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- This topic has 115 replies, 21 voices, and was last updated 1 year ago by n0mesorah.
May 3, 2022 4:50 pm at 4:50 pm #2082448
Having a non-Jew coach a sports league where the kids show up for a few hours and go home, is not what the Shulchan Aruch is discussing. Not even close.May 3, 2022 4:50 pm at 4:50 pm #2082449
By that thinking, a non-Jew teaching Math in a yeshiva would be assur.May 3, 2022 4:58 pm at 4:58 pm #2082425Golden Middle WayParticipant
I long gave up reading this forum because I was quite appalled at the direction of hashkofo it’s taking. However, I do think it is quite amazing that even people who are so far from the truth, still want to follow the ‘yeshiva’ world news. That is a kiddush Hashem in itself. I also do think that some people are having amusement shteching with these negative hashkofos! and finally, I think deep down some of you people are really searching for the truth. You are confused, and this back and forwards is because you want to know the real authentic thing. Shame we don’t have a real rov or godol screening these discussions and giving us the real torahdik hashkofos.May 3, 2022 5:01 pm at 5:01 pm #2082490🍫Syag LchochmaParticipant
considering you only signed up 2 months ago that would be interesting.May 3, 2022 5:18 pm at 5:18 pm #2082502Golden Middle WayParticipant
Sorry I meant I am not enjoying this particular topic on this forum. There is some very good information here. I apologize about not being clear and specificMay 3, 2022 5:21 pm at 5:21 pm #2082512
Syag, you made me laugh today.May 3, 2022 6:55 pm at 6:55 pm #2082510AviraDeArahParticipant
Nomesorah, while there is a small distinction, it’s not as stark as you describe. Having non frum teachers is very bedieved, and only as a matter of last resort. Go ask any menahel about who they choose for English teachers – unfortunately good frum English teachers (for boys’ schools) are rare.
The heter for having such teachers is that they’re in a jewish school and are accountable. They’re subordinate to the guidelines and standards of the school, although i know many, many students who were influenced regardless. I know of a certain English teacher who convinced many boys to go to college against the wishes of their parents and rebbeim, and that’s just the tip of the iceberg.
Here, there’s no one on top of them, as the situation was described as a non-denominational group of kids, some happened to be frum, some weren’t, and there’s a coach who will say heaven knows what to the kids. He might use foul language. He might shmooze with them about girls they have crushes on and encourage it. That’s just the first two examples that come to my head.May 3, 2022 8:45 pm at 8:45 pm #2082555
And you might post in an unbiased fashion.
I know all the chillukim.
But that is not the point.
These issues have nothing to do with an apprenticeship.May 3, 2022 8:45 pm at 8:45 pm #2082541KuvultParticipant
If you can’t have a not Frum coach how can you have not Frum teachers or go to a historical site and listen to the guide? (Though this is probably one reason you don’t want kids to learn secular studies). Maybe weighing the downside of interacting at a young age which is zero against creating positive relationships which payoff in the future the Derech is clear. Unless you believe “They hate us because they hate us” or they’re “jealous” of us; creating trust, understanding and friendship at a young age goes a long way toward things being easier in the future.May 3, 2022 8:52 pm at 8:52 pm #2082557KuvultParticipant
How is there no one on top of them? Do you think the coach wants the management getting complaints from the parents? How is that different then a principal getting complaints about a teacher? It’s amazing how you think your way is the only way that you’ll make stuff up. I’ve worked with kids that were both more Frum and less Frum than me and like every other adult I tailored what I said to who they were.May 3, 2022 9:26 pm at 9:26 pm #2082586AviraDeArahParticipant
Kuvult, i addressed your concern about teachers above. It’s far from a given that we readily employ non frum teachers. I know menahelim who prefer non jewish teachers, because they’re respectful of the institution moreso than non frum or left wing MO.May 3, 2022 10:05 pm at 10:05 pm #2082605
So it is not an issur. And is subject to preferences.May 3, 2022 10:56 pm at 10:56 pm #2082638Always_Ask_QuestionsParticipant
Avira > I know of a certain English teacher who convinced many boys to go to college against the wishes of their parents and rebbeim, and that’s just the tip of the iceberg.
A plug for online schools (or having cameras in the class that parents could watch): I hear all shtus that teachers might say and discuss with the kids. Equivalent to what amom suggests: inviting people to your own house instead of sending them somewhere to interact with strangers.May 5, 2022 10:26 am at 10:26 am #2083359hujuParticipant
I was going to start a thread called “non-youthful Misconceptions,” but then I realized the Coffee Room already has that covered.May 5, 2022 11:26 am at 11:26 am #2083372commonsaychelParticipant
@huju, this is one of the times at I agree with you 100%, amazing how this thread was hijacked.May 5, 2022 11:46 am at 11:46 am #2083418
When I get old, I’m going to think that I’m right.
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