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LIVE BLOG: ISRAEL AT WAR – DAY 203


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493 Responses

  1. Such unspeakable carnage:- The Following must sadly be said:- Cause & effect:- This is what transpires when:-
    1) viscous self hating Jews interfere with מחיצה in Dizengoff & other places during נעילה when our fates are being sealed
    2) When leftists show total disregard & total disrespect for moral & religious Jews
    3) When we didn’t have תקיעת שופר to protect us during 1st morning of ראש-השנה when our fates are being written

  2. Israel failed and is still failing

    I hear Kahana saying I told you so, I hear the many Gedolim screaming I told you so.

    אם השם לא ישמור עיר שוא….

    You think heads will roll? Neh
    You think BIBI wil doing anything meaningful? Neh! (He will talk big…)

    You think they will carpet bomb as they should? Neh!

    You think they will endanger their own Jewish soldiers so not to extract too much damage in Gaza, so the Jew hating media and the other liberals won’t talk so much bad about us? YES! R’L

    Already they are asking the Americans for more shields (band aids) instead of going on the offensive and extracting such a high cost from the Gaza a that they won’t even think of accidentally throwing even a rock let alone a rockets

    The Israeli politicians are weak and many are evil

  4. @147 How is your first response to play the blame game?! Do you think you bear no personal responsibility? Do you think I bear no personal responsibility? Do you think us frum Yidden bear no responsibility, and ‘its only those leftists’? What an absolutely disgusting take! It sickens me that you are so wrapped up in politics that you don’t even have a basic level of critical thought or self-reflection.

    If the first thing you think is who else and what else is to blame, you are a sick, sick person, with your neshama rotted away.

  5. @y2r What a sick and wretched person you are. Yidden are rachmanim, bayshanim, and gomlei chassadim – not cynical politics-obsessed people who are so rotten to the core that when seeing 700 dead, 2,500 injured, and 200 captured Yidden, all they have to say is a cynical political take.

    How low you have fallen, you are sick in the head – the very Yiddishe middos inside of you have rotted away and been replaced with fatal cynicism. You have no ability to just mourn, no ability to be nosei be’ol – instead you immediately use this situation as a jumping board for your political discourse.

    What a sick person you are. Your actions disgust me to my very core.

  7. Time for immediate serious Teshuva and Achdus together ASAP as one loving nation. Nothing just happens by coincidence “Ain poranius baolam ela bishvil yisroel” everything has a direct wake up call message from Hashem our loving father even if there are no Yidden involved in the tragedy.

    Are we going to finally stop living in denial and FACE REALITY and accept Hashems wake up call for serious Teshuva and Achdus together ASAP as one loving nation so Hashem can send Mashiach already bkarov and stop this time of no stop horrific tragedies worldwide in klal yisroel?

  11. In the 1980s, a Rabbi from Brooklyn made aliyah and became a member of Knesset.

    If only we listened to him in the 1980s, then this would not be happening in 2023 CE.

    How to Solve the Palestinian Problem:

    The best way to deal with the so-called “Palestinians” is to send them [with one-way tickets] to the prison-like detention centers in China’s northwestern region of Xinjiang.

    These are the same detention centers where China’s Muslims are forced to live.

    The Chinese are experts at dealing with Muslim terrorists.

    After many years, so-called “Palestinians” will forget about so-called “Palestine”.
    PROBLEM SOLVED!!!

  14. Hashem tzodek. It is all spelled out in parshas nitzavim. Gofris vamelach sreifah kol arzta. We don’t keep the Torah Hashem warned us. Its not this polotician or the leftists or the neturei karta or Biden or Bibi. It is me and you!!!!
    ANYTHING ELSE IS ABSOLUTE KEFIRAH!!!!!!

  16. Best סגולה for Israel right now, is to immediately release Yigal Amir from prison, and totally exonerate him.
    To give an idea of the enormity of this crisis, Israel has already lost a higher % of its population to this carnage, than America lost on 9/11

  17. Should israel bomb iran because iran funds hamas and helped them

    What about making peace with saudis when this is how they react to jews getting murdered

    N

  18. When Achav was our king many years ago, we went to battle and we won every single battle and not even one Yid was hurt. The Midrash explains this secret how come no one got hurt: All the Jewish people were getting along with each other (99%)-Frum or not Frum or in between-They all got along-Zero fighting amongst each other.

  19. The Ministry of Foreign Affairs confirmed that the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia is closely following the developments of the unprecedented situation between a number of Palestinian factions and the Israeli occupation forces, which resulted in the high level of ongoing violence on a number of fronts there.

    Saudi Arabia called for an immediate halt to the escalation between the two sides, civilian protection and restraint.
    Saudi Arabia recalls its repeated warnings of the dangers of the explosion of the situation as a result of the continuation of the occupation, the denial of the Palestinian people of their legitimate rights and the repetition of systematic provocations against their sanctities.
    Saudi Arabia renews the call of the international community to assume its responsibilities and activate a credible peace process leading to the two-state solution in order to achieve security and peace in the region and protect civilians.

    Translated from
    Saudi arabic news

  21. The majority of the israeli security cabinet has been accused of corruption
    And the minister barak and gantz had their cellphones hacked days prior to this
    This gov is so incompetent and corrupt how can it manage to deal with this terrible situation?

  22. @amiricanyeshivish
    Stop the self flagellation. No Jew is responsible for what Hamas have done/are doing. It is written in their Quran that all Jews should be eliminated before their day of judgement arrives. They won’t stop no matter how hard you study and keep the Torah.

  23. They got caught with their pants down, that’s for sure. Busha on the lack of intel …cherpa on the loss of life HYD. Useless Israeli Govt.

    אין לנו להישען אלא לאבינו שבשמים

  24. They have one in Tel Aviv and in Jerusalem

    Also,
    Thw agudas yisroel should give more money to ukraine and continue to do nothing but advocate for useless
    Kollel spending and patronizing corrupt israeli governments with all the priveleges of the israel american taxpayers
    The agudas yisroel is composed of a few corrupt oligarchs who “run” the community by making it into an elite social club favoring them and their families. The agudas yosroel needs to stick it where the sun doesnt shine.

    Israel has big problems. It needs permission from america. The secretary of state is a gay jew from yonkers and the israeli gov is composed of corrupt israeli orthodox bigots and cleptocrats.

    Iran has a nuclear bomb and that means that israel no longer has thst deterernt.

    Saudi and the other muslim countries seems to be playing both sides and saying that the american public cares more about saving money at the gas pump than keeping israel jewish.

  26. America needs to stand by its word and not break its alliance with israel. Israel was attacked by Iran, directly. American assets and citizens were targeted. Now israel needs to bomb iran and it cant because america wont give it permission. How many more terorist attacks like this until they eliminate the snakes in iran

  27. America needs to stand by its word and not break its alliance with israel. Israel was attacked by Iran, directly. American assets and citizens were targeted. Now israel needs to bomb iran and it cant because america wont give it permission. How many more terorist attacks like this until they eliminate the snakes in iran

    Saudi needs the oil price above approx 88-89 usd to earn a profit and it is happy to keep the price high. It says it will produce more oil for peace w israel but it is run by a dishonest murderer no different than hamas who is freidns with america ( mohamed bin salman )
    Who can trust these people!

  29. it’s true that many countries in the Middle East have rulers or leaders who have been in power for extended periods, often exceeding 20 years. This phenomenon is observed in various countries across the region, including Israel and several Arab nations.

    In Israel, the political landscape has seen long-serving leaders and individuals who have held significant influence for extended periods. For example, Benjamin Netanyahu served as Prime Minister for a total of over 15 years, non-consecutively, until 2021. Similarly, other countries in the region have had leaders with long tenures.

    Political stability, historical and cultural factors, governing structures, and geopolitical dynamics all contribute to the longevity of leaders in the Middle East. However, it’s important to note that the political landscape is constantly evolving, and leadership situations can change over time.

  30. it’s true that many countries in the Middle East have rulers or leaders who have been in power for extended periods, often exceeding 20 years. This phenomenon is observed in various countries across the region, including Israel and several Arab nations.

    In Israel, the political landscape has seen long-serving leaders and individuals who have held significant influence for extended periods. For example, Benjamin Netanyahu served as Prime Minister for a total of over 15 years, non-consecutively, until 2021. Similarly, other countries in the region have had leaders with long tenures.

    Political stability, historical and cultural factors, governing structures, and geopolitical dynamics all contribute to the longevity of leaders in the Middle East. However, it’s important to note that the political landscape is constantly evolving, and leadership situations can change over time.

    Bibi has been president for 20 years and did nothing yet we praise him

  31. carrie11
    You are an apikorus. Yes, they plan, but ultimately it’s only Hashem who gives them success. It was Him who protected (and continues to protect) from their countless attempts to murder Israelis. Thousands of times their plans were thwarted, and this was totally messed up, way beyond the wildest imagination of the worst terrorists.
    תלמוד בבלי מסכת יבמות דף סג עמוד א
    אין פורענות באה לעולם אלא בשביל ישראל
    of course we should do some serious introspection.
    אין אדם נוקף אצבעו מלמטה אלא א”כ מכריזין עליו מלמעלה
    even the tiniest pain only happens if it’s been decreed on by The One Above.
    May we all get a chizuk from this, do teshuva, shteig, and see nissim v’niflaos, yeshuos v’nechomos!

  32. @carrie11 but what he said is truth. They said it many times ices social media and on main stream media, that they are at war with the religion. They declared war on Torah. They went on Simchas Torah which called in Shabbos to dance in front of Hamas controlled Gaza. They arrived by car and blasted music. You have to be blind if you think that H’ didn’t allow this to happen. And a koffer as well. The situation of awful. That being said, I’m still losing sleep over their murdered and their kidnaps, still crying for them, I’m still praying for them, and still being H’ to return the captives.

  33. ‘carrie11: this is TOTAL KEFIROH!!! A few weeks ago, 6 terrorists were killed from a bomb they intended to throw at Israeli solders – that what happens when HASHEM does protect us.
    Sadly, for some reason, HKB”H decided on Simchas Torah to remove his protection and allow the tragedy to happen.
    It is noteworthy, that the carnage started at a major chilul shabbos event on a day when a million Jews in Israel called ויכולו – teaching us to increase shmiras shabbos. This was also emphasised by many Rabbonim following the omission of Shofar on the 1st day of Rosh Hashonon due to Shabbos concerns.

  34. @Bochur01 – normally I would agree with your comment about the Blame Game, but in this case, captured terrorists have stated that the protests that have been going on recently actually encouraged them to enact this attack at this time.
    When Jews are feuding among themselves our enemies are encouraged to attack.

  35. It’s amazing all the nonsense and blame on the secular israloes that are all.tinuk shnishbas that never knew anything better. As far as I remember 6 million innocent jews were killed in cold blood during the holocaust including 1 million children that never sinned and millions of holy tzadikim were all killed and they all were murdered for unknown reasons..

  36. sad, I agree with all of the above but now it is a different time….go out to the nearest burger or food stores and ask if they are delivering to the IDF and give them an order pay for it and send it off…..drop the language and yes we are all complacent in this….I am frum but not always and I am sad that I wasn’t always….so being frum a jew is truth…..go out and support those whose stores are closed and give them parnassah and have them sent your goodies to the nice soldiers, police and ima’s and Tati’s that are helping if you can’t…plain and simple, Bibi has done what he could against so many liberal and disgusting plans, but , that is all gone now and we want our babies home fast…..lets all do tschuva on this page, I am sorry for the pain I caused and I hope all on this page is safe, has families that are safe and lets use YWN for prayers and not hate…big hugs, I learnt a major lesson guys, instead of anger at your neighbor, be hurt and angered at all the goyem coming into our country and not behaving……this is the problem and not us….hugs again, I am sorry if I harmed anyone and we are family

  37. I don’t see anyone mentioning Hashem here! All this is yadHashem! We can’t judge why Hashem is doing it but certainly everyone must do teshuva! Rav Elbaz says there must be achdus. Why do we wait for a war before we become united?! Yes , the frummer need to work on achdus! Of course the left are at fault too. But can we blame them when they are totally ignorant? Therefore we have to be mekarev them and make sure to cause a kiddush Hashem with all out actions so that there will be no finger pointing at us. This is so important as we are Hashems representatives in the world!

  38. Bochur01 so according to you it was the victims fault…like the victims of the holocaust. They should have looked into themselves. Basically they deserved it.
    Very nice musar. What yeshiva are you in again?
    I think the only one that’s sick here is you. Take your head out of your sand.

  39. According to press reports (which in wartime are often a source of “fake news”), many of the civilians murdered were non-Jewish tourists attending a goyish music festival. This will significantly anger the countries they came from, as well as serious discrediting left wing opposition to Israel.

    There seems to be an international consensus that Iran was involved, as well as organizations operating within and with the toleration or support of the governments of Syria and Lebanon, and it is important to note that Iran and Russia the major supporters of the Syrian government – meaning there is a great opportunity for this to cease being the “Arab-Israel” conflict and become part of a broader conflict.

  40. @carrie11

    In the end of the day, we are in Galus because of our actions, and learning Torah and davening for the Geulah is the only thing that will stop Hamas. As long as we aren’t Zocheh for the Geulah and continuing to do averios and not learning Torah, then we are responsible and deserve anything that happens to us. I say deserved since everything that happens in this world is because of Hashem and anything Hashem allows to happen to the Yidden is because on Rosh Hashanah he paskened that we deserve it. Also learning Torah and davening isn’t supposed to stop Hamas directly but in order for Hashem to find us Zocheh to be protected from sinum am Yisroel.

  43. 147: On top of all your other mindless posts, your comment about freeing a murdering Jewish terrorist from jail to further exacerbate the tragedy we are experiencing. The singular focus for now is to destroy and annihilate Hamas/IJ terrorists in Gaza and Hezbolah and their surrogates in the North should they dare to initiate hostilities (which I sense may have already begun).

  44. @Carrie11
    Rav Shternbuch has said the opposite. He said that everyone should learn more because THAT will save people. He said it is pikuch nefesh. Do you believe Hashem runs the world or those savage beasts???

  45. @goldpen
    It has nothing to do with the cabinet or gov or Arab animals. We need to do teshuvah and strengthen our avodas Hashem. Only HE runs the world. Let us remember that!!!

  46. @carrie11
    It’s true they won’t stop no matter what, “eisav soneh l’Yaakov”.
    The point @Americanyeshivish is trying to make is, the toll of the attacks can be zero if we only keep the Torah, if we get along with one another.
    Your statement is Kefira as it’s written ain poronius elah bishvil yisrael. Any tragedy in the world including tsunamis in Japan are meant to be a wake up call to do teshuva.
    How much more so an attack on actual Yidden in Eretz Yisroel.
    God will punish the resha’im responsible, the hamas terrorist who orchestrated this attack, yet at the same time time WE must follow the directive of our father Yaakov Avinu when he went to fight the original war against our nation and daven to the Ribono Shel Oilam for a salvation, may it come speedily.

  48. U.S. military aid to israel and Egypt is about 2.67 and 1.6 billion annually.

    Americans consume about 9 million barrels of oil per day.

    Any difference in price fluctuations means billions of dollars in america or in foreign rivals pockets aid makes sense to make sure the Suez Canal stays open so europe can get its gas and that israel keeps a watch on those Saudi , iranian Iraqi and Syrian oil producers

    In a way israel makes money off of the pollution too

  51. @carrie11 – This is basics of Judaism… Not sure where you’re at, but you are 100% wrong. This only happened because Hashem wanted it to and let it happen, and that is our fault. Hashem is forced to send us wake up calls and to punish us when we fail to serve Him correctly. It is our misdeeds that have caused this, we are the ones that caused it and we are the ones that can stop it (by correcting what caused Hashem to have to bring this upon us).

  52. @147; @DavidtheKanoi

    Not blowing Shofar when the first day of Rosh Hashonoh falls on Shabbos DOES NOT diminish Divine protection. Although the Gemoro does say כל שנה שאין תוקעין לה בתחלתה מריעין לה בסופה, Tosafos quotes the Behag who says explicitly לאו דאיקלע בשבתא אלא דאתיליד אונסא, the Gemoro is not referring to a year in which Rosh Hashonoh fell on Shabbos, but rather to a year when an אונס occurred and prevented the blowing of the Shofar.
    We didn’t blow the Shofar this year because Chazal told us not to; this can only increase Divine protection.

  54. @gold pen
    Calling Kollel spending ‘useless’ is, at the very least, uncomfortably close to Apikorsus. The Gemoro tells us that one who says,”מאי אהנו לן רבנן” is considered an Apikoros.

  55. Is bibi just trying to
    Save face to stay in powrr or is he powerless because americans wont give permission to use american weapons freely

  57. Much of this discussion is rather silly. Of course there is Yad Hashem in everything. That is undeniable. But this doesn’t absolve us from doing what we need to do. Picture spending the week doing nothing, accepting that Hashem decreed our parnosoh on Rosh Hashanah. That never meant that we should not go to work. To sit back and claim that Hashem is doing this, so let’s do nothing and let Hamas y”sh do their thing. This is stupid, murderous, and suicidal. We remain obligated to do what we need to, and that means military intervention. My gut tells me that we need a ground war, but these decisions are left to the military experts. And, obviously, they need Syatta Dishmaya for all they will do. Every zechus can help.

    So these accusations about kefira ring hollow. We need to be realistic and study what did happen, what is occurring now, and daven our hearts out.

  58. If those posting comments would use correct spelling and punctuation, the rest of us not used to texting gobbledygook might read their infinite wisdom without the need for translations.

  59. A lot of republicans don’t want to arm Ukraine and Israel. I say arm our Allie’s so they can fight Russia and terrorists

  60. In gaza
    They are more
    Frum and they all enlist and fight
    But in israel they arent so frum they just read the books and arent men of action

  61. @Gedol Hador: No one said not blowing the Shofar on 1st day R”H diminshes divine protection. However, there is a lot being written and said about that subject. My Rav in his droshoh clearly said it must go hand-in-hand with Shmiras Shabbos.
    He cited a moshel of a minister who has offended against the King. His wife came to his defense and that worked. Later another minister also offended, and tried the same trick to bring his wife to speak up for him. But when the King saw her brusied he found out she was often abused by her husband, so the King didn’t accept her defense – the same with Shabbos, if we claim to omit Shofer because of Shabbos, we can only do so if we are truly honoring it.
    I do however, support your later post of מאי אהנו לן רבנן

  62. Israel is often touted by high ranking politicians and government figures as americas greatest ally.
    Let’s not for political reasons compare Ukraine to Israel

  63. @sechel83 October 8, 2023 10:43 pm at 10:43 pm
    (ראה שיחת פרשת ויחי תנש”א (תורת מנחם

    What does it say ? (or atleast provide a link please)

  64. IDF: INCIDENT DOESN’T REPRESENT TIES WITH EGYPTIAN ARMY
    Troops killed along Egypt border named: Ohad Dahan, Lia Ben Nun, Ori Yitzhak Iluz
    Senior officer says nothing to stay ‘unsolved’ in probe of attack by Egyptian policeman who infiltrated into Israel, remained undetected for hours before and after initial shooting

  65. The three Israeli soldiers killed by an Egyptian policeman in attacks on the border on Saturday morning were named by the Israel Defense Forces as Staff Sgt. Ohad Dahan, Sgt. Lia Ben Nun, and Staff Sgt. Ori Yitzhak Iluz.

    Iluz, 20, from the northern city of Safed, and Ben Nun, 19, from Rishon Lezion served as combat soldiers in the Bardelas Battalion. Dahan, 20, from the southern city of Ofakim, served in the Caracal Battalion.

  66. They were posthumously promoted from the ranks of sergeant to staff sergeant and corporal to sergeant, respectively.

    There are five mixed-gender infantry units within the IDF’s Border Defense Corps, which is responsible for defending Israel’s borders with Jordan, Egypt, as well as the West Bank security barrier. The Bardelas and Caracal battalions are tasked with the Egyptian border.

  67. The circumstances of the incidents on Saturday, which occurred between Mount Sagi and Mount Harif in the Negev desert, were under investigation by the military, including how the gunman, an Egyptian policeman, managed to infiltrate Israel from Egypt and remain undetected for several hours before and after the initial attack.

    According to IDF spokesman Rear Admiral Daniel Hagari, Ben Nun and Iluz began a 12-hour shift together at 9 p.m. on Friday night at a military post on the Egyptian border. After the soldiers did not answer calls on the radio on Saturday morning, an officer reached the scene and discovered the pair dead in separate areas of the post. Hagari said the IDF believed they were killed at around 6 or 7 a.m.

  68. Several hours later, shortly before noon, the Egyptian policeman attacked troops who were scanning the area. During the clash, Dahan was killed and a non-commissioned officer was lightly wounded. The gunman was killed several minutes later by another group of soldiers, according to the military.

    The IDF was investigating how and when the Egyptian attacker infiltrated into Israel, how he was not detected for several hours, and what the military could have done to prevent the deaths of the three soldiers.

  72. To Bochur01

    Relax, stop calling names, especially to people you know nothing about.

    We all know that we need to do תשובה and Daven, עת צרה היא ליעקב

    But have you learned Gitin the past Tisha B’av?
    אמר רבי יוחנן, ענותנותו של רבי זכריה בן אבקילוס החריבה את ביתנו’ וכו’,

    We see that even after looking into oneself one should take out general lessons

    They say once some one was R’L hit by a car and everyone said תשובה….. Rabbi Miller said let’s learn a lesson, “look carefully before. You cross the street”

    Yes we are all very hurt, and we all feel absence of urgency to do תשובה and be better at the same time we feel sick to the bones for the EVILNESS that was done to our brothers and sisters. YES WE WANT REVENGE, in the biggest way possible ( that is a torah concept!!!)

    We want to learn lessons so we can do our Hishtadlus to protect our fellow Yidden with Hashems help of course!!!!

  73. I am someone that was extremely horrified and heartbroken for the families of the dead and the captured when i first saw the news about the attacks.However as i started to think more about it something bothered me.Right now I’m specifically thinking about the deaths by the rave.Let’s say 250 people were brutally murdered in algeria in cold blood what would my response have been?I would have probably been disgusted and horrified ,but i wouldn’t have been as emotionally invested in the pain and the death as i was when in hapened in “Israel”.Now let’s think, who was at this rave and what was happening?It was a bunch of mushchasim including a decent amount of full-fledged goyim who were high, getting drunk and doing all sorts of disgusting acts of pritzus and znus while at a goyish music festival.This took place on admas kodoesh in the paltarin shel melech and without question caused tremendous tzaar to the shechinah.After thinking about this why are we mourning these deaths this way ?what connection do we have to these people they are not yidden they are israelis.I’m not at all saying that what I’m saying is proper or correct and am writing this in order that if I’m wrong which i may be what am i thinking wrong

  75. When they say civilians know that in reality, Hamas regular military force consisted almost entirely of light infantry and short-range fires capabilities. All other warfighting functions are performed by civilians—local and foreign—contributing population support within gazas dense urban environment . Mission command is facilitated by civilian couriers who provided assured communications. Intelligence comes from civilian human and open-source intelligence analysis. Civilians dig communications tunnels and trenches, drive bulldozers to build berms, and serve as mobile protection platforms to deter idf strikes. Civilian households distribute all classes of supply to Hamas units and provide medical support, and civilian labor manufactured weapons including precision missles, anti aircraft guns, IEDs, and suicide vest IEDs from commercial off-the-shelf components or even weapons grade explosives smuggled from iran and other state arsenals.
    In my opinion
    that much of this population support is involuntary, yet their physical contribution to Hamas’ war effort is critical to the duration and effectiveness of Hamas’ operational reach.
    Hamas harnessed the millions of civilians in Gazas economic footprint to produce and distribute supplies with minimal manpower, providing an extremely favorable tooth-to-tail ratio that allowed them to project more combat power further than a similar conventionally organized and sustained force. On the opposite side, the same civilian population does comparatively little to enhance idf operations. Once liberated by the idf, civilians escaped to safety and the idf expends resources and combat power to secure and sustain the civilians: soldiers distributed supplies, provided medical care, and constructs shelters, adding to a net reduction in idf operational reach.

  76. Wow, the pontificating here is impressive. (Sarcasm). Y’all clearly know everything and the IDF should listen to you. (Again, sarcasm).

    On a more serious note, if you would like to do something effective, you can get the names of soldiers fighting. Each of you can pick a name and learn Torah and Daven in 18 hour day shifts in that soldier’s merit until he/she (get real, there are more than likely female soldiers and cops fighting alongside male colleagues) leaves Gaza.

  77. @VoiceofReason2005 It may punkt be partly true, but that guy is obviously a sick degenerate – besides for it being quite clear from the language of his post, he was literally the first poster – yom tov finished, he looked at the news, and said ‘Aha – its the leftists at it again!’ He is clearly sick and rotten to the core – the very Yiddishe middos in him have been rotted away.

    In addition to the fact that I see no reason for it to be reported on that a Hamas terrorist purportedly said they were encouraged by Leftist riots – it is completely useless information, for sure for us, and it serves only to distract us from the pain of other Yidden, and the fact that Hashem brought this upon us.

  79. @147, The level of infighting in Israel for months leading up to the attack was indeed frightening, and to Hamas own admission, emboldened them to harm us.
    The achdus this national tragedy has generate is unprecedented. Hashem gave us a painful surgery to keep our body intact. Whoever continues to engage in hateful rhetoric and sinas chinam is getting off the operating table during surgery. Hate toward our brothers is more dangerous than anything else.
    As a frum Yid living in Israel, I can say that even the unaffiliated have awoken to teshuva after the attack, so why continue to spew virulent hate at our (less fortunate) unaffiliated brethren?? You should be davening for them instead…

  80. פרקי דרבי אליעזר פרק לב

    ששה נקראו בשמותן עד שלא נולדו ואלו הן, יצחק, וישמעאל, ומשה רבינו, ושלמה, ויאשיהו, ושמו של משיח שיביא הקב״ה במהרה בימינו… ישמעאל מנין, שנאמר וקראת שמו ישמעאל. ולמה נקרא שמו ישמעאל, שעתיד הקב״ה לשמוע נאקת העם ממה שעתידין בני ישמעאל לעשות בארץ באחרית הימים, לפיכך נקרא שמו ישמעאל, שנאמר ישמע אל ויענם.

  81. Lets not get too uppity about non-frum people being targeted.

    We are sitting here in London wondering who will be next. There have already been robberies in Golders Green and elsewhere, antisemitic slogans painted, and pro-Hamas rallies, all egged on by our equivalents of Ilhan Omar and the like. The picture in the US is the same – or will be.

    These people don’t care who is frum or not frum. We have known this for hundreds of years now.

  82. @DavidtheKanoi

    Thank you for clarifying your comment. However, saying, “No one said not blowing the Shofar on 1st day R”H diminishes divine protection,” is incorrect: even if you didn’t say that, @147 certainly did.
    I’m afraid I also disagree with what your Rov said: those Yidden who didn’t blow Shofar this year because of Shabbos (but would otherwise have done so) are mostly shomrei Shabbos; those who are mechalelei Shabbos would probably not have blown the Shofar anyway, not just because of Shabbos concerns. And even if there are mechalelei Shabbos who didn’t blow Shofar this year, surely that is better than if they had blown the Shofar? I mean, would your Rov tell a mechalel Shabbos that since he anyway doesn’t keep Shabbos he should blow the Shofar on Shabbos? Or that if he can’t walk to Shul on Shabbos he should drive?

  83. Pentagon Official: “We do not rule out carrying out a special operation to liberate our citizens in Gaza.”

    I’ll believe it when I see it, and if it does happen it needs to happen”IMMEDIATELY” because time is running out for these precious souls.
    Not to say that Israel alone (obviously with Hashen’s help) can’t do it, but after all the USA has the “BEST” special forces in the “ENTIRE WORLD”.

    Just a thought !!!!!

  84. Do you have a son in Mesivta/Beis Medrash that wants to help fight this war?

    They can fight in a powerful way by committing to 5 mins of learning a day as a zchus for a young chayal on the frontlines.

    To join, email [email protected] and they will receive a name of a chayal

  85. Dear all, important message: in a few hours, Hamas terrorists will be posting photos and videos of hostages and torture on all social media platforms. The Israeli Government requests two things that you can also do:

    1.Absolutely do not share these videos or photos; they are part of psychological warfare against Israel and even against you.

    2.Absolutely prevent your children from watching them; they are not suitable for children and will be terrifying.
    So, perhaps it’s a good idea to have a conversation about this and make it clear that, aside from being Jewish and Zionists, which we appreciate, these are human beings who are being objectified and exploited for visibility, likes, and to compromise our Jewish spirit.

    I appeal to everyone, if you want to help Israel, this is one of the ways.
    Thank you.

    Please share the message

  87. Can you please put titles over the videos the same way you put title over the blog posts?
    I would like to have a clue what I am about to watch before clicking on a video.
    @mods:
    Feel free to not allow this comment through. It is intended as a request for management, not directed to the public

  88. Based on all the facts trickling in:

    We have witnessed a full fledged POGROM in 2023!!

    #NeverAgain is not a thing from the past!

    We need to do Teshuva!
    We need Achdus / Unity!
    We need to do Hishtadlus!

    Always remember:
    !אם ה’ לא ישמר עיר – שוא שקד שומר”

  89. @Gedol Hador / @DavidtheKanoi
    The above-mentioned fact of RH on Shabbos was written by the most prestigious German Posek of over 150 Yrs ago.
    Aruch LaNer

  91. as the brisker ruv said “the medinah will only bring shfichas dumim (bloodshed) to yiden”,
    since the world war 2 there was no place in the all globe that Jews has been killed like in this medinah day after day ,even in Iran itself where they are killing and hanging people, the Jews are not getting killed, they are not scared to go on the streets, “ani matir es besarchem” hasem yrachem olainu, it is time to say for Hashem OK we are doing tshoova , we don’t want any more from deep of oure hearth, and not interesting any more to have a medinah before Mashiach, please Hashem we trust you you know how to take care

  94. @HJtE4UE-“it is time to say for Hashem OK we are doing tshoova , we don’t want any more from deep of oure hearth, and not interesting any more to have a medinah before Mashiach, please Hashem we trust you you know how to take care”

    So are you suggesting to lose the war? Or just hand over the keys willfully?

  95. @HJtE4UE-Besides, if Hashem didnt want Jews controlling Israel, there were plenty of wars that could have been lost. 1948 Independence war, 1967 6-day war, and 1973 Yom Kippur war, all wars that were MIRACULOUSLY won which was a clear indication it was Hashems will. Its impossible to explain these victories in a natural way.

  99. וְלֹֽא־תָקִ֤יא הָאָ֙רֶץ֙ אֶתְכֶ֔ם בְּטַֽמַּאֲכֶ֖ם אֹתָ֑הּ כַּאֲשֶׁ֥ר קָאָ֛ה אֶת־הַגּ֖וֹי אֲשֶׁ֥ר לִפְנֵיכֶֽם: (ויקרא פרק יח פסוק כח)

    רש”י:
    ולא תקיא הארץ אתכם – משל לבן מלכים שהאכילוהו דבר מאוס , שאינו עומד במעיו אלא מקיאו; כך ארץ ישראל אינה מקיימת עוברי עברה (ראה תו”כ קדושים פרשתא י פרק יא , יד). “ו
    לא תרוקן” (ת”א) – לשון ריקון , מריקה עצמה מהם

  100. the Israeli government need anyways to be totally and completely distorted before moshiach will come , as the gemura say’s in sanhdrin that this government is holding up the geulah ,
    so the only thing you need to do is to daven to hashme
    pleas hashem destroy the medinah without any Jewish blood loses , and do not daven to hashem that the Zionist government shell win the war because then you are again pushing off the geulah,
    just wait for hashme and trust him to do his job with neesim more than the neesim in mitzrayim
    and chas veshuom dont be happy with the Zionist strikes holding up the geulah further ,

  101. SHAME ON YOU, who use the dead of 1000s of yidden for your political propaganda!!!!!! Disgusting! I have seen the same during the start of the Ukraine War, where people were cheering Putin.

  104. HJtE4UEh, do you not consider the mass intermarriage and assimilation in the US as bloodshed? Is it not remarkable to you that compared to other demographics, the Jewish population in the US has remained relatively stagnant for decades?

  105. Gaza Resident to BBC: “We are the people who are not part of this conflict and we’re paying it off.”
    Are they not? Who celebrated following the massacre?
    Who cheered when a holocaust survivor and other hostages were paraded?
    Who gives moral and practical support to Hamas?
    Who does not have a Son, a brother a cousin a terrorist?
    The Nazis could not have murdered 6m Yidden without the support of the local population in the various countries, neither could Hamas operate without the help of the so-called [not-so] innocent civilians!

  106. it’s a good thing that more people don’t read the demoralizing rubbish in the comments, or they might come to the conclusion that jews aren’t worthy of having their own lemonade stand, let alone their own country.

  108. Our prayers have to be directed to hashem that he should do nissim and to protect all of jewery. We don’t have to teach hashem how to protect us our prayers should not be directed that the IDF should be successful our prayers have to be directly to hashem and only he can decide how to protect kllal yourself. We don’t have to advise hashem how to do it. The IDF is worthless if not guided and protected by the almighty unfortunately the larger part of the IDF are Jews that do not follow the Torah unfortunately this is how they were brought up in their schools that is and was run by the Medina kefirah.

  110. Why not make an iron dome that shoots at the exact location where the shots came from? Does seem like Israel wants to prevent future shots.

  111. The gov of qatar is activeharboring hamas that is why they are always the “neutral” party
    Qatar should hand over the hamas operatives it is harboring and those terrorists should be put on trial.

  112. The arabs shouldnt be involved in negotiations unless they are willing to accept the refugees.
    This is absurd. Its the fox guarding the henhouse.
    U.S. WRONG TO INVOLVE QATAR AND TURKEY IN ISRAELI HOSTAGE NEGOTIATIONS Latest Developments
    Turkey and Qatar are reportedly working with the United States to broker a “ceasefire” or “hostage exchange” between Israel and Hamas. At the same time, Israeli officials are preparing to destroy Hamas as a terrorist organization capable of inflicting further harm on Israel. Any premature ceasefire or hostage negotiation that forces Israel to back down from military retaliation and puts more Hamas terrorists on the battlefield would hamper Israel’s efforts.

    Turkey and Qatar are state sponsors of Hamas. Their potential role in a ceasefire or hostage negotiations raises questions as to whether the United States will push Ankara and Doha to close Hamas offices, expel Hamas officials, and cut off financial support to the Hamas government in the Gaza Strip.

    Expert Analysis
    “The Obama administration attempted to rely on these sponsors of Hamas in 2014. Israel opposed it then. So did Egypt. I don’t see what would change here. They remain sponsors of Hamas, and they have no business negotiating anything, except perhaps the reparations they owe the Israelis for loss of life and limb over the years.” — Jonathan Schanzer, FDD Senior Vice President for Research

    “Washington would only be undermining Israel’s military posture and rewarding both Iran and Hamas by working with either Turkey or Qatar on a ceasefire or terrorist prisoner release. A better policy would be to use sanctions pressure against Ankara and Doha to force the closure of Hamas offices, expulsion of Hamas officials, and termination of financial support to Hamas by both capitals. Turkish Airlines and Qatar Airways should not be allowed in U.S. airspace so long as Hamas gets safe harbor.” — Richard Goldberg, FDD Senior Advisor

    “Qatar understands the gravity of Hamas’ attack on Israel and is now out in full force trying to rewind the clock to October 6, offering all kinds of de-escalation, truce, and even peace proposals. Unfortunately for Doha, that ship has sailed, and the free world now expects Israel to dismantle terrorist Hamas just like the world decimated terrorist ISIS.” — Hussain Abdul-Hussain, FDD Research Fellow

    Turkey’s Hamas Ties
    In 2021, Israel accused senior Hamas officials based in Turkey — Hamas’ West Bank chief Saleh al-Arouri and senior Hamas member Zacharia Najib — of directing a terrorist attack in Israel. Hamas leader Ismail Haniyeh lives part-time in Turkey, and he and his son hold Turkish passports. Turkey’s banks also funnel money to Hamas and other terrorist organizations.

    In July, Israeli customs authorities intercepted 16 tons of explosive material used to make rockets on its way from Turkey to the Gaza Strip. Turkey’s President Recep Tayyip Erdogan regularly meets with leaders from Palestinian terrorist organizations. In May 2010, Erdogan greenlit a flotilla of ships to breach the Israeli blockade of Gaza, which led to a deadly incident with Israeli forces and a decade-long breakdown in a longstanding Israeli-Turkish diplomatic relationship.

    Qatar’s Hamas Ties
    Hamas maintains its main office in Doha, where Haniyeh lives most of his time. Besides Iran, Hamas receives a large part of its funding from Doha, reportedly between $360 million and $480 million a year. Qatar uses a third of the subsidy to purchase fuel from Egypt and ship it to Gaza, where Hamas sells it and pockets the revenue. Another third goes to impoverished families, while the final third goes to pay the salaries of Hamas bureaucrats. This support allows Hamas to bankroll social services, therefore maintaining political support and prolonging its grip on power. Qatar’s state-sponsored media channel, Al-Jazeera, has justified Palestinian terrorism, spread antisemitism, and demonized Israel with its global reach.

