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May 2, 2014 3:22 pm at 3:22 pm #612677Sam2Participant
A new Chareidi Hesder Yeshiva is opening up. It doesn’t require you to be in training with the rest of the army as its service focuses on cyber-defense. Anyone have any thoughts on it?
May 2, 2014 4:25 pm at 4:25 pm #1013221☕ DaasYochid ☕ParticipantYou first.
May 2, 2014 4:32 pm at 4:32 pm #1013222Sam2ParticipantDY: I think it’s a good idea and should be a middle ground that (almost) everyone is happy with. They’re learning full-time for 4 out of 6 years once they start (and they don’t have to start at 18). Their service keeps them away from women and other issues in training that people have. They’re on the Machon Lev campus but they can stay relatively isolated so they are not in close quarters with non-CHareidim every day. If more middle-ground solutions like this could be found, I think it will have a profound positive effect on all segments of Israeli society, both Chareidi and Chiloni (and everyone in between). If it works out, I think this is a great thing.
May 2, 2014 4:35 pm at 4:35 pm #1013223popa_bar_abbaParticipantHow many people can do this?
May 2, 2014 4:51 pm at 4:51 pm #1013224☕ DaasYochid ☕ParticipantI hear your point, but I have some doubts.
I hope it doesn’t give the impression that those who choose to remain in exclusive learning yeshivos aren’t doing their fair share.
I don’t know what the qualty of shiurim and learning will be.
I don’t know how much it helps those who have been unsuccessful at keeping sedorim, as it’s designed to be a serious learning program. In fact, I’m not sure who it is the best solution for; how many bochurim can keep two sedorim but not three? And what about the other four years?
It doesn’t answer the taynos that chareidim don’t put themselves at risk (the same way the demand for sheirut leumi doesn’t).
May 2, 2014 4:54 pm at 4:54 pm #1013225HaLeiViParticipantYour description sounds great.
May 2, 2014 5:40 pm at 5:40 pm #1013226Sam2ParticipantDY: It doesn’t answer that, that’s true. But people claiming that aren’t out for blood. They just have a growing frustration with people they consider free-loaders. This would make them not free-loaders. As to your other point, there is a small but noticeable opinion in the anglo-Chareidi community in Israel that those just learning actually aren’t doing their fair share. However, they very strongly think that the problems with the army preclude any way of helping. This is a tremendous option for those people. It’s not meant for dropouts like Nachal Chareidi is/became. It’s meant for those who want to learn seriously but also feel an obligation to help their country.
I made a slight error, by the way. It’s a 4-year program total. The first two years are 2 full Sedarim with tech training at nights. The second two years are army in cyber defense with a full night Seder during those years.
May 2, 2014 6:28 pm at 6:28 pm #1013227To be or not to beMemberI think that would work, but isn’t four years longer than the average Israeli’s army tour? shouldn’t it be three years?
May 2, 2014 6:35 pm at 6:35 pm #1013228☕ DaasYochid ☕ParticipantBut people claiming that aren’t out for blood.
No, for many it’s an understandable emotional issue (we’ve had threads about it, and I’ve dealt with their tayna IRL as well), but this solution, as well as the sheirut leumi idea, shows the illogicality of it.
I don’t think such a program will take off as the standard. You’re asking bochurim to decide at age 18(?) that they will never develop the hasmadah to learn full time. That’s too young, IMO.
May 2, 2014 8:40 pm at 8:40 pm #1013229Sam2Participant2b: Army is 3 years, I think. But Hesder is 5-three years of learning and two of army. So this is a 4-year Hesder program.
May 4, 2014 4:59 am at 4:59 am #1013230rationalfrummieMemberNo one needs to decide what career path they want to pursue at age 18. Some yeshiva guys could dog the 2 years of learning followed by 2 years of service (with night seder), and then continue learning full-time ad meah ve’esrim!
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