #1891694
    mdd1
    Participant

    Som1, I believe there is no need for further discussions. YOUR WORDS SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES!

    #1891695
    mdd1
    Participant

    And also, Som1, don’t let yourself be programmed by the right- wing media which lies even more than the msm when they want to.

    #1891696
    charliehall
    Participant

    “STOP LYING at the begining trump was the only one who did anything about the virus”

    That is a lie. Schumer, Biden, and Warren called for action on consecutive days in late January while Trump was at the same time doing nothing except banning Chinese citizens (but not others in China) from traveling to the US, and praising Xi Jinping for how well he was doing with the virus. His next action was to ban testing a week and a half later. He would continue to deny that the virus was a major problem for another five weeks after that. And he obstructed the delivery of medical equipment to where it was needed for another two months.

    And the Trunpies complain that De Blasio and Cuomo didn’t shut down early enough even though Trump was at that time denying that there was a problem.

    “AND AT NO POINT ANYWHERE IN THE COUNTRY WAS ANY OF THE HOSPITALS OVERWHELMED”

    Another lie. NYC hospitals had to do massive numbers of things they should not have had to do. They had to reuse personal protective equipment, which certainly spread the virus — because Trump obstructed delivery of PPE. They had to transport patients because hospitals were nearly full. They had to discharge patients too early lest they need death panels to decide who was to be denied care. Oh, and Texas now has such death panels. But the Governor of Texas is a Trumpie Republican — apparently Trumpies can decide to kill people and they don’t get criticized.

    “before the spike there’s tens of thousands of protesters and rioters in the streets”

    After the protests, the rate of new infections, hospitalizations, and deaths in NYC went DOWN. That is because we didn’t open up. In places like Texas they reopened too soon, at about that time. That is how they got death panels. Oh, and the first death panel was in a small county that didn’t have any protests.

    “KEEPS ON CHANGING HIS MIND”

    As any intelligent person does when evidence shows that a mind should be changed. As Ralph Waldo Emerson wrote, ““A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds”.

    #1891697
    charliehall
    Participant

    “Neither Trump or most of his supporters are anti science or anti vaccine.”

    Liar. Trump promoted anti-vax nonsense for years before he became President. Examples:

    “Healthy young child goes to doctor, gets pumped with massive shot of many vaccines, doesn’t feel good and changes – AUTISM. Many such cases!”

    “Massive combined inoculations to small children is the cause for big increase in autism….”

    ““When will NYT write about vaccine damage and its price?””

    ““Autism WAY UP – I believe in vaccinations but not massive, all at once, shots. Too much for small child to handle. Govt. should stop NOW!””

    #1891698
    charliehall
    Participant

    “Now that the American Academy of Pediatrics ( among others ) has supported school reopening, the unions have dismissed science.”

    Also a lie. this is what the American Academy of Pediatrics, the American Federation of Teachers (AFT), National Education Association (NEA) and AASA, The School Superintendents Association, said in a joint statement last month:

    “Educators and pediatricians share the goal of children returning safely to school this fall. Our organizations are committed to doing everything we can so that all students have the opportunity to safely resume in-person learning.

    “We recognize that children learn best when physically present in the classroom. But children get much more than academics at school. They also learn social and emotional skills at school, get healthy meals and exercise, mental health support and other services that cannot be easily replicated online. Schools also play a critical role in addressing racial and social inequity. Our nation’s response to COVID-19 has laid bare inequities and consequences for children that must be addressed. This pandemic is especially hard on families who rely on school lunches, have children with disabilities, or lack access to Internet or health care.

    “Returning to school is important for the healthy development and well-being of children, but we must pursue re-opening in a way that is safe for all students, teachers and staff. Science should drive decision-making on safely reopening schools. Public health agencies must make recommendations based on evidence, not politics. We should leave it to health experts to tell us when the time is best to open up school buildings, and listen to educators and administrators to shape how we do it.