  114. What’s happening now is literally what happened in parishad korach “Korach convinced people that Moshe was wrong, everyone started protesting against one another, men, women, and children started dying”. Rashi explains when Beni Yesroel argue/protest against one another HASHEM will bring decrees against Benei Yisroel “Chas vishalom” causing even baby’s to die. Rashi says “HASHEM does this to remind us that we are all one nation and we should have “ACHDUS”. HASHEM does not want fighting amongst Bnei yesroel. He brings these “GEZAROS” to bring us back together. Similarly now people are dying both young, and old. WE NEED TO HAVE ACHDUS AND REMEMBER WE ARE ALL ONE NATION AND WE ARE ON THE SAME SIDE OUR ENEMY IS HOMMOS!

  115. When Benei Yesroel are traveling they had The “ANNANEI HAKOVOD” protecting them. Rashi says “When Benei Yesroel argued amongst each other the “ANNANEI HAKOVOD” left them”. “HASHEM” will protect us if we have “ACHDUS” and remember we are all one nation! If we work on ourselves and do what we said on “ROSH HASHANA” “USISHUVA, USIFILA,UTZIDAKA MAAVIRIN ES ROAH HAGEZERAH ” “REPENTANCE, PRAYER, AND CHARITY WILL REMOVE THE EVIL DECREE!” So please everyone I’m begging you DO TESHUVA, DAVEN, GIVE TZEDAKA, LEARN A LITTLE EXTRA, AND REMEMBER TO HAVE ACHDUS! And B”EH WE WILL BE SAFE!

  117. and we daven 3 times a day that the apikorsim hoe hashem know he is the apiokros should get lost in a split second ” vcho haminim crega youveidu ,and hashem know hoe is the apiokros

  118. @HJtE4UEh I was talking about the yidden having achdus with each other. I don’t expect Israel to stop fighting until every last one of those animals is dead.

    It’s a little sad that it takes someone like hittler to show the Jews that no matter how conservative you are if your Jewish your Jewish! We are all one MISHPACHA!

    As sad as it is that some innocent Palestinians are dying , Israel is not at fault. Hamas brought this upon them. And Israel has every right to obliterate these animals of the face of this planet. The people of Gaza should wake up and free themselves from Hamas. When Hamas will put down they’re weapons, there will be no war. And hopefully, a better future for Palestinians as well as Israel.

  121. to Abraham finkel
    rashi says that korach was a rushe beacose he made machlkoes and therfore causing HIS baby’s to die ,and therefore Moshe warned the yiden don’t join this reshoim and warend them as the pusik says “hebodlu” make a split with them don’t be bachdus with them, otherwise thay will have the same punishment like korach, it is open psukim

  122. and therefore Moshe and Aaron and all the tzdikim fight back with korach they didn’t want to give up and they oppose his idea and they didn’t care about escalating machlokes ,as it is a mitzvah to fight with reshoim,, as duvid says in thilim hashm you now “uviskoemchu askotot ” i was fighting

  123. @rightwriter the whole idea that all israeli wars are miracles has been debunked many times over .contrary to the zionist propoganda that the war of ’48 was “a few in the hands of many” ,the truth is that the zionists had 115,00 soldiers versus 60,000 arab soldiers fighting.The arabs didnt have functional training or weapons while the israeli while their weapons werent advanced ,they had weapons stockpiled in anticapation for the war.The 6 day war is also a myth ,all the military experts predicted israel would win swiftly and especially as israel took the initiative to strike. The yom kippur war although it was hard was comepletely within the scope of reason for the israelis to win again like mentioned as israels army was better in many ways.There is a myth that at west point military academy in the US they don’t study israeli wars because they are not strategy rather miracles which is also not true as west point put out a book from their studies on it

  124. @VaretzkyShiur4 To say that there was no had HASHEM in the Yom Kippur war is ridiculous! The fact that Israel exists is a miracle! “Israel is literally a sheep 🐑 surrounded by 70 wolves 🐺!!! It’s a MASSIVE NEIS THAT ISRAEL EXISTS! And if you look at the amount of nations that tried to exterminate all Yidden and failed you will realize how big a NEIS it is that Israel exists!

  126. VeretzkyShiur4 — What??? nonsense…If someone denies the Yad Hashem then that is just sad….Fact is, that Everything is Yad Hashem but in these cases it is undeniably obvious that there were Nissim

  127. If Israel would make a refugee camp in the Gaza for women and children and unarmed civilians they would already be confronting the Hamas face on

  128. When is YWN going to cover Trump’s latest comments about Israel and Hezbollah?

    I know YWN are great supporters of Trump.

    Just wondering.

  131. here are the problems Israel needs to fix
    1. woke armies loose wars
    If the entire purpose of the Israel Defense Force is anything other then defending Israelis that by definition weakens the defense capabilities.

    2. Political security con game
    The gov and media are to make it sound like they destroyed the Gaza threat already from the air
    When in reality the Gaza threat is more than just hamas it’s all 2.5 million gazans
    Politicians / voters usually don’t see the long game. The heredim don’t see the long game on principal because they think the redemption is going to be entirely miraculous

    3. Make terror bad for business
    if the defense industry and governments in general is largest businesses then its actually good for business.
    citizens need to know that a dollar not spent on defense or gov terror insurance is a dollar they get to spend on themselves

  133. elal going to fly “first time” in 41 years? nonsense. they fly whenever it suits them, unless the pilots, stewards/esses and planes manage a spectacular kefitzat haderech

  134. The YWN are such hypocrites, they write against the AP, example like this:
    “APALLING: AP Reporting Begins Slanting Toward Gaza”
    But then supports the AP by taking and copying articles from the AP.
    How absurd!!!

  136. @about nissim, yad hashem, etc. see these days tanya yomi – tanya igeres hakodesh #25
    here is a part translated:
    —we shall precede with the saying of our Sages, of blessed memory: “Whoever is in a rage is as if he worships idols.” The reason is clear to those that have understanding, because at the time of his anger faith has departed from him. For were he to believe that what happened to him is of the L–rd’s doing, he would not become angry at all.
    And though it is a person possessed of free choice cursing him, or hitting him, or causing damage to his money, and therefore guilty according to the laws of man and the laws of Heaven for having chosen evil, nevertheless, as regards the person harmed—this was already decreed from Heaven, and “the Omnipresent has many agents.”
    And not only this, but even at that particular time when he hits or curses him, there is vested in him a force from G–d and “the breath of His mouth,” blessed be He, which animates and sustains him, and as it is written: “For the L–rd told him: ‘curse!’” Now, where did He say (so) to Shimi? But this thought, that occurred in Shimi’s heart and mind, descended from G–d, and the “breath of His mouth—which animates—all their hosts” animated the spirit of Shimi at the time he spoke those words to David. For if the “breath of His mouth,” blessed be He, had departed from the spirit of Shimi for a single moment, he could not have spoken at all.
    (And that is the meaning of “For the L–rd told him [at that very moment, indeed]: ‘curse David.’ Who then shall say…?”9
    And as known what the Baal Shem Tov, of blessed memory, said on the verse “Forever, O L–rd, Your word stands firm in the heavens”: The combinations of the letters wherewith the heavens were created, i.e., the fiat “Let there be a firmament…,” stand and remain vested in the Heavens forever, to vivify and sustain them.
    see there at length

  137. (Local times there on 13.10.23. From N12)

    12:35 – It is reported in Gaza: the IDF distributed leaflets – in which it urged residents to evacuate the Gaza Strip to the south.

    12:00 – The IDF destroyed dozens of positions for launching drones built on the roofs of civilian houses in the Gaza Strip. “This is another example of how the terrorist organization Hamas uses the citizens of the Gaza Strip as a human shield,” said the IDF spokesperson. It should be noted that the Hamas UAV array was tested during Operation “Guardian of the Walls” during which it tried to implement a number of plans to launch UAVs that failed – some of them were intercepted by the Air Force and some of them fell due to technical malfunctions.

    (2 hrs & 18 minutes after IDF announcing to the UN)

    (Local time in Israel)

    08:04 – So far, more than 400,000 residents of the Gaza Strip have evacuated to about 100 shelters and relatives.

    08:03 – IDF warplanes attacked 750 military targets throughout the night across the Strip, including underground tunnels, military compounds and outposts, high-ranking houses that served as military headquarters, IDF warehouses, communications rooms and the organization’s operatives. At the same time, three mortar operatives of an organization were thwarted in Gaza City in the northern Gaza Strip.

    07:49 – IDF spokesman, Brigadier General Daniel Hagari: “Our priority is the elimination of senior officials and terrorists who participated in the murderous massacre. We cannot live with Hamas-ISIS rule near our borders. We are going to collapse the Hamas infrastructure in Gaza.” He further added: “We have informed 258 families that their loved ones in the IDF have fallen since Saturday. The status of the abductees is 97 families.”

    07:44 – The Hamas Interior Ministry told the residents of the Gaza Strip this morning – in response to the IDF’s call to evacuate their homes: Israel is trying to spread false propaganda to sow confusion among the residents of Gaza. Do not cooperate with these attempts which constitute psychological warfare.

    07:11 – IDF spokesperson to residents of Gaza City: “All residents are called to evacuate their homes, move south for their protection and settle in the area south of the Gaza River. This evacuation is for your personal safety. It will be possible to return to Gaza City only after a notification confirming this. Do not approach the fence area with the State of Israel. Hamas terrorists are hiding in Gaza City in tunnels under houses in Gaza City, and inside many buildings are innocent civilians.”

    06:25 – Israel’s Ambassador to the UN Gilad Erdan: “The UN’s response to Israel’s early warning to the residents of Gaza is a disgrace! For many years the UN has been ‘turning a blind eye’ to the arming of Hamas and its use of the civilian population and civilian infrastructure in the Gaza Strip as a hiding place for weapons and his murder. And now, instead of standing by Israel, whose citizens were slaughtered by Hamas terrorists and who tries to minimize harm to those not involved, he preaches specifically to Israel. It is better for the UN to focus now on returning the abductees, condemning Hamas and supporting Israel’s right to defend itself.”

    05:42 – The IDF informed the UN: 1.1 million Palestinians living in the north of the Gaza Strip are required to evacuate to the south within 24 hours. In response, the United Nations called for the cancellation of the demand in order to “prevent a disaster and devastating humanitarian consequences.” According to the details that the IDF provided to the representatives of the United Nations, the residents of Gaza City are required to move to the south – in order to prevent possible harm to them. Those who do not obey the instructions – “put the himself and his family in danger.”

    05:40 – The pictures of the Israeli abductees, including toddlers and the elderly, were projected onto the UN headquarters – demanding their release. The headquarters of the families of the abductees in the US made three demands: their immediate release, the opening of a humanitarian corridor for the supply of medicine and necessary equipment, and a call for the intervention of world leaders in general and the Arab world in particular. “The world needs to know. The world needs to wake up. We will not rest until our sisters and brothers who were captured by murderous violence return home to their families,” it said.

  138. Every time Israel does not fire directly at the FIRST trail source of rocket smoke in Gaza, they further gamble with their citizens lives. Word has it they’re trying to experiment again with newer versions interceptor defense tech.

    That’s what Israel does best lately, they gamble & experiment on their citizenry. We saw it in early 2021 and we’re seeing it live again now.

  139. If the Palestinian refugees from Jordan went to Lebanon and then Israel wins the war there then they will have to give them Israeli citizenship and there is a arab majority in the Kneset
    Like if they would all go to South Lebanon and Israel takes the place then now they get social service and the right to vote and fight the majority

  141. Ywn you pay for the ap feed you are supporting Reshaim.
    Do you drive a bmw or Volkswagen
    What’s worse subscribing to The NY Times or to the ap

  142. Already nebach 13 Jewish hostages held in Gaza have been killed by their own army’s bombing. Why couldn’t they negotiate the release of the captives before bombing civilian populations where they know the hostages are being held? Why were all the military bases and doors and gates unlocked and easily accessible? Before Succos all the Israeli websites were telling people that there is known threats and that they should carry their guns to shuls. Why weren’t the soldiers in the south warned and forearmed? Egypt notified Israel 3 days before of a great imminent attack. The leaders of the country did nothing. We are a leaderless nation and this is what happens r”l. We need to daven for our true leaders and Moshiach Tzidkeinu B’mhaira!

  143. please look at the big picture, today I saw an image of a Lion holding the world as I did morning prayers walking the Rova, we still hold the world and G-d still controls, all of who is or was on Dizzengof was supposed to be where do we go from here….no bias, no boo boos….Israel is a Torah World and is a place where Shabbos is kept, those who chose to play foolish games like children can do so but let Israel do and be what the Creator held a mountain over our heads for 216 years till 6000, we are all related to one another right now and share souls period…..forget the goyem…forget all except who we are and I will Dave for one who can’t that is the best I can do other than knowing that all that I have is empty without HASHEM or ALL OF YOU JEWS STANDING BESIDE ME….we are Lions, the WORLD we are holding is ours to take care of ..

  144. THE IDEA OF SOMEONE SELLING DEAD JEWS ON LINE is horrid…GETTY WELL, they are gentiles as is most of the world….Mitzva Candle, Maharal……all good…..we are exactly where we need to be to be free of this….we are asked by Hashem to love all Jews…..there no need to add a ‘but’

  145. HASHEN ‘NEVER FAILS’, from the end of the holocaust Hashem has been moving our enemies out of the Holy Lands, to all over the world, first to Europe, Great Britain, and on and on, the Palestinians he moved to America no different that Lakewood becoming a Torah Centre, which is now becoming a Hindu Temple and centre for Idol Worshipping, Hashem’s, movement to America as well built

  146. Editor. Please DO NOT POST pictures of rocket landing sites as it happens. We know the enemy is using these pictures to improve accuracy!

  147. Time has arrived to grab 199 Hezbollah children, and hold them as hostages and collateral for immediate safe return of all 199 Israeli hostages, no questions asked.

  149. Why did the Israeli military let such a tragedy happen they wasn’t prepared for this do you think people living next to the Gaza never thought it’s a possibility this is a ghetto kind of thing when millions went to the trains saw a video how a couple of wimpy terrorist put them to sleep

  150. I pray fervently for the safety and for the health of every single Jew it pains me greatly I am very fearful and very doubtful of an Israeli victory not once did I hear in any speech of the Israeli high ministers asking for the help of God all they keep on blabbering is we want victory we will have victory etc etc but I have not yet heard them say with the help and grace of hashem we will prevail not once do they mention hashem without the guidance and help from the one above their army with all their ammunition can go to sleep why isn’t the whole frum world screaming that by omitting the name of hashem in all their speeches they are digging their own graves for themselves and for all of jewery unfortunately. It’s time that the none religious ministers wake up from their deep sleep haven’t they learned anything from the latest events maybe it is time for the final redemption how can we expect it to come without some repentance.
    עורי ישנים משנתכם

  151. Can someone please explain the following; for over a week Israel have cut supplies, water, electric to Gaza. How is it possible that all the hospitals have Electricity and water. How is it that the people of Gaza have internet? How is it that the people of Gaza miraculously all have there phones? How is it they the people of Gaza are giving interviews to the Media on there laptop? If they are using generators and this is there only way, there is no way after more than a week there will still be any electricity left in there generators, the same with car batteries. Something doesn’t make sense or if someone can please clarify.

  152. Mr. 147, do you believe that if the IDF took 199 Palestinian children hostage that Hamas would be willing to release Jews as a hostage swap?

  154. Peirush Harosh Al Hatorah- Parshas Noach Perek פרק ו פסוק יא
    חמס-גימטריא גיהנם
    Perish Chizkuni on same pasuk on חמס:
    חמס: גילוי עריות
    חמסי ושארי״‎” שנאמר
    חמס: עבודת כוכבים
    ‎חמס וישובו להכעיסני״”‎ שנאמר
    :חמס
    שפיכות דמים
    ‎מחמס בני יהודה אשר שפכו דם נקי בארצם״‎” שנאמר

  155. Peirush Harosh Al Hatorah- Parshas Noach Perek פרק ו פסוק יא
    חמס-גימטריא גיהנם
    Peirush Chizkuni on same pasuk on חמס:
    חמס: גילוי עריות
    חמסי ושארי״‎” שנאמר
    חמס: עבודת כוכבים
    ‎חמס וישובו להכעיסני״”‎ שנאמר
    :חמס
    שפיכות דמים
    ‎מחמס בני יהודה אשר שפכו דם נקי בארצם״‎” שנאמר

  156. No body in Israel army ever asked the gerer rabbi or of ponevehz or salbodka or the yanuka for a eitzah about the war or hostages all they want is give us honor and attention as the army of Jewish people they really do not care about godly life

  158. @IpchahMistavra The conference is still happening, need to find out where it will be. Also maybe contact Governor/Mayor…etc.

  160. The video doesn’t show anything the Gaza rockets do not ever have enough explosives for such a fire only Israel does somebody was waiting on an Israeli boat for the opportunity to revenge they don’t hide any weapons in hospital and if it came from ground it’s visible also in the video it is possible to see with technology that the bomb came from the ocean not from where Hamas was this means they was waiting for this opportunity the rockets never have very much exclusives

  161. 1. איתן בן בת שבע

    2. אריאל בן שירי

    3. כפיר בן שירי

    4. אביגיל בת סמדר

    5. אלה בת מעיין

    6. דפנה בת מעיין

    7. סהר בן הדס

    8. ארז בן הדס

    9. נויה בת גלית

    10. נווה בן עדי

    11. יהל גני בת עדי

    12 נעם בת שרון

    13. אביב בת דורון

    14. רז בת דורון

    15. אמה בת שרון

    16. יולי בת שרון

    17. אמיליה בת דניאל

    18. אוהד בן קרן

  162. PLEASE PRINT OUT THE Below LIST AND BE מתפלל OLSO put it at the קברים צדיקים as an קוויטל

    שמונה עשרה ילדים ישראלים מוחזקים על ידי מחבלי חמאס ברצועת עזה
    1. איתן בן בת שבע

    2. אריאל בן שירי

    3. כפיר בן שירי

    4. אביגיל בת סמדר

    5. אלה בת מעיין

    6. דפנה בת מעיין

    7. סהר בן הדס

    8. ארז בן הדס

    9. נויה בת גלית

    10. נווה בן עדי

    11. יהל גני בת עדי

    12 נעם בת שרון

    13. אביב בת דורון

    14. רז בת דורון

    15. אמה בת שרון

    16. יולי בת שרון

    17. אמיליה בת דניאל

    18. אוהד בן קרן

    !!!!!!!!!!!!!שכולם ישוחררו מהר ועכשיו

  164. Anybody that has a mind it’s virtually impossible that Israel army should not “catch these terrorist in the act”
    They have the phone connection they have satellite picture clear to see these terrorist put the katyusha there and shoot them the Israeli army see and know it every time and where it is from it is impossible that they don’t have the means to kill them or the explosives before they send it the only reason they let them do this is because they wanted them to go shoot the katyusha from that place over the Gaza so that some will not get it’s target and then they have propaganda on the pact Gaza people that have no place to go this time there is video to prove that the bomb came from the ocean and a Israeli ship not a katyusha that landed far from the hospital and if there was any explosive next to the hospital it is visible to see this but if your using video as evidence there was a bomb from the ocean

  167. The disciple video of Rashantah Tlaib, faking to cry, gets me worked up, she would not care a stuff about all the dead in the hospital if she would belive the truth that the palastinians don’t care about the lives of their own people. All Americans should be embarrased that an animal like this has such a high position.

  168. With all this talk about ukrainian black market arms sales of american guns to gaza what about the massive amounts of thefts of idf weapons / black market sales by idf itself ??
    I saw the videos and many militants were using us made guns.

  169. Military Police launched an investigation into the theft of a heavy machine gun from troops during an exercise in southern Israel last week, the Israel Defense Forces said Sunday.

    The IDF did not elaborate further on the circumstances of the theft, although many details were published by Hebrew-language media outlets, whose military correspondents are regularly briefed off the record by IDF officials.

    According to the reports, an all-terrain vehicle drove into a training ground used by troops of the IDF’s Givati infantry brigade, and a suspect on it snatched the FN MAG machine gun that was placed next to an armored personnel carrier. The reports said the suspect or suspects waited a while and carried out the theft while the soldiers weren’t paying attention.

    Military sources were cited by the Walla news site as saying the incident was an escalation of the frequent thefts from army bases. “Stealing ammunition and collecting bullets from training grounds is commonplace. Stealing weapons? It has become a dangerous phenomenon,” the unnamed sources said.

    For years, the military has struggled with thefts from its bases, both by soldiers — who have stolen everything from bullets and missiles to army jeeps — and by criminal gangs.

    In response to a query by The Times of Israel on the reports, the IDF responded with a boilerplate: “A Military Police investigation was opened over the incident, and upon completion, its findings will be forwarded to the Military Prosecutor’s Office for examination.”

    Earlier this month, two Israeli suspects were detained for the theft of 26,000 bullets from an army base in southern Israel, and in December, eight Bedouin suspects were arrested over a similar theft of 30,000 bullets from another army base in the south.

    Security officials fear that stolen ammunition and weapons could be used in terror attacks. Last year, almost a thousand stolen IDF bullets were found on Islamic State-inspired gunmen who killed two Border Police officers in a terror attack in Hadera.

    By EMANUEL FABIAN
    Emanuel (Mannie) Fabian is The Times of Israel’s military correspondent.
    18 June 2023, 10:05 pm

  170. Bullets and rifles have been stolen from a military bunker within an IDF base, in the south of Israel

    The Israeli army reported on Tuesday that 26,000 bullets and rifles had been stolen from a military bunker within an IDF base, in the south of the country.

    A joint investigation by the Israeli police and the military police has been launched.

    It’s been over six months since the last similar theft. The recurring incidents previously plagued southern IDF bases. The robberies could be committed by both soldiers or criminal gangs.

    In December, eight Bedouin Israeli men were arrested for their involvement in an October break-in of an Israeli military base that had resulted in the theft of tens of thousands of bullets. They were captured with help from the Shin Bet internal security agency.

    Arab communities in Israel have experienced a surge in violence over the past few years, and according to a 2020 parliamentary report, some 400,000 weapons are illegally circulating in the country, the vast majority in Arab communities.

    On Monday night, lawmakers from Arab-majority parties of Israel’s parliament met with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu in order to fight the rising crime rates in Israeli-Arab communities, and presented a “list of demands.”

    Earlier on Monday, Israeli National Security Minister Itamar Ben-Gvir announced his intention to appoint a czar to oversee the fight against crime in such areas, however many in the Arab community refused to cooperate with the far-right minister.

    From

    i24NEWS
    June 06, 2023 at 04:26 AM

    —-
    This is weird because idf only showing us soviet weapons ****

  171. Army tank stolen from military base in Israel found in scrapyard
    The decommissioned tank was found in a scrap yard 20km from an army training base in northern Israel, authorities say.
    A tank that was stolen from a military base in northern Israel has been found in a scrapyard, police have said.

    The Israeli Ministry of Defence had reported the theft of a tank from an army training base near Eliakim Interchange north of Israel, the police said in a statement on Wednesday.

    The tank was later found 20km (12 miles) south of the coastal city of Haifa in a scrapyard.

    “From a preliminary investigation of the circumstances of the case, it is suspected that the tank is not active and was stolen from the scene for reasons that are being investigated at this stage,” a police statement said.

    “Upon locating the stolen tank, a notification was sent to the Ministry of Defence and the police opened a joint investigation with the Ministry of Defence,” it said.
    A military statement said the tank was just the chassis of a Merkava Mk II that was decommissioned many years ago.
    “It has no means of armament, and its systems do not function,” the statement said. “The tank was stationed in a firing area, that’s open to any passersby, and was used as a stationary vehicle for soldiers’ exercises.”

    The statement said the tank “was returned to the security system”.

    “The investigation of the incident continues, and a command investigation will also take place,” it added.

    Two suspects have been arrested in relation to the theft, according to The Jerusalem Post.

    Last February, two veteran army soldiers stole a tank from the Golan Heights to protest against the government’s plans to overhaul the country’s judiciary.

    Israel has been in political turmoil in recent months over a government plan to introduce judicial reforms seen by the opposition as a power grab in favour of the executive authority.

    Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, however, insists that the reform would enhance democracy and restore the balance among the legislative, executive and judicial branches of the government.

    From aljazeera qatar news
    20 Sep 2023

  172. Weapons are stolen from Israel military bases every week

    Weapons are stolen from Israel’s military bases every week, Itzhak Brik, former chief complaints officer in the Ministry of Defence, said yesterday.
    Commenting on the theft of some 70,000 bullets and 70 grenades from the Israeli military base of Tznobar in the occupied Golan Heights, Brik told Ynet News that the thefts are among the army’s “big failures”.
    He noted that not all the burglaries are being reported and some may have gone unnoticed because the army does not count the weapons at its disposal or does not know about them.
    “All that is reported by the media is leaked information about burglaries that the army could not prevent,” Brik said, stressing that the army does not wish to reveal details of the burglaries.
    He accused the Israeli army of not doing enough to protect the weapons due to the lack of human resources, noting that in 2019, the army created a guarding system for its military bases, but nothing happened.
    “They invested millions in arms warehouses, but these warehouses were abandoned,” he added.
    The Israeli army has for years struggled with weapons being stolen from its bases across the country, mainly in the Negev, the Jerusalem Post reported.
    Many of the weapons stolen in recent years were taken by soldiers along with civilian contractors who work on the bases, the newspaper added.
    Israeli authorities fear that the stolen weapons, which include machine guns, grenades and explosives, may end up in the hands of criminal organisations or the Palestinian resistance in the occupied West Bank.

    Weapons are stolen from Israel’s military bases every week, Itzhak Brik, former chief complaints officer in the Ministry of Defence, said yesterday.
    Commenting on the theft of some 70,000 bullets and 70 grenades from the Israeli military base of Tznobar in the occupied Golan Heights, Brik told Ynet News that the thefts are among the army’s “big failures”.
    He noted that not all the burglaries are being reported and some may have gone unnoticed because the army does not count the weapons at its disposal or does not know about them.
    “All that is reported by the media is leaked information about burglaries that the army could not prevent,” Brik said, stressing that the army does not wish to reveal details of the burglaries.
    He accused the Israeli army of not doing enough to protect the weapons due to the lack of human resources, noting that in 2019, the army created a guarding system for its military bases, but nothing happened.
    “They invested millions in arms warehouses, but these warehouses were abandoned,” he added.
    The Israeli army has for years struggled with weapons being stolen from its bases across the country, mainly in the Negev, the Jerusalem Post reported.
    Many of the weapons stolen in recent years were taken by soldiers along with civilian contractors who work on the bases, the newspaper added.
    Israeli authorities fear that the stolen weapons, which include machine guns, grenades and explosives, may end up in the hands of criminal organisations or the Palestinian resistance in the occupied West Bank.
    From middle east monitor from
    November 14, 2022 at 9:19 am

  173. @ yeshiva world
    SINCE WHEN DOES A WAR GIVE YOU A HETER TO START POSTING INAPPROPRIATE
    PICTURES , you are being מכשיל the public !!!
    And especially in a time we’re the rabbanim say to be extremely careful in שמירת עינים

  174. The guns and drugs that are flowing into Israel are creating societal problems and public safety issues. The influx of weapons is also a major counterterrorism concern. Smuggled weapons have been a contributing factor to the surge of violence that has plagued the West Bank and Israel. Consider the December 2022 case when Israeli authorities arrested brothers Mohammed and Adam Abu Taha, residents of a Bedouin town near Beer Sheva in Israel’s Negev desert, on charges of smuggling weapons and ammunition. The brothers knowingly sold the weapons to members of Palestinian Islamic Jihad in the West Bank and to criminals in southern Israel. Indeed, this increased arms smuggling occurred against the backdrop of over a year and a half of violence that began with an
    11-day battle between Israeli forces and Hamas in May 2021 and continued through a string of terror attacks in the spring of 2022 that prompted a sweeping Israeli military campaign with nightly West Bank raids targeting terrorist operatives. In July 2023, Israeli forces carried out an operation targeting militant facilities and weapons depots in Jenin, focusing in particular on the Jenin Brigades of the Palestinian Islamic Jihad. Alongside the extensive collection of chemical materials to make explosives and hundreds of assembled explosive devices seized, authorities also found thousands of rounds of ammunition and weapons such as M-16s, pistols, and shotguns.”
    Of the 472 terrorist attacks foiled by Israel security forces in 2022 in the West Bank or Jerusalem, 358 were shooting attacks, underscoring the centrality of small arms smuggling to this spike in violences

  176. “SINCE WHEN DOES A WAR GIVE YOU A HETER TO START POSTING INAPPROPRIATE PICTURES…”

    Since it is critical that people see exactly what is happening rather than reading about it. I’m sure the editors have consulted with daas torah regarding the the types of photos that are appropriate. (And all caps makes your comment even less cogent)

  177. “I’m sure the editors have consulted with daas torah regarding the the types of photos that are appropriate.”

    Can’t be too sure after posting a picture of Inna vernikov with a gun only to have it replaced with a picture of a gun (due to a commenter)

  178. Israels overreliance on indirect fire against palestinians is overkill and it always gets them in trouble. see how the world reacted when israel didnt bomb a hospital. What if it does bomb a hospital or kills too many non combatant civilians. It is terrible for people who did nothing to deserve it to lose their houses , even if they hate us.

    Another thing is the rhetoric about animals/ brashness and bravado should not be something we see from children and certainly not from our leaders.

    Israel is a baby country and it needs to stop believing in cult fantasies and grow up

  179. Can someone explain how the # of hostages spiraled up from 201 to 212?
    Is this based on some information that came out from debriefing the 2 Chicago’ans released on Friday?

  180. Mr. Goldpen, I don’t understand your comments. They seem hypocritical to me: you say it’s not right to refer to Chamas as animals, but you call the Israeli people babies. I would like to know what is the difference between the two.

  181. Arm mini drone swarms to execute all bellligerents in the territory quickly and efficiently and with minimization of suffering. Then develop Gaza into a nice gentrified beach resort to host the Yiddin from Amerika who might need a refuge soon. Why send in the slaves unless the purpose actually were to cost casualties from Yisroel? Truth be told, the purpose probably is to drag on conflict indefinitely and for such crisis to justify printing more moneys and to distract from the true hors de combat, the vaxed. WWIII might make life exciting.

  182. Is the update above regarding the girl from Alumim who doesn’t sleep on her bed accurate? I thought that Alumim was on of the shower shabbos kibutzzim whose families weren’t hit as hard. I know four people are missing, and a number of foreign nationals were murdered, but is it true that entire families on this kibutz were slaughtered as well?

  183. Honestly, I think any general or anyone in any hierarchichal chain of command who makes the decision to send in troops to risk their lives when drones or robots would have sufficed at this point of technological innovation and cheap drones, that person should be treated like a moser, no questons asked.

  184. Dmdmoses46
    I might agree with you but are you consistent? Did you ever watch the Nazi atrocities? Many pictures there are also inappropriate…
    The world has to see it and we need to see it. I’ll tell you why: The haredi are generally anti Zionists for good reason. Not being fully aware of the massacre, will allow some sympathies from us towards the enemies. Neturei Karta needs to be shown to the world as non jews and mosrim to the highest level. When we don’t know what’s going on, we boost the morale of the anti Zionists all around the world. I see the COMMENTS here and it’s extremely insensitive to the existence of Israel and it’s people!

    Maybe that should be censored? When they show us how we take arms, of course we need to realize that it’s not kochi votzem yudi and we need to have compassion for innocent lives but it’s a show to help us cope and understand that everything is done to eradicate evil!

  185. Bibi should ask for 10 b2 spirit bombers with some moabs and drop them over and iranian oil and airforce and armament facilities when he is ready.

  187. Also , as useless as un is and as useless as un peacekeeping is. Why cant israel get some kind of un peacekeeping mission for gaza? Why cant un peacekeepers keep gaza safe from israel and vice versa??

  188. ccb45:
    Let’s fix that for you.

    “The haredi are generally anti Zionists for good reason…Zionists need to be shown to the world as non-jews and mosrim to the highest level.”

    As well, let’s be very clear. From a halachic perspective, Israel was born of many grave sins, and it never did have a right to exist. Its continued existence is a continued rebellion against G-d and the greatest danger to Jews, may G-d protect all His children. So, there is no need to show sensitivity to “Israel”. Its citizens, however, do deserve sensitivity, as they are Jews. But that doesn’t permit falsifying the Torah, G-d forbid.

  189. HaKatan
    Why to the world? Isn’t it putting Jewish lives in danger? Kissing Iranian mullahs? Isn’t that against torah? It paints a bad picture on Jews and gentiles won’t descriminate between frum and not frum. When they see Jews speak against Israel, they don’t understand that it’s Frum angainst instigators! All it knows is thath there are jews protesting but as a whole are criminals.

    I agree fully that there was an halachic problem with Zionists. Existence however is paramount so Arabs or other countries don’t decide to attack us! Self defense is not a crime. There are many Jews living in Israel (as you said as Jews they don’t deserve to be killed by man’s hands!), that don’t deserve to die and same for IDF soldiers. What do you want? Give it back to arabs chalilah? You gotta be out of your mind!!! After the state was formed, many of our Gedolim have NOT ascribed to this rhetoric! I understand that Satmar Rebbe was a Kodosh and Godul in every area but he didn’t speak for the majority: see how many gedolei yisroel from Poland and even Galicia, Russia, Lithuania have not spoken out against Israel as a state! They did call out against the kfirah and attack against torah but not to the level of besmearing Israel and calling for it’s breakup! Wanna say they’re wrong, go ahead but know that you position is extremely unpopular and we resent this and the entire poshim of Naturah Karta. Satmar Rebbe was against the activities NK too… I don’t disagree on Zionism, neither on expansion, temple mount, but I support Israel for providing aid and protection for it’s citizens (beshitah; even if it proves that Israel wasn’t able to prevent killings, nebech)!

    You should be ashamed of yourselves!

  190. Keep seeing in the news people yelling and screaming at Hamas that they killed civilians but the fact is that could of not killed any people and headed straight for the army air force if they did that they would be the same as Israel is doing now to them the Israel army air force is not so far from the Gaza and they know this very well also maybe planes they have by the Jordan border and Egypt so when they keep screaming this it goes into my mind what if they didn’t to this and headed for air planes

  191. Mr. .,
    If I understand you correctly, it sounds like you’re saying that the Chamas terrorists could have stolen aircraft from Israeli, Jordanian, and Egyptian air bases and could use those aircraft to carry out massive air strikes on many more Israeli targets. Is that right?
    If so, I think you have a brilliant point. For me, it speaks to Hashem’s precision and exactness when using the middas hadin: Orthodox Jews believe that Hashem is in control of every small moment of all history, of course. We may not be able to know the reason for the tragedy, but we know the source; the true source. I have heard some comments, posts, and reporters wonder how it is possible that the IDF intelligence agencies did not know about and could not stop the terrorist attacks. While of course investigation and analysis of the subject with a natural, cause-and-effect lens is important on a few levels moving forward, my personal gut feeling was that it happened because Hashem made it so. It was his will. It could not have happened otherwise. It would have been worse if he deemed it so, and could have been less severe as well.
    None of what I am saying now is addressing the world of hishtadlus, past or future, or the world of pain, grief, morning, and anxiety. For me, an important step in healing and recovery, with many other steps to go along with it, is knowing that Hashem is with me every step of the way.

  192. Seriously, everyone. Just open up your eyes. Hashem sent this to us not in order to have us argue over the best way to win and proclaim how all fellow commentators on YWN are dumb and kofrim. Our job now is to leave our differences and focus on ahavas yisrael. On caring about each Jew. Nasty comments are getting us nowhere and are really not the best way to get zchusim for Klal Yisrael.

  193. There are many more productive things to do at this eis tzara than spending time formulating a nasty comment to another Jewish individual.
    It’s interesting how on Israeli religious news sites there are barely any more nasty comments since the war started. We should never need more tragedy to unite us here in the US for us to actually have some ahavas chinam.

  194. If Egypt gave Israel ten miles on the border to dig up all the tunnels which is why Hamas owns the Gaza it still would not stop the terror and might make it worse Israel is surrounded with people that are ready to war with their life

  195. Mr Allen
    If the Hamas was not terrorist they could of won the Israeli army and they still can from the Jordan and Egypt border incursions just like the Gaza to the planes and thus win the army they also have enough guns in the west and they aren’t killing women that they see
    The fact that Israel has the bomb makes it worse
    According to Torah law it is forbidden to kill people Israel is doing this and not so they have safety but only revenge and worse
    Here is the main point
    The fact Gaza had this border incursion was a miracle you can see a couple of flimsy terrorist take a whole army with tanks and into captivity without gun fire which is maybe why they didn’t go for the planes cause they was surprised it happened miraculously
    The state of Israel to this day and every year of it’s existence was all miracle the pasuk says in the tochacha “vahaya kasher yasis” just like I was happy to do good “ken yasis alechiem” I will not make your enemies happy on you this if we don’t do what hashem wants
    The Israel army is a bigger war against God then the Germans they declare that thier existence is greater and that he needs them and they use Torah and speech on personal lust there is a war against the truth more then against the Islam that is why they won’t win this war the miracles hashem does are till this day and if we forget then he takes it back
    There is this video of soldiers singing “lman bies hashem” we say in Hallel but it isn’t that anymore
    We say “yemin hashem oseh choil” but that’s not why they are fighting in fact the Israeli army wanted this should happen so pretty people will give them kavod that now we need them to save us and for every gun and bullet that an Israeli buys Palestine gets that also
    The Gemara says how do we know that if somebody says to kill or you will get killed not to do this “it is a sevarah” who says your blood is better then the others this means even a old person and Palestinian it seems that we use Torah to say that our blood is royal and eternal
    Israel is not doing self defense

  196. ccb45:
    I never said to kiss Iranian mullahs.

