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YWN Coffee Room » Bais Medrash

Kashas on the Parsha

(258 posts)
  • Started 4 years ago by coffee addict
  • Latest reply from HaLeiVi

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  1. coffee addict
    having withdrawal symptoms

    I had a kasha on last week's parsha which i didn't get an answer to so i wanted to see if anyone in the coffee room knows and maybe add your own kasha on the parsha to the thread

    In last week's parsha (eikev) the passuk compare's Eretz Yisrael to Mitzrayim and Rashi says that Cham built Tzoan in Mitzrayim and Chevron in EY for his sons so how is it that chevron is part of EY if it belonged to Cham (i'm including intrinsically the answer the Shaarei Aharon gives, Shem was supposed to get EY so any part that Shem didn't get shouldn't be part of EY and if you say that Avraham bought it he just bought Maaras Hamachpela and it's feild not the whole city

    please ask questions if I'm not being clear

    Posted 4 years ago #
  2. rt
    Member

    what is the problem with Cham having eretz canaan?

    Posted 4 years ago #
  3. theprof1
    Member

    Cham had EY even though Hashem promised it to Shem. Cham built the land and it was named Canaan after one son. Had Canaan observed the 7 Noach mitzvos he would have been able to stay.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  4. coffee addict
    having withdrawal symptoms

    Cham had EY even though Hashem promised it to Shem

    malchitzedek melech shalem was shem and shalem is yerushalayim

    noach divided the world into 3 parts and shem got EY Hashem didn't promise it to him he "gave" it to him

    Posted 4 years ago #
  5. coffee addict
    having withdrawal symptoms

    I'm refreshing this post b/c i have a new question that i don't know the answer to and maybe the CR can help me.

    In this weeks parsha the passuk says Chadal lihiyos Sarah orach K'nashim to which rashi says that dam niddah stopped

    but in Noach where it says Vatihi Sarai Akara lo yalad
    the gemera in yevomos says either she was an aylonis, she was a tumtum or she didnt have a rechem. If this is so, then how can she have dam niddah in any of those 3 cases

    Posted 3 years ago #
  6. WIY
    Managed to post for 3 years without getting a subtitle

    mbachur
    Look back a few Pesukim in Perek Yud Alef Pasuk Ches and read the Rashi.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  7. WIY
    Managed to post for 3 years without getting a subtitle

    Mbachur
    Nu did it help?

    Posted 3 years ago #
  8. coffee addict
    having withdrawal symptoms

    Perek Yud Alef Pasuk Ches

    i don't underrstand over there it talks about the dor haflagah and rashi says b'olam hazeh

    Posted 3 years ago #
  9. Not really on this weeks Parsha but I heard it this week
    אל ירע בעיניך על הנער ועל אמתך
    We do not see that Avrohom Avinu should express any
    feeling over Hagar's exile.
    2 really belongs in another thread but I'M lazy
    A good one!! The Ansvei Sdom were "frumies"
    They were wicked with the excuse that were acting L'Shem Hasheואנשי סדום רעים וחטאים, לה' מאד

    Posted 3 years ago #
  10. WIY
    Managed to post for 3 years without getting a subtitle

    mbachur
    Sorry it was Perek 18 Pasuk 8 see Rashi there.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  11. coffee addict
    having withdrawal symptoms

    wellinformed, i know about that rashi.

    Chadal means she stopped, are you saying that she stopped after she saw dam on that day (which was when the malachim came) it seems like it's talking about before that day

    Posted 3 years ago #
  12. WIY
    Managed to post for 3 years without getting a subtitle

    mbachur
    Yes, before the day the Melachim came it seems like it had stopped, (meaning it had stopped years before that) then the Melachim came and it started again.
    I agree your Kasha still stands. Ask a Rabbi, Id like to know the answer as well.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  13. coffee addict
    having withdrawal symptoms

    BH for artscoll (if they didn't come out with an english transalation for the midrash i would've never seen it or even figured it out if i did

    there are two pshatim in chadal
    one means that it started then stopped
    one mmeans it never started
    (the midrash quotes 2 psukim i cant remeber where they are and i dont have a midrash handy)