    “Local school leaders, public health experts, educators and parents must be at the center of decisions about how and when to reopen schools, taking into account the spread of COVID-19 in their communities and the capacities of school districts to adapt safety protocols to make in-person learning safe and feasible. For instance, schools in areas with high levels of COVID-19 community spread should not be compelled to reopen against the judgment of local experts. A one-size-fits-all approach is not appropriate for return to school decisions.

    “Reopening schools in a way that maximizes safety, learning, and the well-being of children, teachers, and staff will clearly require substantial new investments in our schools and campuses. We call on Congress and the administration to provide the federal resources needed to ensure that inadequate funding does not stand in the way of safely educating and caring for children in our schools. Withholding funding from schools that do not open in person fulltime would be a misguided approach, putting already financially strapped schools in an impossible position that would threaten the health of students and teachers.

    “The pandemic has reminded so many what we have long understood: that educators are invaluable in children’s lives and that attending school in person offers children a wide array of health and educational benefits. For our country to truly value children, elected leaders must come together to appropriately support schools in safely returning students to the classroom and reopening schools.”

    #1891780
    anonymous Jew
    Participant

    Charlie, the teacher unions all oppose reopening and see no medical risk marching with Black Lives Matter. If health is their only concern, why do the demands include banning charter schools, keeping private schools closed and, in case of the LA union, Medicare for All? The Academy of Pefiatrics says children are suffering more damage staying home.
    Yes, Trump was an anti vaxxer, but he is now pushing for a vaccine. Who cares what he said before. Senator Harris claimed 10 months ago that Biden was a virtual racist ( for associated and cooperating with racist colleagues in the Senate) and a predator,supporting women’s claims against him. Are you now going to hold her to those beliefs as well?

    #1891874
    som1
    Participant

    “And also, Som1, don’t let yourself be programmed by the right- wing media which lies even more than the msm when they want to.”
    TELL ME ONE LIE FROM THE RIGHT WING MEDIA (OR LEFT WING) THAT I REPEATED

    #1891875
    som1
    Participant

    “Schumer, Biden, and Warren called for action on consecutive days in late January while Trump was at the same time doing nothing except banning Chinese citizens (but not others in China) from traveling to the US”
    actually stop lying to yourself schumer biden and warren and practically all on on the left were downplaying it calling it just like the flu or a bad cold and calling trump racist for placing a travel ban
    ” and praising Xi Jinping for how well he was doing with the virus.”
    at that time the world didn’t know that china was lying but once we did trump was harsh on china and ALL THE LEFT WING MEDIA AND POLITICIANS WERE SAYING HOW TRUMP IS CRAZY FOR BLAMING CHINA AND CALLING IT THE CHINA VIRUS, AND INSTEAD CALLED IT THE TRUMP VIRUS, AND PRAISING CUOMO WHO PROBABLY DID THE WORST JOB THEN ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD NO EXAGGERATION

    #1891908
    mdd1
    Participant

    Som1, it was clear from the very beginning (once it appeared in China — before it got anywhere else) that this virus was serious business. It was clear from all the reports — to anybody who is somewhat educated and has his head screwed on right.
    New York has a high death toll — true. But once the virus got seeded in NY, there is only so much Cuomo could do. He appears to have done a great job bringing the virus under control BY APPLYING SCIENTISTS-ADVISED PUBLIC HEALTH MEASURES !!! IN OTHER PLACES IN THE US IT WAS NOT PROPERLY DONE! Thanks to right-wing lunatics. Just closing the border with China to their nationals was not enough. They reopened in the South against advice of the top doctors who were warning it was going to cause what it did.

    #1891990
    n0mesorah
    Participant

    This vaccine inoculates against science.

    #1892007
    som1
    Participant

    “New York has a high death toll — true. But once the virus got seeded in NY, there is only so much Cuomo could do. He appears to have done a great job bringing the virus under control”
    yeh like sending nursing home patients that got the virus back into the nursing home which killed tens of thousands of people !!

    #1892053
    mdd1
    Participant

    There is this accusation about the nursing homes. It needs investigation what he could have done differently, how much he knew etc.

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