    But the world must know that Zionism and its State are anti-Jewish to their literal core (read their “Jerusalem Program” and much more; it’s not a secret).

    This would help Jews around the world because the world must not blame even one Jew for anything the Zionists do or don’t do. Of course, the world should also care about our brethren under Zionist rule. But not to conflate the two.

  197. ccb45:
    The Torah does not change. While many gedolim did and do “work with” the Zionist State, that is merely a different tactic in dealing with that same forbidden State.

    The Satmar Rav wrote, and it could be slowly happening as we speak whether or not the Zionists like it, that if the Zionists cared to save Jewish blood – which they have made amply clear over the past century that they do not – then the Zionists could go to the UN and end this whole tragedy of Zionism while still keeping the Jews there safe.

  198. Israle should stop torture then it should get more buffer space and create vassal states with friendly govts on all its borders. Jordan is basicly an american vassal state and so is egypt.
    Israel needs a vassal state for gaza and west bank boys and for south leb and southwest syria girls
    The boys and girls should be replaced by kurds , Christians , and other friendlies from allover, maybe some mongolians? Some south sudanis ? Throw some in there eritreans too ? Anyone who needs a place to go that isnt jewish can became a citizen of israels vassal states

  200. I have read many articles discussing what to do with the Gaza Strip after Israel -Hamas current war, including an article on Yeshiva World News by MK Yair Lapid suggesting that the PA and Mr. Abbas assume control of the Gaza strip as well. I do not like that suggestion, as Mr. Abbas has his hands filled already with the West Bank–also he is getting older and if he should die in the next 10-20 years who knows what will the future bring to the PA. Also, as is well known the Gaza Strip is already super-crowded, and who knows how crowded it will be in another generation of say 25 years!!?? It behooves the UN and the western world including President Biden to find a better and more humanitarian solution. Some suggestions that come to my mind including dispersing them among the neighboring Arab countries, particularly Egypt and Jordan — in particularly the Sinai Peninsula is a large area and very sparsely settled which would accommodate many refugees in a respectable and “humanitarian” living arrangement allowing each family to have a little garden or a larger farm and more living space. Also I recall over 50 years ago that Uganda was suggested for the Jewish homeland but ultimately Israel was chosen instead — surely Uganda would also be a good alternative for some of the Gazans. The United Nations could help with all the necessary funding as part of the UNWRA budget. The US as well, already showing interest in migrant refugee populations from the southern hemisphere could also surely find an under populated area in the country to also help out. The important thing is that Gazans deserve more living space, and should not be all along the Israel border where all they do is dream of returning to their old Israeli homes — let them have land and become farmers and builders and build up the land as the Zionists did in the 20th century.

  201. Spell check changed the word values to values and Gali’s…and chanfeh to Changan…didn’t read over my post before posting…

  202. HaKatan
    Hak nisht in tshenik. 1. I’m ticked off that you require the world to submit to R’Yoel ztvk”l radical approach (he was a tzaddik gumer but didn’t enjoy support by most rebbes). 2. The UN themselves said they’re not a government body; just an organisation. They don’t issues passports nor create laws for countries. Even this idea of giving back to the un was termed ridiculous!

    I’m sorry to say that it bothers significantly when groups say that we shouldn’t support the idf when they do their best to defend us bs”d, of course. It’s stupidity and ludicrous to even suggest that the tzavah be dismantled. It’s stupid to say tgat we shouldn’t be mispallel for the victory, yet just that everyone should be spared and things should be ok. The military is hishtadlus despite in being created for zionism.

    Kuzei reah vkadesh. What does the movement have anything to do with the now???!! We need the protection and we believe im Hashem lo yishmur… it’s not a contradiction. Sorry, but the shitah is not popular and when talking to the hamon am, use other agreed upon sources please!

  203. @hakatan
    Giving it over to the UN is the joke of the century.
    You think Arabs will sit by while UN takes over .
    At the first casualty of Arab malcontents is buried , the individual armies supplying the troops to the UN forces , will be drawing up their withdrawal plans , Those plans to be executed only a few days later.
    Leaving millions of achenu b’y to the [non existent] mercies of our pere adam cousins.
    Evidence of said mercies can be adequately supplied , in their most fresh form ….. Lo Oleinu

  204. HaKatan, my long post regarding Zionism wasn’t posted. So I’ll just say in short, Jews were murdered and killed for two thousand years before Israel’s independence. If you are a believing Jews you’ll know that we are in golus and they still hate us and would murder every single Jew including the anti-Zionists. Zionism is simply another excuse to hate Jews. On the other hand, it’s a mitzvah to defend our lives and Jews should support those who defend our nation regardless if you agree with the Israeli gov or not.

  206. I have a friend who is a wonderful Chasidishe Yid. He got married a few months ago. He told me. that some of his close family members were not allowed to attend his Chasuna because he belongs to the other Rebbe and the rebbe of the other group warned his Chassidim that they better not attend the wedding.
    I guess now , we finally all see very clearly who is the REAL ENEMY and it’s not the other Rebbe.

  208. we are still in galus till the mashiach comes the goyim have anti semitism in the blood and we have this Israeli country they acts wrongly it seems that they think its okay to kill thousands of women and children if one of them might die or get captured they are angered that the Zionist did not give them security

  209. ccb45, yankel berel and philosopher:
    The Zionist State is an unprecedented and massive and constant rebellion against G-d. The Chazon Ish said rhetorically “How long will it last, 50 years?” He also said “One morning, we will wake up to find that the State of Israel simply doesn’t exist anymore.”

    So, if you are a believing Jew, you know that this idol of Zionism and its State will vanish. The only questions are when and how.

    As the Satmar Rav said, if the Zionists wanted a way out, they could find one. I didn’t say the UN would run it; I said only that they could go to the UN which could find a solution for them to keep the Jews safe while ending the Zionist lie and State.

    And if you’re a believing Jew, then you know that living under a decent gentile nation is far, far, far better than the punishment for violating the three oaths (which the Zionists severely violate), a punishment that Hashem clearly meted out, as has been clear for a century now, and even more so in the recent news, R”L L”A.

    It is classic Zionist propaganda, and foolish, to claim that gentiles hate Jews anyways and that anti-Zionism is just another excuse. It is further Zionist propaganda (and close to, if not actual, kefirah) to claim that Jews have been consistently murdered and killed for 2,000 years, as if that’s normal.

    First, the overall hatred of Jews (and Hashem’s determination of how peaceful Jews have it in galus), is dependent on schar viOnesh. Obviously (as we also saw from Zionist evil during the Holocaust), it is astonishingly foolish to give gentiles an excuse to hate Jews, like lying to them that the Zionist State is Jewish so that if a gentile disagrees with something the Zionists do or don’t do, that he incorrectly blames all Jews for that.

    Anti-Zionism is not the same as anti-Judaism. The Zionist State is not Jewish and is, in fact, anti-Jewish. That is a fact, especially to any believing Jew.

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  213. HaKatan
    I guess in a comment section, debate is hard.
    Satmar Rov said: if an Arab is pro Israel, he’s not an antisemite, while if he’s not pro Israel, he’s an antisemite. Which makes a lot of sense: the medinah is one thing but the Arab rishos is another.

    The bobover rebbe z”l said: 60 antisemites sat down and organised in an area called the UN!

    Stop this whole nonsense! The Bobov rebbe (while a staunch anti Zionist and respected by the Datmar Rebbe), has commented on the al hageulah Sefer he authored, that: ich vunder zich vi a chochim vi ehr zol zich azoi banareshen. Meaning. A smart person like him, should write so much things that seem unintelligent! Six day war was no nissim and his whole view of the existence (as of 1967, of course).

    The only need for this kanuas now is: to stop encouraging military service (for the merit of taharah and exposure), and the need for yidden to realize that kochi veotzem yudi is apikorses and to realize how little the government used Hashem in their statements. Anything else is really it appropriate and the measures EXTREMELY unpopular!

  214. Anyone who claims thjs is a flase flag should be semt to gaza or be sued like alex jones.

    Why do u put clips of cult orthdo propeganda of seculars putting on kippah to say bracha.
    Noone has to wesr kippab it us bizzare ortho coopted practice to emulste symbolism propoganda in other religions cults like crosses or islamic beads skullcap etc
    Extrmism is a sin

  215. The IDF doesn’t draft married women and certainly not nursing mothers. Having a milk bank is a great idea, but it’s not being used for soldiers.

  216. HaKatan, I especially did not mention the Holocaust because I knew how brainwashed you are and will blame Zionism for the Holocaust…So for 2,000 years out nation has been persecuted, entire Jewish kehilos destroyed, Jewish women raped, young children, men and women murderered, are you going to blame the kedoshim? Do you think that today is different, it’s a different world and we are not hated today? Sorry to inform you, as Shloima Hamelech said, ” there is nothing new under the sun”. Even in the year 2023 they want to kill and annihilate us because we are still in golus. This has nothing to do with Zionism, Zionism is an excuse for the haters just as they always excused their actions…we supposedly killed their Yushke, we supposedly killed their dead child and used the blood for matzos, we supposedly destroyed their economy, we supposedly want to take over the world, etc, etc. And now we supposedly stole their land. Lies and excuses to have a reason to kill us.

    Nothing to do with Zionism. Zionism is their excuse today. Sh’bechol dor v’dor…

    Is Zionism bad? There are many bad aspects of Zionism that had effected am Yisroel negativitely. But that doesn’t take away the fact that Jews must defend themselves against those coming to kill us. The fact is also that due to Zionism there are the most Jews today are living in Eretz Yisroel since the churban. That is the reality. Zionism is not black and white, neither aveirah nor mitzvah. Zionism is a framework of being able to work, live, protect oneself, of course only with siyatta dishmaya, to serve Hashem or to rebel against Him. And one could be in the IDF and not be a Zionist either….Zionism is not the end all and be all.

    Hashem should give hatzlacha and bracha to all those serving in the IDF, protecting the Jewish nation. We will withstand it all because Hashem is with us ( and no, it is not the work of the yetzer hora, chas v’sholom to attribute success to the sorta achra as anti-Zionists did when Jews won the wars when Arabs attacked them). Hashem and only Hashem will save us! Am Yisroel Chai!

  217. ccb45:
    Satmar Rav never said that.

    The Bobover Rebbe’s statement, if true, is irrelevant. Also, “banareshen” implies unbecoming, as in below one’s dignity, not “unintelligent” as you rendered it.

    Either way, history has shown the Satmar Rav to be quite on the mark with that sefer, and it’s got tremendous insights for those who learn it.

    The Zionist wars were ordinary military victories, though there could certainly have been individual miracles as happens all the time.

  218. boyaner:
    He was publicly mekabel Hashem as king of the world; that’s no small feat, especially for a secular Zionist shmaded by the Zionists.

  219. Hakatan ,
    Why is thst how we are publicly makubol
    The ol yoke of heaven ?
    Maybe its through actions to each other instead of to the air or smashing our heads on a wall ?

    Philsopher
    Buried deep in your eloquent statement was the bizarre point tat and idf solider could serve the country snd not be a zionist ? What type of sucker theory is that ? Explicate pls
    Either he is a zionist or a gangster capitalist for wall st furthering big oils billion dollar daily racket
    I think since america did a visa waiver program recently many israelis can just leave and are not really fighting for their lives it is a blessing in disguise many can just leave and go to usa which is a better option than facing ied’s atgms vbied’s suicide bombers ,etc if u think of a killing method and hamas will do it, at least in usa the muslims and arabs do not shoot rockets at jews etc ( even if they wanna really badly)
    In the jewish autonomous oblast on the border of china deep innthe siberian steppe there is a safer homeleand for jews.
    There is such a thing as nukes and chemical weapons which basically make the idea of an ethno state obsolete which is why zionism only functioned as a secular idea from 19th and mid 29th century before the widespread of atmic bombs etc.

  221. HaKatan
    You are so brainwashed that it’s not even funny. Why is the Satmar position carry more weight than the Bobover? Actually the Bobover statement was moderate compared to “most” gedolim that apposed the al hageulah. Bobover didn’t despite vayoel Moshe but many did.

    I think the Ger, Belz, Viznitz, amongst others were holy people and were repulsed by the al hageulah… Satmar does not speak for Yehadus hachreidus. It’s no sanhedndin. They keep the aidah hostage to their ideation!!!

    I respect everyone but doesn’t seem like you do the same. Even if you claim there were no out of ordinary nissim, let me tell you something that I hope will give you some insight…

    1. Interesting, many rabbis that agreed with the basics of the shita, along with ordinary hassidim, felt that the turmoil in judiciary Israel, will bring down the government, henceforth bringing the prophecy of the Satmar to fruition. However, the result of this was: Seeing the inner turmoil and the non coexistence between different factions, our sonim, took advantage of this and attacked. Just a thought.

    2. It definitely would take either Moshiach or a great NES that is far greater than anyone ever experienced, to bring down the government while calming relations with the Palestinians, Iran, and all Moslem countries that try to kill us (don’t say it’s not true; their doctrine says it). Btw, there’s a Chafetz Chaim brought by reliable sources that said how we would be suffering from this Pera Odom and no matter what profession they take it will be “Pera -profession-“; Pera lawyer, Pera doctor, etc…

    So ain somchin al hanes and we don’t just sit around and wait for moshiach. Meaning: you need to do hishtadlus while waiting for the nes. Part of it is, YES, defending it! Being thankful and supportive to those shelichum that Hashem sent to protect you. Just like the police and firefighters in Israel deserve thanks; just as someone standing guard outside your shul for protection deserve thank you, so do the soldiers! And for moshiach, you don’t wait around and not buy a car if you need one… you’re grateful that you have a car and you take good care of it. You thank the car dealer too…

    Nothing I’ll say will really enter your mind because you’ll always go back to the yechidum that called for the suspension of the government, which is ludicrous. You’ll always belittle EVERY godul that doesn’t agree with your ideology! We should have no army because either a nes will happen or moshiach is coming? Of course we believe that a nes can happen and that moshiach is part of our 13 beliefs. You just need to put things in the right perspective at all times!

    I’m not Zionist but you’re not the one to define it. Sorry you feel otherwise!

  222. HaKatan
    And yes, I’m a Bobover and heard this statement in the name of the rebbe by many older chassidim. The claim of no nissim ticked off every godul that wasn’t yet bought off by Satmar! Lubavitch screamed, klausenberg, screamed, and Rishin screamed, amongst many others.

    He had a good thing going but the extremism didn’t get him where he wanted! I’m not talking against him c”v but the same way Lubavitch was not a G-d, nor Bobov, nor Klausenberg, nor Ger, so wasn’t Satmar! Even if I don’t want to argue with you on the issues, stop proselytizing and start living. I assume you didn’t finish shas yet nor completed your avodah (obviously your living b”h)! How much bittul Torah this fiasco has caused. What is practical today is Emunah that everything is Hashem and there are no other powers. We say this and talk mussar about this. The other points are barely relevant now!

  223. philosopher:
    I am not brainwashed; rather, I read and I also do not believe propaganda. Have you read? Or do you just convince yourself you’re not brainwashed?
    Read Rav Miller. Read the Satmar Rav and other rabbanim who knew that Zionism in Europe would lead to disaster. Read all the history on what the wicked Zionists did and did not do before and during the Holocaust. Perfidy, for example, is just a “taste”.

    To answer your academic question, of course I’m not blaming the kedoshim, certainly not the ones who knew better than to sing hatikva as they entered the gates of Auschwitz (yes, that happened). For 2,000 years, whenever one country became unfavorable to Jews, there always was another one to which to run. That’s the rule of galus, and it always worked for 2,000 years up until the Holocaust.

    The reason it didn’t work during the Holocaust is, of course, Zionism and the Zionists. There’s too much to discuss, but for starters, and only for starters, the Zionists, claiming to be “leaders of the Jews” (the Zionists haven’t stopped lying, of course) lobbied governments against allowing in Jews who would have escaped Europe because the Zionists wanted only the useful ones in then-Palestine.

    Antisemitism is a reflection of assimilation; it’s Hashem’s tool to remind that we are the am haNivchar and not part of the Nations (exactly the opposite of Zionism, of course). We saw it in Mitzrayim and on and on (see the Bais Haleivi’s famous piece on Shemos).

    So, no, claiming that Zionism is “just another excuse” is silly for both that reason and more. Criticizing anything about Zionism, especially since in fact it is Zionist and not Jewish, for real, is perfectly legitimate. Calling for harm of even the hair on the head of any Jew, however, is not legitimate even if that Jew lives in Israel.

    Zionism is very b&w; it is a greater tragedy for Jews than the goyim understand. The Brisker Rav said the Zionist State violates not only the Oaths but “the entire Torah”. That’s very, very bad, at least to a Jew.

    The number of Jews and yeshivos there is irrelevant due to the above but, besides, there would have been many more Jews living as Jews there and learning Torah had the Zionists not invaded a century ago. Great gedolim noted that Mashiach would have already come, too.

    The bottom line is that, if you are honest, you will realize that you think that the State is a good thing and therefore you distort the Torah to fit that. Don’t do that; look at the Torah first, look at what Hashem wants first.

  224. boyaner:
    Their army is a den of all three – in spades.

    The army is mixed gender, etc. That already is forbidden, never mind what happens as a result.

    Any killing intentionally done by that army which is not permitted by the Torah is, of course, murder.

    Zionism is idolatry and heresy, and their army is the main indoctrination/brainwashing force of that idolatry and heresy. In the Zionist army, they teach what they claim is Judaism, not patriotism as in normal armies.

  225. ccb45:
    Have you learned and studied all that I did, or does calling names make you think you know better?

    This is not about Satmar, Bobov or anyone else. The plain facts are that the Zionists’ victories in their wars were, as the Satmar Rav wrote, conventional military victories. Decades later (meaning by now), when the Zionist records about those wars have all been declassified, you can see exactly how much propaganda and lies the Zionists used in claiming that their victories were “miracles” when they very clearly were not.

    1. I have a different thought, but I will not share it so as not to offend people.

    2. It might take a neis to end Zionism in a way that keeps all Jews safe (and also turns off almost all, if not all, that hatred coming from the gentiles), but then that might be the only option at this point, so let’s keep davening. We say it daily in ViLaMalshinim, and that idol and its State will definitely end when Hashem decides He wants that to end.

    Hishtadlus is not a feel-good term. But it’s anyways irrelevant. The French army protects those in France. The Italian army protects those in Italy. Now, therefore, the Zionist army protects those in…Israel. They are not the Jewish army; they are the Zionist army of the Zionist State of Israel. The Zionist heretics (same thing) in control of the Zionist State of Israel are the ones who tell those soldiers what to do. So, those Zionist soldiers who protect the Jews there certainly do deserve thanks, just as would a firefighter here, et al. as you mentioned.

    I never belittled any gadol. But Zionism is treif, no matter whom you think held otherwise.

  226. ccb45:
    Please calm down about the whole “nissim” nonsense. Again, Zionist propaganda was accepted as “gospel truth” until people had the chance to read the actual facts and see that the Zionist wars were, indeed, conventional military victories. The fact is that’s what it was. You can claim there were individual nissim, which there certainly could have been just as there are all around the world all the time. But their victories simply were ordinary military victories, not miracles as the Zionist propaganda lied.

  227. Just because there was a miracle doesn’t necessarily mean that its good
    the goyim actually have anti semitism in the blood do not mean to scare people
    we are in the galus and only God saves us

    The Americans are giving Israel lots of weaponry according to the news post
    This would mean that Israel needs it or else it can won’t win the war this means thousands of tons of explosives and dollars and still no report just how much Hamas was damaged but it seems that not everything they do is terror and sometimes it is actually war related
    Like the hostages it looks like area getting taken care of this while Israel is killing the families with young children getting crushed alive in buildings and smothering to death the hostages are treated with respect this means it is a war for the monetary not just anti semitic
    Some people see Israel as saying we can kill hundred civilians for the life of one Israeli

  228. HaKatan
    The Pupa Rov recently gave stern warning to people to c”v take the arab side. He quoted that the Satmar rebbe, despite his vehement opposition to zionists, never tolerated taking the side of the sonim, our Arab neighbors. Satmar rebbe said cholilah to even think about taking their side.

    Halacha was his issue. Of course there’s such a thing as showing compassion but goven who these monsters are, I’m not losing sleep over it and I’m sure Satmar rebbe didn’t either.

    When you preach these controversial subjects to a goy, they get more infuriated and confused. They don’t understand halacha and how we love our brethren, even those that aren’t like us! Israel does a terrible job and makes it harder for us but the goy cannot handle these complications. Tell them, I’m not zionist and even when they believe you, they’ll but you in a dangerous position where you’re tounge tied! There is nothing wrong to use the first Rashi in Breishus to the goy and tell them to jump the bridge if they don’t like it. There is NO choice!!! Ein Breirah…

  229. @hakatan
    You suggest – go to the UN ???
    Now tell me – how many Bosnian civilians were directly MURDERED right under the UN’s nose ?
    What did the UN do in Iraq when their headquarters were bombed ?
    How long did it take the UN to fold ,pre ’67 when Nasser told them to evacuate from Sinai ?
    Is the UN safeguarding South Lebanon ,as they should according their own mandate ,from ‘Hizbollah military assets and personel” ?
    What rocket science to you think the UN will come up with ?
    The UN is NO BETTER than its constituents . Which pretty much says it all ….
    .
    The UN – the JOKE OF THE CENTURY .
    .
    To entrust them with the lives of millions of yidden is a direct recipe for mass disaster, hoyo lo sihyeh .
    And the height of folly and irresponsibility.
    .

  230. @hakatan
    Besides, you write as if the satmar rov was the only t’ch in klal yisrael , his gadlut notwithstanding .
    1] Ever went through Shut Avne Nezer ? He doesn’t have anything to be ashamed of , compared to shut divrei yoel .
    He writes clearly that 3 Shavuot are NOT incumbent on Yehuddim [end of YD] , only on the malachim.
    You and the Satmar rav can argue , but his shitah is not erased because of your arguments .
    I know many people who , in any other machloket in halacha [Shabbat or Yoreh Deah] would be noheg like Avne Nezer as opposed to Divre Yoel .
    2] besides that- it is reliably brought from Rav Ohr Sameach that even if 3 Shavuot were applicable , it was rendered irrelevant after Balfour Declaration. [other rabbanim referenced 1947 UN Partition Plan]
    3] Rav MiSteipla in his Karyane DeIgrata writes that even if hakamat hamedina was against halacha , now that it was established , bedi’avad once established , it is not being over an issur anymore .
    Just for a wider perspective of ge’onei olam .
    And Even if satmar rav was right , there still is the clear and immediate pikuach nefesh issue which you completely fail to address .
    Shmini Atseret / October 7 is an extremely sad and painful reminder of what these barbarians are capable of .
    Don’t forget that their motto is ‘The Suitcase or The Coffin’ , HaShem Yishmerenu.

  232. Hate to tell you bad news
    But you can’t get rid of the Hamas even if your destroy them from the Gaza they will use Egypt and the Jordan to do worse
    How safe is the border with Egypt and terrorist are from Israel till Afghanistan it is childish to think if the Hamas isn’t in the Gaza then they can’t come from Egypt or even from the uae

  233. If Israel can’t contain these terrorists then they can’t expect Egypt or the Jordan to be able to do that and Iran has thousands of missiles and we are trying to destroy this regime and that makes it suicidal
    The Holocaust survivors didn’t think that Israel was an answer to Jewish eternal shalom they knew what goyim hatred was and still felt in the galus we when millions of people are biting thier knifes think it’s a picnic and for shabbat also

  234. Hakatan, i have no doubt you’ll be OK living under the UN or even under Arab rule would you live in EY and not esconsed in your US dining room sofa… KOL hakovod if you relocate to Gaza to show the world that as a Torah Jew you are against the Zionist state. It would be mamesh a kovod shomayim. The NKs could move there with you.

  235. yankel berel:
    These tired Zionist arguments are all distortions and mistakes. Besides, all gedolim agreed with the Satmar Rav that the State violated the Oaths. The Brisker Rav added (to which all anyways agree) that it also violates the entire Torah. It’s not just a “Satmar” thing.

    For the Avnei Nezer argument, please see True Torah Jews Org:
    “The Avnei Nezer (Yoreh Deah 454) asks: when and where did the Jewish people accept the Oaths that prohibit them from leaving exile and taking over Eretz Yisroel? He answers that the Jewish Oaths were imposed on the roots of the Jewish souls in Heaven, and the gentiles’ oath was imposed on the angels of each nation…At this point, the Avnei Nezer is bothered: if the oaths are not legally binding, how could there be a punishment for violating them? He answers that “I will permit your flesh as the gazelles and deer of the field” is not to be understood as a direct punishment, but as a cutting off of Hashem’s protection that comes as a result of the sin. Sometimes even when a person cannot be culpable for what he did, the sin itself distances him from Hashem. ”

    See their site for much more.

    The Or Sameach one was not “reliably brought”; it was in a Mizrachi publication. As well, he never said the oaths ended. He merely said, assuming he even said it, that the single oath of rebelling against the nations would not be violated given the Balfour Declaration. But that was effectively rescinded, the Brits wrote that the Zionists read too much into that declaration and, more importantly, that is all totally irrelevant to both what actually happened – Zionist terror and wars against the nations – and the other Oaths, like emigration en masse and creating a State.

    In other words, this alleged Or Sameach merely permitted a small group of Jews to go to E”Y since it seemed the nations now permitted this. But creating a State and rebelling against the nations continued to remain forbidden.

    The Steipler didn’t say that either; he was discussing only voting in Israeli elections, that once the State was established, since your voting in elections doesn’t have anything to do with the State continuing, you’re allowed to vote in Israeli elections.

    Just for a wider perspective of geonei olam, all of whom forbade Zionism and its terror and wars and rebellion against G-d and, liHavdil, the nations as well.

    Pikuach nefesh doesn’t allow for violating the oaths. Obviously, self-defense is understood, but that doesn’t pertain to the Oaths.

  236. As much as the Satmer Rebbe was right about certain aspects of Zionism, many great Chareidi gedolim, poskim and rabbonim have different shittas regarding Zionism or relating to Zionists. T

    The biggest chilul Hashem is when we fight between ourselves and don’t support each other. our enemies love it but Hashem hates it.

  237. @hakatan
    1] Rav Chaim Vital writes that the ‘oaths’ expired at the end of elef hachamishi.
    2] the ‘oaths’ are not mentioned in any of the halachik codifiers e.g. rambam and sh’a. hashmatat harambam is a solid proof.
    3] you are misquoting the Steipler . He says that after bedi’avad once the state was created be’isur , its subsequent existence is not a sin , therefore participation in elections is not participation in sin .
    4] Pikuach nefesh is not docheh the 3 oaths ? where do you get that chiddush from ? Only 3 averot hamurot are docheh pikuach nefesh . Sh’A permits hillul shabat in fights against potential murderers . No mention of concern about oaths.
    5] Ramban holds kibush haarets is mitsvat ase min hatorah
    6] Much of gdolim resistance against hakamat hamedina was because its blatant anti religious character and mass loss of innocent life . No proof can be brought for their support of the ‘oaths’ shitah [besides if they explicitly said so]
    7] Don’t have Avne Nezer on hand now. will bln look it up .
    8] How could R Akiva support Bar Kochba initially , wasn’t this against the oaths ?

  238. It’s not just the Zionist
    If you go to the bies hamikdash you have to bring karbonos and what rabbi doesn’t say that the army is needed to save us now from the slaughter in Israel and usa

  239. @hakatan
    9] you claim the or sameach permitted only small groups to immigrate because that was permitted by the nations .
    If so The much later UN Partition Plan can also be considered ‘permission ‘ by the nations .
    10] Re the oath of mass emigration – that is only for those who advocated and organized mass immigration as such .
    Rav Vosner and his family zatsal were illegal immigrants to then palestine under british control.
    Although they were part of a mass immigration.
    11] Since as stated pikuach nefesh is docheh the oaths , then we could argue that since emigrants from the west were saved from the holocaust because of their emigration , their emigration was mutar as pikuach nefesh even al hatsad that oath would apply lemaaseh.
    12] Jews in Arab lands had to emigrate because of pikuach nefesh [even if it was caused by zionist actions – pikuach nefesh is pikuach nefesh , irrespective its source] Existence of the state proved to be their salvation . fact is and remains those [very many] individuals were saved by the states continued existence [not talking about the states establishment here]
    13] all those arguments [based on the past] fade, however, in the face of the, real ,existential issue facing millions of innocent lives in the future . There is no practical viable alternative .
    All clear eyed people agree .
    Its only the ‘yikov hadin et hahar’ people who close their eyes to this clear reality in front of us .
    Mass pikuach Nefesh .
    Blame game does not subtract from pikuach nefesh .
    Therefore , rosh yeshivat mir , Rav Chaim Shmulevits zatsal writes clearly in his Sichot mussar that an Israeli soldier who fell in israels wars is bedarga of Harugei Lud , ve’ein kol berya yechola laamod bimechitsato.

  240. This written after the argument of the satmer oaths “Rav Chaim Shmulevits zatsal writes clearly in his Sichot mussar that an Israeli soldier who fell in israels wars is bedarga of Harugei Lud , ve’ein kol berya yechola laamod bimechitsato.”
    Don’t know if true or not but it is missing the words “that protected the Zionist not Jewish people” for crying out loud
    The satmer oaths are not about piety it is politics and facts that from evil people come one bad that is torah and that is that they do not and will not and have and can not protect the Zionist not Jewish people the juicy real estate of Israel and it’s crazy chulent culture got to us

  241. yankel berel:
    Zionism is treif, liChol haDeios.
    1] Nope. See True Torah Jews. He was referring to Hashem’s “oath” of “kol haYom dava”, that galus must be (at least) 1,000 years unless there was teshuva meiAhava.
    2] The Satmar Rav addresses this. The Oaths are brought down by numerous poskim including the Rambam himself in Iggeres Teiman.
    3] Nope. You are misquoting. See also Rabbi Yaakov Shapiro’s book The Empty Wagon in which he wrote to Rav Chaim specifically about this and Rav Chaim indicated what I stated and not what you did.
    4] The Maharal says that it’s yehareig viAl yaavor. It’s not just the Big 3, by the way. For example, during a shaas haShmad, it’s anything public, etc.
    5] The Satmar Rav addresses this too. Obviously, the Ramban is not arguing with an open gemara brought down liHalacha by the poskim. So, that’s only when permitted, of course, not when that violates the oaths.
    6] Nope. See both the Brisker Rav and Satmar Rav, for example. But this is irrelevant and inconsequential.
    7] Great.
    8] Of course not, because he thought that Ben Koziva was actually Moshiach. The oaths apply only until Moshiach.
    9] Regardless, that would allow only limited peaceful ascent, not any State (as that is dechikas haKeitz) and certainly not Zionist terrorism and wars which the Zionists used to create their State (for years leading up to 1948).
    10] Not sure what you mean here, but probably irrelevant anyways.
    11] It’s not. Even if it were, they could have gone to America or other countries. It’s irrelevant, regardless.
    12] That’s quite a pretzel you’ve twisted. The Zionist arsonists lit on fire the entire Middle East, so their “State”‘s continued existence is therefore justified as pikuach nefesh. This is where idolatry really starts going off the rails. They could have moved to France or elsewhere, too, as it happens.
    13] What is or is not “practical” is not relevant. Hashem conducts both Klal Yisrael and Eretz Yisrael not on derech haTeva but on sichar viOnesh. All clear-eyed people agree.
    Rav Shmulewitz’s opinion is also irrelevant to this. Others also hold that anyone killed for being Jewish makes them Jews who died al kiddush Hashem.

    Zionism is idolatry and heresy and indefensible. The Torah never changes.

  242. We should ignore the fools who call Israel a contravention of the will of Heaven, thereby taking G-d out of Jewish history.

    We should ignore the fools who make יד אחת with the murderers of our brothers and sisters and think themselves righteous for doing so.

    These fools are caught in a time warp and are fighting battles from a hundred years ago.

    We have one little Israel, the only Jewish country in the world – with 6.8 million Jews – who need G-d’s protection and our full and unequivocal support.

    We should love and support the world’s only haven for our people UNCONDITIONALLY and ALWAYS.

  243. Anyone arguing with HAKATAN is wasting valuable time. I’ve yet to see a Satmar actually ever submit to any of the arguments you give them no matter who said those! It’s SATMAR above all, nebech!!!

  244. Hakatan
    Since Satmar is against Neturei Karta, why don’t they officially call out and bad them with excommunication. Maybe we can call them YM”S? (It’s a question, not a implication; c”v to make this up on your own. Daas torah is needed)! Chazal would definitely call for their demise as being rodfim and anti Torah. You never kiss up to your enemy!!! I’m very surprised how the kanuim will demand from acheinu to be fully with them but not condemn action that’s traitorous towards am yisroel! It’s beyond me. If Zionism on one side of the scale and NK on the other, the sins of NK would not only weigh down but likely break the scale!

  245. Not 1 soldier should be dying or even risking their lives to save anyone being used as a human shield in Gaza. This is a perfect example of what Chazal says “whoever has compassion on the cruel is being cruel on the compassionate” but the reshoim that run the Israeli government don’t care about halacha or what the Torah version of morality is, they will continue to spill Jewish blood to placate the UN.

  247. The hypocrisy/dishonesty/two facedness of many Kanuim – ahem, Hakatan – is mind boggling!
    When it suits you, the Tziyonim are all about Kochi V’oitzem Yadi (which I believe is so for a large part nebuch), but then when it suits you the Miracles of the 6 day war are simply “propaganda sold by the Zionizts “. Which one is it? You don’t know because you’re simply locked into the need of being Mekabel Daas of the Satmar Ruv ZL for whatever the reason might be. You don’t have a true personal opinion. Nor should you. Just be honest and say “I’m Mevatel Daati to my Rebbe “ and just shut up and not post all this dribble.

  248. Ccb45, i do not think I’m changing hakatan’s opinion at all. I just don’t want his ideoligy to go uncontested while while Jews are being murdered and are finding thremsleves in increasingly dangerous situations which is being fuled by irrational hate and ideology.

  249. kinsler:
    The lack of logic/emotional knee-jerk defense of the Zionist idol/silliness by pro-Zionists is mind-boggling!

    The facts are that the Zionists have possessed a formidable military force and weapons with which, al pi derech haTeva, they had no problem destroying their opponents in their past wars.

    Of course, no matter how strong you are, you still have to credit Hashem. This is plain and obvious to all, and has zero to do with the above.

    But the Zionists’ rebellion against G-d is anyways far greater than “only” Kochi viOtzem Yadi.

    Also, it’s not just the Satmar Rav’s daas Torah. It’s the others, too, and also what is now known as the plain facts, unlike Zionist propaganda and lies.

  250. Ari Knobler:
    Your emotional defense of the Zionist idol and its State are sad to read, and your conflation of that with those who dance with murderers is appalling.

    What Hashem allows versus what He wills are sometimes very, very different. For example, did He want 6,000,000 of His children murdered in the Holocaust and all the rest of that pain there? Obviously not. Did He allow it? Obviously yes.

    So, just because He allowed the State to come into being and to continue, does not at all mean that He wanted that State. In fact, looking at the Torah, it is very clear that He abhors that State.

    Of course, one should not make יד אחת with murderers, but that is a straw man argument; that doesn’t change the fact that the Zionist State always was and will be treif.

    The fools truly caught in a time warp from a hundred years ago are the “Religious Zionists” who still believe after close to a century that their idol State is the beginning of the redemption when that was a forgery, etc.

    The Zionists have one little Israel, the only Zionist country in the world – with 6.8 million Jews – who need G-d’s protection…

    We should love and support the world’s only haven for our people – the Torah – unconditionally and always.

  251. ccb45:
    It is a waste of time to argue nonsense against the Torah. “Satmar” is not the point.

    Regarding Satmar and NK, I do not care what they hold of each other; I care about what the Torah holds about the facts.

    I happen to disagree with your invented assertions about NK. The Iranian leader they met claimed specifically that he has nothing against Jews and Judaism but only against Zionism. I have no idea if he meant what he said or not, but I do know that NK proclaims that their goal is to tell the world the truth that Zionism is not Judaism and that Jews are not responsible for anything that the Zionists do or don’t do.

    Given the current political climate and recent attacks against Jews worldwide solely due to the Zionists’ latest war (justified or not is irrelevant), it is astonishing that more Jews don’t at least understand from where the NK is coming – trying to protect Jews worldwide from Zionism and its Big Lie of representing Jews.