    Posted 3 years ago #
  14. WIY
    Managed to post for 3 years without getting a subtitle

    Mbachur
    The problem is Rashi translates chadal as pasak. I don't think pasak has both meanings as well.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  15. HaLeiVi
    Member

    With regard to Tumtum, Tosafos in Yevamos 64, I think, says that obviously that was resolved by the time they were married. The point is more that anyone that was that way can't have or is unlikely to have children. As far as Ailoness goes, perhaps it is still possible to have a cycle with out being fully equipped.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  16. coffee addict
    having withdrawal symptoms

    Wellinformed,
    the midrash btw is mem ches, tes zayin
    and the matnas kehuna explains it like this
    ill have to look at rashi again

    Haleivi,

    and what about not having a rechem

    Posted 3 years ago #
  17. HaLeiVi
    Member

    While I consider the first Kasha answered, the second one is definitely a hard one. It was an attempt, not definitive. Anyhow, not necessarily does it have to mean that there was nothing at all. It could be refering to essential parts.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  18. coffee addict
    having withdrawal symptoms

    i only asked 1 kasha

    Posted 3 years ago #
  19. HaLeiVi
    Member

    I'm considering Tumtum as one Kasha (not anymore) and Aylonis as a second.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  20. Rak Od Pa'am
    Blocked

    Why dont we see any concern by Avrohum Avinu A"H over Hager at either of her 2 expulsions from his home?.
    He was concerned about Yishmael.
    See Pirush Hamishnayos L'ambam Avos 5:19 Those who dont have it handy go to http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=42469&st=&pgnum=21&hilite=
    It still is hard to understand. Given that אאע"ה suppreseed his gahmiyos but why wasnt he concerned over Hager about who חז''ל say שמה קטורה שנאים מעשיה כקטורת and was concerned over Yishmael who OTD ed?
    2) Why did Hashem tell him not be concernd over Hager when he wasnt?

    Posted 3 years ago #
  21. squeak
    Makes smalltalk with the two most sandy ectoplasmic beings on Earth (not to mention the Man on the Moon).

    chad pami, chada m'turetz b'chaverta. Hashem said not to be worried about Hagar, so Avraham was not worried. Hashem also said not to be worried about Yishmael, but he was anyway, which is a lesson in chinuch bonim.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  22. Rak Od Pa'am
    Blocked

    Huh???
    Go find your Chumash
    פסוק י"א וירע וכ is before פסוק י''ב ויאמר וכ

    Posted 3 years ago #
  23. HaLeiVi
    Member

    Why should he be worried about an adult? It was bad in his eyes to send out his son. Hagar was Sara's maid

    Posted 3 years ago #
  24. Pashuteh Yid
    Modern Chareidi Zionist

    I have a different kashya. There is a Rashi which says Eliezer really wanted to marry off his own daughter to Avraham. Avraham told him I am boruch and you are arur, v'ein arur misdabek bvaruch. I am troubled by this strong and possibly hurtful language. Especially about a choshuveh person like Eliezer about whom it says Yafeh sichoson shel avdei avos yoser mitoroson shel banim.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  25. coffee addict
    having withdrawal symptoms

    I don't understand your question, is it that why did Avraham say that, or how can Eliezer be considered arur, please explain

    Posted 3 years ago #
  26. WIY
    Managed to post for 3 years without getting a subtitle

    Pashuteh Yid
    Hashem calls Cham Arur so all his children are Arur I believe Eliezer was a descendant of Cham so that's why he is Arur. Avraham wasn't insulting him just stating the facts.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  27. Pashuteh Yid
    Modern Chareidi Zionist

    WIY, so if somebody is ugly and asks to make a shidduch, you tell him he is ugly? If he has a low IQ, you tell him he is stupid? Just stating the facts??? Why not say, I don't think it will work out.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  28. WIY
    Managed to post for 3 years without getting a subtitle