    But you statement at the end, about how the NK is orders of magnitude worse than the Zionists indicates one of two things: either you have zero idea about what Zionism is and has done to Jews, or your scale you mentioned was made by Zionists.

  252. To the people of compassion
    Just because there is miracles doesn’t mean it’s a good thing. There is only one torah.
    The satmer rabbi war a very great man and he wasn’t the only person.
    He said the sin that was done that brought about the Holocaust
    You can see it now how much Zionism is in the blood of the Jewish community and how it can bring sorrow for us
    Saying things like those that go to war are on par with the rosh yeshiva
    The love of this land Israel is not a good thing necessarily unless it’s completely for the same of God first
    Not come to Israel cause of the culture and fun which most certainly is the purists
    Also not good to say the rabbi says this from piety but not for me and its not a fact there is no rav that will say if Jewish people don’t deserve it they can’t bring sorrow

  253. @hakatan
    You dismissed pikuach nefesh of millions with one stroke of the keyboard .
    Maharal does not write as a posek .
    Nor is he accepted against ALL the Poskim that only 3 hamurot are stronger than pikuach nefesh.
    If it would be your own daughters life at risk , you would think about it longer and deeper than just citing a maharal without a source , and AGAINST all established poskim .
    Schar VeOnesh ?
    What sort of reasoning is this ???
    If there is pikuach nefeash .
    Even a sfek sfeika of it , you MUST give it SERIOUS consideration .
    In a RESPONSIBLE way .
    Not just some parroting of some ideological Shitah .
    There PEOPLE behind these she’elot .
    People with little children .
    People with aged parents .
    People with Torah .
    People of yir’at shamayim .
    With a stroke on the keyboard you sentenced them to death ????
    Shomu Shamayim ….

  254. @hakatan
    If these people would be stricken ch’vsh with some machla l’o , would you dismiss it with – HKBH works with schar ve onesh ????
    We would / should do ALL we can to help them BEDERECH HATEVA . We would be mechallel e’thing to bring them a Yeshua BEDERECH HATEVA .
    Same here .

  255. @hakatan
    “what is ‘practical’ is not relevant”
    I cant believe that a normal yehudi with a harts could react like that .
    Can you imagine Hatsolah saying what is practical is not relevant ???
    Or Askanim for the Klal ?
    Or security organisations ??
    Or law enforcement ??
    Or your wife when you need help ??
    ?!?!?!

  256. yankel berel:
    Violating the oaths is forbidden and is a source of calamity R”L L”A. Violating the oaths, therefore, is not hishtadlus and does not act against pikuach nefesh; just the opposite – violating the Oaths is a clear cause of pikuach nefesh as the gemara states openly and as the poskim bring down.

    But this is irrelevant. The gedolim warned that there would be wars forever and Jewish blood was spilled like water if the Zionists were to establish their State. They were proven to be very right about that, of course. Whatever hishtadlus and protection from pikuach nefesh that individual Jews need and may halachically do, they obviously should. But that idol State was never, and will never be, the answer.

    Regarding “practical being not relevant”, you obviously didn’t understand what I wrote, if you’re comparing that to Hatzalah, et al. Hashem runs E”Y by His unique hashgacha and NOT on Derech haTeva. Therefore, the Teva assessment of the situation there in E”Y is irrelevant.

  257. HaKatan
    I’m not gonna argue with someone that repeat his same stale statements and just seeing one way!

    It would help for you to watch a clip about the lubavitcher speaking to a kofer nebach and telling him to see a doctor; rofei nefesh. When the guy told him that he doesn’t need one, he explained that he needs a doctor because he’s so sick he doesn’t realize he needs a doctor!

    I don’t mean to make fun but point out that you’re so engrossed in your own mind and your enclave that you need someone (a godul), to open your mind and see that not everyone is on the same boat in the same intensity! If you don’t believe you need to see one, that in itself shows it’s an emergency to see one!

    I learned in Bobov and when I was younger and immature, I didn’t see anything else. Like: Oh, I didn’t know that others do different! I thought Bobov uber altz. When I matured I realized that harbeh deruchim lamokom and that I don’t HAVE to understand. You don’t question others just because you don’t understand and definitely not gedolei yisroel.

    It’s part of the tenants of almost every movement in ultra orthodoxy to respect what gedolim say no matter if you agree with lutvish or not; if you agree with chassidish or not; sefardi, or any ehrliche tzaddikim.

    Will i accuse you of saying that anyone not agreeing with you, isn’t a godul? Well, I don’t think so because the gaavah would be so bad and we know about Kol hamisgoeh! Satmar rov, even if he was alone in the “entirety” of the shita, had more right to condemn gedolim because he was an unquestionable godul btorah and in yitahs shumayim. He also had seniority too. In any case, he wouldn’t allow you to talk against gedolim and you are.

    If I tell you that the boyaner which is a talmud chochum and a smart person, beloved around the world (I’m not boyan), has given a present to the IDF soldiers along with personal brochos, what would you say? Can I guess???!!!

  258. Hakatan

    None of the quotes or misquotes of various gedolim can negate blatantly obvious facts. Not a single Gadol ever met or encouraged others to meet our enemies. If anything, most gedolim, despite their objections to Zionism, were concerned about harming the states image in the eyes of the world. Look at the actions of Agudah over the last 70 years. Are you going to pull out the conspiracy theory that Agudah is not really run by daas Torah? Get real.
    More importantly, the Chazon Ish Zatzal told the Satmar Rebbe that we build good instead of fighting evil. Of course specific battles must be fought as the Chazon Ish himself did against Sheirut Leumi. However, it was all for the purpose of building good. This has clearly been the Derech of most of our leaders. We invest our time and energy in learning and spreading Torah. We teach by example the beautiful ways of the Torah and inspire others to follow them. We dont Kannaus on internet forums. Such unbridled Kannaus, even if correct, only pushes others away from Torah and is mechallel Shem Shamaim. Maybe show your comments to your Rebbe or Rav and ask him if it is proper for you to post.
    Thank you for reading my post.

  260. Gavriel Rubin:
    None of the quotes permit encouraging rotzchim, and I never claimed that they permitted doing so. This is a straw man argument.

    However, I don’t know from where you got the “hashkafa” that you’re not allowed to meet enemies. The Torah disagrees. Going back to the gemara’s times, Rav Yochanan Ben Zakai met Vespasian just before he was to destroy Yerushalayim and the Beis HaMikdash. In more contemporary times, and not an exact comparison, of course, Rav Aharon Kotler stated during WW II that he would prostrate himself in front of the Pope if it would save even the fingernail of a Jew.

    As well, it is important for Jews to point out to the world that Zionism is not Judaism (the Satmar Rav called that a mitzva gedola and more, if memory serves). This is a kiddush Hashem (because Zionism is the opposite, of course) and also can potentially save Jews, R”L. This is not a radical idea; it is plain logic. If any gentile has an issue with anything the Zionist State does, he can take that up with that State and leave Jews out of it because Zionism is diametrically opposed to Judaism and the Zionist State is Zionist, not Jewish.

    Your conjecture about Agudah and the “State’s image” is just that. From what I gather, since millions of Jews live there, Agudah’s lay leadership feels it appropriate to advocate for weapons and such for that State to protect the Jews under their rule, just as they would do if there were millions of Jews in France or England. But, a decade or so ago, when the Zionists were planning on drafting all the yeshiva boys there, Agudah and others held a massive atzeres in Manhattan, despite the “image” problem that would cause the Zionists.

    But since you mentioned it, Rav Chaim Brisker, when he left the Agudah, stated exactly that: that it will be run by the secretaries (lay leadership). There were stories of exactly that, pre-State, of a lay leader delivering a lecture, including his daas baal haBayis, not just reporting facts, to a room-full of the Moetzes. There’s more… I am not claiming what does or does not happen, but there is certainly ample precedent for that claim.

    Get real, as you said.

    I don’t believe that story with the Chazon Ish, as it makes no sense. Even if it were true, however, the most you could say is eilu viEilu…

    Finally, there is a tidal wave of kefirah and a”z that the Zionists have unleashed on the world, especially since their latest war began on Yom Tov. If people understood the tsunami of deios kozvos that have assaulted Klal Yisrael – thanks to Zionism and its immense propaganda – especially those who don’t know any better, more people would help clarify the truth to acheinu Binei Yisrael.

  261. ccb45:
    So, in other words, you have no response, so you just claim it’s only one gadol.

    Your story at the end, of the Boyaner rav who gave a present and brachos to an IDF soldier, doesn’t change the reality of what is and is not daas Torah, and is irrelevant to that.

  262. @hakatan
    hakatan is paskening dinei nefashot without any authorisation , without any mekorot based on a hardened and simplified shitah .
    he claims that in e’y, teva does not apply , only schar ve onesh . And according to schar ve onesh if people are attempting to murder a yehudi , it is assur for idf soldiers to kill them because ‘teva does not apply’ ….
    Go figure.
    He claims that because of his interpretation of a gmara in ktubot, killing the would be [and the has been] murderer , will not prevent him to continue to murder .
    Therefore idf soldiers should immediately stop all activity , and all innocent people in e”y will be safe .
    Safe in a real and physical sense .
    Because hakatan said that derech hateva does not apply , only schar ve onesh .
    And hakatan wants us to believe him that he is not speaking in his own name .
    He claims to speak in the torah’s name.
    No matter that hamas explicitly declares to repeat simhat torah’s massacres again and again until there is no one left chv’sh.
    The sheer recklessness which is evidenced as the defining hallmark of his approach of the sugya of pikuach nefesh, serves as a good indicator of the maturity and responsibility of his approach to all other relevant sugyot .
    Question for hakatan – more or less, please . Without changing of topic .
    If idf would have not responded on simhat torah and the following 2 days , would there be more or less innocent korbanot in e’y ?
    if there is no straight answer from hakatan, then we all know the real answer …..

  264. FORWARDING AN EMAIL:

    ____

    Arabic speakers know that ‘From the Rivers to the sea…’ “Free” speaks of pure-Arab: Arab racism / supremacy, ethnic cleansing and genocide of Jews -non-Arabs

    Without going into Arab-Palestinian oppressive regimes’ nature of PA or Hamas and the ironic term “free” or “freedom” chants.
    But in Arabic, it is the ARAB – to be of the area, which is the yearning by this and such slogans. [1]
    Worse than merely Arab-apartheid of Arab republics but it’s about Arab ‘purity.’
    It is no different from Hitler’s helper [2] Ahmad Shukeiri that wanted to establish in Jerusalem a “purely Arab government” for all of Palestine. [3]
    Or today (SJP/WOL) Nerdeen Kiswani known for interrupting Holocaust ceremonies [4] that push that ‘Palestine is Arab’ chant. [5]
    In fact, the very basis for objecting a Jewish State by the Arab Higher Committee in 1947 was exactly that: Arab racism – as expressed [6] by its spokesperson Jamal Husseini, only months after he and Shukeiri justified the Holocaust. [7]
    What’s amazing is that with Google translate age Israelophobes have still the audacity to go Arafat style ‘Double Speak’ [8] – that is, to lie in English to the West.
    Including Rashida Tlaib.

    ______

    NOTES

    [1].
    Imam of Peace @Imamofpeace:

    Rashida is a liar. Why? Because the chant “From the river to the sea” is a translation of the original Arabic chant “from the water to the water, Palestine will remain Arab.” This is a genocidal call to ethnically cleanse the land from all non-Arabs i.e. the Jews.
    The original Arabic chant: من المية للمية فلسطين عربية

    Nov 3, 2023

    Sam Halpern, “Noa Tishby slams Rashida Tlaib for ‘from the river to the sea’ claim.” The Jerusalem Post, Nov 4, 2023.
    https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/antisemitism/article-771642

    [2]
    Congressional Record: Proceedings and Debates of the …, Volume 107, Part 24, United States Congress 1961, p.5735:
    https://books.google.com/books?id=ijg4AQAAMAAJ&pg=SL1-PA5735&dq=#v=snippet&q=%22all%20out%20for%20Hitler%22&f=false

    Shukairy joined the Arab Higher Committee which was also headed by the ex Mufti. Shukairy got his start in politics in the early 1930s when he belonged to a group of fanatical extremists led by the ex-Mufti. This gang cooperated with the Communists and prior to the Hitler-Stalin Pact sought in every possible way to sabotage the Allied war effort against the Nazis in the Middle East. However, when Soviet Russia joined the Allies, Shukairy’s group split with the communists, and went all out for Hitler.

    The Detroit Jewish News. Friday, February 03, 1967 (p. 9)
    https://digital.bentley.umich.edu/djnews/djn.1967.02.03.001/9

    ‘Antiwar Group Warns Public of PLO Leader Shukairy.’
    In a letter to the editor published in Wednesday’s New York Times, Dr. Albert Simard, secretary of the Society for the Prevention of World War Three warns of the “dangerous” background and activities of Ahmed Shukairy, head of the Palestine Liberation Organization who, he said, had expressed hatred of the West.
    Recalling the pro-Hilter activities “highest levels of government” of Shukairy when he was associated with the notorious Grand Mufti of Jerusalem.

    [3].
    The Progress-Index from Petersburg, Virginia, June 13, 1967, p.4.
    https://www.newspapers.com/newspage/47754873/

    ‘Palestine Liberation Group Badly Mauled.’ By Michael Goldsmith, Beirut, Lebanon (AP).

    The Arab defeat in the Middle East war leaves a big question mark over the future of the Pafestine Liberation Organization and its firebrand leader -leftist Ahmed Shukairy. Shukairy narrowly escaped capture by Israeli forces in Jerusalem and many of his “Liberation Army” are now prisoners of the Israelis. “We will wipe Israel off the face of the map and no Jew will survive,” Shukairy declared two days before the war broke out June 5. He vowed to lead the vanguard of his troops into the Israeli sector of Jerusalem and set up a “purely Arab government” there for all of Palestine.

    [4].
    “Jewish leaders demand termination of CUNY Law dean.”
    Haley Cohen, The Jerusalem Post, Jun 14, 2023.
    https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/article-746278

    Gunz, a former classmate of Kiswani’s at CUNY Law, has said that Kiswani has been criticized “because she interrupts Holocaust memorial ceremonies and says that she hopes the last thing Zionists hear in their life is ‘pop pop.'”

    [5].
    “Anti-Israel Groups Stage Days of Resistance Protests.” ADL, Aug 13, 2020.
    https://www.adl.org/resources/blog/anti-israel-groups-stage-days-resistance-protests-0

    At the rally in New York City, a few protesters prominently displayed flags of the terrorist groups Hezbollah and the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP). Among the chants were “Hey-hey ho-ho, Zionists have got to go” and, in Arabic, “From the river to the sea, Palestine is Arab.” One speaker spoke glowingly of the “growing militant struggle of Palestinians to avenge their homeland” and of Palestinians and others around the globe “taking up the armed struggle of revolution because they have no other choice, they have no other way to fight for their struggles.” The event’s MC, Nerdeen Kiswani of the anti-Israel group Within Our Lifetime-United for Palestine, referred to Jewish people who immigrated to Palestine and later Israel in the nineteenth and twentieth centuries as exclusively European, despite the large percentage of Sephardic and Mizrahi Jews who came to Israel, often in response to persecution, from the Middle East and North Africa, and currently make up the majority of the Israeli Jewish population.

    [6]
    Herf, J. (2022). Israel’s Moment: International Support for and Opposition to Establishing the Jewish State, 1945-1949. India: Cambridge University Press, p. 65.
    https://books.google.com/books?id=vHRUEAAAQBAJ&pg=PA65
    https://www.meforum.org/63545/jeffrey-herf-what-was-behind-the-miracle

    Jamal Husseini claimed the Arab world’s “territorial continuity” served as a “natural bulwark for peace, homogeneity, and race” that a Jewish state in the region would destroy.

    [7]
    Behind the British Conspiracy.” B’nai B’rith Messenger. 12 July, 1946, p.6: .
    https://www.nli.org.il/en/newspapers/bbh/1946/07/12/01/article/47

    Achmed Shukeiri, chief of the Arab office, who restituted in his conversation the words of Goebbels, justified the murder of six million Jews of Europe “because Hitler could not be all wrong.” I met Jamal el Husseini; he issued the same warning as Shukeiri (he being Shukeiri’s chief) … and reiterated his justification of the mass murder of six million Jews “for Hitler couldn’t be all wrong . . .

    [8].
    “Listen to Arafat in Arabic, Not in English.”
    David Eliezrie, The Los Angeles Times, Feb 27, 1996.
    https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1996-02-27-me-40531-story.html

  265. HaKatan: I think what the question really is right now is this: Now that the Zionists have succeeded in getting a frightneningly large amount of people around the world to hate all Jews, despite the efforts of the Satmar Rov Z”L, what do we do?
    Aside from that, did the many Gedolim that spoke against the medina call for the death of the people running it? I don’t think so.
    Many of the Yidden killed were shomer Torah u’Mitzvos, and many that survived took upon themselves to come closer to Hashem. I don’t believe any Yid thinks that what happened on Shmini Atzeres wasn’t a terrible calamity and a big chilul Hashem. Because now that the world a. equates Israel with Judaism, and b. almost all of the murdered are Hashem’s children.
    Therefore, what the Israeli army is doing now is defending against the terror to Jews and not allowing Hashem’s name to be mechulal and do nothing. I know what the Zionists are saying, but the fact is that they are fighting against a group that carried out a terrible act against Hashem’s children. I heard that the Satmar Rov (I think) said by one of the wars that if Israel wins it will be a chilul Hashem, but if they lose it will be a chilul Hashem. So we daven for (I forgot) either for Kiddush Hashem or the good of Klal Yisroel.
    So, seeing the climate of the world now, what the Israeli army is fighting against, and what the opposers are advocating for, on which side do we place our support?

  266. Yankel Berel:
    “And according to schar ve onesh if people are attempting to murder a yehudi , it is assur for idf soldiers to kill them because ‘teva does not apply’ ….”

    I did not say anything remotely like that. I’m sorry if you misunderstood what I wrote. I specifically wrote “self-defense is understood”. Jews are always not only permitted but required to defend themselves as needed.

  267. A Fish Out of Water:
    I think the very first thing is to follow what he calls a great mitzva and tell the world that Zionism is diameterically opposed to Judaism and that Jews are not responsible for anything the Zionists do or otherwise as their State is Zionist, not Jewish.
    I never called for the death of anyone. But we all daven viLaMalshinim three times per day. That bracha is pretty clear, especially in nusach sefard.

    Of course, the massacre on Simchas Torah was a horrific calamity and a big chilul Hashem, as you stated. Hashem’s children were slaughtered. Obviously, that is a chilul Hashem.

    Not everything the Zionist army is doing now and at any other time is defending Hashem’s children. Obviously, whatever good they are doing, we hope goes well.

    We certainly do not place our support with savage rotzchim – of course not – but we also do not place it with the Zionists and their army, both because of what the Zionists are (haters of Hashem and His Torah) and because the safety of the Jews in E”Y is not actually dependent on them; it is dependent solely on Hashem as it is His land and He runs that land (and His people) through His hashgacha, not biDerech haTeva.

    Simply, we place our support, specifically our prayers, with our brethren all around the world including in E”Y. “Acheinu kol bais yisrael…”

  268. Hashem please give hatzlacha for the IDF soldiers to wipe out Hamas and all the other terrorist gangs operating in Hamas. And may they find and return the hostages whole and healthy. And may the self-centered Netanyahu, who shakes in his boots in front of every US president, and the Israeli leftists in the government, not pull the Israeli army from Gaza again so that another terrorist group should not take over Gaza again and cause the hostages and the soldiers’ blood to be shed in vain and would place Israel again in danger as before c”v.

    Hashem please send moshiach speedily so that there be peace and no more wars. Amein v’amein

  269. HaKatan:
    Thanks for your clear response.
    I’m sorry, I did not mean to insinuate that you called for anyone’s death.
    What I did mean was to suggest an idea that maybe the mitzva of educating the world does not apply now. The rationale for this is the fact that many, most, or all non-Jews that have an opinion are placing Jews and Zionists on the same side either to be against them or to support them.
    Because of the current situation, if we try to tell the world that Judaism and Zionism are two opposites, they will hear that Jews are saying that Hamas is right. They will think, “If Jews don’t support their brothers, why should we?”
    What comes out is that in a time when the importance of educating the world is greatest, it is very difficult, perhaps impossible, to do. Because we run the risk of causing the strengthening of support for the enemies of Hashem and His people.

  270. hakatan :
    I specifically wrote “self-defense is understood”. Jews are always not only permitted but required to defend themselves as needed.
    Good. “Jews are required to defend themselves as needed.”
    So ,hakatan agrees . Even if [!] the establishment of the state was illegitimate and against the torah , even so there is a REQUIREMENT that Jews defend themselves .
    And that is not against the 3 oaths .
    So , in what matters most , i.e. the future , hakatan agrees that all steps necessary for the defense of Jews should be taken .
    Since there is no other credible alternative al pi derech hateva [not sure about s’char va’onesh ?] for the defense of said Jews , apart from the idf , we can rest assured of hakatans support of the idf .
    Thank you .
    I can rest my case .

  271. I’m going to break my own rule and respond to the aptly named HaKatan:

    You yourself framed the State of Israel as something G-d allows but dislikes (“abhors” in your trademark hyperbolic argot.) If Israel is acceptable בדיעבד as you imply, that is enough to warrant our acceptance of her existence and our prayers for her survival.

    Whether Israel was founded as a state that conforms to Jewish law is not finally the point. The religious are becoming a majority in Israel and the state will inevitably become a religious nomocracy. A now-deceased rosh yeshiva whose father had been the פוסק הדור once explained that G-d made it possible that the coming Torah state would be equipped with an established infrastructure that would enable it to function smoothly. So, your proclamation that Israel “will always be treif” is without basis and betrays your own self-satisfaction. Instead, you should take the path of Amos who said, “לֹֽא־נָבִיא אָנֹכִי וְלֹא בֶן־נָבִיא אָנֹכִי.”

    The idea that a Zionist state should not be considered Jewish is absurd on its face. As for the Religious Zionists whom you attack with such verve: Shame on you. Young Jewish boys, many of whom are far more righteous and learned than you, have been laying down their lives in defense of their Jewish brothers and sisters with the Shema on their lips. When you attack Israel, framing her as irredeemably godless, you by extension attack them. How dare you.

    You are smug, willful and completely obnoxious. It is chiefly your lack of compassion, your blithe absence of even a modicum of רחמים, that leads me to conclude you are of the ערב רב. Now toddle off.

  273. the Israel government and their army is not allowed to exist period their army is not saving lives because if they would dismantle the government with the army their would be no danger anymore the u.n. And America would make sure everyone is safe and the arebs won’t have a reason to kill Jews and it would be against their interests to do so in addition the Israeli government is יהרג ועל יעבור so it’s irrelevant. Btw if you really cared about Yiddishe lives you wouldn’t support sending soldiers into Gaza what gives you the right to sacrifice them to save others in the future. Also this whole war is not Going to accomplish anything even if they kill every member of Hamas in Gaza Iran will recreate Hamas in a second and half their leaders are in qutar anyways and בכלל it’s a very dangerous game it could lead to a war with Iran and the whole Arab world and maybe even Russia and china

  274. What ever you think about satmer and Zionist it is safe to say that they will not help the moshiach or any prophet in the ultimate redemption in the least from the slaughter of Jewish souls and nobody should think it wasn’t all the hand of God even with all the pain and suffering that they caused and still do this very day from making the pleasure world into spiritual and the young girls that marry arabs and even October 7 we cry out for they’re help but the Zionist state years of glory is so pre destined exactly how long the country will last and how long they will continue to make anti semitism to goyim and gut im and they continue to say that the Jews is dependent on them and only likes to live in Israel and take millions of people to this dangerous place where if you don’t like torah then it is not very pleasant a place where some people have the chutzpah to say that the rambam talking about living there had to do with a sick army for the real estate and not to go there only the sake of Torah

    The time and exact date and years of the Zionist state is and war pre destined and written in God’s book like it says in Daniel after they let a dog drink from the kelim of the bies hamikdash “mnie mnie tekal uparsin”
    The time of the end to the Zionist state is now and it will not wait one more minute because this is what is in the tikkun of neshomis

  275. A Fish Out of Water:
    I would say just the opposite:
    It is all the more important now (for at least two reasons, one spiritual and one physical) to educate the world that Zionism is diametrically opposed to Judaism and that the Zionist State is Zionist, not Jewish, and (not to leave out) that we Jews care about our brethren there under the Zionist thugs in power there, of course.

    That (anyways) of course does not mean to march in Pro-Palestine rallies.

  276. yankel berel:
    To be clear, no Torah authority (including Agudah) claimed that the Zionist State is acceptable “bidieved”. The Zionist State was and is and always will be against not only the three oaths but against “kol haTorah kula” as the Brisker Rav noted.

    While individual Jews must always defend themselves against even a potential attacker R”L L”A, that does not convey any legitimacy to the Zionist State. If there are IDF soldiers who are specifically protecting Jews in a manner approved by G-d, then that act of protecting Jews is obviously good. But that does not grant any legitimacy to the Zionist “State”, its army, etc.

  277. Ari Knobler:
    The Brisker Rav stated that the Zionist State is a violation of the entire Torah. He meant exactly that. Therefore, it is obviously not “hyperbolic” to state the obvious: that G-d abhors that State. Only an idolater or maskil (same difference in this case) would challenge that particular assertion.

    The Brisker Rav also said that this applies even if Rav Amram Blau Zatza”L would be that State’s Prime Minister. The many problems with the Zionist State include, but are not at all limited to, that it doesn’t run according to the Torah.

    The truth is, and this addresses your next point, too, that it’s impossible to have any Jewish State prior to Mashiach’s coming as that is one of the tasks delegated exclusively to Mashiach.

    Let’s rewrite that next paragraph so you understand (hopefully) how silly this is: “The idea that the golden calf idol should not be considered Jewish is absurd on its face. As for the egel worshipers whom you attack with such verve: Shame on you. Young Jewish boys, many of whom are far more righteous and learned than you, have been laying down their lives in defense of their Jewish brothers and sisters with the Shema on their lips. When you attack the golden calf, framing her as irredeemably godless, you by extension attack them. How dare you.”

    The Chofetz Chaim himself pointed out that those same Zionists are from the Erev Rav. Rav Elchonon pointed out that not only is Zionism idolatry, but “Religious Zionism”, of which you are so enamored, is simply idolatry and religion mixed together.

    You can write silly insults, but those don’t change the indisputable facts.

  278. Ari Knobler:
    To clarify further, what makes something Jewish is simply its accordance with Hashem and His Torah. It really is that simple.

    So, the Zionist State, which is a violation of not only the oaths but of the entire Torah, is very obviously not Jewish.

  279. Just at the kappos and ghetto uprising was with the Nazi the Zionist are like the Hamas they care only about themselves nothing to do with saving Jewish people just at much they eat chazir and have morrocan girl friends
    If there are some dati people that think they are doing God’s will that was depleted when you see people with beard’s and peyos on the har habayis to incite hatred a chillul hashem
    Going to the kever of Yosef hatzadik or eliezer doesn’t make you a good person or not gay it actually doesn’t mean anything cause they no longer have any interests in this world
    Ask any rabbi or rosh yeshiva if the Zionist that made the state of Israel was bigger reshoim then the communist or ghetto kappos and they will say that they was they hated the Jewish souls something not describable
    Then ask them if from the wicked comes only bad or not and they will say that the state of Israel is going to have a very bitter end tell me a rabbi that will say the Zionist are any place but in hell and that they will save Jews

  280. @hakatan
    1] you agreed that defense of yehudim is required a/p torah .
    You also agreed that Individual soldiers who are engaged in that defense are acting a/p torah .
    Using your logic, it is clear that the idf merely by existing ,training and fighting as a unit are not any different from the individual soldier , mentioned before .
    Specifically not mentioning any anti religious activities they undertake . Am referring here to a [theoretical] fully religious idf .
    No idf = clear sakanat nefashot for millions .
    Therefore – Existence/readiness of idf is mema’et sakanat nfashot .
    Therefore Existence/readiness of idf is mandated a/p torah.
    2] Building on previous point .
    Existence/readiness of idf is impossible without existence of the medina.
    Therefore existence of medina is [present and future] mandated a/p torah .
    Irrespective of history .
    Simple.
    3] you misquoted Karyana de’igreta . He clearly says that the issur of the medina was only at its establishment . Not bediavad .
    Look it up .
    4] Avne nezer does not say it the way you quoted .
    He says the reason of Rambam omitting the oaths in his Yad , is because there is no issur hilchati whatsoever to transgress the oaths .
    Only that if a person feels like going against [or is going against] the oaths it is merely a siman .
    It is a siman of either a disconnect between the persons guf and his neshama , or a disconnect between his neshama and HKBH.
    Which obviously should be rectified .
    Lav davka through adherence to the oaths .
    Rather Through added adherence to the torah as a whole.
    3] The oaths are mentioned by Shlomo hamelech . Much before hurban bayit rishon . So why was milhemet hahasmonaim and subsequent establishment of their meluha not against the oaths ?
    4] rambam in yad writes that part of nes hanukah is the fact that ‘hazrah malhut leyisrael karov le matayim shana’ . Seems like hakamat malhut beyad yisrael is considered a positive phenomenon .
    5] Kingdom of the Khazars was also a malhut of yehudim . Was that against the oaths ? Obviously not . Although that for its continued existence wars had to be waged .
    6] It is brought from rav miBrisk that establishment of the medina was a ‘smile’ from heaven after the war , in the sense that refugees found a place to go to. Quoted by R moshe shmuel shapira z’l r’y be’er yaakov, [talmid and relative of the rav].
    7] Heard from a hasid from belz a similar saying from R Aron miBelz .
    8] whether the establishment of medina was permitted a/p torah or not, is irrelevant now . What is relevant, is the She;ela how to be mityaches to it , now that it exists . Refer you to point 1 and 2.
    9] Medina is against the whole torah .
    Supposedly .
    How so ?

  281. “If there are IDF soldiers who are specifically protecting Jews in a manner approved by G-d, then that act of protecting Jews is obviously good.”
    [quoting hakatan]
    Lets rephrase your words in the collective form.

    “If there is an IDF which is specifically protecting Jews in a manner approved by G-d, then that act of protecting Jews is obviously good.”

    or in a slightly different form :

    “If there is a medina which is specifically protecting Jews in a manner approved by G-d, then that act of protecting Jews is obviously good.”

    Protecting Jews is approved by G-d .
    Period.
    The only source ever heard to the opposite was a maharal without a source .

    Contradicted by all poskim in Sh’A .

  282. HaKatan: Do not think yourself revelatory. I know all about the Brisker זצ”ל, the Chofetz Chaim זצ”ל and Rav Elchonon זצ”ל הי”ד. (As a matter of fact, my late father ע”ה met the Chofetz Chaim when he was traveling through Poland in the mid 1920s.)

    You talk in generalities about the ג’ שבועות, about Zionism and other issues as though your הבנה is conclusive. Obviously, it is not. This always come across like a young bochur who just read through עיקבתא דמשיחא and, feeling his oats, goes and tells off his Mizrachi, child-of-survivors father as though the old gentleman just stumbled into Yiddishkeit from off the street.

    If you learned גמרא seriously, you would realize that one cannot simply be מדמה מילתא למילתא willy-nilly. No, it is not acceptable, and certainly not reasonable according to the crystalline system of logic of the חז”ל, to equate the State of Israel to the עגל הזהב and expect no pushback. As we say, מה עניין שמיטה אצל הר סיני?

    However, you do these things all the time. You simply spout invective and cherry-pick barbs spoken by selected giants of yesteryear, and we are all supposed to close up shop. That’s not how it works. I could retort about the Dvinsker זצ”ל, an infinitely greater scholar than the rebbe you sometimes reference, who wrote that after the San Remo Conference of 1920, the ג’ שבועות are null and void. I could do this, and provide you with more quotes, but it is not necessary. In fact, comparing and weighing up obscure מקורות at this hour is in very poor taste. Why? Because we are dealing with פיקוח נפש on a massive scale.

    Try to process reality one more time: We have close to seven million Jews living in Israel. That is the most important issue. פיקוח נפש overrides all your gripes and grievances.

    I assume you are a decent Jew and not just a pretender. If so, you recited the אחינו prayer yesterday morning before we returned the ס”ת to the ארון הקודש. If you have any כוונה and your prayers are not a פּוסטע זאַך, then you meant what you said:

    אַחֵֽינוּ כָּל בֵּית יִשְׂרָאֵל, הַנְּתוּנִים בְּצָרָה וּבַשִּׁבְיָה, הָעוֹמְדִים בֵּין בַּיָּם וּבֵין בַּיַּבָּשָׁה, הַמָּקוֹם יְרַחֵם עֲלֵיהֶם, וְיוֹצִיאֵם מִצָּרָה לִרְוָחָה, וּמֵאֲפֵלָה לְאוֹרָה, וּמִשִּׁעְבּוּד לִגְאֻלָּה, הַשְׁתָּא בַּעֲגָלָא וּבִזְמַן קָרִיב, וְנֹאמַר אָמֵן

    Hashem should have compassion on ALL Jews in peril. Not just the ones you like. We pray that ALL Jews in distress, no matter where they are, are delivered from trouble and sorrow to light, salvation and redemption.

    In an earlier post you called me emotional. YOU BET I’m emotional about loving the entire Jewish People and about standing up for them – especially in an עת מלחמה. Only a child would choose to be a pettifogging ankle-biter at this moment when the Jewish People need our תפילות, our support, and our love.

    Now of all times, it is beyond the pale to point your finger at millions of our brothers and sisters because it makes you feel special.

  283. I thi
    I’m sure HaKatan and Co. would like to live under Muslim Arab rule… I’m sure they would like it…

    I don’t care about secular Zionism or even religious Zionism. The fact is that for the Jews living in Israel it is extremely, extremely stupid and living in a dream world to think that Muslims can govern Jews, or even under the terrorist loving anti-Semitic UN, and expect Jewish lives not to be in peril.

    HaKatan and “anti-Zionists” cannot lie to my face that they would be ok living under rule of these violent people ( would likely wouldn’t even let live at all…) who are CURRENTLY murdering hundreds of thousands of their OWN PEOPLE in the Middle East, they have no ruchmunis on their own people, kol shekein Jews! They have in recent years murdererd tens of thousands of Christians, Yazidis, Kurds and other minorities in the Middle East. And the UN officials who are terrorist supporters don’t give a hoot!

    Are you people insane?! It is stupidity of the highest order to think that Jews should be “governed” by these perah adom. But I suggest if you want those who hate that Jews are defending themselves, those who call themselves “anti-Zionists”, but if you are against Jewish defense then go live under the Muslims yourself, don’t be a hypocrite writing so casually about who should rule Israel while you wouldn’t dare live under such a regime you want other Jews to live under.

    There is no such thing in the Torah that Jews cannot defend their lives. Jews are obligated to defend themselves and their families, period.

  284. yankel berel:
    1-2] To paraphrase your logic: food is required. Lack of food is sakanas nefashos. Therefore, all food (including non-kosher) is permitted.
    3] No, I did not misquote Karyana diIgarta. You misunderstood it. As mentioned, see Rabbi Shapiro’s book “The Empty Wagon”, where he writes how he wrote to Rav Chaim about this to ask him and that is the answer.
    4] Multiple poskim bring down the oaths liHalacha, including but not limited to that very same holy man, Rambam, in his Iggeres Teiman. Stop the willful delusion.
    5] What do the Khazars have to do with anything?
    6] He never said anything like that. He lived there and knew quite well and stated clearly that the State was a disaster for Jews.
    7] Whatever
    8] Yes. It is a chilul Hashem and open merida against Hashem and, as the Brisker Rav stated, we daven viLamalshinim three times per day against the Zionists.
    9] In its denial of the Hashem, the Torah, its laws, the way Klal Yisrael is not a “nation” but a people of the Torah, shmading the Jews there, etc.

    Your rephrasing was a destruction, not a rephrasing. According to all Torah authorities, not just the Maharal, of course, the Zionist State always was, is and always will be, forbidden by the Torah no matter how many you Jews you imagine it to be saving, even if we can do nothing about that.

    And, once again, see the Satmar Rav and others who bring the numerous poskim who bring the oaths down liHalacha.

  285. Ari Knobler:
    I don’t. It’s quite obvious for anyone who cares to learn the topic.

    Actually, the Brisker Rav was the one who said that: “The State they have managed to achieve is the greatest triumph of the Satan since the Golden Calf”. In hindsight, of course, it’s pretty obvious that he was right, but that’s besides the point that he was the one who made that comparison.

    You can retort about the Dvinsker, but your retort would be wrong. He never said the shevuos are null and void. He said that the “fear” of violating the oath of immigrating to E”Y was no longer a concern in light of the Balfour Declaration. That has nothing to do with the other oaths, like dechikas haKeitz, and never permitted merida baUmos and aliya chChoma which are exactly how the Zionist State was actually founded.

    I assume you are a decent Jew and not just a pretender. If so, you recited the ViLaMalshinim prayer in your shemone esrei. If you have any כוונה and your prayers are not a פּוסטע זאַך, then you meant what you said.

    Hashem should have compassion on ALL Jews in peril. Not just the ones you like. We pray that ALL Jews in distress, no matter where they are, are delivered from trouble and sorrow to light, salvation and redemption.

    Nobody pointed any fingers at millions of our brothers and sisters.

  286. The bottom line is that “anti-Zionists” are hypocrites. They should go live in Gaza, we’ll see how they like it. From behind their screens they can decide who should rule their millions of brothers and sisters in Eretz Yisroel but they themselves would never voluntarily live under such violent monsters who behead and burn innocent people. I challenge these hypocrites to go live under the Muslims and the UN symathizers. Let’s see how you like it.

  287. @ hakatan
    1-2] When there is no other food , yes- non kosher food is permitted.
    On second thought ,
    No .
    Not ‘permitted’ .
    REQUIRED.
    if it is ok [and mandated] for an individual soldier [your words] , it is ok [and mandated] for all soldiers combined .
    if it is ok [and mandated ] for the soldiers combined , it is ok and mandated for the entity without which there is no defense possible at all .
    You willfully ignore this argument .
    Your analogy re kosher food is relevant k’rchok mizrach mima’arav.

  288. @hakatan
    I reread the Karyana de’igrata .
    It is clear as day .
    The issur is only lekatchila .
    Not bedi’avad.
    The first prerequisite in a debate is honesty.

  289. @hakatan
    4] you accuse me of delusion . if there is a willful delusion here, it clearly is on your part .
    We were debating avne nezers position on the oaths , remember ?
    Avne nezer clearly asks why there is hashmatat haposkim , hashmatat harambam ?
    This is a regular and routine question on any topic in shas/halacha , asked by all types of poskim and mefarshim.
    If poskim in their works ADDRESSED TO KLAL YISRAEL LEDOROT ignore something and leave it out , there is a reason . It’s not just forgetfulness [chvsh].
    No matter that in a private letter , addressed to a specific community [not klal yisrael] , at a specific time [not ledorot] it is mentioned .
    Aderaba – that makes the omission in his Yad Hahazaka even more glaring …
    Bekitsur no difference what we think about the omission . Fact is that Avne nezer [the topic here] asks it .
    He clearly answers – that the reason is that it NOT AN ISSUR HALACHATI . that’s why it is omitted.
    And That stays as Avne nezers maskana !!!
    Honesty , honesty ……. .

  290. @hakatan
    3] you ignored the question about the hashmonaim –
    why was milhemet hahasmonaim and subsequent establishment of their meluha not against the oaths ?
    4]you also ignored the rambam in yad about hanuka/ hashmonaim –
    ‘hazrah malhut leyisrael karov le matayim shana’ . Seems like hakamat malhut beyad yisrael is considered a positive phenomenon .
    Any answers ?

  291. @hakatan
    5] Khazar kingdom is clear proof that existence of malhut yisrael before mashiach is permitted .
    any answer – please ?

  292. @hakatan
    6-7] You claim to know with certainty that rav mibrisk and admor mibelz never said anything like that .
    How can you know ?
    Were you next to them 24-7 and monitored everything that they said ?
    Do you know the context within which this remark was made ?
    How could you know ?

  293. @hakatan
    9] you misunderstood the question
    will clarify , the question was -how is a totally religious state, with rav amram blau as PM [your words] considered as being ‘against the whole torah’ ?

  294. Has anybody learnt mishleh that from the wicked comes no good things
    It is assur to make a new Torah and say that they are tzadikim and saving the Jewish people the satmer rabbi says that they made the Holocaust how can rabbinic people lie to these Yiddish neshomis and say that it’s kadosh the Israeli army and not expect hatred from them or that they will have to answer the heavenly court on this
    NO RABBI WILL TELL YOU THAT THEY ARE PROTECTING THE JEWISH PEOPLE
    we are getting into more danger every single minute the state of Israel existence and it doesn’t matter how much the moslems are killers or not and the anti semitism
    this belief that without Israel we are dead and we can do what we want is wrong and is known that president Biden stated this religion in many public speeches
    It’s crazy that people can’t get it out of there head that no protection of the Jewish will come from the Zionist

  295. philosopher:
    Not very philosophical.
    Let’s try that again. The Satmar Rav wrote that if the Zionists cared about Jewish lives, they could tell the UN that they want out and the UN would figure out a way to govern that territory, as they did over a century ago, before the Zionists invaded and terrorized the British and Arabs there.

    Since you mentioned Arab rule, though, before the Zionists inflamed the entire Middle East in their intentionally reckless invasion of the area and fighting and terror the Zionists inflicted there prior to achieving their State in 1948, Jews did live just fine under Arab rule. No, it was not all roses, but it was better than under the Christians and it was, of course, far, far better than under the Zionists.

    The bottom line is that the pro-Zionists are on the side of those fighting G-d and the Torah, and some of them make really illogical arguments on top of that. Living in Gaza is, of course, not a logical step, despite the recognition of the truth that Zionism has always been both a disaster for Jews and (even worse) a meridah baHashem unparalleled in history – the greatest achievement of the satan since the eigel, as the Brisker Rav put it.

  296. yankel berel:
    Again, if the Zionists cared about Jewish lives, they would go to the UN and have them figure out a solution to have some other entity administer that territory, not to fight endless wars and shmad and sacrifice Jewish lives for those wars, especially when those are not in self-defense but rather for “nationalist” other reasons.

    The Steipler permitted voting, not the State. Rav Chaim confirmed this, too, as mentioned, despite baseless “Religious Zionist” propaganda to the contrary.

  297. You Google very well, Katan, but you have obviously never learned the kuntres. Your passive-aggressive copying and pasting of your interlocutor’s comments shows what you really are all about, namely, to be an irritant. As for the שבועות, any post-Auschwitz Jew more concerned about מרידה באומות than פיקוח נפש should have his head examined. And with that, I wish you a full and speedy recovery.

  298. Ari Knobler:
    Not sure what Google has to do with this. I mentioned multiple times that Rabbi Yaakov Shapiro in his book “The Empty Wagon” brings the kuntres, and that he specifically wrote to Rav Chaim to ask him which interpretation is correct, and Rav Chaim responded that the Steipler had referred to only voting, not to the State. It is “Religious Zionist” propaganda to falsify the Steipler’s Torah for Zionist purposes.
    My copying/pasting was actually a reflection of my irritation at the continued insistence of genuflecting to the Zionist idol, not my attempt to be an irritant. Sorry that wasn’t clear.
    As for the שבועות, most Jews likely didn’t understand that מרידה באומות actually caused all that פיקוח נפש. But once the historical record is examined, that’s indeed what it shows; like how the early boycott proclaimed “in the name of world Jewry” by Zionist organizations against Hitler which did nothing but enrage him and cause him to proclaim, “now I will finish them off”. And, with that, I accept your good wishes.

  299. I cannot engage directly with Hakatan, the disregard of the safety of his own people make my blood boil and I can’t engage in dialogue with such a person. But I will answer his points in any case.

    Go to the UN, lol…hysterical. The most vicious, anti-Semitic organization ever to exist… Wow…what an idea to entrust the lives of Jews with an organization that hates Jews … unbelievable.

    Hakatan is conveniently disregarding the fact that Muslims ARE CURRENTLY killing thousands of other Muslims, have in recent years killed and expelled tens of thousands of Christians, Yazidis and other minorities… He’s ignoring the beheadings, burnings , and rape, the atrocities that scream till the heavens, committed by fundamentalist Muslims, and it has nothing to do with Zionism. A very large part of the Muslim population is very, very violent and it has absolutely nothing to do with Zionism, they are violent all over, not just the Arabs in Israel.

    The absolute disregard for historical truth is disgusting. To say the Zionists the Zionists inflicted fighting and terror on the British and Arabs is absolutely disgusting. The truth is that the Arabs inflicted terror on the innocent Jews, massacring Jews in Chevron and other communities with the enablement of the British. The Zionists agreed to a two state solution proposed by the UN, it was the Arabs who refused and went on to terrorize the Jews. The blood of Jewish kedoishim is so cheap in the eyes of people like Hakatan, they will reinvent history.

    People like Hakatan ignore the fact that Jews have a right, and an obligation, to defend themselves and their families from an enemy that has sworn to annihilate them. To blame the enemy’s desire to annihilate Jews on “Zionism” is absolutely ridiculous in light of what Yidden went through throughout the 2,000 years prior to Zionism and because of what the Muslims are doing to other Muslims and people of other races and religions today.

    I am not a Zionist. I resent the Israeli government for throwing Jews out of their own homes and giving over land to be ruled by terrorists. I resent that the Israeli government puts world pressure before their citizen’s safety. I resent that so many Jews who are Zionists disregard basic halachos and almost all of their Yidishkeit comprises of “settling the land”… With that being said, Jews should defend themselves. It is not a mitzvah to
    not defend yourselves. Hashem should help the IDF, they should have much hatzlacha in destroying the terrorists.

  300. I noticed that in the picture of journalists looking at Hamas atrocities, there’s one journalist smiling. I wonder at what.

  302. philosopher:
    You can laugh and you can mock. But that doesn’t make you right. Nobody ever claimed that Muslims or the “UN” should rule over Jews in Israel. There are many Christian nations that can do so no less effectively than they do in their own lands.

    And the Chevron Massacre was precisely a result of Zionism, as mentioned. The absolute disregard for historical truth is disgusting.

  303. hakatan is continuing to offer the same platitudes and ignoring clear proofs and clear questions .
    He continues to falsify avne nezers position on the oaths
    and the rav mistaipla’s position on the medina.
    He also blatantly ignores clear mass pikuach nefesh in direct contradiction of torah guidelines .
    He does not engage in honest torah debate either.
    He seems to be losing all credibility he started with.

  304. HaKatan has lost all credibility and everyone here has to make machuah.

    To say that Jews were guilty for a boycott against Nazi Germany. It’s over the gevul… The instigator, which was hitler, is always wrong no matter who or what makes him pay! Hakatan is oni bedaas and is just here to antagonize people.

    If he was in Germany from 1923 onward, what would his solution be? Maybe try to change Hitler’s mind; are YOU out of your mind???

  305. Btw, there also is a debate if misgarin bumos is applicable when it involves one nation. And Palestine wasn’t a nation at all…

    The UN didn’t want the state and none of the other countries other than Arab countries wanted it.

  306. From the wrong pride the mistaken say the Israeli army is saving Jewish people what are we is it a religion and sacrifice or it is ethnicity and cleanliness how can war be a religion like the moslems aren’t they also saying it’s a mitzvah to fight and kill
    There was rabbi akiva buried in teveria and somebody told him to stop teaching cause it’s dangerous life threatening and he said if a fish can live without water this belief that since the goyim anti semitism we have new leaders and demand a territory will as the rabbi said before the state lead to a Holocaust

  307. hakatan claims there are ‘christian countries who can rule effectively’ over bloodthirsty monsters .
    thats his [extremely vague] solution for mass pikuach nefesh .
    He declines , however to name those countries …..
    He also declines to say what those countries are going to do once the body bags of their soldiers will start arriving home ….
    What those governments are going to do when the weeping and angry relatives will confront them …
    He declines to say how long those governments will persist in keeping their soldiers there ….
    He also declines to say whether the scenes – after those soldiers’ INEVITABLE withdrawal – will surpass the simhat torah massacres or not ….
    .
    But he still insists we should take his “mass pikuach nefesh psakim” seriously …..
    .

  308. Philosopher and Yankel Berel: One of the hallmarks of our unyielding friend is the constant name-dropping. He trots out personages like R’ Yaakov Shapiro, with whom I once corresponded, and others, as though we’d never heard of them. The mere mention of their opinions should leave us awestruck and prostrate, no?

    As a child of a survivor of Dachau, and as one who grew up in a community heavily populated with survivors, I can say with confidence that my parents and their compatriots עליהם השלום would have considered the condemning of Israel and the Jewish People at such a time to be the height of inappropriateness. As my father ע”ה would say: עס קלייבּט זיך ווי אַן אַרבּעס צו דער וואַנט

  309. yankel berel:
    You meant that you are “continuing to offer the same platitudes and ignoring clear proofs and clear questions.”

    And that you “continue to falsify the avnei nezer’s position on the oaths
    and the Steipler rav’s position on the medina.”

    Your claim that I “also blatantly ignores clear mass pikuach nefesh in direct contradiction of torah guidelines” is simply not based in reality.

    Therefore, you seem to “not engage in honest torah debate either”,
    and you seem “to be losing all credibility…”.

    Since people seem to just mock me and not believe a word I say, you can see on True Torah Jews org and look up the sources yourself – instead of believing Zionist idolaters:

    The Oaths brought down liHalacha:
    “The following is a brief list of some of the poskim who do discuss the Three Oaths as binding: Rashbash 2, Rivash 101, Piskei Riaz Kesubos 111, Kaftor Vaferach chapter 10, p. 197, Maharashdam Choshen Mishpat 364, Pe’as Hashulchan Laws of Eretz Yisroel, Chapter 1, Section 3, Aruch Hashulchan Choshen Mishpat 2:1, the Gadol of Minsk in Sinai v. 6, p. 213.

    And here are some well-known commentators who discuss the oaths as binding: Rabbeinu Bachya on Vayishlach, Abarbanel Bereishis 15:11, Maharal in Netzach Yisroel 24, Ohr Hachaim Hakadosh Vayikra 26:33, Rabbi Yaakov Emden in Sefer Hashimush 66b, Yismach Moshe Tehillim 127:2, Rabbi Samson Raphael Hirsch, Siddur p. 703.”

    Regarding the Steipler:
    “The Steipler was asked about the Satmar Rebbe’s argument that voting in Israeli elections is prohibited. The asker had asked him about voting, and his reply is that although the state violates the oaths, those who participate in its elections do not. Rabbi Chaim Kanievsky later clarified in a letter that that this was what his father meant.

    The Satmar Rebbe, on the other hand, held that by voting one is sending a representative to become part of the Knesset, and thus he has a share in the sin of maintaining a state and transgressing the oaths, among other sins (Vayoel Moshe 1:141).

    In any case, the Steipler does not say that the state itself is permitted after the fact.”

    On the pathetic attempt to use that Rav Meir Simcha letter:
    First of four points (I don’t want to quote the entire page – but see there):
    “All these poskim said was that the oath does not apply to immigration with permission from the ruling power, such as the Turks or the British. They never discussed the idea of founding a sovereign state. Neither did the British, at that point in time. Founding a sovereign state means effectively ending the exile, and is a violation of the oath against “forcing the end,” one of the additional oaths listed in the Gemara.

    In the same letter where the above statement appears, Rabbi Meir Simcha continues, “If Hashem grants that the matter expand and blossom like a rose, as it grew in the time of Artachshasta, when they were under the Persian Empire, a restless bear (Kiddushin 72a) – and all the more so under the rule of civilized Britain – then surely it is a matter that stands at the zenith of the universe.” So it is clear that he is talking only about settlement under the British. ”

    Then:
    “It is also worth noting that the authenticity of this letter by Rabbi Meir Simcha has never been verified. According to the book “Rabbeinu Meir Simcha” by Z. A. Rabiner (p. 162), the letter was written for Menachem Mendel Finkelman, who came to Rabbi Meir Simcha as an emissary of the Zionist Organization in Latvia. It is highly unlikely that Rabbi Meir Simcha would have written a letter for the Zionist Organization, which he strongly opposed. ”

    There’s much more; those interested in the truth, rather than mindless idolatrous Zionism, can easily seek that by checking the sources brought there to see the lies and propaganda the heretical Zionists have been feeding them.

  310. Read hakatans remarks juxtaposed with ALL the questions asked .
    Make a mark next to the ones he avoided .
    Compare the numbers of the avoided questions with the ones he [attempted] to answer .
    The ratio is approx 9 [avoided] to one [attempted] .
    He should [attempt at least] answer all of them .
    For sure the pikuach nefesh ones .
    Where did he get this idea from ?
    This idea of ignoring pikuach nefesh ?
    Not ‘plain’ pikuach nefesh .
    Mass pikuach nefesh ….
    is there any source in the torah for that ?
    This is not a debate between zionism and aniti zionism .
    This is a debate between pikuach nfesh and ….
    [not really sure how to fill in those dots , seems like hakatan doesn’t either]

  311. Does the pride of the state Israel as Jewish help against anti semitism when it’s a war with all moslems not just palistanian or arab but people that can easily put a bomb in the synagogue and abuse those that don’t have Zionist Jewish pride so the get wealthy
    Or if we could live in the galus and have faith that God will protect us cause of the Torah some could say that until now Israel didn’t help anybody spiritually but now it’s okay to fight and kill cause our lives are in danger this means only to fight not see yourself as protector of the innocent rabbi
    Ultimately these rabbonim that say Israel state is a savior of them would not help anybody but themselves because you can’t learn Torah on the blood of your brother

  312. Regarding the Steipler:
    “The Steipler was asked about the Satmar Rebbe’s argument that voting in Israeli elections is prohibited. The asker had asked him about voting, and his reply is that although the state violates the oaths, those who participate in its elections do not.
    [hakatan]
    ======================================
    read the letter itself [in vol 1 under inyanei tsibur]
    his reply is that although the ESTABLISHMENT OF the state was a violation of the oaths , nevertheless , since now that the state IS ALREADY EXISTING , and the STATE’S EXISTENCE IS NOT AGAINST the ‘oaths’ , those who participate in its elections [post facto AFTER its establishment] are not in violation of the oaths , EVEN IF WE WOULD CONSIDER PARTICIPATION IN knesset elections as a ‘positive participation in the State’s existence ‘.
    Read it in its original source .
    The entire letter.
    It is crystal clear .
    ======
    This is only a side point , however .
    The main [unaddressed ] point is

    MASS PIKUACH NEFESH .
    .

  313. @hakatan
    Re list of poskim who hold oaths are binding le halacha.
    many of them are not poskim [wrote it in agada sfarim ] , but that’s besides the point .
    Main question is [avne nezers question – ]
    WHY THE HASHMATA OF THE RAMBAM ???
    WHY THE HASHMATA OF THE TUR ???
    WHY THE HASHMATA OF THE SHULHAN ARUCH ???

  314. yankel berel:
    I don’t think I intentionally avoided any questions on anything I wrote. But you might have questions based on your misunderstanding of either something I wrote, what is reality, or some combination thereof.

    Besides, the ratio of questions answered to unanswered, even according to your dismissive mocking, is surely much higher than that, meaning many more answered than unanswered. But you like to mock. And not to acknowledge the answers you have received. That’s not nice.

    I’m not sure what problem you have with my portrayal of pikuach nefesh. The Maharal says that they must give up their lives rather than violate the oaths. Other than that, and the 3 chamuros (and the IDF resoundingly violates all three) and a shaas haShmad, everyone knows that vaChai bahem means viLo sheYaMus bahem CH”V.

    To be very clear, until the Zionist idol is totally finished, the Zionists will always be like the arsonist who then came running with a fire hose. Better that they shouldn’t have set aflame the Middle East (and world) in the first place. They are not G-d’s appointed defenders of the Jews; the Zionists invaded and made themselves a “State” there. This is the army of that “State”, both of which generally operate in a manner against G-d and His Torah.

    Rav Chaim was surely able to read KDI at least as well as you can, and he wrote that his father was speaking only about voting, not the State which remains forbidden, of course, as I mentioned in the past.

    But you knew all that and just wanted to mock me so that you could bow to the idol of Zionism.

  315. yankel berel:
    WHY THE HASHMATA OF THE RAMBAM ???
    this question is being answered well and strong on 50 pages in The safer VAJOEL MOSHE , the problem with you is you don’t want to look inside in the VAJOEL MOSHE
    WHY THE HASHMATA OF THE TUR ???
    this question is being answered well and strong on 50 pages in The safer VAJOEL MOSHE , the problem with you is you don’t want to look inside in the VAJOEL MOSHE
    WHY THE HASHMATA OF THE SHULHAN ARUCH ???
    this question is being answered well and strong on 50 pages in The safer VAJOEL MOSHE , the problem with you is you don’t want to look inside in the VAJOEL MOSHE

  316. @hakatan
    By the way – looked up one of hakatan’s mar’ei mekomot over shabbat –
    Aruch hashulhan in hoshen mishpat
    He does NOT say that the oaths are binding the way katan quotes him .
    he is discussing a TOTALLY different scenario and published his sefer under a despotic Tsarist Regime.
    Any interested reader should read the FULL context and draw his own conclusions …..
    .
    BeKitsur – anything hakatan quotes , rightly deserves the readers’ own research , and the readers’ own judgement .

  317. Pre Oct/7/23 racist Arab Islamist-fascist atrocities:

    Take a look.

    For years there have apparently been ‘peace agreements’ with the Arabs, and even with Hamas there were silent agreements according to which they were given a lot of money, they opened the gates for the flow of workers to Israel so that they could make a living, they did so much for them in order to make things easier for them.
    And what it turns out is that the leaders of Hamas are not at all interested in the people living in Gaza, as they explicitly said that this is the role of the UN, they are only interested in the billions that go into their pockets, and in the meantime they armed themselves with many weapons for an opportunity as it fell into their hands on Simchat Torah, they infiltrated the kibbutzim and other places close to Gaza and slaughtered Jews, tortured them in the most savage way and did acts that cannot be written down.

  318. “Biden administration officials have demanded an explanation about Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu’s comments… that Israel will maintain security control over Gaza after the war”
    I will try to explain to the befuddled “administration officials” in plain English what this means.
    This means that Israel will remain in control of Gaza after Hamas is eliminated. Israel will remain, stay, retain, keep, hold, possess, dominate, and in general rule the Gaza strip.
    If you still did not understand the intent, please pick up a copy of “Counterterrorism For Dummies” at your local bookstore.

  319. @HJtE4UEh
    You are arriving in the middle of the conversation .
    The issue started with katan claiming ALL poskim agree that the mere existence of the medina , even if fully religious ,is against the whole torah , whereas the rest of klal yisrael says that this is a argument between gdolei yisrael .There was NO ARGUMENT that rav misatmar z’l is of that opinion . the argument is whether EVERYONE is of that opinion .
    Katan is trying to deceive us .
    That’s all .

  320. @hakatan
    It does not matter how some people quote other people who ‘explain’ texts against their obvious meaning and their obvious intent.
    No matter how chashuv the people being ‘used’ in this fashion , are .
    Aderaba , their chashivut only compounds the sacrilege.
    I call on every reader of these pages to check every mar’e makom katan so liberally throws around .
    Read it inside .
    The whole thing .
    Apply your critical thinking facilities .
    Then decide for yourself whether this the only/ best explanation, or not .
    Otherwise you will be not much more than a ‘useful idiot’ .

  321. to summarise –
    Hakatan has a few approaches re pikuach nefesh
    1] ask the un either what to do / or give them task of governing and securing millions of innocent citizens .
    2] christian countries will ‘effectively’ govern and protect everyone
    3] there really is no problem of pikuach nefesh at all . Even if chvsh millions die as a result of closing the medina down , its no problem .
    Maharal [somewhere] ‘paskened’ that the oaths warrant giving up ones life [even if its not one of the hamurot] .
    We don’t need further investigation in this matter .
    Its simple .
    Its decided already.
    —————
    He continuously alternates between those three approaches.
    But when we pin him down on the details and specifics of each of his approaches , he either changes to one of the other ones .
    Or he ignores you totally .
    Lo ken haderech …
    Even with a minimal knowledge of Tshuvot of real gdolim bemeshech kol hadorot will suffice .
    The immense koved rosh you see when deliberating any she’ela lehalacha .
    Multiplied in a case even of pikuach nefesh of a yachid .
    Kal vahomer of so many …..
    It seems like that according to his third approach , Millions can die . But the medina has to close down ….
    .
    Some niggling question here – is that type of reasoning what’s also behind his first two approaches ?

  322. To this person that keeps saying pekuach nefesh probably one of the Zionist rabbi that cares only about himself and never in the dark for a Jewish person
    If Israel in danger America will send ships and European countries boats to let them live in another place and have business
    If Israel wins the war the hostages will get killed and many more Jewish girls become married to moslems do you care
    These people that keep saying pekuach nefesh are the those that are the kappos how do know this cause of they don’t care about the spiritual certainly not the physical let biesyakov girls go to the army and then talk
    This is a new torah from the rabbis since you’re saving Jewish people you go to paradise it’s a religion could have girls with you also but it’s kadosh you saving Israel
    The rambam didn’t bring it cause at that time in history it wasn’t something that could happen but there is also an halocha the rambam brings and that is that all the Jewish people have to give there life not to give one person to the goyim but fighting a war then thousand years ago was not something that would happen so he didn’t need to write it
    Seems like Israel is looking to live in shalom and it won’t get it cause all this time we are only saying you protect the Jewish people nobody mentions doing teshuva and something like for the sake of God

  324. yankel berel:
    You seem confused, and your attacks on me are uncalled for.
    I don’t recall quoting an Aruch HaShulchan but, even according to what you wrote, he never said the oaths have ended, etc.

    To clarify your “pikuach nefesh” questions once again:
    The Maharal holds that the oaths are inviolable, yehareig viAl yaavor. Regardless, individual Jews should certainly defend themselves. One has nothing to do with the other.

    You then attempted to “extend” that pikuach nefesh to the Zionist army and State, which makes no sense, as pikuach nefesh is an individual matter, and the Zionist State is irrelevant to that.

    On that note, I also pointed out, as the Satmar Rav writes, that if the Zionists wanted to stop their endless wars, they could go to the nations and tell them we want out and we want you to find a way to take over in a manner that all Jews remain safe.

    Of course, the Zionists would never do this, and the idolaters reject the very notion out-of-hand as that is deeply offensive to their idol. But that is the reality.

    Nobody – certainly not I – ever claimed that “millions can die” CH”V.

  325. The Hamas linked Islamic lobby CAIR called on Biden to demand Israel release Ahed Tamimi (JPost 9 Nov.23)

    On 30.Oct.23 this fascist “Palestinian” Arab star posted about their yearning to “drink the blood of the Jews” and her pro Hitlerism.

  326. 12.Nov.23. President Herzog, revealed to the BBC that, days earlier, A.H. ym”s Satanic book ‘Mein Kampf’ was found in a bedroom a home that was used by jihado fascist Hamas fo terror. The terrorist added annotation…

  328. I woud like to post my sincere regret about any comment I made in criticism of the medinah’s mismanagement of its war effort. I realize that it is arguably criminal like sedition to undermine the war effort. I support the war effort. Alleged war crimes only matter if the accused find themselves subject to the jurisdiction of a state that ratified the Rome Statute, since the PA ratified the Rome Statute and the ICC recognizes its jurisdiction over disputed territories. So, if you delivered white phosphorus or odered its delivery, don’t vacation in Europe. I would like to conclude with a statement of solidarity with Yiddin in Yisroel: I wish I never had left. On that note, please, I beg of the authorities of the regime, please do not interrogate me for my prior comments should I choose to reenter Yisroel. Thank you.

  329. I should state some of my ulterior motives before political views. I realize now tht I support a contrived hasbara PR campaign that increases general animocity in Amerika towards Yisroel because too many Jewesses breeded with nochrim in Amerika, so I welcome animocity from them in order to keep a check on the conception of mistakes. Does that make sense? If there were a more effective way to keep Jewish women from making mistakes and handing them off to others, I’m all ears. Jews getting kicked out of Amerika wouldn’t bother me. I would rather be in Yisroel anyway. Would be glad if Jewish women quit making mistakes. Did I mention that idea yet? Mossad LeAliyah Bet once instigated civil unrest that lead to emigration to Yisroel. Not opposed to similar moves today. It deserves mention that it likewise would not bother me if Yisroel fell under an alternative occupant, just as long as that alternative occupant respected Yisroel and its inheritance more than the current regime. Even so, this idea is entirely theoretical, and in practice I never would support such an upheavel, and I retract such a view if it is seditious or subversive. I do actually support the war and do not care about saving face in Amerika or worldwide.

  330. On second thought, I support saving face in Amerika and worldwide to whichever extent saving face is necessary to consolidate in conquest and subjugation of all territories on Earth financed by central banks. That is my position. If it’s necessary to crack a few eggs along route, like the mistakes that result from close proximity and the semblance of national unity with others in Amerika, the war still might be justified. I could assume it is. For the record, I retract my views, and I don’t support Jewish immigration to Yisroel under durress. Sorry for working out my own views in dialogue with myself on this forum…

  331. hakatan is a master of sidestepping .
    His quotes are fraudulent .
    And he does not employ honest torah logic which is sorely needed in these torah discussions .
    .
    On top of all that he even plays the victim card ….
    .

  332. Could someone explain how can frum Yidden support sending Yidden into Gaza to fight we don’t have a סנהדרין של ע״א we don’t have אורים ותומים. who takes אחריות for all the yidishe soldiers that were killed what’s the היתר to kill some Jews now in order to maybe save other Jews later לשיטתם.

  333. Hakatan claims he did not say millions can die .
    But that is clearly implicit in his words .
    Whenever the question of pikuach nefesh comes up , we keep hearing from Hakatan .
    He keeps on quoting a maharal [without giving a clear source] , which is against all poskim .
    That contravening the oaths is yehareig ve’al yavor..
    He employs that maharal as an answer to the question of pikuach nefesh .
    Meaning – that even when the existence of the medina is saving lives , and the folding of the medina is endangering lives , even then we should still fold the medina and ….. endanger lives .
    No limit on how many lives that would be [chvsh].
    So – in essence I am asking with simple common sense – one plus one equals two .
    Quoting maharal in this context has only one meaning .
    and that is :
    Better to fold the medina and endanger millions of lives , rather then keep the medina in existence and save millions of lives.
    Once we accept that this is hakatans way of thinking , we can easily understand why he keeps on coming up with [other] imaginary ‘solutions’ for p/n .
    Like the idea that some unnamed ‘christian countries’ who can ‘effectively’ rule over those bloodthirsty monsters .
    Or the idea of UN rule .
    Or the idea of asking and listening to UN ‘advice’ .
    Once hakatans shitah is accepted , that folding of the medina is a must .
    Even at the cost of [many] lives.
    Then all those ideas don’t have to ACTUALLY save lives .
    It’s enough that they APPEAR to save lives .
    Because we have to fold the medina anyway .
    No matter the cost.

  334. @hakatan
    …You then attempted to “extend” that pikuach nefesh to the Zionist army and State, which makes no sense, as pikuach nefesh is an individual matter, and the Zionist State is irrelevant to that….
    [quote from hakatan]
    ========================
    Am I hearing [or reading ] right ?
    It makes no sense to extend the pikuach nefesh issue to the army and state . Because pikuach nefesh is “an individual matter” , and the state is irrelevant to that …
    .
    Is there any sense or logic to this argument ?
    Maybe there is . but have not merited to see any [yet] .
    Maybe hakatan will enlighten us …..

  335. @hakatan
    To refresh your memory –
    you quoted from aruch hashulhan C’M 2 [toward the end].
    You posted that on Nov 8 at 11.50 PM .
    Oaths are [supposedly] binding halachically.

    1] Will repeat – subject there is a total different one . Bear in mind he is printing under the Russian Tsar.
    2] If that is his opinion , in the way you interpret it , why does he say nothing of the sort in his hilhot melahim [think end of chapter 74] where he does discuss this ?

  336. The tannaim who said the oaths over recorded in the Babylonian Talmud resided in Yisroel under Roman occupation shortly after the Bar Kokhba Revolt, crushed by over a dozen legions in a strategically indefensible position. It is important to avoid hashmad, like how Rebbe Yehuda, who chazal recounts received generous support from the Romans, neglected to organize a tractate on laws of war, important in historical circumstances not to oppose the occupant. The earliest support for the idea, although not in an oath, I think is expressed in the rebuke of Shimon and Levi for laying siege to Shchem, which was a military offensive in the understanding of the Rambam, since there was some risk of an indefensible strategic position if the nations would have retaliated. Later in Melachim or Divrei HaYamim, we see how the attempt to break from vassalage to a suzerain resulted in severe subjugation. In Ezra 4 we see a letter stating the Jews rebelled ומרד and in consequence the Persian Emperor to whom they were subject halted construction. Anyway, even if the earliest source we have for the oaths on record was after Bar Kochba, the reason for the oaths is almost as old and indispensable a concept as Yisroel itself.

    Empires replaced Rome, and now we live in the age of ostensible national states. Perhaps nowadays sovereignty doesn’t really rest in the people and institutions we are indoctrinated to believe. Perhaps the sovereignty of states was conceded behind the scenes, sort of like in how Yosef HaMashbir used the mechanisms of the Egyptian state to subjugate its subjects and seize their assets. I for one believe kibbush yachid shmeih kibbush has been applied by some international financiers who shall remain nameless for over two centuries now in incremental usurpation of the sovereignty of states. Putting a sovereign into debt becomes a way to effectuate control over the sovereign and to assume his agency, such that the banker ultimately becomes the principal of the “sovereign”, the true de facto sovereign albeit somewhat covertly, and the ostensible heads of state just function as figurehead agents, political actors in the Hollywood sense. In all honesty, you personally shouldn’t even see the medinah as a sovereign state either. You should see this conflict as one arranged by the true de facto sovereign, the international banking cartel. It serves a purpose beyond what spokespeople of the medinah claim. I could make an argument that this is the sod referred to by Rebbi Levi over in the sugiya on the oaths. It was the way out of occupation and subjugation that averted breach of the oaths. VaYoel Moshe serves probably as the most comprehensive collection and analysis of sources in chazal relevant to sovereignty in Yisroel. If more Yiddin were holding in those same sources that VaYoel Moshe analyzes, it might become possible to form a competent Sanhedrin. Today there aren’t 70 Yiddin holding in laws of war, let alone the rest of chazal, so it’s irrelevant. It also serves as important controlled opposition purpose for Yisroel, a perception management purpose I think. It helps that some interested goyim can look up truetorahjews.org and learn to distinguish between Zionists and true Torah Jews. Forgive me if saying so is any bit disrespectful of the Satmar Rav or of Satmar, G-d forbid.

    The real war of the international financiers is directed against the lower-rung subjects of any ostensibly sovereign state. It involves the orchestration of a series of “crises” that ultimately serve as excuses to create more debt, inflate currencies, draining purchasing power of people, forcing them into austerities, killing with the vax or whatever else, cause kids to miss their biological purpose through abominations, etc. That’s the real siege of today. Really like Moshiach ben Yosef, acting like Yosef HaMashbir. Stay out of their way. We have enough hors de combat in Yisroel. The bottom line is if the oaths are relevant today, they apply in relation to the international financiers. I assume no matter how bad things get, they always will control the resources to hire the drones to do their dirty work to maintain control. If civil unrest rises, like if the others start a mered against their respectively occupied states, it probably just means they will expedite plans to liquidate, to put people into WHO/FEMA camps or something else.

    Re the “war” in Gaza, you literally have no idea what is happening in Gaza unless you’re there, and even then you can’t necessarily believe what your eyes see. The strategy of governance seems to be heading in the direction of inundating people with information they cannot process as real, so they experience a debilitating destabilization of their sense of reality. A good short documentary that describes this strategy can be found on YouTube titled Adam Curtis – “Oh dear”-ism II and Non-Linear War. Perhaps Gaza now functions as a movie set. Perhaps they need some new source for distraction in the news. Not sure. Who cares. Far more casualties from the vax than Hamas, so shall we focus on Hamas?

    Anyway, there’s really no turning back from here. The de facto sovereign cannot relinquish control without risking his own defeat. The ball is rolling. I just wish they had destroyed all the statues in Yisroel first like instructed in Sifrei Devarim on כל המקום אשר תדרך כף רגלכם. A shame any Yid who attempts to destroy those statues there ends up detained and probably tortured by the regime cuz really that should have been done first.

  337. @5783
    Ayen Sh’A hilch Shabbat
    Nochrim Shetsaru …
    Famous psak based on gmara eruvin [as far as i remember]
    Clear and simple.

  338. So every Israeli leader is out and on the front lines supporting their soldiers while Hamas and Nasrala is in hiding like the cowards they are. Speaks exactly to the type of animals they are.

  340. a person named Mohammed started a religion called Islam some people died not to become that later in history somebody made a religion “protecting Jewish people” this means you could do anything against the Torah and still called a great person cause you save the Jewish people from the anti semitism and harm
    So what is the nation of Israel obviously it is only ethnicity not a religion cause moslem making holy war are the only people that say you get paradise for fighting and killing
    The rambam never said it a mitzvah to live in Israel to go the beach and eat trief
    The oaths are in gemorah and it is stated clearly as a fact not halocha if you do this your punishment is this many rabbonim spoke of this before the holocaust
    The end of Israel days are pre destined and quoted from rabbi like the chofetz Chaim nothing anybody will do even will all there might will stop it cause heaven wills it

  341. Netanyahu says there were “strong indications” Hamas hostages were held in Gaza’s Al-Shifa Hospital
    evening-news.
    By Caitlin Yikek, November 16, 2023.
    (cbsnews . com/news/benjamin-netanyahu-hamas-hostages-gaza-al-shifa-hospital/)

    ________

    Missing text –from the interview– in above link:

    Netanyahu:
    This is why there was no fire exchange when we entered, because the Hamas guys in the hospital fled as soon as we came in. Some were inside, with the doctors….

    Nora then asked, quoting Biden about “extremists settlers violence[sic] pouring gasoline on fire.”