    Pashuteh Yid
    Hashem cursed the children of Cham. Hashem blessed the children of Avraham. Oil and water don't mix. Eliezer was a Tzaddik and him and Avraham were very close even though Eliezer was his slave. The only reason Avraham said no was because Hashem said that Elizer being a descendant of Canaan and Cham is cursed. If there was any other reason Avraham would have said it. Maybe Avraham did say it won't work out at first and Eliezer pressured him for the reason and so he forced Avraham to explain.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  29. HaLeiVi
    Member

    When Chazal say what he answered it is not a quote, it is his reason and therefore the root of any response he said no matter how he said it. He might have told him, I love you very much and you're a great guy, but there is a certain Yichus problem which is not your fault at all.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  30. WIY
    Managed to post for 3 years without getting a subtitle

    Haleivi
    Why can't it be a direct quote?

    Posted 3 years ago #
  31. HaLeiVi
    Member

    Chazal aren't telling stories, they are teaching Torah. Often you'll find different depictions from different places in Chazal. In the Medrash you can see more to the conversation that Reb Yochanan Ben Zakay had with Vespasian, than what the Gemara mentions. It is not a contradiction of the facts, it is merely a difference of depiction. Each one is pointing out the important facts.

    If we would read about our time in Chazal, we would also be surprised at what is left out. As the Maharal often explains, what we see in the Gemara is Chazal's perspective of what is important and noteworthy.

    It may be that Avaraham Avinu said those words exactly, and it can also be that he didn't even mention those words at all. Chazal are telling us what his answer was, in essence.

    To further explain this concept, if I were to tell you that a fence tells you not to enter, even if it is very simple to step over it, you wouldn't ask, 'but a fence can't talk!' Actually, a fence can talk, albeit it can only say one thing. It also does not have a choice to say it or not. Often, something is considered said, when actions are what spoke it.

    Nobody listened in to the conversation of Avraham and Eliezer. Chazal knew what the reason is that he didn't want to be Meshaddech with him. Chazal also Darshened from the Pesukim that Eliezer hinted that he would want to be Meshaddech. The answer is implicit in Avraham Avinu's actions. Eliezer might have understood himself or he might have not. If the latter was the case, then Avraham Avinu answered him, surely in a nice way.

    By the way, it says that after this Shlichus, Eliezer's status was changed to Baruch. So it definitely wasn't a personal insult. It was a Yichus issue. We find in the Gemara an instance where a Talmud did not want to marry his Rebbe's daughter because he felt that his Yichus is better.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  32. Pashuteh Yid
    Modern Chareidi Zionist

    HaLeivi, I hear what you are saying.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  33. רש''י בראשנת כ''ז מ''ד גם שניכם" - אם יקום עליך ואתה תהרגנו יעמדו בניו ויהרגוך ורוח הקדש נזרקה בה ונתנבאה שביום אחד ימותו
    כמו שמפורש בפרק המקנא לאשתו סוטה יג

    וזה לשון הגמרא שם ....... באותה שעה נתקיימה נבואתה של רבקה דכתיב למה אשכל גם שניכם יום אחד ואע״ג דמיתתן
    לא ביום אחד הואי קבורתן מיהא ביום אחד

    Did any one see a תירוץ ????????????

    Posted 3 years ago #
  34. I have a question on this week Parsha (Vayechi):
    Yacov says with regards to Reuven "reishis oni" whic Rashi says means that Reuven was conceived with Yacov's first tipah. Now, the Rambam says that a woman cannot conceive from Bia Rishona. How then did she conceive Reuven with Bia Rishona?

    Posted 3 years ago #
  35. WolfishMusings
    The Wolf

    Machlokes Rashi and the Rambam?

    Or else (warning: possible heresy alert) possibly the Rambam was just wrong on that fact -- especially in light of what is now known.