    Netanyahu:
    I have condemned it in Hebrew and in English and here again with you.
    I’ve condemned any committing vigilante justice. I said that in the Judea Samaria community and by the way they agree with me.
    99% of the settlers community in Judea Samaria are law abiding.
    It’s only, a tiny, tiny fraction and some are teenagers who come from ouside the area. But even a tiny fraction is unacceptable.

    But I wouldn’t make a false symmetry. There is no moral equivalence against the hundreds and hundreds of [terror] attacks. Even today, in Jerusalem.

    And, this is a big one. Every violence by extremists we condemn, by anyone. Yet, we are 42 days into the worst killing of Jews since the Holocaust, the horrific raping, the burning of babies, slaughtering children in front of their parents, slaughtering parents in front of their children and Mahmoud Abbas is yet to condemn it. Not only that, but officials in his government lauded, lauded this.

  342. Response to ., I personally think a lot gets justified in extenuating circumstances of milchuma, and I think there has been a milchuma for the entire history of the medina, even if I might differ in my opinion of what qualifies as a milchuma. Anyway, Rambam in last book of Mishneh Torah discusses great zchuyos of a chayal. עי׳ מ״ת הל׳ מל׳ ומל׳ פ״ז, הל׳ ט״ו. Also milchuma is doche Shabbos. In my opinion there’s always a justification for some in Yisroel to be asuk in milchuma on Shabbos, and honestly there are several and several kinds of milchamos running siumulatenously right now in my opinion (chova, mitzva, and reshus). Also, pidion shavuim is doche Shabbos. Anyway, I could say all the more so with respect to siege of territory in Yisroel proper or in defense of territory already under Yisroel. It could be argued that anytime there is siege to territory where Yisroel has historic title or acquired through conquest or other means, or when they show up on the border (see sugiya in Eurivun, already when approaching from near Euphrates it was seen as siege on Yisroel, Nehardea is mentioned there if I remember correctly), it is milchemes chova. People can pose a threat from anywhere today. Someone half way around the world could control a drone or hack a computer, so there is always a justification as some foreigners literally are on the borders or within the borders at all times.

    Ram’ in hil’ mel’ umil’ brings permitted to eat treifos during milchama to lay siege to foreign territory when none available (which is a chiddush in my view to say so about a discretionary war to acquire foreign territories, as his source in Devarim and the gemara is dealing with apparently a milchemes chova of conquest of Yisroel, but he says so). Anyway, if Ram’ permitted for mil’ reshus, assumedly permitted for chova and mitzva. Is there enough non-treif available in Yisroel now? Nisht pashut. I think most animals there are treif cuz the animals might be kept alive with antibiotics, so would be permitted to eat treif cuz mil’.

    Re mitzvus yishuv haaretz in the Rambam, I honestly think it requires consideration of the Ram’ in Hil’ Beis HeBechira at the end of the sixth perek where he discusses the chazaka on Yisroel, I think that sugiya is relevant to hashing out the opinion of the the Rambam on mitzvas yishuv haaretz. I basically think that because Ram’ viewed Yisroel as possessing a historic title through a chazaka, which is stronger than a claim based on conquest, that he wasn’t taking for granted the assumption that the claim would to the territory would be made through conquest. He forsaw in my opinion the possibility that the chazaka claim would be realized without a need for milchamah. It is best discussed in a sefer by HaRav Gershon Arieli in my opinion. Sorry, I could have organized that better and cited sources better, but not enough time, and I hope you can figure out what I meant.

    Also, just to clarify, I oncee above commented Rebbi Yehuda and should have specified above that I meant Rebbi Yehuda HaNasi, not Rebbi Yehuda bar Ilai (who is a stam Rebbi Yehuda), but in context it might have been clear which Rebbi Yehuda I meant.

  343. When I say pidion shavui is doche Shabbos I mean aside from war reasoning that if a medina nabs you and in compulsory service under durress makes you enter either a staged or real war, you are obligated to redeem yourself from the detainment just as well, which might be expedited by following their orders even on Shabbos.

  344. Cute and copy from the rambam
    וכל הנלחם בכל לבו בלא פחד ותהיה כוונתו לקדש את השם בלבד same then psukim from David hamelech
    This means that even if eating trief the soldiers are more fit to fight it’s not לקדש את השם
    In Nehardea the army might have been with king over there against enemies and bandits not necessarily their own place
    Permitting him to eat trief even if the war was “reshus” it was only for pekuach nefesh not a normal sunset
    The other rambam וחייב בשביעית ובמעשרות without a state of Israel cause of the kedusha and it’s our land
    But the rambam brought is talking about David hamelech and the sake of hashem only and the state of Israel was to rid the Jewish people of that and am trying to say that in mishleh and medrash it seems that from bad can not come good and from sin can not come merit
    But nobody is saying bad about doing something for the sake of hashem but it is a religion to say that the present state of Israel is this cause of pekuach nefesh
    But I will have to agree that anybody that does something only for the sake of hashem as the rambam says it’s a tzadik but saying that eating trief is also a mitzvah and that of living in Israel as what the rambam meant would be considered a grave sin if said from a rabbi
    Also no rabbi would say you could be mechalel shabbat not to go an Israeli jail

  345. It is arguably a heksher mitzvah in an obligatory war, milchemes chova or milchemes mitzvah, to eat treif if treif necessary sustenance to be effective. If I understood correctly, the Rambam understands it is a milchemes reshus to acquire territory abroad not necessarily even to defend Yisroel and not necessarily even as preemption. It is my understanding that handing to Israeli detention or jail is mesirah, there is a significant enough threat in those institutions of torture at hands of nochrim that one who hands off to such institutions is a rodef (could be moser is learned out from rodef). Pretty serious. I can bring Torah sources if not on phone right now we redeem captives on Shabbos from nochrim, if so, why can a captive not act to redeem himself? Obvi if it’s shas hashmad and it’s to belittle mitzvos, might be yeharog val yaavor. I’m not musmach on these sugiyos. Would like to learn them well. They seem relevant. Don’t insult me.

  346. I meant to say Rambam understands treif permitted if no kosher available in milchemes reshus, which by definition is not a matter of self-defense.

  347. @Yankal Berel,
    seriously I just (very bemusedly) went through the argument between you and Hakatan, and I must say, you really make a right old fool of yourself.
    e.g. you state that “3] The oaths are mentioned by Shlomo hamelech . Much before hurban bayit rishon . So why was milhemet hahasmonaim and subsequent establishment of their meluha not against the oaths”.

    Your stupidity really is amusing!!
    Instead of reading what Shlomo Hamelech writes, in alluding to all the exiles we have faced, and than ultimately Mashiach bimehera beyamenu amen, and realizing that you are mixing pizza and chulent, two separate things, you use it as a proof for your absurdly ignorant statements!
    You very conveniently forget (the most important part, but this is typical of all zionist lunatic resha’im- I really hope you aren’t one), is the difference between what the Holy Chashmona’im were fighting for, and the egel hazahav av”z the zionists fight for….
    It is quite clear that the Chashmona’im were fighting against exactly what zionism is, so the axiom-isation of the two is ludicrous at best, and downright kefira at worst..

  348. “Secular Zionism is a rejection of the Jewish faith. It supplants God and Torah as the basis of the Jewish people, for which it substitutes a common land and language. There can be no greater evidence of this than the anthem Hatikva which states that the hope of Jews for two millenia has been “to be a free nation in our land”—not a nation of God and Torah. This anthem was scheduled to begin the program.

    The dominant presence of the President and Ambassador of the State of Israel and the speeches they would perforce deliver supporting a secular State, meant that the thousands present would be inspired to honor an ideology which is the antithesis of Judaism. Pikuach nefesh does not override supporting the rejection of Judaism.

    Torah Jews recognize the need for a government in Israel, and, of course, will do nothing to dismantle it or to expose it to danger. But they cannot recognize its ideology as legitimately Jewish.

    In addition, it became clear that the rally would have no prayers (except in the form of songs by a singer); and it would have (this, from an advertisement) a massive chant by the attendees of “Never Again!”— implying that the physical might of the army—not Hashem—will protect the Jewish people.

    I felt that Torah Jews should not be exposed to all of this secularism”
    From RABBI Aharon Feldman

  349. @jewgut
    you are right that there is no comparison whatsoever between chashmonaim and zionists in their essence .
    Chashmonaim were spiritual heroes and tsaddikim whereas zionists are mostly mesisim and madichim.
    That goes without saying. Pashut Kebei’a bekutcha.
    The question was specifically to hakatan who claimed that the mere EXISTENCE of Jewish sovereignty is prohibited even if the PM would be R Amram Blau . And supposedly that is a clear Issur Hilchati, agreed on by all poskim [!] .
    If so why is the meluha of hasmona’im not against the Halacha ?
    That is [and was] the question .
    Hakatan ignored it .
    Maybe you have an answer ?
    Thanks.

  350. JewGut
    I’m not sure what you’re saying about Shlomo Hamelech. But the Misgarim and 3 oaths were not applicable in Beis Rishon as we see the milchemed hurshus was allowed. In Beis Sheinu, one of the stipulations were to be under the occupation of the Umos. Nevertheless, the two exceptions were: Malchus Yuvon, where they tried to defile our neshamos and so in the Roman rule under bar koseba. Just to note: The Rashab of Lubavitch made a protest at the Peterburg asifah in front of the gedolei yisroel that our gifum were given over to the Umos, not our neshamos.

    We could and should fight for anything the governments in the world do to weaken our ruchnious. That was what the Chasmonoim did. We need to do diplomacy but to also let know the goverment (like in the case of the education gzeirah in NY), that we’re ready for mesiras nefesh. If we had a beis hamikdosh, we would fight with weapons…

  351. JewGut: I have a hard time arguing with Rabbi Feldman but don’t the two paragraphs below contradict each other? If the president and lobbying don’t support Israel, what’s the point of a government that has it’s hands tied? What exactly does this mean: “Pikuach nefesh does not override supporting the rejection of Judaism”? Does it mean a ban to serve in Knesset, vote, military, or even lobbying? I wish to understand this better!

    “The dominant presence of the President and Ambassador of the State of Israel and the speeches they would perforce deliver supporting a secular State, meant that the thousands present would be inspired to honor an ideology which is the antithesis of Judaism. Pikuach nefesh does not override supporting the rejection of Judaism.

    Torah Jews recognize the need for a government in Israel, and, of course, will do nothing to dismantle it or to expose it to danger. But they cannot recognize its ideology as legitimately Jewish.”

  352. What Rabbi Feldman is saying, that we cannot have support for secularism: Is it the chillul Hashem that we show the world or is it an Inyan of bordering on having out minds challenged by secularism? If the latter, would it be different if all those gedolim were to announce to their constituent and maybe Klal Yisroel beforehand that they shouldn’t get influenced by the talks and just understand that we need solidarity with Israel to encourage the president and the lobbies to continue supporting Eretz Yisroel?

    Just like he spoke about the fact that we need a country to help protect us and an army and he never made a clear statement before this event (all the years of the state), towards the idea of getting influenced by secularism, we do need to show that we all need the weapons and the other neshek for protection!

    Of course with Point One I CANNOT say anything different because it’s kefirah mamsh to put yourself in a sofek to what the pastors will talk about and it’s also a chillul hashem too. I just don’t full understand point 2 and would love some more clarity! The agudah, ALL the years had 0 problems with lobbying for the state and it’s security…

    Please educate me…

    NOTE: I am mevatel my thinking towards gedolim but have difficulty with this and don’t know whom to ask for explanation. Thanks.

  354. @yankel berel,
    I hear what you’re asking, so here’s the answer:
    Really speaking, the answer lies in what you yourself said.
    What do I mean? Well, MiResha’im Yotzah Resha- the intrinsic polaristic difference between the Chashmonaim and the diametric opposite- the tziyonim is the answer.
    What was the reason for the Chasmona’im doing what they did and what was the reason for what the tziyonim doing what they did?

    Many Gedolim past and present have said, that (it’s actually just sechel hayashar) people have to understand the difference between a fight on our physical existence (מלחמות על הגוף) and on our souls (מלחמות על הנשמה). And the Gedolim said/say, that yes when it comes to our wars- physically, we have to remember that we are in galus etc etc, but when it come to our souls, we have to remember that the neshama of a Jew WAS AND IS NEVER IN GALUS!! There is no such thing as misgarim be’umos when it comes to our neshamos!!
    For our souls we have to fight bitter and hard! There is no such concept of bowing for the goy when it comes to our souls!
    So, for example look at the difference between Chanukah and Purim.
    Chanukah, was mainly a fight on the souls, hence the ban on learning Torah, Bris Mila, Rosh Chodesh etc. That warranted a full out PHYSICAL war, throwing out the window any idea of misgarim be’umos!
    But, Purim, a war that mainly, was on bodily harm, killing Jews in the physical sense, warranted Tefilos Tefilos and tefilos (and you can say some ‘Protekzia’, in the form of Esther Hamalka’s ‘connections’).
    This is the intrinsic difference between the Chashmona’im and the tziyonim.

    But as I said above, for frum Jews with frum hashkafos, it should be enough to know that the fact in itself that these are Tzadikim looking to save Klal Yisrael (Chashmonaim) and that those are resha’im whose whole modus operandi/ constitutional declaration is the utter destruction of the Torah Ch”v, that in itself should already be enough.

  355. @ccb45,
    maybe could you clarify what your question to me was I didn’t fully understand, but just to note, your first comment to me was exactly bang on my point, read my answer to Yankal Berel.
    Your other comments to me was a bit confusing and I’m not sure what you mean to say..
    Please explain, thanks.

  356. yankel berel
    According to Ramban, hashmonoim melucha was against Torah. Specificity that Yehudah has malchus, not shevet levi.

    Why didn’t Yehudah take melucha from yevonim. It’s not clear from Jewish history but some claim that the conditions for Beis Sheinu was that they be subjugated to the nations.

    You see it with Persia, Egypt afterwards, Macedonia, Greeks, Romans. The reason for the hashmonoi revolt was religious and that is ok till today. Even bar koseba was justified because religion was oppressed.

    We don’t and not allowed to use weapons to defend religion in the nations because the restriction in Golus 2 was stronger. Yet, based on what tzaddikim (take the Rashab at the Petersburg gathering), our souls were NEVER subjected to golus.

    That’s why Lubavitch actively fought the communists till the last man standing in an open revolt. We need to call out to anyone trying to disturb our holy convent to leave us alone…

  357. @jewgut
    @ccb45
    All your explanations are good for agada .
    I am asking re halacha .
    Katan claims EXISTENCE of Jewish sovereignty is against HALACHA .
    Even with tsaddikim like r amram blau as PM .
    This HALACHIC issur is [supposedly] agreed on by EVERYONE . All rabbanim . Universally.
    My question is HALACHIC .
    How could chasmonaim establish and maintain sovereignty ?
    They should have fought [according to you] for religious freedom and then call some other nation to administer the area .
    Maybe The UN [tongue in cheek] ?
    They were only criticised re malhut beit david vs. malhut kohanim . That was their only avla .
    If they would give it to malhut beit david , they would be perfectly ok .
    Why ?
    Thought that existence of Jewish sovereignty is against halacha ?

  358. I am trying to work out my views on the Hashmonaim. If you go to Hebrewbooks.org, you can download a version of Vaoyel Moshe that can be copied and pasted into a text file and searched easily for “חשמונאים”. I remember a discussion that Levim aren’t bnei melucha. Worth reviewing. Still trying to work out my own views. Like, alst the side kadsha rishona kadsha lasid lavo (not sure), then I could hear an argument that Levi still have a vested interest in the site that was designated wtih kedusha, like it would mean they still would have fiduciary duties in relation to the site, like trustees over it, irrespective of whether a de jure sovereign with a legitimate claim to royal inheritance of the House of Dovid in fact maintained effective control over that site. Not sure how it’s possible to hold kadsha rishona kadsha lasid lavo alongside the drash towards the end of Seder Olam brought in the Bavli that there will be a first inheritance, a second, but not a third. Not sure if that implies kadsha rishona kadsha leshasa. If the yerusha was lost after chorban rishon so that there became a need for a new act of inheritance, then it sounds like it lost its kedusha. Also, Mishnah in first perek of kelim may imply kadsha leshasa. I think in the writings of Rav Aharon Chaim HaLevi Zimmerman available on Hebrewbooks.org he discusses in a few places the machlokes kadsha rishona kadsha lasid lavo in a way that might have relevance for Cohanim/Levim at that site. Dunno. For the record, if you search Mechilta for “על תנאי”, you find a minority opinion of Rebbi Nosson that melucha beis Dovid is conditional. Sources in chazal against that opinion, but anyway. Also, there’s a Yerushalmi in Maaser Sheni 5th perk that Beis HaMikdash will be rebuilt before Beis Dovid. I like the opinion in Megila in the Yerushalmi in the name of Rebbi Yochanan that bamos are permitted as long as the Aron is out of its place. Makes sense that it only would be a problem to me if there was a functioning central location for it already, in which case it would be divisive of Yisroel. Also, I don’t hear the logic that the sacrifices need to occur that one location if it remains with kedusha in its designation for it. Why is it not possible to designate more than one location as potential locations for the offering? Does it anyway remove from the kedusha of one to have designated another? Maybe if that one is misused, that’s the issue. I don’t think it wouldn’t make Yerushalaim any less kadosh to offer in Shilo for instance. It arguably is a better location today to slaughter animals in terms of logistics.

  359. Showers, restrooms — and terrorist headquarters: a glimpse into the tunnels of Hamas in Shifa.

    The Shifa Hospital in the heart of Gaza has become a symbol that characterizes Hamas • For years the IDF has been interested in getting there – to the tunnels that serve as headquarters for the most senior members of the terrorist organization • A little over a week ago the IDF raided the building, and in recent days broke through the front door that leads to the tunnel • The documentation Inside reveals: equipment that probably belongs to the abductees, helmets and weapons •

    Ohad Hemo |The main edition | Posted 11/22/23

    Shifa Hospital, located in Gaza City, is not just any hospital. For a long time the IDF has known what it is really used for: a terrorist headquarters for the most senior members of Hamas. Tonight (Wednesday) on the “Main Edition”, we provide a special and first glimpse into the underground tunnels that were located under the hospital, more than a week after the IDF raid . to the building. Along with showers, rest rooms and sinks – terrorist headquarters were also located. The documentation from the inside also shows equipment that probably belongs to Israeli abductees who may have been held there , as well as IDF helmets and weapons.

    ([https://img.mako.co.il/2023/11/21/MINHARA_2111_SHIFA_re_autoOrient_i.jpg]
    The hatch door in the terrorist tunnel in Shifa after it was broken into).

    In addition, 47 days after the start of the war, it is already possible to identify the buds of opposition to Hamas – which has controlled the Strip for nearly 20 years. This, after we talked with Palestinians from Gaza, who say that “Hamas is corrupt”, and has brought destruction and destruction upon them. ..

    https://www.mako.co.il/news-military/6361323ddea5a810/Article-e8bccbec3b7fb81027.htm

  360. The goal and dream of Israel army is to take the terrorism from them and bring it to America and countries political propaganda nothing good comes from a state that’s existence is war with God

    Imagine if all the Gaza people decided to become Israeli and get citizenship it would be something great and make all of them proud but it would also end the state cause they are the majority of people

  361. Nu
    Am still waiting for an answer .
    Anyone out there ?
    The question was to hakatan who claimed that the mere EXISTENCE of Jewish sovereignty is prohibited even if the PM would be R Amram Blau . And supposedly that is a clear Issur Hilchati, agreed on by all poskim [!] .
    If so why is the EXISTENCE of meluha of hasmona’im not against the Halacha ?
    .
    Hakatan ignored it .
    Seems like everyone else is too ?
    @Jewgut ?

  362. Can’t take it
    The truce in fight was for Thursday and that means that some of the hostages are free Friday but Israel says no we are not stopping the bombing till after that this makes people say that Jewish state are worse then the terrorist how can in front of all the world use people as politics cause you like the honor as leaders of the people and a cozy home and these hostages life’s are in tremendous danger biggest disgrace ever what comes before freeing these captives it’s crazy
    And that also announce for some reason that they are letting the red cross talk to the hostages in Gaza what does that mean

  363. In response to yankel berel, need more time for Vayoel Moshe text search for Hashmonaim. If they let in the Red Cross, it probably means it is a staged conflict zone.

  364. To understand what the Hashmonaim thought of themselves, it helps to read the apocrypha, dunno if that’s what Rebbi Akiva means by “sefarim chitzoniim” in his opinion brought in Sanhedrin. If so, maybe don’t go there unless you want to be like Rebbi Eliezer (sorry if memory fails me on who says so in Pirkei Avos) to know what to say to the “apikorus” (not in the literal sense in this case cuz not very much Epicurian or similarly subversive Greek philosophy made the apocrypha, tho there are ideas possibly not aligned with chazal, tho with critical analysis these sources can provide notice and evidence of material facts from history). Book of Jubilees seeks to justify the Hashmonaim if I remember correctly in a few sections that discuss their kingdom ideally. Also, it helps to read the Books of Maccabees. Probably Josephus helps too, also helps to understand that transition from Hashmonaim kingdom to Herodian/Roman, how that worked precisely, perhaps sort of similar to any hijack of today’s states if that occurred. Those sources and probably more might help to understand the Hashmonaim. Seder Olam might help a bit too, the original work, not just the quote that appears in the Bavli. Also, a lot more probbly needs to be said about the Persian restoration. I personally wonder whether Ezra and Nechemia weren’t under duress from the Persian Emperor. Could be the whole dedication of the Second Temple was ceremonial without any meaning in terms of kiddush and just occured to appease a foreign emperor who essentially had appropriated the ancient tradition of his subjects from Yisroel and wanted it to function in a way that benefitted the Empire. The honest truth is if you read the nevua brought in Sefer Melachim right after dedication of the Bayis Rishon, the prophesy Shlomo gets there about what happens if he fails to go in the Torah that it will get destroyed, it almost sounds as if the condition subsequent is to leave the site damaged as a reminder not to breach duty to HaShem. I just said that outside without consulting the sources, which was probably a mistake. Please disregard what I just said if it’s kefira or something akin to it, I don’t want kares just trying to understand how the whole history fits together. Also, while putting my cards on the table, when you go thru all of chazal relevant on the sugiya including midrash halacha (Mechilta, Sifra) and including Megilla in the Yeurshalmi especially with an eye for bamos, this whole Onias in Egypt bama and Shimon HaTzaddik going there to fulfill a nevua really also makes me question whether the ideal location to operate a sacrificial cult today might be somewhere else, dunno, perhaps somewhere closer to livestock and further away from urban sprawl. Maybe Uruguay today makes more sense as a bama site, considering how much kosher meat comes from south America. Alternatively, maybe the ideal would be to return to the original idea of the Mishkan or of kadsha leshasa, to become a semi-mobile animal slaughter operation. Also, honestly, if there some decentralization to the whole animal slaughter thing, allowing a bama contest, the best probably ultimately could function as the centralized one. Maybe it could help to reconceptualize the whole relationship to livestock for meat in Yisroel, where currently the operation is to have nochrim castrate the males for us, even tho clear breach of chukos bnei Noach in opinion brought in Sanhedrin. Also, most animals usually are sickly unless actual free range with feed without poison. Industrialized mass animal production and slaughter for human consumption can run into problems. I don’t mean to cause any machlokes over kashrus, but truth be told imo you probably should do your own shechita with your own animals if you can, which was perhaps the ideal pre-chet haegel, that each head of household run his own bama. Dunno if that flies in Brooklyn. It’s possible to get back to that eventually by saying bamos are permitted to get back to that. Or similarly, maybe a return to more local slaughter, the local bama, would be a better approach? Walk your animal to the local bama when it needs to be slaughtered if you’re not holding yourself? Dunno… Agin, forgive anyor all of these ideas if this brainstorm is inappropriate. If I didn’t think these ideas deserved consideration, I would not have proposed them.

  365. The best bama would be at sea for the tachash or the levioson. The shechita should be performed by a well-trained scubadiver I would say irresective of tribal affiliation best in kavana and cut. That is the way to get the tachash leather. I think the ideal slaughter involves first befriending the aquatic mammal and then slitting it when it least expects it. There is an opinion I think in Bavli Pesachim I already forgot whose that tachash is kosher. It’s like an aside in some shakla vetarya, but it makes a lot of sense to me that it would be. Once tried to argue before learning that sugiya and finding support that or tachash must be a kosher animal cuz why else would they use on the mishkan. Someone argued against me what about chilazon that isn’t kosher to eat? Still, I would think tachash would be kosher even if rare or virtually impossible to shecht properly. I don’t like to infer ikar taamei mitzvos, but at least dolphins and whales aren’t carnivorous of other animals besides fish, they do have multiple stomachs and would chew their cud if they had it, not an expert in their anatomy to analyze whether their “hoofs” are split, so not sure if they should be consumed today with Mercury levels and microplastics in oceans, in an ideal world one shechita on a whale preserved well could feed a man for life, just one cut for meat in a lifetime, at least could offer in flames today what not consumed, but anyway at least also could save the leather as a roof on a Mishkan structure, that makes sense to me I guess to start with a bama on or near a boat to get the tachash leather, guess the shechita would have to be in the water. That’s how I’d start. Basically, if it were up to me, I would use the Torah as a justification to start whaling to make priceless leather for the roof of a portable structure that would imo technically belong to HaShem. Could make it an aquatic competition between shochtim. Probably could be syndicated to audience that’s holding, maybe keep it confidential and priveleged thru some appropriate legal structure. Important that the Torah, if this is Torah and some modern equivalent of the origins of the tachash leather, be respected. Not worth risking kares necessarily to try to understand a sugiya in the Torah. There is a whaling event still in the Faroe islands I would attend if I had the budget. Best to avoid exposing this sugiya in the Torah to foreign authorities even if their legal system would permit it after scrutinizing Torah sources, since that exposure itself might be mebazeh the Torah, and being mebazeh the Torah is darshened out as a source of kares somewhere in Sanhedrin if I remember correctly. Sorry if this is not the right forum to express my views, since an indiscriinate audience could visit this site…

  366. From a blogger:

    Amanpour selecting interviewees and desperately begging: please say “genocide” (On civilians uses by ‘Palestinian’ regime as shields)

    Nov 23, 2023

    Longtime anti-Israel activist Christiane Amanoour, as part of demonizing Israel has also an obsession with semantics.

    At the time of protests against Judicial reform, Amanpour pressed at least one Israeli interviewee to use the T word – ‘totalitarian,’ in case reform goes through. But to her disappointment, it did not.

    Now, after Oct 7 atrocities by the Gaza fascist genocidal regime, who foresaw Israeli response and have always been using non -combatants to make sure they die, Ananpour knows all that, but her israelophobia virus has a particular obsession with name calling on the victim and only democratic entity in the region. The G word, bit, she is so desperate about that.

    So first she had Mr. Bartov on, and she tried to extract from him her desired slur, struggling, she kept pushing like, “when is going to be the line.. crossed” so it can finally–to her joy– be called that. But the real gist of lefty Bartov was that he is against certain people in the coalition and as soon as they are out. All is fine.

    Of the “amazing” points was, deeming “ethnic cleansing” on evacuating people so they’re not killed. What would anyone terming this as such, really prefer for those people to stay?

    But Amanpour didn’t give up, after Antonio Guterres was slammed for a lying post [https://twitter.com/maor_x/status/1726895291478245473] [https://twitter.com/HenMazzig/status/1726653958431916079] [https://twitter.com/KseniaSvetlova/status/1726705819671224809] about “unprecedented” she found UN’s Griffiths still recycling Guterres pseudo line. She was so enthusiastic to post it on X.

  367. @Yankal berel,
    Look, I have told you and supplied you with the reason and halacha, if any halacha that stands in the way of a target is to be considered agadata in order to make it ‘non halachic (which in itself is sheer stupidity, because countless basic halachos are sourced from agadatas and are halacha lemaseh- this ‘agadata not being halacha’ (in every case) reasoning ignorance coming purely from a zionist drive to change reality.
    I don’t mean it personally to you, you could be waiting sincerely for an answer, but it seems to me that the message is not not getting across, rather it is not of interest to be heard.
    Correct me if I am wrong.

  368. I said already, the reason being is simple logic, it is quite head-scratching for me to understand what you didn’t understand in my words, but I’ll put it simpler:
    1) The Chashmona’im were fighting against the existential threat to Torah in their times, they weren’t fighting for ‘freedom per-se’, or for nationalistic freedom, sovereignty etc, they were simply fighting to save the Jewish People from being destroyed through destroying our Torah ch”v.
    The zionists are fighting against directly against, they are the modern day enemy equivalent to the Misyavnim (and Yevanim).
    2) ‘Even if R’ Blau was…..’, well there it goes, ‘sovereignty’ ‘Jewish State etc is all against the Torah full stop irrelevant of who/why/when etc, the question is as you put it what about the Chashmona’im, so read my first point, that they were not fighting for sovereignty, they were fighting for their very existence. Therefore, it wouldn’t help if someone like the Satmar Rav or R’ Amrom Blau etc would be in charge of such a state, because Jews are not allowed to ‘claim’ sovereignty whilst in Galus, H’ will redeem us, and reinstate Malchus David.
    So lets just clear things a little, if your question was on the Chashmona’im and what they exactly were engaged in and how it was allowed/warranted etc, than I have answered, but if your end game point is to come out and say that intrinsically a Medina is allowed, (notwithstanding the immeasurable evidence (that obvious religious zionists would rather ignore) from Poskim, Rishonim, Gaonim, Achronim, everyone against making a state), trying to bring a proof from the Chashmona’im, than –
    1) Again, see my first point debunking the possibility to bring the Chashmona’im as proof,
    2) Look at all the Poskim fromm all generations against making a state before Moshiach, end-of-story….

  369. Nothing in the oaths prevents the mere claim of sovereignty over the territory of Yisroel, unless claiming sovereignty involves inciting a prohibited mered against the de facto sovereign or engagement in a military formation (going up in a wall). Sovereignty over Yisroel I think is claimed in tefilla daily, and the continuity of that claim might ultimately be indispensible to the legal claim to and acquisition of the territory, like holding the deed to the property in dispute. No one of normal descent from the House of Dovid in this generation seems likely to claim royal inheritance of Beis Dovid, not likely since none have for a long time. The more likely scenario would be a clone of someone from Beis Dovid who was heir. Rebbi Yehuda HaNassi had a tradition to be of beis Dovid, I think in the Yerushalmi. They probably called him Nassi in recognition that he would have been king if not for the Roman Emperor. Exilarch claimed to be of Beis Dovid too. At best imo, whoever maintains effective control over any territory today to which that royal family has title (not sure the royal family possesses the title and not Yisroel collectively, especially considering opinions the sovereignty of Beis Dovid is conditional, brought at least in two places in the Mechilta), that de facto sovereign at best should act like a fiduciary for the presently incapacitated de jure sovereign, like the apotropos Yoshiahu probably had from age 8 till maturity. That’s how I view Beis Dovid, unless the largest court ever poskins Beis Dovid was on condition: the heir of Beis Dovid lives in something like an embriyonic condition if not more fully developed. For the record, the constituent technologies necessary to clone a human have been available for quite some time, decades before Dolly.

  370. Re cloning, there’s an opinion brought in the Bavli Pesachim 68a in the name of Rebbi Yochanan that in the future tzaddikim will do tchias hamesim. Maybe it’s cloning. No need to wait for Beis Dovid to start mitzvos already incumbent, like there’s a Mishnah in the Yerushalmi Maaser Sheni that the Beis HaMikdash precedes the restoration of Beis Dovid. I personally struggle with the idea of any avoda, whether at a bama or in Yerushalaim, being done without maintenance of effective control over that territory. Like, doing the avoda cuz some foreign emperor gave you permission or worse instructed you to do so, that seems pretty compromised to me. Seems to me like not being a subject of any foreign sovereign might be a prerequisite, otherwise it’s like HaShem resides in a territory subject to that foreign sovereign, it’s like HaShem lacks sovereignty or has an offense to his honor, Heaven forbid. In theory you could have avoda done where no other sovereign claims title to the territory and yet without any real assertion of sovereignty oneself. An example would be if you took a boat into international waters to slaughter a whale at a bama at sea. That is an obvious example that comes to mind. Could technically even be in eretz Yisroel at sea if on the Meditarranean in the right lattitude. Alternatively, could find terra nullius. Like, one place that could work that arguably is still in Eretz Yisroel, which extends to Nahar Pras, is an island on the Euphrates right at the Syrian and Turkish border. It technically is possible to walk from the Turkish side to the Syrian side, and the Syrian side is territorially incontiguous with the rest of Syria due to the river. Syrians can’t access the territory except through Turkey. So that is a small site where no sovereign would bother to challenge an assertion of sovereignty. Another example is Merir Island in the Republic of Palau. Anyway, it deserves some consideration an idea that the real power of the melech is in his power to draft for the military. That is usually what requires the most cuz it’s a big deal to put other people’s lives at risk if they aren’t consenting. It’s a main point mentioned more than once in a commentary by Rav Gershon Arieli on the Rambam Hil’ Mel’ uMil’. A lot of procedural requirements for war apparently concern that issue. Also it deserves mention that not everyone mashuach necessarily was a melech, examples of Eliyahu and Elisha, tho common element might be they weren’t subject to any kings either. In other words, they had sovereignty over themselves tho not necessarily over subjects. Anyway, probably authored later after chazal, but Midrash Tanchuma on Ki Sisa brings that everyone who occupies himself with the Torah will become a leader and a king. I could hear an argument that multiple sovereigns in a single nation could provide greater security, like diversifying a portfolio, or like how the Holy Roman Empire was virtually impenetrable for the fact that each German principalty had its own defense, so any invasion would have needed to engage against multiple defense strategies. There can be strength in decentralization, assuming the agudas don’t lead to civil war. But, anyway, the main point is it’s really tough to find any valid excuse to delay fulfillment of the obligations of the Torah at this point. I for one cannot identify any valid excuse.

  371. @jewgut
    1] Avne nezer is CLEARLY matir Jewish sovereignty al pi halacha, halacha lemaase [end of YD] based on hashmatat rambam and sh’a [and his understanding of sugyat hagmara]
    So its not ALL poskim [as you state] . It matter of DEBATE between the poskim .

    2] My question is [was] the following – if EXISTENCE of Jewish sovereignty is assur , and once a Jew finished defending himself against aggression , he is not allowed to maintain Jewish malhut [as Katan argued is the maskana of ALL poskim] , then why DID THE HASMONA”IM NOT INVITE OTHER MALHUYOT TO ADMINISTER THEIR TERRITORY ?
    Their meluha continued for nearly 200 years [lashon harambam].
    No one invited other malhuyot , nor is there any record of any discussion to do so .
    You have not addressed this point [yet].

  372. ‘”Keep waving” – the instructions Hamas terrorists gave to the Israeli hostages are exposed… They tried to present themselves as humane and as if they were taking care of the hostages who love them – but these are cruel terrorists who make propaganda about the lives of our kidnapped civilians!’

  373. @Yankal Berel,
    You have only confirmed my points.
    You choose to whitewash and distort in order to attain your goal.
    You really don’t seem to me to genuinely have a question and seeking an answer.
    If you really did, you’d look at what I wrote, search it up, and look at the sefarim that deal with all these issues (not just the ones written by some novice idiotic and ignorant yeshiva bachurim full of pride thinking they have already understood all what e.g. Vayoel Moshe etc “meant”, and see themselves as of substantial posture and importance of opinion to argue with them), and you’ll see that there are plenty that deal with e.g. the Avnay Nezer that you misquote, and out of context.
    I am no missionary and don’t need you to agree with me, I only answered your question, but if your only satisfaction accomplished would be if I agreed with the mantra poised point you’re trying to make, than forget about it.
    I wouldn’t mind answering your point with whatever knowledge I know and can supply, but I am not interested in squabbling with a wall, sorry…..

  374. Sorry, I accidentally referred to Sifra for ir nidachas. Meant to refer to Sifrei Devarim. Sifra is attribued to Rebbi Yehuda (bar Ilai), which is important for some sugiyos, e.g., nochri haba al bas Yisroel havlad mamzer, which is not the psak of the Bavli in Yevamos, but it is apparently the opinion of Rebbi Yehuda (bar Ilai) if like Rebbi Yochanan you learned Sifra, meaning Rav Dimi in Bavli Yevamos turns out was correct about the opinion of Rebbi Yehuda (bar Ilai), also that was the opinion of Rebbi Yehuda HaNasi brought in the Yerushalmi. Sidepoint. Anyway, also, I am not incorrect to have noticed that the braisa in Bavli Sanedrin that an ir nidachas will never be, that opinion is not reflected in Sifrei Devarim, which is tannaic as well. So, in theory, a melech Yisroel or some partnership who discretionarily resorted to kiddubush yachid smeih kibbush on the gansa velt already starting like over two centuries ago, they might rely on Sifrei Devarim rather than that braisa brought in the Bavli to have held that laying siege to an ir nidachas is permitted. And if you say an ir nidachas must only be in Yisroel, perhaps they went and did some kiddush to the territories of conquest by in fullfillment of all relevant procedural means albeit covertly to have applied some obligations of the Torah, e.g., mitzvas ir nidachas, just as Syria was given partial kiddush Eretz Yisroel for some mitzvos after the conquest of Dovid which was by means of kibbush yachid shmeih kibbush. Anyway, siege to ir nidachas, taka mamesh if I put on my reality glasses and look around, that quite indeed actually appears to have in fact occured with this whole vax thing, the Science seems like avoda zara, the rov fell for it in most cities, transfection risks are real and appear in Pfizer docs released on court order, I am prudent for having kept my genetic integrity if relevant to me out of the eiruv if most therein vaxed. Know the real milchama. It’s not the staged one w controlled opp Hamas, even if they offed some casualties. That’s not the real milchama. That is a distraction from the real milchama. If you are getting hungry, it means you’re under siege.