    The Wolf

    Posted 3 years ago #
  36. decisive viewpoint & WolfishMusings

    SEE רש''י בראשית י''ט ל''ו

    Posted 3 years ago #
  37. coffee addict
    having withdrawal symptoms

    wants to be I was thinking of that teretz too.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  38. deiyezooger
    Say my name 6 times fast. cmon. TRY IT

    Look up the Ohr HaChaim on that pusik.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  39. להמכנה עצמו הוגה דעות

    מי שעוסק בהבלי הקאווע שטיבעל אין לו עסק בנסתרות של אוהח''ק
    ובפרט הקטע שציינת

    Posted 3 years ago #
  40. RuffRuff
    HaLeiVi / Cedarhurst

    Wolf, as for Rashi arguing with the Rambam, see what Rashi whites by Lot's daughters. Anyhow, the Rambam didn't make it up, it's in the Gemara.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  41. coffee addict
    having withdrawal symptoms

    how can Yaakov bring up Reuvain's maaseh with switching the beds, you're not allowed to have someone recall his past transgressions if he does tshuva?

    Posted 2 years ago #
  42. -™
    dash

    Yaakov only kept the Mitzvos when he was is Eretz Yisroel and this occured in Mitzrayim.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  43. Shticky Guy
    THE SHTICKIEST POSTER IN THE ©®

    Rashi in Vayigash explains how we arrive at the 70 people who were in מצרים with יעקב. He says there were 66 counted in the פסוקים, and מרים was born on arriving there making 67, and יוסף and his 2 sons makes 70.

    What about יוסף's wife אסנת who, חז"ל say was the daughter of דינה? We mention דינה herself and also יעקב's other granddaughter שרח בת אשר. So why not אסנת. And dont say that רש"י is not bringing מדרש because he says that the שבטים's twin sisters had all died, so he is including מדרש. The only guess is that she may have also died.

    Does anyone have a solution or has anyone seen this anywhere?

    Posted 2 years ago #
  44. coffee addict
    having withdrawal symptoms

    Dash,

    Seriously!

    (I'm lavan garti taryag mitzvos shemarti)

    Posted 2 years ago #
  45. HaLeiVi
    Plays the aeolian harp by air

    Shtickey, the Ramban there points to the Pasuk that says explicitly that the count is besides for their wives.

    Rashi asks about the Te'umos and answers that the Te'umos must have died. Rashi obviously learned in the words, מלבד נשי בני יעקב, that we are not counting the wives they got from the local population. Therefore, the Te'umos should be counted. Yosef, however, did not get sold along with a Te'uma, and perhaps Rashi is going with the Medrash that Asnat was Potifars daughter, or as you said, she died, too.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  46. HaLeiVi
    Plays the aeolian harp by air

    Coffee, Yaakov was telling him why he is not fit for Bechora, Kehuna and Malchus.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  47. coffee addict
    having withdrawal symptoms

    Haleivi,

    Would it suffice just by saying pachaz kamayim (why mention ki alisa miishkavei aveecha)?

    Basically the reason he can't get bechora is bc he is pachaz not because of what he did

    Posted 2 years ago #
  48. littleapple
    Member

    I agree Yaakov was giving mussar (see Onklos- kibal ulphan)

    Posted 2 years ago #
  49. coffee addict
    having withdrawal symptoms

    Shticky,

    Someone else asked me this and I told him the only people that were counted were sons descendants whereas asnas is from a daughter

    Posted 2 years ago #
  50. Ken Zayn
    born Kenneth Solomon Zaynestzky

    Can any learned poster please help me with pashut peshat in a pasuk and a rashi. At the end of vayetzei (31, 33) the pasuk discusses lavan searching for his idols in the tents of yakov, rachel, leah and the two amahos (bilha and zilpa). What is the order in which he searched according to the pasuk and acc to rashi? The pasuk says first yakov's tent (which rashi says means rachel). From here is confusing: "leah's tent then the amahos, and he went out of leah's tent and into rachel's". How could he go directly from leah's tent into rachel's (for rachel's second search) if the pasuk just said that after leah's tent he went to the amahos tents and not to rachel's tent? (and the ramban says he only went once to leah's tent)? And rashi is also shver to me as he writes that lavan returned to rachel's tent BEFORE searching the amahos which again seems to be keneged the pasuk?

    Posted 2 years ago #

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