  375. @jewgut
    You are a cop out
    I learnt avne Nezer myself , properly and I quote him within context and accurately . Am not quoting him from any Yeshiva bachur.
    I read your point about hashmonaim .
    You only explain the difference between Hashmonaims battle for religion vs zionism battle for nationalistic reasons .
    Which is correct , but does not address the question .
    The Q was – AFTER the end of the battle , AFTER victory , why did they not invite any other meluha to take over ?
    Seems like the EXISTENCE of Jewish Sovereignty is not against halacha …
    Have not heard ANY answer to this point ….
    Nu ….

  376. Who in the Atlanta community vaxed out due to the influence of Michael Broyde. He was mareh heter to have Jewish kids captive of a private school that was grooming and had pedos. He made implied threats against me, attributed to me a loathsome disease I don’t possess, and pressured me to leave Yisroel in a cover up of war crimes. He is like a dirty handler. He caused me to leave Yisroel. He then pressured the whole Atlanta community to vax out. Glad you idiots threw your resources towards bit important Yiddin baalei Torah like that fat disgusting piece of moser garbage. That’s what you support. He has a nice big house. He gets paid big bucks to make sure you mess with your genes. I meanwhile cannot afford food. Thanks Broyde for pressuring me back to the States. You want to threaten me again? I suppose if this gets published, you’ll do your duty to have another one discredited and make it appear they deserved to be thrown under the bus? You are a MOSER.

  377. Can the person making comments as “yaken berrel” or “jewgut” clarify whether you are Michael Broyde from Atlanta? If so, I just want to say you’re responsible for irreparable harm for all generations to come to the genes of Jews in Atlanta. You are implicated in the irreparable harm to the Jewish captives of a private educational institution that was abusive for saying it’s a good school. You put a great distance between me and the people I should have warned about the vax. You caused me to feel humiliated in a way that cost me years of my life, never resolving my understanding of an important sugiya nochri haba al bas Yisroel havlad mamzer for fear of being threatened or attributed a loathsome disease I do not possess just for undertanding chazal. You are a disgusting baal taiva baal gaiva. The fact that some Jews in Yisroel were conditioned to feign respect for you is a problem. It literally has a cost of the whole Atlanta community becoming like an ir nidachas. You are a moser. You aidded and abbetted mosrim. You provided them moral support and to some extent logistical support. You sent a Rav with a pizza to that abusive institution once a week to learn the Parasha. I am prohibited from commmunication with you.

  378. @ jewgut
    and anyone else
    Same Question applies to the Khazar kingdom .
    A meluha of jews .
    Existence of a meluha of jews ?
    How is that permitted ???

  379. Look I answered you, and I will give you the benifit of the doubt and answer once more, but seriously pay attention and read:
    Lets break it down even further than last time:
    1) The chashmona’im fought a battle of Torah against impurity.

    2) The ultimate result being reinstating the avoda in the Bais Hamikdash.

    3) 25 years of fighting until Eretz Yisrael was clean of both the hellenists/yevanim/syrians and the misyavnim (the zionists of their time).

    4) The reason for their fighting was not nationalistic, it was purely religious and holy for the sake of the Torah, which therefore led not to national soveriengity, rather to the Bais hamikdash standing and that being the Koach (ultimately Hashem as in everything).

    5) They did not give up Erets Yisrael after acheiving “soveignity”, because 1- they never seeked to acheive that so it wasn’t a cheshbon at all, and 2- their ultimate reason for waging battle, to re-instate the avoda, and wipe out the impurity jewish or not at the time was acheived, and they were not about to give it up to unknown forces to allow the reversal of their holy and difficult battles.
    This said, it was not neither a “state” nor “soverignity”, it was simply the kiyum of being able to live as Jews should do.
    Proof? Well, clearly, the revolt against the yevanim was not for national independence. The Babylonians, Persians, and Egyptian Ptolemies all controlled Eretz Israel, yet the Jews never attempted to overthrow their rule. Only when the Greeks made Torah observance virtually impossible did the Jews fight.
    It was not independence etc that they seeked to acheive nor was it viewed as acheived.
    It’s like asking a pilot who had to eject out his plane if he won the paragliding contest. It wasn’t the reason for him ejecting, nor was it in his interest or knowledge.
    Perceiving it as paragliding is because your like/are knowledgable in paragliding and therefore think that’s what he did.
    Same here, you may look through the lense of nationalism/independence etc, but you gotta remember, the Chasmonaim were neither seeking it, nor aware of such idea’s, hence them “not giving up”. It simply was irrelevant.

    5) Besides, this said, it is clear, that the diametric opposite, the zionists and their state was done for the exact purpose the chasmonaim were fighting against.
    Ay, you ask and what is with a frum medina?
    Well the fact that seeking statehood/independence etc being the antithesis of Judaism, underlines the difference between the chashmonaim and today.

    P.S. If say for arguements sake, the never was a medina, and the Bais Hamikdash was still around, and we were not sent into galus, it would be incumbent on us to do as the chashmonaim did, but enough with imaganing, at the end of the day, we are in galus, and waiting for Hashem to speedily take us out, and back to Eretz Yisrael and to be zoche to see בנין ציון וירושלים אמן.

  380. To yankel Berel the difference between the חשמונאים and now is that then we weren’t under the גזירה of golus and now we are. even though they were משועבד to the גויים but after the seventy years they didn’t have to be משועבד anymore the only reason they didn’t rebel till then was because they weren’t on a level high enough to be able to defeat פרס and later יון who were very powerful it says in the גמ׳ that if the Yiddin whould be worthy ביאה שניה with עזרה whould be just like ביאה ראשונה with יהושוע with great ניסים but because they weren’t worthy it was with the permission of פרס and they were still משועבד to them but later when the יונים made גזירות they had no choice and they fought and when as a result they had א״י they kept it because their was no גזירת הגלות but later when the Roman’s came then they were מכניע themselves because again they weren’t on a high enough level to be able to fight Rome and when the בריונים did fight the חכמים spoke against it because it wouldn’t work. You asked about בר כוכבא revolt that was because they thought he was משיח and when they realized he’s not משיח they killed him because over there was the גזירת הגלות. bnogea The Kazar kingdom first of all their kingdom was very far from בבל and there was no contact between them and the גאונים and everything they did was על דעת עצמם and we don’t have any תשובות of the גאונים in that time about that saying it was מותר and no one ever gave a heter for their kingdom. Also we don’t know too much about the kingdom we just know that the king converted but we don’t know how many שרי המלוכה converted with him and if it was ממש a Jewish country and even if it ever did become mostly Jewish it could be that was only hundreds of years after the king converted and if ראשונים mention the king converting doesn’t mean they knew about or agreed with this that hundreds of years later it became a Jewish country. ואין לנו אלא what the גמ׳ says clearly that in golus we’re not allowed to rebel against the גויים or make our own kingdom and leave גלות by ourselves and the rambam brings it in איגרת תימן and whenever it was נוגע (משיח שקר וכדומה) the גדולי ישראל came out and said that were in גלות and we can’t go out by ourselves.

  381. I heard that in the kazar kingdom they let other religions serve what ever they wanted and they didn’t distrow ע״ז now if it wasn’t considered a Jewish country then that would be okay but if it was Jewish then it’s against Halacha and that means that they didn’t ask any of the גדולי ישראל how to run their country

  383. @jewgut
    All correct .
    All you write is correct.
    Like you said – the INTENTION of hashmonaim was not sovereignty .
    .
    But the RESULT was most definitely Sovereignty .
    Jewish Sovereignty.
    Maintained ,upheld and defended for close to 200 years .
    Maintained without ANY MENTION of looking to give it over to other powers who could be amenable to religious freedom .
    No one is on record , no Sage is on record petitioning for exploration of transfer of power to a non jewish meluha.
    At least to EXPLORE how not to be over an ISSUR [it allegedly goes against the ENTIRE torah] while ensuring freedom of religion.
    It clear .
    There was Jewish sovereignty . No one made a peep .
    .
    Clear = EXISTENCE of Jewish sovereignty is not against torah.
    .

  385. Palistanians are still the majority if they all decided to become Israeli citizens it would end the country cause all the money would go to socal services and non for security these people talk about that they are saving Jewish nation and it’s only getting more dangerous the more we honor them as family and great the galus gets worse

  386. Honestly, it’s a shas hashmad. I am not sure the concept is limited to when they’re trying to cause Jews to breach the Torah, which arguably applies today. It arguably could apply even to a situation in which they are trying to depopulate Torah Jews. The shoresh appears in such contexts in nach, lehashmid. So, I’d concur, Hashmonaim-style medina is overdue if it would be or would have been effective. would have hoped for such a motivation from the unvaxed, but now those resisting mainly would be like residents of ir nidachas hors decombat who already have permanent genetic damage. Anyway, cession is one way to create a sovereign state without breach of the oaths if applicable. I think that technically has occurred, like the federal legislation that created the Federal Reserve, I see that as cession. The WHO treaty and domestic legislation that enables putting folks into FEMA camps, would call that cession as well, a partial cession of sovereignty. Those have been gradual for over a century to the point that it would be reasonable to call a spade a spade and say we live under an occupation that fails to adhere to laws of occupation. Anyway, cession from preexisting states or creating a state in terra nullius were options to get around oath issues of a rebellion or any military engagement to create a sovereign state. Also, there were also a number of sovereign Jews historically on the Arabian peninsula, like Banu Qurayza, Banu Qaynuqa, Banu Nadir, the kingdom of Dhu Newas.

  387. I would say any situation of a sovereign clearly engaging in deballatio is really hashmad and is yehareg veal yaavor, even if perpetrated by the state some of us were indoctrinated to view as the start of redemption. Depopulation policies implemented by the occupant of Yisroel today definitely register to me as a just cause for a war. Aside from just cause, the question imo is whether is it a reasonable possibility for subjects on their own initiative or in some collective organization to defeat the occupant. The answer appears a resounding “no”. Not only do most Yiddin seem to have bought into the psyop of the regime, accept the propoganda, wave their flags, maybe criticize the gov but just vote opposition w/o addressing the systemic issues, face too much cognitive dissonance to appreciate reality, most seem compacent, docile, conditioned to be obediant, basically willing to commit a”z on a simple nudge, thereby warranting a judgement of ir nidachas. I can count only a few who passed on the vax, and among them hardly a soul besides myself who would be moser nefesh to overthrow the occupation to be able to keep Torah in its place if the season were right. For the lack of support, it truly would be hevel havalim to attempt it. Moreover, the unvaxed ultimately may be beneficiaries of the deballatio policies implemented, as long as they survive with their genes in tact. If there was a critical mass for something like a levée en masse against the medina by people who merit their liberty, if it appeared strategic, that’d be a different matter. If likely to fail now, silly to try or even contemplate it, as it might just lead to more survaillence by the abominable. For the record, I realize I mispoke about the sefer of Rav Chaim Aharon HaLevi Zimmerman w shu”t on topis like if mitzvas shmiras hamikdash is noheg today and the Levim, I think it’s relevant to justification of the Hashmonaim, it’s not on Hebrewbooks.org, tho there is one with a bit that’s relevant there, the work is titled אגרא לישרים, can send it as a large PDF to anyone who requests. He also wrote a number of books even in English that deal with issues of Zionism.

  388. the story in shoftim of the war on binyamin that they didn’t ask the urim vetumim correctly and many people was killed in this time also we don’t ask the rabbonim correctly only we command them to say and that is why there is going to be tzaros

  389. Which Rabbonim are we to ask today? Who is holding in hilchos milchamos on matters like when does it become appropriate to be mored ba”malchus” due to its depopulation policies? Should we consult the Rabbonim that vaxed out? Do we have 70 who learned chazal and who also passed the vax test? Cuz if they didn’t pass the vax test, I don’t feel comfortable with their judgment. And, if they didn’t learn chazal including those portions relevant to sovereignty and war, including what never made the Bavli in halachic midrashim, the Yerushalmi, Tosefta, in all seriousness they really are not qualified in the matters that a relevant court would have jurisdiction. Anyway, it says in the Yerushalmi, וְשֶׁאֵינוֹ רָאוּי לְכָל־הַדְּבָרִים אֲפִילוּ לְדָבָר אֶחָד אֵינוֹ רָאוּי. I beleive no person, whether bankster or general or political actor or Rabbonim or melech Yisroel or Beis Dovid, should make any decision that risks compromising the security of Yisroel at least unless those competent in the relevant sources have acheived the minimal quarum in the majority in support. Someone like Rav Gershon Arieli was qualified to his opinion on what to do if no urim vetumim. I sincerely have no idea who are the Rabbonim today. If there are Rabbonim, perhaps they should form a group to address some rather urgent issues in Yisroel, since omission of activity seems rather costly at this point too.

  390. Even if a court of at least 70 were formed, would that court have the jurisdiction to overrule a decision of a court or individual authority that was greater in number and wisdom, the choice of laws (or stari decisis if that concept is approprite for appelate jurisdiction, not sure how to relate to it in legalease, anyway, it’s in a Mishna in Eduyios if I remember correctly and also appears in the gemara Avoda Zara elsewhere, “בחכמה ובמנין” search). Suppose we have an opinion that was the opinion of Rebbi Akiva and was accepted among his students and also by any court of his generation, does that mean we’d need a majority in excess of 12,000, the students of Rebbi Akiva who died in Bar Kochba (according to gemara in Yevamos, some sources in chazal put the figure higher)? Serious question.

  391. In Sanhedrin it says in a din Torah this one chooses a dayan and this one
    Satmer rabbi agreed that Rav Aharon kotler was a very great man and also the Zionist rabbis agreed that Rav shach is the gadol hador, and these rabbis say to collect millions of dollars litterly not to have children in there education thus chinuch aztmoi and not to have yeshiva people in the army and that means now when we are at war if they draft them in the army we leave the government is thousand people will get killed

  392. @YankalBerel,
    I tried to give the benifit of the doubt but you have proven 100% that you never had any question and it was meant rather as a rethorical question that gives insight to your utter ignorance in the matter.

    Intent doesn’t just have impact on the end product, rather it is most times the actual cause for the outcome of whatever it is.
    In this case the Chashmona’im.
    It is quite clear from what i said in my last post, you are looking through the lense of secular nationalism mixed with a bit of “religious” flavouring that ultimately leads to the shituf otherwise known as religious zionism.
    Therefore you perceive it to be the Chashmona’im being the heads of a soverign state, and therefore ultimately being kofer in hashgacha elyona.
    You have to realise that this new warped way of thinking was not around 2/300 years ago, let alone thousands of years ago in the times of the Chashmona’im, so you can’t sensibly and logically look through your lenses and say that they did the same.

    They DID NOT fight for soverignity.
    They DID NOT attain soverignity.
    They DID NOT need to give up soverignity because there was none.

    They DID fight against the same tumah forces that today demand soverignity.
    They DID win the war against them and ultimately purify E. Y. from sinners like the then version of zionists.
    They DID keep this going until due to Klal Yisraels sins we were sent back into galus, “ad yom pokdi osam”.

    I hesitently speculate what you’d say about when Hashem took the Jews out of Mizra’im…
    Yeh of course to satisfy your guilty concience (coming from the religious flavouring of the shituf) you’d say that Hashem “helped” (He did/does/will do EVERYTHING it’s not just “help”), but you’d stop short of being able to say that it was not “soverignity” rather a supernatural gift from Hashem that HE controlled and guided.
    Maybe not, but that is what your basically saying about the Holy Chashmona’im.
    Completely ignoring the supernatural essence (no verbally/transcriptly admitting but wriiting something else doesn’t count) of it, the fact that it was clear ratzon Hashem.
    Interesting to note, that until today, we don’t laud the “mightyness” of the Chashmona’im (of course it is essential to recognise their mesirus nefesh that caused the whole zechus of the nes), or thank them.
    We thank HASHEM for HIM fighting our wars (sidenote, sefardim don’t say “v’al hamilchamos” because wars are not a thankful thing), for HIM saving us etc.

  393. @Yankal Berel,
    remember that parts of Klal Yisrael that left Mitzrayim before the time and tried to gain “soverignity” were wipped out by the Palestinians.
    Instead of having to bend the un-truth into form to look similar to the truth.
    admit the glaring truth.
    If the Chashmona’im fought and won, and the parts of Klal Yisrael in Mitzrayim (seemed) to do something similar, but got wiped out, try to think why.

  394. @Yankal Berel,
    remember that parts of Klal Yisrael that left Mitzrayim before the time and tried to gain “soverignity” were wipped out by the Palestinians.
    Instead of having to bend the un-truth into form to look similar to the truth.
    admit the glaring truth.
    If the Chashmona’im fought and won, and the parts of Klal Yisrael in Mitzrayim (seemed) to do something similar, but got wiped out, try to think why.
    IT IS BECAUSE “SOVERIGNITY” WAS NOT A CONCEPT THAT EXISTEC in relevance to them.

  395. The students of rabbi עקיבא passed away in a plague the בא כוכבא legends are Zionist made up propaganda and against חז״ל.

  396. @Jewgut
    First of all we have to agree on the terms and on the definitions .
    What the words mean .
    Sovereignty is not an INTENTION or a MOTIVE .
    It is a FACT .
    Sovereignty means – you govern yourself .
    No one governs you .
    You have a meluha.
    Either you have a meluha or you do not .
    No matter WHY you have one .
    Thats what sovereignty is .
    .
    Now – whether hashmonaim exercised sovereignty or not , is not a matter of opinion.
    It is a question of fact .
    Either they did or they did not .
    Either it is day or it is night .
    I do not think you can find any historian on this planet who will say that hashmonaim did not exercise sovereignty .
    The Rambam himself writes so , clearly and explicitly , in beginning of hilchot hanukka in his yad hachazaka. [for nearly 200 years – his language].
    Look it up.
    .
    For Your information – I do NOT say hallel on 5 iyar .
    I say tahanun.
    I am not a zionist and it is clear to me that zionism had a DEVASTATING effect on Klal Yisrael.
    But I happen to like accuracy .
    Just because your enemy is evil , that does not mean that accuracy is out of the window .
    Accuracy in history and facts .
    And accuracy in torah .
    .
    Even when that accuracy happens to have as a result – not like a ‘widely accepted’ shitah…..
    .

  397. What rabbis was bar kochva army
    The results of chanukah was the bies hamikdash and ruach hakodesh
    The results of Zionism is I’m your friend cause it’s sakonas nefoshos and you get some stipends and support and less anti semitism and better life with the state of Israel more pride in yourself but the truth is without the pride factor the money and life would of been more holy and not seeing these people as friends or protectors and the speedy coming of moshiach and life quality

  398. @5783
    Read your comment –
    The issur [supposedly] is the 3 shevu’ot.
    The SOURCE of the shevo’ot is a passuk in Shir Hashirim – BEFORE the establishment of the meluha of the chashmona’im .
    The gezerat hagalut WAS applicable then , as they were smack in the middle of Galut Yavan . [one of the 4 galuyot]
    So the issur – if valid- should apply to them too.
    Lema’aseh it did not .

    Seems like Avne nezers shitah which is based on hashmatat harambam and hashmatat ha Shulhan Aruch , coupled with avne nezers own understanding of the relevant sugya , is correct.
    Existence of Jewish sovereignty is not against the torah.
    .
    Re the Khazars .
    R yehuda Halvy who wrote the fictionalized discussion between the King and the Haham , instructing the King about all pertinent things the King is supposed to know al pi torah , and LEFT OUT something that [supposedly] is against THE ENTIRE TORAH [!] , that Jewish sovereignty is assur , and that in case that …

    should he and his nation convert , they will have to transfer their sovereignty to another meluha …
    Why did he leave out such an important point ?
    Seems that -again – existence of Jewish sovereignty is not against the torah.
    .
    Like avne nezer .
    .
    Btw – even without Avne nezer .
    even if we accept the opinion of hakatan in the point that establishing a meluha is assur .
    Even if ESTABLISHING jewish meluha and rebelling against the nations is assur , who said EXISTENCE [once established be’issur] is prohibited ?
    Who said that once it exists , demolishing an existing metsi’ut is mandated ?
    .
    The above point is to be made BESIDES any possible consideration of pikuach nefesh.
    Even if there would be no chashash of p/n.
    .

  399. Finally tried to look up Avnei Nezer referred to above supposedly on Yore Dea Siman 454, didn’t find it. Went to look up the reference in Maamar Shalosh Shevuos Siman 34, it does refer to that siman. Dunno.

  400. Thank you for that avnei never
    It’s completely satmer hundred percent the pasuk from shir hashirim is for all galus
    What the Israeli army is doing now is only the issur of killing people it is not giving any security to Jews anyplace on earth the arabs are the majority of people there and they could easily make peace for Israel giving them another million votes from Jordan and that would mean we run out of Israel on boat fast cause that have the majority vote

  401. The avnei nezer says that a person that doesn’t listen to the shevuose he will not have shemira from hashem on his neshama and also about the swear of the angel when a person is born and he also talks about the mitzvah of living is Israel and his psak halocha is that of the grand satmer rabbi it’s never a good thing to kill people on earth especially when it will not bring any security

  402. @Yankal Berel,
    Digress is the word.
    Look, you’ve proven me right too many times so lets end it there if you may.
    You are looking at the story of the Chashmona’im through ‘nationalistic’ lenses, and therefor ‘understanding’, ‘seeing’ and ‘defining’ it as you do.
    If you’d look at it from a Torah perspective though, you’d understand it very differently, in fact the opposite from how you look at it.
    And saying or not saying tachnun/halel etc on 5 iyar is irrelevant and only evident of the intrinsic ignorance on the matter.
    saying tachnun (and maybe even selichot) and not halel is a outcome by-product of the whole topic, not a defining meter stick to know which ‘shita’ you belong to (as if we are talking about some football team lehavdil).

    You don’t need to listen to me, i am not your father, but there is no point in me repeating myself or even explaining further, when you’ve decided on what accuracy means, and distort mekoros to support this in order to “prove” your point. Neither will it, until you take off your ‘nationalism’ glasses off.
    I look at things from a Torah perspective unlike…
    so, kol tov

  403. @jewgut
    I also look from torah perspective . Difference is that I look at the source , learn it a few times . Deliberate BOTH options of understanding , Try without bias to put myself in the shoes of the Author and understand what his shitah really is .
    Learn the Avne nzer in this way and it is clear what his shita is .
    Btw you have not answered the Q about chashm …

    WHY DID THEY NOT HAVE TO TRANSFER THEIR MELUHA TO OTHER POWERS ????

    They had 2 Centuries to do so and never did ….

    And no one even discussed , asked , argued about the topic ….

  404. @jewgut
    they might have found a power who would let them their religious freedom .
    Did they even look for one ? Look for another power ?
    Negotiate ?
    Nope.

  406. @ any interested reader
    Will repeat a summary of Avne nezer’s words here
    You can look it up inside and see for yourself .
    He says the reason of Rambam omitting the oaths in his Yad , is because there is no issur hilchati whatsoever to transgress the oaths .
    Only that if a person feels like going against [or is going against] the oaths, it is merely a siman .
    It is a siman of either a disconnect between the persons guf and his neshama , or a disconnect between his neshama and HKBH.
    Which would result in a ‘lessening’ of hashgaha pratit toward that person[s] , (the true meaning of ‘hefker’)
    Which obviously should be rectified .
    Lav davka through adherence to the oaths .
    Rather Through added adherence to the torah as a whole, and / or teshuva .
    Which in turn would ‘reconnect’ him to his neshama and/or HKBH , which in turn would cause him stopping his going against the oaths , while said reconnection would ‘increase’ hasgaha pratit’ twards him .
    .
    So , bottom line , the so called satmar shitah is not “THE unanimously accepted torah position” as was pashut during all the previous dorot.
    Rather – It is one valid possibility of explaining hazal and halacha .
    There are other possible explanations .
    Like Avne nezer.
    In other words it is ‘a matter of dispute’ in halacha .

  407. One of the largest found in the war: the IDF uncovered a huge stockpile of weapons in the Gaza Strip | Documentation.
    In the activity of the combat team fighters of the 460th brigade of the 50th battalion, weapons were found near a clinic and a school in the northern Gaza Strip • The IDF spokeswoman stated that the stockpile contained hundreds of rockets and RPG launchers, dozens of anti-tank missiles, dozens of explosive charges, long-range missiles, dozens of grenades and unmanned aerial vehicles • The IDF added: This is further proof of Hamas’s cynical use of the residents of the Gaza Strip as a human shield
    Nir Dvori | N12 | Published 11:41 06.12.23

  408. Found the Avnei Nezer. Easiest way is to just go to TorahJews dot org, Resources section, Books section, Shuirim on Vayoel Moshe in English at the bottom, sources used in the shiurim at the bottom, Sources for Siman 34. When I went thru VaYoel Moshe with the shiurim on Vayoel Moshe there, which are really excellent, I was thinking of whether Shlomo ever took anything like an oath that would have been obligatory on the whole nation as his subjects, perhaps by oath if it is by oath the acceptance of obligation of a sovereign. I didn’t actually reread the relevant sections of Sefer Melachim and Divrei HaYamim, which may have been the right choice. But, I remembered the incident at inauguration of the Beis HaMikdash that there was a navua afterwards and sort of like a promise for what happens if breach of the Torah, sort of sounds like gazelles in the field, I realize that it’s really darshened out from Shir HaShirim, I’m saying Shir HaShirim seems like it’s alluding to a oath or obligation taken earlier. If I were to go thru again, I also would pay attention to whether any of Shlomo’s descendants ever ended up vassals of foreign sovereigns and rebelled against them and were suppressed or any similarity of language between the oaths in the gemara and those incidents. I think there is a similarity in Book of Ezra 4 if I remember correctly, tho later. It could be that anytime a sovereign of House of Dovid in duress accepts in oath, which is essentially usually historically like terms of conditional surrender, to another sovereign as a result of conquest under that foreign sovereign, such an oath would apply to all subjects of the sovereign. Makes me think of how the Japanese, owing allegiance to their Emperor, like automatically accepted the American occupation when their Emperor did so. Dunno. I would try to understand something that sounds like an oath taken historically in some event reported in Nach. There’s also the incident when they came to Shmuel originally pleading for a king, and Shmuel responds with the sort of servitude to expect from it (the description of which is uncannily similar to what ultimately occurred under Shlomo), so maybe specifically in that acceptance/assent to be subjects to a sovereign (whether starting from that occasion w Shmuel of acceptance or if a later occasion with Dovid) can be conceptualized as being subject to any agreement of that sovereign (or oath or bris, I think Mechilta uses the language if I remember correctly of a bris with Beis Dovid in particular), such that if the sovereign is obligated under oath that if that sovereign fails to fulfill his duties, if he loses territorial sovereignty and those subjects become like gazelles without the defense of a sovereign, they may thereby be bound to conditions subsequent to which the sovereign agreed. It might be operative by two different legal mechanisms, one that Yisroel took more like avdus or servitude in relation to a de jure sovereign with a royal family inheritance, and the oath really only concerns what that sovereign agreed as any condition subsequent if the sovereign ever breach duties and thereby lose territorial sovereignty, so it’s like Yisroel accepted Shlomo’s oath thru acceptance of subjugation to Malchus in Beis Dovid. Not sure. I would have to spend more time working out the idea, and it could be there’s not enough there, or that it’s too dochuk, but that’s the way my thinking was inclined when I went thru VaYoel Moshe. Anyway, you’d have to pay me to organize my thoughts better. I really don’t like the idea that neshamos took oaths. That’s really the point I wanted to make. In all due respect to the Avnei Nezer (cuz the issue definitely warrants consideration), I have trouble with this Avnei Nezer and might be inclined in my own direction that would take time and effort (and resources I don’t have) to hash out if it would turn out to have potential, not sure yet, so I’ll just put the idea out there in case someone else does have that. Also, I also am not holding yet in the Zohar, but I feel like I am overdue to go reread the more historical books in Nach. If there were known with absolutely certainty that there’s no one from Beis Dovid who could inherit the throne, I’d here an argument that it was discretionary and that if that royal family inheritance ends with no heir then it reverts back to what it was before Shmuel did minui melech, which arguable (as Shmuel argues) was a better arrangement, like just fending off defensively in any milchemes chova if necessary, like in Shoftim they’d assemble the militias when invaded, but otherwise just keeping Torah and submitting to din Torah if necessary. That seems preferable over subjugation to any sovereign. But, anyway, if it’s possible to clone from Beis Dovid, if DNA remains from the royal fam, would the clone would have a claim of royal inheritance? If so, I’d assume there exists an heir, so no reversion to the Shmuel ideal ever. Dunno.

  409. Anyway, I don’t know if the implication was lost above, but I’ll just say it here: I personally in my humble opinion believe that it would take a court of experts of everything (do we have one today?, rishonim matter less than all of chazal imo cuz weren’t rishonim in original smicha requirements) in excess of the number of students of Rebbi Akiva in order to overrule the binding precedent that there exists an obligation to endanger ones life to oppose a sovereign engaging in debellatio, irrespective of any oath, among other precedents. ש.מ.ד. If any recent gene therapy turns out a slow kill bioweapon, shas hashmad. I could hear the argument it’s shas hashmad. That’s been my understanding since at least 2016. Definitely hear that argument. Would it make sense to mored bamalchus if the melucha tried to get everyone vaxed out? Very serious shila.

  410. Even if there were to be a critical mass who recognize it’s a shas hashmad, what if the shmad looks justified tho? Like, what if I was doresh, choker, and shoel heitev, and the velt didn’t pass cuz it looked like everyone had done avoda zara, seemed very foreign and cultish with the Science cult, would it be then justified to support siege of what appears an ir nidachas? Maybe it’s reasonable for the unvaxed to support shmadding an ir nidachas?

    Cuz that’s honestly where I’m holding: I would be ready to be moser nefesh being mored bamalchus, but the more I think it over I actually support the shmad cuz it looks like they’re shmadding ir nidachas, also not sure thre ever could be effective an effective levée en masse to defend Yisroel anyway, and I don’t want to be targetted by the occupant sovereign either for anything subversive or seditious, so just best to stay out of harm’s way in hopes to inherit in the end. If the velt didn’t actually vax out, then I guess everything is okay. Did I miss a memo not having been in the velt? Was it all bemirma? Did people actually mess up their genes? I’m asking very seriously because I think I might be in the mourning stage of denial, and it actually does not register to me when I hear people claim they vaxed out. My mind immediately wonders whether they’re not part of a conspiracy and are just covering themselves.

  411. Did they ask any rabbi if what they are doing is correct and saves Jewish people the navi says that asking him is like a doctor but in Israel a doctor is like a murderer
    What do they think will happen
    The Gaza is a Palestine government that gives stipends on it’s wealth someone lost all his family he gets some explosives or a gun and kills people they shut Gaza gates no economy but Egypt smuggling and it’s terrorist again that want a true ethnicity of Palestine do they think it’s just going to get forgotten about all the billions in housing lost and destroyed cause they was wrong for killing people that kept them in a place cause they fear for they’re lives

  414. They aren’t protecting any Jewish people it’s only getting worse if they was serious to save us there would be thousands of dead in the army cause they won’t kill civilians countries are saying that you have to fight war and not just bomb buildings from planes not knowing if you’re crushing innocent people to death this act of cowards can’t face battle with people Israel is not doing a single thing that will stop Hamas even if they kill every last person on pay stipends and homes there revenge for families smothered and Islam will make a terrorist that will close the Gaza gates that bring starvation to them and a tunnel with weaponry and freedom fighters
    If Lakewood NJ township had three times as many people and you was not allowed to leave for all your life that is something like what it is to live in Gaza this means never allowed to go to Howell or Jackson and there is many more people and you’re fenced in they will kill you if get close to zone and you want business and tourism and college but you’re only terrorist to a Egypt government that won’t rescue you and either would Russia and it is on your heritage land

  416. Wonder if after the war Israel will agree to buy gas from the uae so they can pay to rebuild the homes of civilians or if they won’t do that and purchase gas from other political places not giving a dime to the innocent

  417. Indeed, it could be said that . holds like Rebbi Nosson in Sifrei BaMidbar: “‘And they warred against Midian’: They surrounded it from four sides. R. Nathan says: They left a fourth side for them to flee from.” The Rambam brings the midrash lehalacha: “When a siege is placed around a city to conquer it, it should not be surrounded on all four sides, only on three. A place should be left for the inhabitants to flee and for all those who desire, to escape with their lives.” There should be a place left for them to flee. Perhaps more funding should be allocated towards the establishment of non-profits like Nefesh B’Nefesh but to help Gazans afford to leave? It’s actually a pretty easy sell to most Arabs, the idea of taking funds to go colonize another part of the world. Totally can be pitched in a way that appeals to them.

  418. Also says in the Art of War “When you surround an army, leave an outlet free.” Wanted to say perhaps Sun Tzu was holding in Rebbi Nosson, but Sun Tzu preceded him.

  419. Carl von Clausewitz held similarly “The risk of having to fight on two sides, and the still more dangerous position of having no line of retreat left open, paralyse the movements and the power of resistance; further, in case of defeat, they increase the loss, often raising it to its extreme point, that is, to destruction.” It seems a like of great military minds thought so. Well, anyway, if I had to guess, the aim in Gaza is not for a strategic victory but rather to drag out conflict endlessly in an expensive mess.

  422. @”.”
    They won’t, but do you really think they care an iota about civilians?
    There are too many “accidential coincidents” that begs the questions how and why:
    1) They at civilians at the nova tumah party [yes you can answer this one, but as the gemoro says, shalosh pa’amim chazaka, and too many you can’t).

    2) The soldiers were told not to fire.

    3) Cameras along the fence that day were off and not working.

    4) The Generals were ALL on holiday in Elat, and even when told, didn’t IMMEDIATELY get up and go back, it took at the best HOURS AND HOURS, and

    5) Why their response took so long.

    6) They chose to ignore their own intelligence that warned them of this.

    7) They ignored intelligence from other countries (e.g. Egypt etc).

    8) They took away the right from residents in that area to hold guns in their house.

    9) They ignored the abnormal activity and paragliding sessions at the border.

    10) They also ignored the warnings from within about the above (9).

    And much much more.
    It g=begs the question, WHAT IS THE TRUTH??

  423. Longtime Israel-basher AKA Sari Bashi, who continues racist-Arab Omar Skakir tradition at HRW was asked on CNN (12 27.23), as two kids were among adults arrested by IDF: ‘What does it say about Hamas using human shields?

    The “objective” Sari Bashi ignored that important human crime but focused on bashing Israel and played as if she doesn’t know why Hamas suspected terroriss are stripped of clothes to check for weapons.

  424. Actually, nevermind, Carl recommends to sieze the line of retreat of the enemy. You could say it’s a machlokes Carl against Rebbi Nosson and Sun Tzu.

  425. Nevermind, maybe it’s not a machlokes. You could make a chiluk (and okimta?). Perhaps Carl is advising in a case of having the enemy surrounded and possessing a strategic advantage that enables eliminating the enemy at limited casualty rate to one’s own side, whereas Rebbi Nosson and Sun Tzu advised against surrounding the enemy without retreat in a case (really based in historical circumstances and military technology available then that did not afford a general strategic advantage, and surrounding an enemy then might have meant they defend far better) that one’s side lacked a strategic advantage of eliminating the enemy at limited casualty rate to one’s own side. IDF casualties are limited due to the relative technological strategic advantage. So, maybe in such a scenario of strategic advantage even Rebbi Nosson and Sun Tzu would support surrounding the enemy from all sides. Anyway, re casualty rates, really, it would appear far more have died from the vax jabs, actual military countermeasures, than in Gaza. Plus, who knows what propoganda comes out of a war zone is real, right? Like, I won’t believe in white phosphorus till I’ve seen it with my own eyes, and I hope I never do, you know? Anyway, I need to think more about the Rambam and Rebbi Nosson. The Rambam takes the Sifrei in a unique direction in his psak. Why does he reject the opinion of the chachamim? Maybe Rebbi Nosson would limit his concept to the case of a war against Midian? Also, would it make sense maybe to put chachamim in the category that it makes sense to lay siege and not leave an enemy a retreat? They hold in Sifrei BaMidbar ‘”And they warred against Midian”: They surrounded it from four sides.” So, really, I would say it’s a machlokes Carl von Clausewitz and the chachamim against Rebbi Nosson, the Rambam, and Sun Tzu, but maybe through an okimta/chiluk imo it could be suggested that all might agree to lay siege “from all sides” if there’s a strategic advantage.

  426. When the yiden suffered from the communist everybody said it was them not us and till no end we still have no repentance from them and they from the katonist till the ghetto and the rabbi that says of the simplistic mitzvah to fight protecting Jewish people the gates of heaven but this I say do not care what anybody says “haomrim shalom” when frum yiden of torah walk on the har habayis with all the blood its “af ani bchamas kayre” the karbonos will not stop and I know everybody says but thats them not me why should we suffer but the sad thing is that we do and it is because man see the face but God the heart if the rabbi wouldn’t say they was anti semite

  427. “derech eretz kodmah latora”
    This means every philosopher has to ask the reasoning of his actions like when chabad keep looking at the Rebbe red cushion chair what are you trying to say? And you keep on saying it like don’t know what is it that moshiach came already
    When the Zionist rabbi says like Hitler simple you die in war go to heaven what is he trying to say is it that we have no Jewish people without this army of znus and arrogance
    When they say that he died for the mitzvah of living in Israel does he mean to say that “vchai bahem” is not possible and that now the goyim will only kill us so hashem made a new mitzvah to say your fighting for life
    But this I just don’t know when people with peyos and beards go and walk on the har habayis with the biggest brezenouse and complete face in front of millions of arabs and all the world that knows its the worst thing you can do in the torah and that it is against the Jewish religion to do and that they must bring karbonos and that it is a place of Islam where these frightened people need big security not cause anybody is doing anything but only they are cowards what are they trying to say is it something bad about God

  428. When I learned the sugiya in Kesubos about the oaths, the bit about gazelles honestly sounds like fun. I personally would enjoy it if things turned ugly. Would make life exciting. Best not to count on any man to protect you anyway. The mention of gazelle honestly makes me hungry. They used to chase gazelles in the field for food. Really and truly, it would be a shame to go through life without even knowing what gazelle steak tastes like. That would be horrible. I would even more regret it never to taste tachash or levioson steaks. In response to . above, any Yid who has an urge to go onto Har HaBayis should channel his urge into a more appropriate avenue, like maybe take up a new skill or hobby of shechita, cuz the fact of the matter is magav won’t allow anyone to do shechita there even if there were some Cohanim ready, and if you’re really concerned about the cuts being as H’ prescribed, apparently you will need to slaughter elsewhere. You ought to learn how to shecht your own basically cuz that’s like a pretty valuable skill in life. If they cut the supply chains in Yisroel you might be feeding on pigeons, who knows. Makes sense to be able to homestead. Think about how much time each ben habayis had to learn shechita originally, like not even a full month. You may as well at some point just go buy a goat with its genitals still in tact (not castrated) from an Arab, and if you want a nice location, go to Shilo in the field with the parameters that are correct that the tour guides consider the spot for Shilo, and do a shechita there. I right now have a freezer full of venison. I like this deer meat. Wish I could offer korbanos properly. I truly wonder if it wouldn’t be an issue halachically to burn some up (alst the tzad bamos are permitted, then as a nedava, otherwise just stam burnt, maybe offered al tanai). Worst that happens is H’ receives a gift in shomayim H’ wasn’t expecting? It wouldn’t necessarily mebazeh all things considered, if I’m wrong let me know. I would like to eat a peacock too. I need to order some peacock eggs to test my new incubator. I once saw a wild one walking around near Kever Yishai in Chevron, it might have wandered in from Area A, no joke. Had I known then that they were kosher, and had I trained appropriately. I really and truly believe the skill of shechita should be so widely dispersed and mastered in Yisroel that every head of household should be capable of it. More important than walking on Herodian stones laid there by Jewish slaves that honestly aren’t mortared to the ground below them and may have been dedicated to Jupiter or Saturn, so perhaps there’s an issur hanaah atop them now? No joke. Is it permitted to do mitzvos standing on idolatrous stones? Best not to infer the reasons for mitzvos, but perhaps a reason for the regalim was in part so that Yiddin could see how the Cohanim did a proper shechita and could mimick it in their own homes year round back when they didn’t have industrial shechita operations and grocery stores and Yiddin weren’t trained to be skillless consumers at risk if supply of consumables gets disrupted. Anyway, if that was an essential purpose of the Bayis, then perhaps it makes sense to pursue well just general dispersal of the skill most vital to the avoda, which is, indeed, it is shechita. It’s really the only semicha in practice today that matters anyway. It’s not worth risking an encounter with magav to visit that site if intending to attempt a mitzva. Literally, if you step in the wrong place there notwithstanding the best of intentions, they still can wisk you to the Russian Compoun for an enhanced interrogation that is indeed tantamount to torture. Stay out of harm’s way. Don’t potentially cause a ruckus on Har HaBayis. Take up scubadiving and shechita instead.

  429. Also, it may have been a bit too deep in implication, so I’ll just say it: dispersal of skills like shechita helps ensure that any breach of oaths, if occuring today or tomorrow, won’t result in “gazelles” simply chased down. If all Yisroel were holding in shechita and serious about it, not sure there’d be gazelles then even worst case. It’s a very valuable skill. I once considered the possibilty that malaach hamaves in Mitzrayim was actually from among bnei Yisroel, the ones who did the best cuts on the korbanos Pesch who then might have went on to work the night shift in shlichus for H’ visiting the neighbors. If so, perhaps it is a sod in the Torah, and perhaps preservation of the tradition once served a national security purpose sort of like drilling. Could consider the same possibility in other mitzvos with prioritization with the drill to bake bread asap as if you’d need to flee your residence or with the drill to bulid a makeshift structure as if you already fled. But, again, if all the purposes for these mitzvos were meant to be more explicit, the Torah presumably would be. Perhaps it’s best if these were among reasons for those mitzvos that they aren’t explicit. There are other valuable skills too.

  430. Also,I would like to share an insight from while processing the deer in my kitchen and I needed to walk into my room, my hands were bloody, and I accidentally smeared blood on the door entering. After noticing, I left the blood because it was really something neat to look at. Very eerie and intimidating and jarring, the blood on the doorpost, macabre if you will, sort of like how Manson Fam writings in blood on the wall once shocked the American public. Like, entering a room with blood on the door, you’re really sort of hit with a seriousness, like it’s a very serious place you’re about to enter, a place of killing, a place of war, not necessarily the place of a peaceful, civil society. I wonder if there’s not a connection between the doorposts and malaach hamaves not only that malaach hamaves knew not to enter the house of Yisroel but perhaps also that if Mitzrim with blood boiling from the fate of their bachorim sought revenge, if they approached a house with blood on the door, they might lose their motive and chicken out or assume the residents already had been slaughtered out of fear. It may have well served as an indication beyond any reasonable doubt like the light of the sun that the niceties and the semblance of the previous social order had ended.

  433. If I had some free time, I might review chapter 6 section 14 of the DoD Law of War Manual on incendiary weapon. I think I remember it makes sense to use at night to light the sky or something. Dunno. Gotta go now.

  434. After the Holocaust some people said it was the last galus cause it was so bad and we are going to meshiach and that we see this from our merit in having these children but all of this are judgement of the wicked

  435. The state of Israel is now in very great danger and it’s not from military strength but the miracles that happened till now before the war also much Torah and frum yiden but it happened to them and not America and this is that man see the face God the heart

  436. I think it makes sense to breed gazelles. For food. Also ibexes. I think theres’s room for like high end rare kosher mammals. I’m just not sure how to approach the logistics. Some issues.

  437. @GD bless (not going to address the rest of your posting name cause I feel it’s degrading to have that in same posting name as GD bless…) I agree with you that something is behind the deliberate ignoring of intelligence info and deliberate withholding of response to the terrorists and everything in between that happened leading up to and on Oct 7.

    I have a theory why they acted this way but I will not write it as I don’t actually have proof to back my theory.

  438. Israel and America have one goal of secularism that’s all they are interested in if not the Holocaust there would be no state they see the country as some security from that but ultimately it’s anti religious
    With shalom the uae and arabia we don’t have dependency on america and considered alone the political gains of influence is gone as countries from Russia to China are in the picture the religious society is taking the social realm and they don’t respect the army ideals thus they let the arabs come something that was known would happen and this made a war for the elite of the country to have that American dependency you can see this how they use kidnapped people as the politics countries

  439. I don’t know if I understand any of this correctly, but I think the relationship with Saudia Arabia always has been kind of odd, starting with British choosing who replaced the Ottoman Empire there and continuing to the US. Like, petrodollar now has value cuz US military provided defense for strategic oil resources there. Saudis were kind of like paying off the mob for protection? Now they no longer want to pay off the mob for protection? Dunno if that’s the right attitude. Iraq once had a regime change cuz they attempted to transact oil in a currency besides USD. Also, would seem the intelligence community probably have some of the Saudi leadership blackmailed in the standard demoralizing abominable stuff, which is an assumption, and I should correct it if I’m wrong, but that’s sort of their general practice, and if so, it really doesn’t fit for a Muslim state, so it’s a bit strained I guess. I think the Western subversion and normalization and demoralization influence that goes hand in hand with cultural influences might be a pendullum that swung a bit too far for the Saudis. Makes sense they would switch to different currency besides USD the moment it seemed the Amerikan empire is waning. Dunno. I suspect lots at the BIS gets planned in major currency trends and staging of international relations, but again I dunno.

  440. Being Jewish is not necessarily only a good thing sometimes it’s a responsibility the galus is not that everything is bad sometimes it’s good and them we think nothing is relative to us and start judging like we are God and but only them there is something relavint to the blessings of Jacob

  441. We live in a life of so much luxury and it stops people from seeing the truth it’s like the luxury in itself is only that people won’t see the real truth this even gets some rabbis that preach things to there masses as to the money but don’t have any thing truth

  442. To say I believe only in God as saving us from goyim
    To say I believe only in God and that’s why I made an army with supposedly does save us from the goyim

  443. Radical Islamist bigotry in South Africa influence

    At Swords of Iron: Outcry over Hamas visit to South Africa. The population is generally supportive of Israel but intimidated by a loud radicalized Muslim community.” Representatives of Hezbollah, Palestine Islamic Jihad, and the Palestine Liberation Organisation were also present.

    In addition, “South Africa’s foreign policy is stuck in the 1960s Cold War with deep ideological revolutionary attachments to the oppressive regimes of Cuba, Venezuela, Iran and Palestine. Although claiming to support a two-state solution, for the South African government, Israel is a colonial manifestation of Western imperialism.”

    Adding to all that, “South Africa has a substantial array of domestic challenges and many believe that focusing on Israel’s war with Hamas proves a convenient distraction.’ 

    It led to SA arguing a fake-genocide “case” against Israel – who is fighting a regime that uses its civilians to make sure they die in their war on Israeli civilians. Anti-Israel case backed by almost only Islamic nations. (Plot is to put, push a non-lslamic face in the front).

  446. I posted this the other day and it was honored…..I no longer will hold a grudge on anyone who is the midst of understanding what it is to be a jew….shame on all of. us….STOP IT NOW…PLEASE….this is them winning….yes, we are stiff necked, and I love it…….please BEHAVE

    Your comment is awaiting moderation
    Destroy it….don’t ask us any questions as we don’t know…..we in Israel are Toraha Jews….this is Hashems’ war we know nothing we are but children in fear of our world not our lives nor our heart. which is glued to the walls of our world the Holy City and the dancing Torahs, have you forgotten this , have you forgotten we know nothing and we must ask , have you forgotten who the child you were blessed to be is “YOU”….please know we are in the right place at the right time 2024 Iron Age, 2024 today…….our AGE, HASHEM’S blossoming truth of Moshiach…..216 years till 6000, open your heart, open mine, lets open all our doors and avenues and bring all our children home ….all our souls are crying and wondering the streets of the Rova…..bring them home with true prayers….ONE TURE ONE NEEDED from one true soul is all that is needed…..I bless you all of you and yes I am angry at your lefts ideas but I know you must jump over these trials and end up in the softest of all journeys that bring you home..please my dear and beloved Israeli’s make this Rosh Chodesh the one that brings home all OUR SOULS…..WE ARE ALL LOST…..I AM WILLING TO BE FOUND….ARE YOU?
    tzedikis
    January 11, 2024 2:47 am at 2:47 am
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    I wrote this quite disjointed and all I guess I want to say is be safe, be loved and know that we are the only heroes with two names…..we have Hebrew Letters……we have more than this world and hold onto it…..as you know how from biblical cries……they want your soul…wrote this in YWN

  447. I would like to eat a piece of organic blue cheese made from raw whale milk harvested using a submarine drone that attaches to the whale utter and fills a bag that floats to the surface of the water.

  448. Participating in the Grindadráp, the traditional whale hunt in the Faroe Islands, is regulated and requires specific authorization. Participants must attend a two-hour class held by a local veterinarian and obtain a license. This class teaches the use of the mønustingari, a Faroese whale-shechita knife. The grind can happen at any time when a pod of whales is spotted, and it is not a commercially organized event but a community-based activity. If I had the resources, I would infiltrate the community to get the closest thing to semicha in whale shechita. I am willing to learn Norwegian and to become an expert in Nordic history and whatever it takes for the whale meat and leather.

  450. PSYCHOANALYSIS
    a related group of emotionally significant ideas that are completely or partly repressed and that cause psychic conflict leading to abnormal mental states or behavior.

  451. It is my sincere hope someday soon to drink a late made with kosher whale milk that is chalav Yisroel. The affluent would pay a lot for such a drink, and expenses seem minimal, compared to a dairy farm. I need to patent the devise. I doubt the FDA would approve whale milk. Ayway, Rav Moshe taught it is possible to rely on the FDA for no pig milk in the cow milk. Perhaps it could be reasoned the FDA does provide Jewish supervision, as if Scott Gottleib (or whoever was his principal or whoever suceeded them) employed avadim/agents to supervise to ensure regulatory compliance of no pig milk. Dunno. Anyway, I too trust the FDA. I trust them to pursue effectively the depopulation policies of the occupant. Like, if there were a milchemes mitzva lemautei nochrim, then Scott must have mitzva points off the charts. Seeing as how I interpret this as a primary purpose for this federal agency, it would hardly bother me to drink a dairy product that lacked their approval, such as raw milk from whale. Anyway, I should hesitate to say “occupant” because truth be told I’m still hashing out my opinion. I’m stuck trying to sort out whether to relate to the central banks as de jure sovereigns, as if for instance the United States legally effectuated through ratification of the legislation that created the Federal Reserve a cession of limited sovereignty to the Federal Reserve, or whether the Federal Reserve is a de facto occupant. There is an interesting section in Grotius that discusses what distinguishes a sovereign from something like a gang of bandits, forgot the term used in my translation of Grotius, but it would help to locate the section again and pay attention to his sources. If I reviewed that, it might inform my understanding on how to relate to central banks. Dunno. Grotius is interesting because he apparently learned Rambam. He also appears to have been holding in Josephus. Leo Strauss gave an interesting seminar on Grotius at U Chicago, its transcript is available thru Library Genesis. The foundations of public international law are important and in my mind should not be categorized as sefarim chitzoniim / “Apikorus” philosophy. For one, a Beis Din obvi can take judicial notice of foreign laws cuz there are rules about it in chazal and the Rambam, sort of like permitted arbitration in choice of laws according to their laws. Goyim can come for arbitration before Beis Din. Also might have national security implications lehalacha, for whether some relevant actions in some relevant circumstances might constitute breach of any oath if obligatory mentioned in Kesubos like being mored bamalchus if relevant (not if cession?). Anyway, I am starting to think that criticism of the Federal Reserve might be something like being mored bamalchus Yisroel and thereby strictly prohibited lehalacha, but it really depends on how to understand something Grotius discusses that I probably should review.

  452. It is my sincere hope to drink a late made with kosher whale milk that is chalav Yisroel. The affluent would pay a lot for such a drink, and expenses seem minimal, compared to a dairy farm. I need to patent the devise. I doubt the FDA would approve whale milk. Ayway, Rav Moshe taught it is possible to rely on the FDA for no pig milk in the cow milk. Perhaps it could be reasoned the FDA does provide Jewish supervision, as if Scott Gottleib (or whoever was his principal or whoever suceeded them) employed avadim/agents to supervise to ensure regulatory compliance of no pig milk. Dunno. Anyway, I too trust the FDA. I trust them to pursue effectively the depopulation policies of the occupant. Like, if there were what Rabba suggests is at machlokes in a Mishnah in Sota, milchemes mitzva lemautei nochrim, then Scott must have mitzva points off the charts, seroiusly, but if so, I could hear an argument that is a sod prohibited from publicizing according to an oath in Kesubos. Seeing as how I interpret this as a primary purpose for this federal agency, it would hardly bother me to drink a dairy product that lacked their approval, such as raw milk from whale. Anyway, I should hesitate to say “occupant” because truth be told I’m still hashing out my opinion. I’m stuck trying to sort out whether to relate to the central banks as de jure sovereigns, as if for instance the United States legally effectuated through ratification of the legislation that created the Federal Reserve a cession of limited sovereignty to the Federal Reserve, or whether the Federal Reserve is a de facto occupant. There is an interesting section in Grotius that discusses what distinguishes a sovereign from something like a gang of bandits, forgot the term used in my translation of Grotius, but it would help to locate the section again and pay attention to his sources. If I reviewed that, it might inform my understanding on how to relate to central banks. Dunno. Grotius is interesting because he apparently learned Rambam. He also appears to have been holding in Josephus. Leo Strauss gave an interesting seminar on Grotius at U Chicago, its transcript is available thru Library Genesis. Public international law, including its foundations, are important and in my mind should not be categorized as sefarim chitzoniim / “Apikorus” philosophy. For one, a Beis Din obvi can take judicial notice of foreign laws cuz there are rules about it in chazal and the Rambam, sort of like permitted arbitration in choice of laws according to their laws. Goyim can come for arbitration or mediation from Beis Din or a Rav. Also might have national security implications lehalacha, also whether some relevant actions in some relevant circumstances might constitute breach of any oath if obligatory mentioned in Kesubos like being mored bamalchus if relevant (not if cession?). Anyway, I am starting to think that criticism of the Federal Reserve might be something like being mored bamalchus Yisroel and thereby strictly prohibited lehalacha, but it really depends on how to understand something Grotius discusses that I probably should review.

  456. The rants might be coherent. The whale might be an allegory for the Federal Reserve. Milking might be collecting from their racket. War might be a fake excuse for states to kick the can down the road and for the central banksters who control them to print more moneys. Kashrus of whale is allegory for the question of the kashrus of the Fed or the legality of its control of states. Anyway, at least this rant is more coherent than the fake war narrative.

  457. Just joking. No allegory. I hate allegory. Allegory is what you use when you’re living under something like a Romanisch occupation and need to speak about the occupant covertly without getting targetted. Like a lot of discussion of Edom in Midrash. We need not worry about such a regime, BH. No, I’m actually just underweight cuz food got too expensive, so I started to think about kosher methods of hunting, and then whale came to mind, then the idea of milking rather than shechita. True story. If the whale was allegory for the Fed, I only thought of that afterwards.

  458. Leo Strauss also gave a nice seminar on the Leviathan. I recently went thru Moby Dick, which a Rav teaching schita in the shtachim years ago recommended to me. My fav part was on processing the whale, reads like they were surrounded by whale, reminds me of Yonah, except in Melville the whale is dead. Milking seems a lot cleaner. Anyway, back to the Federal Reserve. I also went thru The Creature from Jekyll Island not too long ago. It brought back memories for me when I was a captive of a public school in Georgia for half of the 8th grade, we had mandatory Georgia history indoctrination class. They took us captives on a field trip to Jekyll Island. We learned a lot about the history of the place, tho no mention of the Federal Reserve. Funny in retrospect.

  462. Actually, I have work I should be doing now. If the banksters want more positive reviews, they need to line my pockets so that I have the free time to praise them.

  464. My sincere apologies to those will be insulted from my forthcoming comments. Enough of the negativity, criticism of things the majority have no clue about. Politics, military matters. Our position as Torah Yidden is to support unconditionally no matter what is going on. Our tefilos are so important now more than ever before. Let us show a huge support for this cause. Rabbi Brudny spoke so eloquently last night in Flatbush. Let’s do our part, daven from the heart. There is a crisis happening here right now. Support however you can, tefilos,monetary etc. War is not pretty, I was privileged to partake in one of the many in Israel Today one of my children is on the front lines. This is very scary. I daven for him and all the Chayalim to be safe and come back soon Im Yirtze H-shem. Please again keep comments positive & supportive. It’s really not that difficult if you try.
    שבת שלום ומבורך. שלום בעולם

  465. Yes, thanks for that Uncle Ben. You know, sometimes I cannot help but to wonder if the Atlanta community rescued shavuim nimsarim whether I might not have faired better in my career.

  467. Despair is unproductive. Positivity in unwarranted circumstances is confusing, perhaps deceptive if one already understands these things. Criticism has become so warranted yet unexpressed todday that the joke of ignoring the elephant in the room itself has become part of the zeitgeist, memorialized by, e.g., the meme of a guy’s house burning while he pretends all is well. By my own admission publication of some of what I criticize arguably is strictly prohibited lehalacha. And, in practice, whether explicated as obligatory in Jewish law, those are the same things have been kept on the downlow for a long time. I am not trying to raise awareness about the issues with specfic intent to jepoardize the good-times party. I like good times too. Rather, I am raising awareness of the fact that the issues that will jepoardize the good-times party already are being raised, not necessarily even by me, but by others. It appears a ticking-time bomb. The ripple will be felt even in the velt I anticipate. Imo Yiddin ought to prepare perfectly well for that or any contingency that warrants reasonable apprehension and not feign ignorance this time if permitted prepping, though covert prep, which honestly to the wise appears advised in the Torah anyway. If you’re a head of household Yid, you ought to obtain what your 2nd Amend permits. You ought to be prepared to flee on a moment’s notice with sufficient provisions to survive. You ought to possess the entire skill sets prerequisite to homestead in compelte self-sufficiency, without any foreign reliance, which is a vulnerability. Honestly, more Yiddin w resources should find ways of entry into sailing, maybe start some Jewish yacht clubs. The ease of mobility is nice, may reduce some angst. Sorry to hear if you reject the opinion that tachash is kosher, your loss if so. That’s all my opinion.

  468. Also, mini drones can make for a kewl gift. Also, white phosphorus imo is like any commodity, e.g., like precious metals, ammo, etc. Materiel should be acquired for investment purposes imo.

  469. Also, worth looking into, another investment recommendation is collectibles sold at gun shows by private vendors in certain states to residents of those states that don’t have any fed or state registration requirements in exchange for cash, good collectible investments, no overhead in registration expenses, good week.

  470. If I was lied to about Jewish communities vaxing out when they didn’t, and if I spent years of my life in isolation as a result of fear of their shedding that was unjustified, the Jews who used deception or intimidation against me to result in my isolation, like Broyde in Israel in 2019, I would like a remedy for that damage. Any assistance, especially what facilitates my integration and rehabilitation into a proper community and helps me to catch up for years wasted without career development, that would be appreciated. The way you throw your own victims under the bus.

  471. Amazing how so many people openly criticize the situation in Israel. Our job is unconditional support without judgement. It is really easy. For all you holy than thou naysayers, please be positive. This is indeed a difficult time in the holyland without additional rhetoric. It appears so many of you are seriously bored. Get a life by contributing positively to the human race. While most of you will be offended by my comments. No problem, sometimes people need more subtle reminders about the negative speech,outcries etc. Am Yisroel needs our love and support, not bashing/critisizing.

  472. Israel the strongest army in the world on the sewage Gaza with four hundred sophisticated aircraft and planes yet is Hamas can smuggle in two thousands anti aircraft missiles Israel doesn’t stand a chance

  473. Springbok is right, I will try to avoid comments about some petty disgusting deceptive manipulative spookish handler excuse for a Torah scholar that exploits the crown of Torah while hired by goyish institutions like Emory for six figures to enlighten the whole world about how the Torah indeed provides support for trans bathrooms or something (just Google: “Transgender bathroom issue: a solution?”), handler that ruined my life in Yisroel with latent implied threats of harm against me in 2018 for trying to discuss the torture I witnessed first-hand of Yiddin there, this guy literally got paid by the US State Department to help, among other things, keep silence about very serious incidents of torture committed in facilities in Israel, which has continued since, continuing on closed facilities perpetrated against frum Yiddin. Fum Yiddin got electrocuted in the head since 2018, that could have been prevented if not for slobs like Broyde getting in the way to collect their share to eat more slob, while I got hungry and my brain attrophied from isolation. I think he implicated himself in breach of the Rome Statute in territory where it indeed was ratified, probably should be handed to the Hague eventually with the rest, no halachic prohibition against being moser a moser. Criticism is not even beginning to approach a solution to this problem.

  476. Were not bashing israel were just saying zionist are disgusting ricious people who made millions of jews in israel not frum
    when thousand of yeminte jews came to israel the zionist made them cut off their peyos
    and eventually with the zionisim ideology most became non frum rl
    the idf is not bringing moshiach r dov landau told general army who asked him why bochurim in israel dont go to the army he responded the arabs are here because of you
    and the proof to that is that tifrach yeshiva a very choshuve yeshiva wich is in southern israel
    right near where many jews got killed there was a regular simchas torah no one knew anything and no one in the yeshiva got injured

  478. If I learned in Chevron Yeshiva, I would befriend the neighbors in Emek Tzevaim and learn shechita in case food ever got scarse.

  479. I was supposed to start a job in capital markets at FBC & Co in March 2016 but instead was made victim of war crimes. I am capable or at least was before injuries. Can any Yiddin help out, tzaddaka? A belated request from one who was much in need.

  480. To philosophize on the nissayon of our days what is Jewishness is it only a asset or is it a responsibility if indeed there is oneness in the nation of Israel then that means it has to give ability to bring dreams to fruition and not only bring wealth and fame to a popular few that’s is there is only drop of gods oneness but is seems that it is only a fashion of lust even the Torah isn’t for the life after death rather for a culture not focused on the true purity of the Reich as if we all die after some of the sugar and then the pain if it was worth it cause only those that respect can gain from the light of it but true self perfection is gone from all humans even if he can contimplate not liking chocolate the truth of gods existence as the only honor and pleasure and judge and punisher is a forgotten existence never to stop crying about the Holocaust dead to deny that God was the life giver and the pain of the children that has no evidence in the measure but God can not have any reason yet we still have reason to deny he is the giver of life and the only saver from slavery let it be said in heaven as much they say that Jews are one and the life alive no matter what the logic that to the contrary they would sell the one live given for torah Reich culture for one group of people where ethnicity is only an asset is a group of people that have no safe home or truths of lifes realty

  481. If you were the only person you knew who knew about closed facilities on which Yiddin apparently get tortured (and the appearance appeared as real as rotten teeth, so reasonable doubt whether it was the Israeli perhaps Shin Bet version of a KUBARK interrogation method of using deception to intimidate a captive into cooperation by exposing to an ostensible worse victim who failed to cooperate), the only other people with actual notice of what occurs on this closed facility were either implicated in serious torts crimes and war crimes or had themselves been mentally incapacitated, so you were the only person you reasonably presume in a position to stop the torture, which looked unbearable to you, but when you tried to raise awareness in 2018 you were literally said something that by implication made you have a reasonable apprehension of imminent harm of detainment under false pretenses potentially exposing you to such torture yourself, what would you do? If you keep your mouth shut for years, you feel horrible guilt. You can tell yourself that it’s out of your control, but that rationalization does not stop the guilt. If you open your mouth, you literally feel unsafe, you have reason to fear another threat (someone might say again about you, “you’re not well”, like I heard Broyde say to me in 2018 while he was visiting territory under occupation where war crimes occur). What would you do with that guilt? Would you open your mouth? It’s tough to live with that guilt.

  482. Elhanan Groner @elchangr:
    This is how the “settler violence” libel works: this morning Sigal Shukron and Adi Cohen from the extreme leftist organization “Looking the occupation in the eye” came to the entrances of Jericho and harassed a Jewish shepherd. The R’ of the settlement arrived (within the jurisdiction of the settlement). They filmed a calm conversation with him and the anarchist Guy Hirschfeld is already putting up a post that is on the way to sanctions…
    (02.13.24)

    ___

    HADDAD CONFRONTS HAARETZISM:

    The Israeli advocacy activist Yosef Haddad is often interviewed by foreign media for the sake of explaining Israel, but he never imagined that another Israeli would be on the air and he would claim that israel wants to destroy [sic] the palestinian people. “This is what happened when I was an Israeli Arab and found myself in a confrontation in the foreign media with Jonathan Pollak,” shared Haddad, “an anarchist who lives among us and works for Haaretz newspaper. while he defames the state of Israel and speaks like the last of the hamas terrorists.”

    Pollak, who went on air, is a political-social activist who belongs to the radical left, one of the founders of “anarchists against fences” and in 2021 he was even convicted of obstructing a police officer while performing his duty and was sentenced to a month in prison. “I think we must not fall for Israeli propaganda,” said the Haaretz employee and claimed: “the sole purpose of this war, simply put, is to destroy [sic] the palestinian people. in some places, over 70 percent of the buildings were damaged, and what i
    Israel is doing in the gaza strip is nothing but g…e”.

    Haddad could not hear these delusional claims, and replied: “of the 26,000-27,000 Palestinians who were killed as a result of the Hamas invasion of Israel, there are over 10,000 terrorists from the terrorist organization Hamas-daesh [Hamas-ISIS] who were killed. why is this relevant and why is this number important? because it speaks of the relationship, and the relationship it is that every terrorist that Israel has eliminated – there are only two apparently innocent palestinians who were killed.” Haddad asked: “why is this important?”, and immediately explained.

    “Because the average international ratio is one to 10 and we are talking about all this when the conditions of the war are unfair. now, he is talking about the destruction of 70% of the buildings in Gaza, perhaps Jonathan should tell everyone that all these buildings lead to terror tunnels from which Hamas cowardly rises and launches missiles towards idf. if we don’t put pressure on Hamas along the way and eliminate and destroy this terrorist organization, what you saw on October 7 will be much worse in the future.”

    “Because if Hamas is not destroyed, they will remain the authority in the Gaza strip,” Haddad explained, “their principles are to continue attacking Israel and they have already said that to the world. They themselves have said that they want to do October 7 again and again and again.” Finally he attacked the radical left activist again: “but what Jonathan doesn’t tell you is that he is a free man because he actually lives in a Democratic country.”

    “Because if Yonatan were to speak like this, in the way he speaks about his country, if he were to speak like this in Gaza against Hamas – he would be in prison at best, or underground or hanging in a Gaza square at worst,” Haddad reminded, “this is the hypocrisy of man this”. Finally, he said to the interviewer: “And by the way, when he talks about all the buildings that the Israeli army attacks, the army hits them because they endanger Israel,” and addressed the message to Pollak: “and they also endanger you, moron!”

  483. It’s a no win game either there is a terrorist government in the Gaza or they become Israel citizens and live freely like everybody else not in a refugee camp for the next fifty years Israel itself doesn’t want them to become citizens it let in hundred thousand of goyim to keep the majority status of the country

  484. It still looks like it’s only coming from Iran and they can’t fight a good war with Israel but after they start bombing rafah there is Egypt and Libya Arab nations that may say it isn’t anti semitic to stop the ships and weapons supply till there is a Palestine state or Israeli citizenship

  485. Nukes in space was the news lately about Russians putting them in space then the American gov says that it’s not going to harm people only satellite from hearing the news it seems like everybody knows about using lasers which was at first thought to be harmless to man cause it can’t reach earth only space satellite but it seems that so isn’t true the Russians actually had to use this kind of nukes to blow up satellites meaning kill the connection at least to them thus they can’t respond to earth instead of using lasers
    The question is as it seems from hearing the news that the Russians don’t need nukes in space to kill satellite but can do so with lasers and not a missile cause that happened once and the us government embarrassed them on the news from garbage flying around space made from the missiles explosion
    The question is since it seems that lasers can be used why don’t mafia people figure out how to make these lasers and take over the satilites radio at least there is no way in hell that you can’t hijack the radio signals of satilites

  486. From listening to the news it seems that America is saying that the satilites with nukes at best will hurt only other satellite and not humans but then the obvious that if Russia uses a nuke on us we won’t be able to send one back that fast without having satellite
    And we probably don’t have nukes facing Russia now but a small nuke from space is probably no picnic for it’s too late and the government lied and doing nothing about it at all

  487. Shocking: a swastika and the inscription “Death to the Jews” were sprayed in the elevator of a building in Yehud-Monosson.

    The case was located this week in a residential building on Ze’ev Vinhoiz Street in the city (Lugano complex). The tenants called for a police car, who according to the tenants were not too moved by the spraying and claimed that the officers told them that they were “acting hysterically”. The residents in response: “After the events of 07.10 we take every statement seriously and with concern ”

    Staff, Ono News, 28 March 2024. 10:47

    “As a member of a family of Holocaust survivors, I was shocked to see a swastika in the elevator of my building.” This is what a resident of a building on Ze’ev Vinhoiz Street in Yehud-Monosson tells Ono News, who discovered this week (Tuesday) along with the other tenants of the building that a swastika was sprayed in the elevator, as well as the inscription “Death to the Jews”.

    According to her, the same neighbor called the police, and a police officer did come to the area. According to that neighbor, the policeman “wasn’t overly excited” as she said, and claimed that the neighbors were “hysterical”.

    “We were able to erase the address relatively easily with acetone,” says her neighbor. “But to tell us that we are acting hysterically is a bit disconnected from reality, especially in light of the events of 07.10.

    I personally take everything seriously, especially since I know that in Yehud-Monoson there are a lot of [Arab] Illegal residents.

    We really do not act out of hysteria or fear, but out of vigilance and responsibility, just as is expected of citizens at this time. I hope that the police will complete the investigation and find the suspects.”

    The Israel Police stated: Upon receipt of the report to Moked 100, police officers arrived at the scene to collect findings and evidence. An investigation was also opened with the aim of finding the truth.
    [did.li/q3wrl]

  488. “Those who called for refusal are preachers for recruiting [Haredim] ultra-Orthodox, hypocrisy.”
    Kol Chai, 21:42 31.03.2024, The main edition.

    Minister of the Negev and the Galilee Yitzhak Wasserlauf in the main edition: “The ombudsman does not allow to produce a policy of equal enforcement. Brothers to Arms who called the refusals today preach for the recruitment of ultra-Orthodox. What hypocrisy. Minister Ben Gabir established about a thousand standby classes all over the country. Over one hundred thousand weapons were distributed. It would have taken another minister 20 years.”

  489. Two gedolim said that the only existence of Israel is giving to torah study this means not cause of purity or the ideal thinking of what a Jew is like a new sod in kabbalah that if he views himself like this he can leave galuse

  490. But what is happening now we need the usa like blood support and it is to bomb the gazans out of a hospital and we aren’t on the good with Russia and China

  491. Shocking: “historian” racist Gilbert Achcar compares Oct 7 atrocities to Warsaw Uprising no less:

    ‘ “On Hamas’s October Counter(sic)-Offensive”. 10/8/2023.

    Gilbert Achcar: “..Gaza’s latest counter-offensive brings indeed to mind the 1943 Warsaw Ghetto Uprising.” ‘

    ==

    Not only does he call it “counter attack.”..

    To Support his vile propaganda he quoted a typical Haaretz drama language politically motivated at the judicial reform debate.

  492. Today on NBC, April 5, 2024

    White House national security council spokesperson John Kirby joins TODAY to address the airstrikes that killed members of World Central Kitchen and the calls for an independent investigation. He also weighs in on if the United States is prepared to cut military aid to Israel if they don’t see meaningful changes in fighting.

    Guthrue:

    …The IDF has just released its findings. It says the strike on the vehicle a grave mistake, stemming from a serious failure from mistaken identification, errors in decision-making and an standard operating procedures. Errors in decision-making..

    The WCK says, fine, but it wants an independent investigation…

    Kirby: 

    we will look at that investigation ourselves and take a look at and see what we think of their findings and their conclusions before we make any judgment going forward. This is an agency of the Israeli government that has conducted independent Investigations before…it is almost like an inspector general if you will. They have done this in the past.

    Guthrie:…

    Kirby:

    I don’t want to get ahead of the president…

    I will note, one of the things the president did talk about with the PM Netanyahu was the very real threat they are facing from Iran, right now, a very public threat from the Iranians.

    And the President made it clear,  that our support for Israel and their self-defense is not going to change. The commitment the United states made over previous administrations republican or Democratic and we are going to make sure that to meet that commitment as well. They live in a tough neighborhood. While we are all focused, rightly, on the war in Hamas and Gaza, they’re under threat from the Houthis and militia groups they are funding resourcing training and preparing in Iraq and Syria.

    Guthrie:

    Fair enough.

    To that point, the President when he went to Israel, he called his support for Israel, rock solid and unwavering.

    Now it seems, Israel is on a short leash.

    Kirby:

    Noth things can be true.

    You can have a rock solid, unwavering support for Israel because of the neighborhood they’re living in and threats they are facing but take note in the way in which they’re conducting operations. That’s the discussion they had yesterday…

  493. 4 layers to the pro-hate “protests” on campus

    1. The initiators and still the base:
    Arab racism / Islamist bigotry from SJP (and the likes org.) oiled by Arab oíl Qatar.

    2. Marxists who like them.

    3. Gullible who think it’s cool but don’t know exactly what it’s about.

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